Topic: What do you want to see in X9?

[Fxeni]

I fail to see your logic. Axl doesn't need to die if he's the final boss, first of all. Again, X5 shows that they can fight without the other dying. Make him being controlled by Lumine's remaining data or something, it's not that hard to come up with something to back it up.

And yeah, I liked the Awakened Zero story arc the best. It was the most interesting one of the bunch in X5. The only part I found lame about it was X forgetting Zero, but otherwise I liked it the most.

[Flame]

I didnt quite care for how cheaply Zero died in the awakened scenario.

[Zan]

As for gameplay, X8 made Axl more different from X but I do feel that Axl could stand to be touched up.  Advent's shpiel of copying bosses would be cool if better implemented.  Also, he should be using both pistols in his attacks.

As for gameplay, X8 made Axl more different from X but I do feel that Axl could stand to be touched up.  Advent's shpiel of copying bosses would be cool if better implemented.  Also, he should be using both pistols in his attacks.
combine X8 Axl with Command mission Axl maybe? I do agree that he could stand to be more than a Bass clone with a hover. Also, his Copy ability has not really been that usefull in either X7 or 8... Though i liked how in 7, while you coldnt copy the form of enemies not your size, you could get an ability from them temporarily. X8 could have used that. only in CM has his transform been extremely useful.

I really don't think Axl using an improved version of Advent's system would work out at all in the X-series. Such an ability would allow him to pretty much become THE sole playable character in the game, leaving X and Zero behind.

I think the only change to Axl's copy ability that is absolutely needed for his X8 gameplay, is making the copy shot automatic and the game keeping a record of which enemy data you've obtained with how much energy. Much like how in X7's story he could transform into a robot he copied long ago, instead of immediately transforming into an enemy he killed. It would certainly allow Axl to use his abilities in a more versatile manner.

I fail to see your logic. Axl doesn't need to die if he's the final boss, first of all. Again, X5 shows that they can fight without the other dying. Make him being controlled by Lumine's remaining data or something, it's not that hard to come up with something to back it up.

Remember how pissed off everyone was for not being able to use Spider after a specific point in XCM? First off, it has already been done in XCM, and is therefore uncreative for X9, but in a 2d platformer, having Axl become the FINAL boss, makes sure only 2 out of 3 of the game's main characters can fight the greatest challenge of the game. Why would you not be able to defeat the final boss as Axl? It's the FINAL boss, that's just an insult to the people that like Axl's gameplay.

The only way the Axl becomes a boss notion works out is if Axl can either avoid the scenario completely, or there's an alternate boss for those playing as Axl. And even then, Double Hero System puts a total dent in that scenario. You'd have to somehow reason why X and Zero separately also become a boss, as they're challenged by teams of X and Axl, Zero and Axl. You can't simply have an X5 scenario in which X fights Zero and Zero fights X.

The ONLY way it can be done properly is with the Awakened Zero scenario: entirely optional. But in all honesty, I disliked that about X4~6 and Xtreme2. There are far too many bosses only one of them can fight. I still want to try fighting Double as Zero and Iris as X. Likewise with Berkana and Gareth. If they're going to do it this way, they better implement some sort of boss rush that makes otherwise impossible battles possible. See ZX Advent for example.

[Hypershell]

I'm all for Boss Rush, it's something that should have been done ages ago.  There is no reason you can't kill the character-change for a special segment.  I'd appreciate that in the intro stage anyway in the interest of character themes.

All you need is a reason for X and Zero to split up.  Say they don't know exactly where Axl is, so they pull a stage branch ala Xtreme2.  You play as Axl, you have your choice of either branch, and which you pick decides whether you meet X or Zero.

I'm not sure whether or not I want to see Axl as the FINAL boss, because it would seem pretty anti-climactic if there were no surprises beyond X8's foreshadowing.  But Axl as *A* boss, that could easily work.

I really don't think Axl using an improved version of Advent's system would work out at all in the X-series. Such an ability would allow him to pretty much become THE sole playable character in the game, leaving X and Zero behind.

I don't see how that's at all true.  If 8 animaloid forms didn't make us forget about the other MegaMan characters in Advent, there's no reason X8 would do it.  Without being limited by Zero/ZX's 4-element system there's every reason for copying bosses to be more offensively-oriented and less obstacle-oriented.  There's no reason you need to be granting Axl a new obstacle to clear with every form.  Rather, like Command Mission, your ultimate goal is really expanding his attack selection.  But by using A-Trans for it rather than alternate weapons, it lets the game developers get out of Axl's default mold of 8-directional rapid fire.  That really caused him a severe lack of variety in X8; every weapon was the same handling with a different effect, and it made Axl feel monotonous.

It would also make it easier for there to be an actual point in Axl obtaining Weapon Energy upgrades, if we were to utilize that with A-Trans attacks, which I believe should be the case.  Honestly, when you only need an A-Trans form for five seconds to get through a tunnel/spikes/guard Reploid, who cares how large your Weapon Energy is?

I'm not really into the idea of copying bosses, as they generally feel really bulky.  Heck, the only ones in Advent I used at all were Buckfire and Hedgeshock.  They should expand the amount of reploids that Axl can copy

Here's the thing, though.  As sub-par as ZXA's boss copying was, the Reploid copying of X7 and X8 bordered worthless.  I don't consider it surprising that, when you have 8 forms at your disposal at any time, some of them are for a particular niche (Chronoforce and Rospark in particular).  That said, there was an obvious lack of focus on mobility, and yes, that did hurt (especially Hedgeshock and the Shisaroids).  If they could correct it for future implementation, it would work out a lot better.

For X-series, using a proper boss weakness system over Zero/ZX elemental should help things out too.  It'd mean that every form would be strong against SOMEONE.  You dodge the redundancy of two forms per element, as well as the general pointlessness of neutral-element forms.  All of that forced Advent into a focus on obstacles, and in the X-series that would be easier to avoid.

I should probably mention that I do like the idea of Axl having multiple weapons to choose from as well.  I just think that 8 of them is overkill.

Dual pistols sound nice, but I'm not really sure how that would be implemented in a platforming environment.

It's more of a cosmetic change than anything else.  He's already a rapid-fire character, so just have him hold both pistols out and fire one after the other rather than using a pistol-sized machine gun.  The only gameplay difference would be that the shots aren't perfectly single-file, but that was done as early as the NES with Needle Cannon.

Another thought I had would be, if we went back to manual rapid-fire, he could shoot two shots to a button press.  Dunno.

Playing as them was pretty pointless as well, unless you just wanted 2 of each character.  They should've had more unique playing styles or something.

Well, playing as them WAS fanservice, and it was appreciated.  But yeah, I do agree that the whole multi-navigator thing is kinda pointless.

I didnt quite care for how cheaply Zero died in the awakened scenario.

I don't care for how cheaply he died in EITHER scenario.  Killing Zero is the one thing Inticreates did better than the X-series crew.  Unfortunately that's not saying much.

[Zan]

I'm not sure whether or not I want to see Axl as the FINAL boss, because it would seem pretty anti-climactic if there were no surprises beyond X8's foreshadowing.  But Axl as *A* boss, that could easily work.

I can appreciate him as a boss. As X and Zero have both been fightable before. It's the "final" part that's my biggest issue. One cannot remove a player character from the most important segment of the game.

Really, if Axl is at all made a boss, I would demand X and Zero to be bosses as well. And boss rush, naturally.

I don't see how that's at all true.  If 8 animaloid forms didn't make us forget about the other MegaMan characters in Advent, there's no reason X8 would do it.  Without being limited by Zero/ZX's 4-element system there's every reason for copying bosses to be more offensively-oriented and less obstacle-oriented.  There's no reason you need to be granting Axl a new obstacle to clear with every form.  Rather, like Command Mission, your ultimate goal is really expanding his attack selection.  But by using A-Trans for it rather than alternate weapons, it lets the game developers get out of Axl's default mold of 8-directional rapid fire.  That really caused him a severe lack of variety in X8; every weapon was the same handling with a different effect, and it made Axl feel monotonous.

Thing is, ZXA has all available player characters as transformations of the base form.

In X8 however, we have three different characters. Of those three different characters, only Axl can transform into another character. Therefore, the wide variety of playable forms are only accessible through Axl. Essentially, making you have 11 player characters, 9 of which are Axl. And 9 of which that trigger Axl specific cutscenes. Quite cumbersome, and maybe a far too Axl-centric.

What it really comes down to... is that ZXA's forms are actually too close to full fletched player characters. If X8 is to copy bosses, which I think it's wholly possible, some severe limitations are to be implemented. Either the current time limit system, or we simply act like they're special weapons with a different character model attached to Axl. As in, their mobility is similar to or less than Axl, and they can only attack until their weapon energy runs out. Different from ZXA where each character remained capable of fighting regardless of weapons energy, and where weapons energy was replenished.

[Hypershell]

It's the "final" part that's my biggest issue. One cannot remove a player character from the most important segment of the game.

Well, as I said I agree with the point, but for a different reason.  I don't really see yours, all it means is that the final boss varies with your player (which was done in MHX).  I just feel that story-wise having there be no conflict beyond Axl would be a bad move.  What would be going on for the rest of the game that it's all resolved before Axl's headshot comes into play, anyway?  There needs to be something beyond him.

And yeah, we both agree that we need Boss Rush.

they can only attack until their weapon energy runs out

No reason this cannot be the case, in fact as I mentioned last-post I believe this is the best way to go.  When I refer to ZXA I mean the simple act of boss copying in a platformer, I am not referring to energy management nor am I suggesting that ZXA's take on it would be ideal for an X-series game.  I don't buy that in the least.

Further discouraging the use of alternate forms to replace the default is the fact that Axl hovers.  That in and of itself is a useful ability you'll probably want to use throughout the game.

On the "cutscenes" thing, though, ZXA itself worked around that by switching back to base form.  Another option would be to simply switch mugshots and leave it at that, possibly having Axl speak in a distorted voice.

[Acid]

-Please kill the X8 redesigns.  With the exception of Alia, they suck.

You suck

>:C

[Flame]

I dont like Clamp doing Megaman thank you very much.

[Acid]

Good thing it wasn't even close to Clamp's noodle people.

[Satoryu]

I'm with Cid. The slim X8 designs don't bother me too much. Though I would prefer X9 to have something more like MHX's character models.

[Flame]

honestly as long as they dont mess up Zero's head, im fine.
the issue I had with X8, wasnt exactly the designs, (except for Zero, his sucked balls.) but the models themselves. The designs lookd just fine in the artwork and in the cutscenes, but when it came to the in game models... bleh... X's pose was also kinda... eeehhhh.... He's just standing there kinda slouching over.

[Acid]

X's pose wasn't very dynamic, that's true. But X8's game models were MUCH more spot on than the eggheads in MMXCM.

I really disliked that games models.

[Flame]

I really dont see the eggheadedness in Cm. X is really the only one who has an oddly shaped head. everyone else has too many angles to really tell.

Personally, i liked the X7 models.

[Satoryu]

The models in X7 and Command Mission were pretty bulky to me. The huge feet looked huger than necessary. I think MHX found the right medium between that and shrimpy X8.

[Hypershell]

See, IMO they're SUPPOSED to be bulky.  It's the way it was in pretty much all X1-7 artwork.  To me it conveys a sense of power.  X8's models looked like something you could snap in half.

Art style aside X8's models lacked detail as well.  All characters were the same height, X standing up straight giving the impression that he was taller than Zero.  In artwork the redesign snazzed them up a bit (though I still say Zero looked positively hideous), but in-game it simply did not work.

X's pose wasn't very dynamic, that's true. But X8's game models were MUCH more spot on than the eggheads in MMXCM.

*gives him ZEE UPPERCUT!!*

I don't know what XCM you were playing.  That game was about as close as we got to seeing Sensei in 3D (the way it SHOULD be), and the models were much better detailed than either X7 or X8.  Best 3D visuals the X-series ever saw in my book.

However I do agree that MHX was a killer style.  If they went with that I'd be satisfied.  Just so long as they correct Zero's helmet spikes.

[Galappan]

Wait, I haven't played X7 & have a little memory with X8, but can Axl actually shoot both handguns in separate directions? Left-Right, Up-Down, Down-Right, Up-Left, or like a clock's hand?

[Hypershell]

There was a special weapon in X7 that allowed Axl to split fire between two enemies.  Other than that, no.  Dual pistols have been seen in artwork/cutscenes, X8's Giga Attack, and XCM, but for normal attacks in sidescrolling gameplay, Axl uses only one pistol.

[Protoman Blues]

To me it conveys a sense of power.

LoL, to me, it conveys a sense of physically impossible to [tornado fang]ing run at all.  Shall I fetch the Anime into to X3?   

Not that I mind the ginormous feet though. 

[Flame]

See, IMO they're SUPPOSED to be bulky.  It's the way it was in pretty much all X1-7 artwork.  To me it conveys a sense of power.

makes me imagine X jumping from a building and landing a few stories down on the ground in a cool manner, making a small impact crater.

In artwork the redesign snazzed them up a bit

Their BEST moments was in the cutscenes, where the redesigns looked real good. (I didnt like X's face on the cover.)

Just so long as they correct Zero's helmet spikes.

even MHX had a Liiiitle bit of an issue with them. I WANT ZERO'S SPIKES PERFECT!
Hey, if the next game's models looked like Zero does in TvC, I'd be pretty happy.

LoL, to me, it conveys a sense of physically impossible to [tornado fang]ing run at all.  Shall I fetch the Anime into to X3?

X3 isnt the best example thr PB. in X4 it seemed to work though. especially in that scene where Zero is running in place.

[Protoman Blues]

X3 isnt the best example thr PB. in X4 it seemed to work though. especially in that scene where Zero is running in place.

X3 is the best example for why it doesn't work.  X4 is a prime example too.  #1. You only see Zero's legs for a second, if that.  #2. Watch Double trip over his own fat feet.  #3. In the What Am I Fighting Foraaaghh scene, Zero's legs, for the brief second you see them, are slimmed down pretty much to X8 levels.

[Tickle Buffalo]

Good thing it wasn't even close to Clamp's noodle people.

WANT SO BAD

[Flame]

X3 is the best example for why it doesn't work.  X4 is a prime example too.  #1. You only see Zero's legs for a second, if that.  #2. Watch Double trip over his own fat feet.  #3. In the What Am I Fighting Foraaaghh scene, Zero's legs, for the brief second you see them, are slimmed down pretty much to X8 levels.

dunno. eems to work just fine for Zero in 4.

[Jericho]

Nakayama should do all the designs for X9.

[Protoman Blues]

dunno. eems to work just fine for Zero in 4.

Haha, it works for the reasons I just stated.  You don't actually see him run in the opening.  Heh, but if you watch the Zero vs. Sigma scene, you clearly see the bulky legs overlapping each other more than once, as if their massive boots can Shadowcat-like, Martian Manhunterly phase through each other.

[OmegaZ]

If they need anything in X9, they definetly need to have copy ability for X, Axl's whatever the hell it is, and EX skill type stuff for Zero.