Topic: Mighty No. 9

[Zan]

I've been enjoying MN9. It's different from MegaMan, but not in a bad way. See, I actually like the dash mechanic, and most of the gameplay. I just feel the following tweaks would've helped streamline the experience:

-Double jump, to correct for missed ledge grabs.
-Removal of Beck's uncontrollable stagger/stumble after landing.
-Down dash cancel by side dashing or double jump.
-Weapon select on pause.
-Sub-tank carryover after death.
-Random power up removal.
-Piercing shot toggle and/or charge attack (ala Gunvolt).
-More boss destabilization moments for Ray.

As far as the presentation goes, the lack of facial expressions was my biggest disappointment. It just saps so much charm out of the game. I can live with the graphics, though. A few color modifications to the shader, and they're good to go. See attachments.

[Nexus]

Yeah, this game is just missing weird little things or focused on odd stuff that the average MM game knew not to screw up (albeit through some trial and error, but that was almost 30 years ago). Especially the power-up buff system, which sure as heck isn't random as it's always specific enemies giving specific buffs. It's like they wanted to keep the enemy mini-transformations from early concepts but went about it in a very questionable fashion. Tight platforming becomes worse when an enemy right before a precise section suddenly speeds up your normal movement, and entire sections immediately become a huge slog if you screw up or take too long with a piercing shot buff - especially if the enemy patterns are practically designed around the usage of the power-up, meaning you have no choice but to acutely dash cancel before you ram into that second or third enemy behind the one you destabilized first.

I was expecting the stumble to only be a little story-telling mechanic to tell me that Beck wasn't exactly an experienced fighter, but it stays the whole game and can unexpectedly slip you up at the worst times, like landing on a ledge with any amount of forward momentum causing you to stumble off by accident. When the core game you're ripping off is designed around tight, responsive controls, taking control from the player as an inherent game element sucks.

[ViperAcidZX]

I've been enjoying MN9. It's different from MegaMan, but not in a bad way. See, I actually like the dash mechanic, and most of the gameplay. I just feel the following tweaks would've helped streamline the experience:

-Double jump, to correct for missed ledge grabs.
-Removal of Beck's uncontrollable stagger/stumble after landing.
-Down dash cancel by side dashing or double jump.
-Weapon select on pause.
-Sub-tank carryover after death.
-Random power up removal.
-Piercing shot toggle and/or charge attack (ala Gunvolt).
-More boss destabilization moments for Ray.

As far as the presentation goes, the lack of facial expressions was my biggest disappointment. It just saps so much charm out of the game. I can live with the graphics, though. A few color modifications to the shader, and they're good to go. See attachments.

Are those the vanilla PC graphics or did you use a post-processing injector like ReShade or Sweet FX? The colors seems harsher and over-saturated, for me at least. The stumbling I noticed it happens when you still give Beck movement while landing and it seems you can cancel out the animation by dashing, although that could lead into dashing into an enemy, or worse, 1-hit kill traps. A couple of other things I would like to add to balance some things out:

- Remove the MM1 invincibility frame issue with 1-hit kill traps
- Checkpoints for Countershade's stage, perhaps a checkpoint for each time you subdue him when you're pursuing him
- Actually explain the crouch dash in the intro stage and have the levels actually require the player to use it instead of always having the player "squeeze" through gaps automatically in levels, this way players can familiarize themselves how to use it to avoid hazards like the one in Dynatron's stage and dodge certain attacks

Also I don't think it's the lack of expression that the characters display but rather its the lack of actual animations that hurt the characters visually, it's more stiffer than Sonic '06 mannequin-like models.

[Zan]

which sure as heck isn't random

Not random, yes.
It's just all sorts of useless when a struggling player can't really use it.

Are those the vanilla PC graphics or did you use a post-processing injector like ReShade or Sweet FX?

ReShade/SweetFX. It's over-saturated, yes, but that will boil down to further tweaking and preference. The increased vibrance is definitely a plus, though. Just compare it drabness of the actual Pyrogen stage. It's hard to tell there's anything but grey in there.

Let me upload a comparison (see attachment).

- Remove the MM1 invincibility frame issue with 1-hit kill traps
- Checkpoints for Countershade's stage, perhaps a checkpoint for each time you subdue him when you're pursuing him
- Actually explain the crouch dash in the intro stage and have the levels actually require the player to use it instead of always having the player "squeeze" through gaps automatically in levels, this way players can familiarize themselves how to use it to avoid hazards like the one in Dynatron's stage and dodge certain attacks

Agreed on all points.

I was expecting the stumble to only be a little story-telling mechanic to tell me that Beck wasn't exactly an experienced fighter, but it stays the whole game and can unexpectedly slip you up at the worst times, like landing on a ledge with any amount of forward momentum causing you to stumble off by accident. When the core game you're ripping off is designed around tight, responsive controls, taking control from the player as an inherent game element sucks.

Ray doesn't have it, so here's hoping toward its removal in a sequel.

[Sakura Leic]

Hmm would you think a power-up shop like MM 7-10 be a good addition?

[Zan]

Hmm would you think a power-up shop like MM 7-10 be a good addition?

A power-up shop would be a great way to replace the current power-up system actually. Have Beck collect the different Xel colors to spend on three different categories: speed, power, life.

[ViperAcidZX]

ReShade/SweetFX. It's over-saturated, yes, but that will boil down to further tweaking and preference. The increased vibrance is definitely a plus, though. Just compare it drabness of the actual Pyrogen stage. It's hard to tell there's anything but grey in there.

I'm more of a "less is more" kind of a person when it comes to messing around with SweetFX/ReShade, especially when it comes to using Luma Sharpening. Sometimes a subtle change makes a bigger impact. Here's an example of me using SweetFX (newer versions and ReShade crashes the game sadly) on Darksiders based on a present I found but made some changes of my own to make the changes more subtle and comparable to the console versions since the PC version also had washed out colors (full HD versions can be found in the links below).

Full HD: (before) | (after)

[Protoman Blues]

I've been enjoying MN9. It's different from MegaMan, but not in a bad way. See, I actually like the dash mechanic, and most of the gameplay. I just feel the following tweaks would've helped streamline the experience:

-Double jump, to correct for missed ledge grabs.
-Removal of Beck's uncontrollable stagger/stumble after landing.
-Down dash cancel by side dashing or double jump.
-Weapon select on pause.
-Sub-tank carryover after death.
-Random power up removal.
-Piercing shot toggle and/or charge attack (ala Gunvolt).
-More boss destabilization moments for Ray.

As far as the presentation goes, the lack of facial expressions was my biggest disappointment. It just saps so much charm out of the game. I can live with the graphics, though. A few color modifications to the shader, and they're good to go. See attachments.

Yeah, I pretty much agree with most of this. I wouldn't mind Beck getting a double jump from one of the Mighty Numbers he beats, kinda like the extra jump and slow glide down he gets from Avi.

[Sakura Leic]

A power-up shop would be a great way to replace the current power-up system actually. Have Beck collect the different Xel colors to spend on three different categories: speed, power, life.

Yeah I just found a temporary piecing shot to be stupid and felt a shop system would be better based off of that.  Oh and something to get rid of Beck's Ninja Gaiden Knock Back.

[Nexus]

I still have to wonder what the hell they were really doing between 2015 and 2016, especially such a late release in 2016? I get that Red Ash, Recore and other stuff like the Deep Silver publishing deal probably tied their hands in various ways, but it's like they 'finished' MN9 and then just said "okay everyone drop what you're doing and let's work everything else out." That extra year's worth of time could've easily been spent fixing bugs, improving the various ports, and other things.

[Zan]

I still have to wonder what the hell they were really doing between 2015 and 2016, especially such a late release in 2016? I get that Red Ash, Recore and other stuff like the Deep Silver publishing deal probably tied their hands in various ways, but it's like they 'finished' MN9 and then just said "okay everyone drop what you're doing and let's work everything else out." That extra year's worth of time could've easily been spent fixing bugs, improving the various ports, and other things.

Because MN9 was ported to everything under the sun simultaneous to its development, little to no changes were made after the core product saw completion. The workload for a minor change would've multiplied for every version in existence. Inafune has openly acknowledged this problem after release.

[Satoryu]

However that only applies to Beck, I feel. I started playing Ray today. Battalion's stage gets a bit trickier when you can't get rid of explosive barrels from afar. And the fight is a lot harder cause if you play it too safe, your health will run out. But if you go ham on him, he'll hit you before you can absorb from him.

I beat Ray mode last week. I take some of the above back now that I know a bit more about her gameplay. While some barrels can be taken care of by the third slash from a distance, the best way to handle a bunch of them is to bonk into them with your dash. You have a bit of invulnerability after you bounce off, just like Mic's form for Beck.

I still found the fight with Batt a bit tricky. You have to play super duper safe. If you're too close to him when he decides to jump, he'll run into you. It's actually like that with a bunch of the bosses. I ended up beating Dyna first cause I game overed on everyone else I tried, and I kept my life count at 2. Avi is actually pretty easy to fight first as well.

I'm kinda disappointed with most of Ray's weapons. Dyna's, Cryo's, and Brand's are barely any different from Beck's. Avi's and Shade's are a nightmare to hit bosses with reliably. And Batt's, while being a long range weapon that Ray desperately needs, is a far cry from how good Beck's is. There's no real game breaker for Ray. The closest is Mic's, which is a drill hookshot that is super cool. But like other strong weapons, its ammo isn't the best.

[Flame]

Going through the robot factory, I have to say, was excruciatingly painful. It is amazingly poorly designed. The difficulty is firmly artificial. of particular note: any part with spikes. Especially the section where you have to drop down using Avi's power. the spikes have a fairly unforgiving hitbox, and momentum is a [sonic slicer], ESPECIALLY with Avi's power. I had to abuse the mid air momentum shifting that spamming transform gives you to get past it.  Amd then there's that part with the platforms above the spikes. where it wants you to both use weapons to hit switches ABOVE you, while dealing with enemies hanging from the ceiling in front of you, who knock you off the platforms into the spikes, which follow the Megaman 1 rule.

That was annoying.

[Satoryu]

The first part I got through no problem my first time, but I have died to it on other runs. I think it's because of over correcting too much in between the spikes. If you do the dashes probably you get through perfectly every time.

Second part, Batt bomb. Nuff said.

[Blackhook]

This game is poorly optimised malware. I didn't have fun at any point while playing this game (mostly because the framerate on my laptop just added to the frustration) and I don't want to go back to it.

I can't believe there are people willing to defend this game though.

[ViperAcidZX]

How is this game malware? I disproven the "rumor" of the game bricking Wii Us and the Wii U version has the worse frame-rate from the other versions I've seen yet I can enjoy it.

I beat Ray mode last week. I take some of the above back now that I know a bit more about her gameplay. While some barrels can be taken care of by the third slash from a distance, the best way to handle a bunch of them is to bonk into them with your dash. You have a bit of invulnerability after you bounce off, just like Mic's form for Beck.

I still found the fight with Batt a bit tricky. You have to play super duper safe. If you're too close to him when he decides to jump, he'll run into you. It's actually like that with a bunch of the bosses. I ended up beating Dyna first cause I game overed on everyone else I tried, and I kept my life count at 2. Avi is actually pretty easy to fight first as well.

I'm kinda disappointed with most of Ray's weapons. Dyna's, Cryo's, and Brand's are barely any different from Beck's. Avi's and Shade's are a nightmare to hit bosses with reliably. And Batt's, while being a long range weapon that Ray desperately needs, is a far cry from how good Beck's is. There's no real game breaker for Ray. The closest is Mic's, which is a drill hookshot that is super cool. But like other strong weapons, its ammo isn't the best.

My problem is the iffy i-frames from bouncing off enemies with Ray's tackle, which is why I tried to 1-cycle the Nameless tank when I dealt with it. I could see a bit of utility with Avi's weapon for Ray by using to reach high places quickly since you can lock onto enemies above and I noticed it gets a little more height than jumping.

[Sakura Leic]

He might be talking about how the Steam Version kind of sets off things like Avast.

[yt]https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Hqglwib7nA4#[/yt]

[ViperAcidZX]

I remember seeing Johnny tweeting the same thing happened with the DRM-free version before the review (spoiler alert: Johnny was not pleased with game), though I highly doubt the game would have any malicious code in the game. Valve wouldn't allow that sort of thing to slip by their validation process or it's going to look bad on them, not just the developers.

[Sakura Leic]

Well he was more disappointed than not pleased, which is worse to him since he'd rather rage than be bored. 

[Zan]

Especially the section where you have to drop down using Avi's power. the spikes have a fairly unforgiving hitbox, and momentum is a [sonic slicer], ESPECIALLY with Avi's power. I had to abuse the mid air momentum shifting that spamming transform gives you to get past it.

Know your dash range. And rely on your airdash with Avi activated. There's no real need to maneuver the d-pad there.

then there's that part with the platforms above the spikes. where it wants you to both use weapons to hit switches ABOVE you, while dealing with enemies hanging from the ceiling in front of you, who knock you off the platforms into the spikes, which follow the Megaman 1 rule.

Brandish the whole section. You'll hit the switches, reflect the projectiles, and feel cool while defying gravity.

Alternatively: Battalion.

This game is poorly optimised malware. I didn't have fun at any point while playing this game (mostly because the framerate on my laptop just added to the frustration) and I don't want to go back to it.

I can't believe there are people willing to defend this game though.

Street Fighter V gets flagged by Avast all the time, crashes on the dot of 15 minutes whenever Wacom Tablet drivers are running, and lags out your opponent with roll-backs because it's too taxing on the CPU and GPU.

I found ways around the former two. Do I fault the game for the latter? Hell no.

And you're saying MN9 has framerate issues? Get a better rig. Like seriously.

Ray mode

Haven't made much progress into Ray mode yet because of a Cease & Desist order from Objection Man. Next saturday we'll be racing that on stream. At least if everything goes according to plan.

[ViperAcidZX]

Brandish the whole section. You'll hit the switches, reflect the projectiles, and feel cool while defying gravity.

Alternatively: Battalion.

That's what I've been doing and it's not a bad idea if I'm not feeling like attempting to use the riskier way of Avi's form.

Street Fighter V gets flagged by Avast all the time, crashes on the dot of 15 minutes whenever Wacom Tablet drivers are running, and lags out your opponent with roll-backs because it's too taxing on the CPU and GPU.

I remember seeing this happening with some people who bought the game on Steam. Hell, even Rayman Forever, the MS-DOS port of Rayman 1, still has false positives in some its files yet nothing malicious was found in that game though I heard the reason that game gets false positives from some anti-virus software because an older virus use the same name as one of its executables.

I found ways around the former two. Do I fault the game for the latter? Hell no.

I'm probably going to get some [parasitic bomb] for this, but as someone who's play some challenging games enough to tell the different between a challenge (i.e. me sucking at a game) and artificial difficulty (i.e. when the developers screwed up somewhere in the game's difficulty curve), I want to post a quote from TotalBuscuit and his This Is Why We Can't Have Nice Things on God Hand that I used in a comment I made on SomecallmeJohnny's review of the game:

"You are totally capable of dealing with this. We gave you the tools, why didn't you use them? A bad workman always blames his tools, and when you start off with [God Hand], you will be a bad workman. Some people will not be able to accept that, and as a result, they will absolutely despise the game."

Now I'm not gonna say that Mighty No. 9's difficulty is well-handled since some of us can agree there are some things that fell through the cracks of this games (e.g. bad knockback from dashing, MM1 i-frames to spikes, instant death traps), but to me this is tame compared to playing X6 on Extreme with X only (though I used his armors because that games hates armorless X) or Mega Mari, and when I get destroyed in Mighty No. 9, I didn't buckle or screamed "[tornado fang] this game!" like some people (not you guys though), I kept a cool head, wised up, and learned how to get around the problem then came up on top. Even without if didn't have scoring gimmicks, succeeding was enough a reward for me, and it kept me playing.

And you're saying MN9 has framerate issues? Get a better rig. Like seriously.

Well, it was nice knowing you, Zan...

[spoiler]On a serious note: unless it was a gaming laptop, I doubt a laptop would handle Mighty No. 9 going by its minimum requirements, and in that case I'd suggest you get a lower spec game like RosenkreuzStilette, Metagal, or the Mega Man fan games like Mega Man: Super Fighting Robot.[/spoiler]

Haven't made much progress into Ray mode yet because of a Cease & Desist order from Objection Man. Next saturday we'll be racing that on stream. At least if everything goes according to plan.

I'm looking forward to see this. I'm not sure if there's any tips I can provide despite that I've cleared Ray's story on Normal recently.

[Blackhook]

The thing is I refuse to believe a game like that needs a high spec gaming PC.

...in that case I'd suggest you get a lower spec game like RosenkreuzStilette, Metagal, or the Mega Man fan games like Mega Man: Super Fighting Robot

Assuming I haven't played them already (except Metagal)? Each of them being better in every regard than MN9?
Honestly, MN9 is almost the same As Megaman Unlimited. Unfair yet bland level design, boring story, boring yet unfair boss battles and a playable Zero.

[Sakura Leic]

Actually looking at the minimum requirements I'm actually not sure I can run MN9 on my current Laptop that well since my processor ain't that great.  It has 1.6 GHz (and I am not familiar with how much this can be pushed either since I am hardly a computer expert) but the minimum requirements call for 2.8 GHz.  I do have 6 GB of ram on this thing but again I'm not sure that would make up for it.

Keep in mind this laptop is probably more than 5 years old as well.

EDIT: Okay seems this processor can be pushed to at least 2.5 GHz with turbo clocking, which again I don't exactly know how that works.

[ViperAcidZX]

Actually looking at the minimum requirements I'm actually not sure I can run MN9 on my current Laptop that well since my processor ain't that great.  It has 1.6 GHz (and I am not familiar with how much this can be pushed either since I am hardly a computer expert) but the minimum requirements call for 2.8 GHz.  I do have 6 GB of ram on this thing but again I'm not sure that would make up for it.

Keep in mind this laptop is probably more than 5 years old as well.

EDIT: Okay seems this processor can be pushed to at least 2.5 GHz with turbo clocking, which again I don't exactly know how that works.

I'm not a computer expert either, though not I'm sure if pushing it 2.5GHz will make Mighty No. 9 run at a playable frame-rate (about 30-40 FPS should suffice going my experience with the Wii U version and playing Dark Souls III on my underpowered PC), and turbo clocking can heat up the CPU unless your system has proper cooling.

The thing is I refuse to believe a game like that needs a high spec gaming PC.

Sorry, but my computer is medium spec compared to what's on the market now (it has an NVIDIA 750 with 2GB VRAM, AMD FX-4350 which isn't a great CPU compared to an FX-8350, and 4GB of RAM), yet it meets most of Mighty No. 9's recommended requirements. But then again, I've played other games with lower requirements with worse optimization than Mighty No. 9 (not that I had a chance to play the PC version of Mighty No. 9 yet). Also has it occurred to you try to lowering your settings? My computer barely meets Dark Souls III's minimum requirements yet I can get better performance if I knock it down from 1920x1080 on Max settings to around 1280x720 on High settings going from 30 FPS tops to 60 FPS respectively. Not to mention there are games using Unreal Engine 3 that runs terribly, even on monster hardware, like Day One: Garry's Incident and the launch version of Batman: Arkham Knight.

[Sakura Leic]

That and I have no idea how to Turbo Clock in the first place.