Star Wars Blu Ray is out!

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Offline Protoman Blues

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Reply #25 on: September 17, 2011, 07:07:21 AM
You know, if Lucas is going to change every little thing about Star Wars, he should go back and make The Phantom Menace into a decent movie. I don't think too many fans would mind that (at least, I hope).

There's no way to fix it without literally altering the entire movie, and the second one, and the third one. It's essentially un-fixable.

He probably feels they are perfect as is. :P

After all, they pretty much sort of started his "vision" of how to "improve" Star Wars. He felt Star Wars needed a prequel story. One that tells of how Vader became Vader. so its like, "Ok,... Its not really necessary, we already know all there needs to be known about him, and the mystery about what we dnt know only fuels the imagination, but ok, ill roll with it."

Then we get the prequels... And its like "what..."

You see, prequel movies could have actually been really good. The problem is him. He cannot tell a story. At all, and it's evident by how bad the prequels are, because they really don't even connect to the original trilogy that well.



Offline Gaia

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Reply #26 on: September 17, 2011, 07:19:06 AM
Sure, the Clone Wars DID happen, there WAS characters like Yoda, Anakin, and Obi Wan. The rest of the cast was most likely pulled out of his ass, though one has to wonder how he was able to get Mr. "I am tired of these Monkey Fighting Snakes on this Monday to Friday plane" to play the role of Mace Windu..

Workshop/DA/YT/Photobucket なにかんがえてるの!?
So its about ass now huh? EVEN THE ASS HAS 'EXCEEDED'!

One mention of LEGENDS and everyone goes batshit.  :\

Yep, every time when someone mentions that game people get energized for an apparent reason whatsoever. It's like this everywhere else, trust me.

It got really messy to find my sprite and comic topic, so it's in my sig.


Offline Flame

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Reply #27 on: September 17, 2011, 07:21:07 AM
Yeah. I can see how you doubt his involvement in the originals.

Can it simply be coincidence? He got lucky with the originals?

Many directors who were once good one day started making shitty movies.

and actually, it could be because the original Producer of the movies isnt helping him anymore.

Quote
urtz and Lucas first collaborated on the 1973 film American Graffiti, which became a huge box office hit. Kurtz then became producer of Star Wars, released in 1977, and its sequel, The Empire Strikes Back released in 1980. Many of the more mystical and spiritual elements of Star Wars were influenced by Kurtz, who had extensively studied comparative religion. Kurtz was a Quaker at the time and is currently Buddhist.

Kurtz has claimed that he and George Lucas clashed over how to progress the Star Wars series. Kurtz recalled after Raiders of the Lost Ark in 1981, Lucas became convinced that audiences no longer cared about the story; they were simply there for thrills and entertainment, and he began to deviate from the original planned plotlines for Return of the Jedi, at which point Kurtz quit the series. Kurtz has also claimed that Lucas changed the emphasis from storytelling to one that prioritized toy merchandising. Kurtz has expressed his dissatisfaction with Return of the Jedi and Star Wars Episode I: The Phantom Menace.  Kurtz was particularly displeased with Lucas' decisions in Return of the Jedi to resurrect the Death Star and to change the plot outline from one that ended on a "bittersweet and poignant" note to one having a "euphoric ending where everyone was happy".  Other sources have suggested that Kurtz was removed from the franchise by Lucas after he had allowed production on The Empire Strikes Back to run seriously over-schedule and over-budget.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_Kurtz

think we may have found our missing link in this issue?
Quote
Sure, the Clone Wars DID happen, there WAS characters like Yoda, Anakin, and Obi Wan. The rest of the cast was most likely pulled out of his ass, though one has to wonder how he was able to get Mr. "I am tired of these Monkey Fighting Snakes on this Monday to Friday plane" to play the role of Mace Windu..

Ive hear it rumored before that his condition to join was to have a purple lightsaber. No idea if it's true or not.

...When Larry the reploid accountant goes maverick of his own accord, he's certainly formidable during tax season, but he isn't going to provide X the challenge needed to make him grow as a warrior and reach his potential.


Offline Mirby

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Reply #28 on: September 17, 2011, 07:22:56 AM
I've heard that too, Flame.

Knowing Samuel L. Jackson, I'm not surprised. He was one of the most awesome characters in the prequels.

I'M SICK OF THESE MUTHAFUTTIN SITH IN MY MUTHAFUTTIN TEMPLE!!

OH [parasitic bomb] IM USING LINK AND I ACCIDENTALLY FINAL SMASHED A CUCCO OH GOD HELP
Just enjoy yourself, don't complain about everything


Offline Flame

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Reply #29 on: September 17, 2011, 07:24:48 AM
Well as far as im concerned, Samuel L. Jackson can have any saber color he damn well pleases. Because he's Samuel L. Jackson.

I mean, really, a Purple Lightsaber is pretty cool.

...When Larry the reploid accountant goes maverick of his own accord, he's certainly formidable during tax season, but he isn't going to provide X the challenge needed to make him grow as a warrior and reach his potential.


Offline Gaia

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Reply #30 on: September 17, 2011, 07:34:46 AM
Well, that and he was more of a protagonist whiny "IHATEEVERYTHING" Anikin. Seriously, it was almost like he made the prequels. Jar Jar and Anikin can fall into a Sarlacc Pit for all I care.

Workshop/DA/YT/Photobucket なにかんがえてるの!?
So its about ass now huh? EVEN THE ASS HAS 'EXCEEDED'!

One mention of LEGENDS and everyone goes batshit.  :\

Yep, every time when someone mentions that game people get energized for an apparent reason whatsoever. It's like this everywhere else, trust me.

It got really messy to find my sprite and comic topic, so it's in my sig.


Offline Protoman Blues

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Reply #31 on: September 17, 2011, 07:41:32 AM
Sure, the Clone Wars DID happen, there WAS characters like Yoda, Anakin, and Obi Wan. The rest of the cast was most likely pulled out of his ass, though one has to wonder how he was able to get Mr. "I am tired of these Monkey Fighting Snakes on this Monday to Friday plane" to play the role of Mace Windu..

Sam Jackson will do anything, really. He practically begged to be in this movie in some way, shape, or form. The Purple Lightsaber (which I have) was kind of a gift.

Yeah. I can see how you doubt his involvement in the originals.

Can it simply be coincidence? He got lucky with the originals?

Many directors who were once good one day started making shitty movies.

and actually, it could be because the original Producer of the movies isnt helping him anymore.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_Kurtz

think we may have found our missing link in this issue?

Back in the old days, he had people, probably like Kurtz, to tell him what worked and what didn't. With the prequels, he had complete and total control over pretty much ever aspect of the movie's development.



Offline Flame

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Reply #32 on: September 17, 2011, 07:45:30 AM
So basically, he needs a babysitter when he writes his drafts and ideas.

Although the idea of Lucas being more "merchandise" centered seems about right.

...When Larry the reploid accountant goes maverick of his own accord, he's certainly formidable during tax season, but he isn't going to provide X the challenge needed to make him grow as a warrior and reach his potential.


Offline Gaia

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Reply #33 on: September 17, 2011, 07:46:23 AM
Sam Jackson will do anything, really. He practically begged to be in this movie in some way, shape, or form. The Purple Lightsaber (which I have) was kind of a gift.

Huh. So if I [sonic slicer] and moan about getting in, would I make an appearance in the Clone Wars TV series? (To me it is MUCH better written than the prequels themselves)

Workshop/DA/YT/Photobucket なにかんがえてるの!?
So its about ass now huh? EVEN THE ASS HAS 'EXCEEDED'!

One mention of LEGENDS and everyone goes batshit.  :\

Yep, every time when someone mentions that game people get energized for an apparent reason whatsoever. It's like this everywhere else, trust me.

It got really messy to find my sprite and comic topic, so it's in my sig.


Offline Obdulio

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Reply #34 on: September 17, 2011, 07:52:31 AM


Back in the old days, he had people, probably like Kurtz, to tell him what worked and what didn't. With the prequels, he had complete and total control over pretty much ever aspect of the movie's development.


YES  finally someone on the internet said it , i remember seeing an old making of DVD " Building of an Empire" or something like that ... that talked about the history of the creation of Star Wars and mentioned how he clashed with the people he was working with and the movie companies.


People are always saying Lucas lost it and hes no longer a good storyteller ,  I think he never was,  hes said countless times even back then  ... that the original trilogy isnt what he envisioned .. that he always wanted it BIGGER and BETTER and thats what hes doing now in his own eyes.



Offline Rin

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Reply #35 on: September 17, 2011, 08:09:12 AM
So in other words...
Lucas is, was and forever will be a [tornado fang]ing hack.
A RICH [tornado fang]ing HACK!
Goddamn.



Offline Protoman Blues

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Reply #36 on: September 17, 2011, 08:17:21 AM
So basically, he needs a babysitter when he writes his drafts and ideas.

Although the idea of Lucas being more "merchandise" centered seems about right.

It's not just the writing. It's the directing, editing, and basically everything that goes into making a movie. One person is not suppose to have that much control, because you lose objectivity. Do you know that post production (editors and such) do not watch the production aspect of the movie while it is being shot? It's because the editors' job is to make sure it flows and progresses into a good, cohesive story.

A good example of this is in the re-done version of the original movie, A New Hope. In the newer versions, Lucas re-adds the scene with Han & Jabba outside the Falcon later after Han kills Greedo. That scene was removed because it serves no purpose in the movie due to the previous Greedo scene. Hell, some of the dialog is literally the same like "Even I get boarded sometimes" and more. Lucas probably put them back in because he liked the original scene and also because he wanted CGI Jabba, which looks [tornado fang]ing terrible I might add.

A lot of the "added in" scenes in the original movies are absolutely not needed and they were removed for a purpose. Lucas doesn't understand this, because he wants total control. You can see this in the prequels, when he did have total control. It absolutely reeks of [acid burst] poor editing, because the movies are not only told badly but they're boring at parts, which is why post production is an entirely different field than production. Their job is to objectively look at what works in the movie and what doesn't. But with Lucas pretty much giving orders, there's nothing they can do, cause he has total control.

Don't get me wrong though. I don't even think the best of editing could have saved those movies, because like I told Gonzie, they are pretty much un-fixable without literally remaking the entire movies. Not only do entire scenes need to be removed, but lots of dialog, plenty of story, and a bunch of characters need to go as well.

YES  finally someone on the internet said it , i remember seeing an old making of DVD " Building of an Empire" or something like that ... that talked about the history of the creation of Star Wars and mentioned how he clashed with the people he was working with and the movie companies.

People are always saying Lucas lost it and hes no longer a good storyteller ,  I think he never was,  hes said countless times even back then  ... that the original trilogy isnt what he envisioned .. that he always wanted it BIGGER and BETTER and thats what hes doing now in his own eyes.

This was made even more evident in an interview with Harrison Ford a while back, when he discussed the "I love you. I know." scene in Empire. Ford and the director literally had to fight Lucas on this matter because Lucas wanted Han to say "I love you too" back to Leia, clearly showing he not only knows nothing about the character Han Solo, but does not know how to write two people in love, which is made painfully obvious by pretty much all Anakin & Padme romantic dialog in the prequels.

But yes, that is pretty much exactly what he's doing with all his retouching. He is trying to make the films the way he originally wanted them to be, which is a crime.



Offline Obdulio

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Reply #37 on: September 17, 2011, 08:22:53 AM
In that same making of DVD  , they also showed that Han Solo was originally going to be a some kind of bizzare green alien.  makes me wonder had Lucas had complete control back then if thats what he would have been.

I remember the DVD now .. its called " Empire of Dreams "

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Empire_of_Dreams

http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLCA652992BF6AE229



Offline Bueno Excelente

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Reply #38 on: September 17, 2011, 12:17:14 PM
To those who say Lucas should release the original films untouched, he did cave in to fan demands a few years ago and released the original trilogy in the form of bonus discs within the trilogy itself.
http://www.amazon.com/Star-Wars-Trilogy-Widescreen-Theatrical/dp/B001EN71DG/ref=sr_1_1?s=movies-tv&ie=UTF8&qid=1316254498&sr=1-1

The movies are there, untouched, but still unformatted for widescreen, so you'll have to watch them old-style.

And it IS Lucas' fault. I remember it when he criticized stories like KOTOR II for giving depth to the Sith and having their motivations be one of finding morality in certain deeds than be absolutely ridiculous caricatures of evil fighting ridiculous caricatures of good. Lucas wouldn't have any depth in Star Wars. 90% of the Star Wars book writers also write much better than him. They shoulda gotten Timothy Zahn to write the prequel trilogy story. He already has plenty of experience writing the sequel trilogy books.  Heck, probably every single person who's ever contributed to the extended universe is a better writer, and makes a better story than Lucas. But he's a whiny man who bitches about things if they have more success than him. Like the mess he turned the Clone Wars cartoon in after Tartakovsky made it absolutely awesome.



Offline Flame

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Reply #39 on: September 17, 2011, 04:38:23 PM
Food for thought-

What if Spielberg directed a Star Wars movie.

With No Lucas Involvement whatsoever.

For the sake of argument, he gets the rights to make a movie.

...When Larry the reploid accountant goes maverick of his own accord, he's certainly formidable during tax season, but he isn't going to provide X the challenge needed to make him grow as a warrior and reach his potential.


Offline Bueno Excelente

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Reply #40 on: September 17, 2011, 10:02:56 PM
Food for thought-

What if Spielberg directed a Star Wars movie.

With No Lucas Involvement whatsoever.

For the sake of argument, he gets the rights to make a movie.
It would be very good.

Heck, I loved Kingdom of the Crystal Skull. As in LOVED it. Fans [sonic slicer] about ridiculous parts, but we've had nazi head-melting due to vengeful gods in the first one, heart-ripping without killing someone in the second, and Hitler signing autographs in the third. Nuked fridges is just on-par with the series, and so are aliens.

If you want to see a Spielberg movie (the ones he used to make) today, check out Super 8. Everything about it is Spielberg, from the way kids talk in a way kids really do talk, the way they make it about the genuine excitement and discovery of something amazing, and the way characters are portrayed. Everything about it stinks of ET: Decades Later. He'd be amazing at Star Wars. (and yes, I'm aware that Abrams still left his mark with the continous lens flares that go on through the whole movie. He's gained the right, honestly)



Offline Obdulio

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Reply #41 on: September 17, 2011, 11:25:40 PM


Heck, I loved Kingdom of the Crystal Skull. As in LOVED it. Fans [sonic slicer] about ridiculous parts, but we've had nazi head-melting due to vengeful gods in the first one, heart-ripping without killing someone in the second, and Hitler signing autographs in the third. Nuked fridges is just on-par with the series, and so are aliens.


This  , I never understood all the hate coming from the whole Aliens from another dimension thing.  .. its like every fan chose to ignore all the endings to the other Indy films like Bueno has stated, also dont forget the immortal Knight and the Holy Grail in Raiders of the Lost Arc!

oh and...

http://youtu.be/cpam467FgCA?t=5m2s



Offline Bueno Excelente

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Reply #42 on: September 17, 2011, 11:34:41 PM
This  , I never understood all the hate coming from the whole Aliens from another dimension thing.  .. its like every fan chose to ignore all the endings to the other Indy films like Bueno has stated, also dont forget the immortal Knight and the Holy Grail in Raiders of the Lost Arc!

oh and...

http://youtu.be/cpam467FgCA?t=5m2s
EXACTLY. That scene, in my opinion, is more over-the-top ridiculous than anything in Crystal Skull. And YES, that does include the fridge thing. It's supposed to be funny, guys! Indy movies have been about vengeful gods, evil hell rituals, and the Holy Grail being MAGIC, with an immortal protecting it. Where do aliens from another dimension not fit in? Indy has as much leeway as Doctor Who when it comes to ridiculous things becoming stories, and you all know it.



Offline The Great Gonzo

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Reply #43 on: September 17, 2011, 11:40:32 PM
Weren't there other problems with Crystal Skull?



Offline Flame

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Reply #44 on: September 17, 2011, 11:50:56 PM
Main thing I hated about it was Shia Labouf

...When Larry the reploid accountant goes maverick of his own accord, he's certainly formidable during tax season, but he isn't going to provide X the challenge needed to make him grow as a warrior and reach his potential.


Offline Acid

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Reply #45 on: September 17, 2011, 11:57:09 PM
Fate of Atlantis is the canon IJ4 anyway.



Offline Bueno Excelente

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Reply #46 on: September 18, 2011, 12:04:54 AM
Main thing I hated about it was Shia Labouf
I like him. He's a good Indy's son, being all clumsy, confident and screwing up a whole lot, but still being intelligent and a big rookie.



Offline Obdulio

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Reply #47 on: September 18, 2011, 12:09:26 AM
Weren't there other problems with Crystal Skull?

Yes there are but the main complaint i always hear is the Aliens. second would be the overuse of CGI................. and gophers.



Offline Flame

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Reply #48 on: September 18, 2011, 12:10:52 AM
I like him. He's a good Indy's son, being all clumsy, confident and screwing up a whole lot, but still being intelligent and a big rookie.
Hmmm. Weeell, I suppose he does fit in alright, when you put it that way.

...When Larry the reploid accountant goes maverick of his own accord, he's certainly formidable during tax season, but he isn't going to provide X the challenge needed to make him grow as a warrior and reach his potential.


Offline Bueno Excelente

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Reply #49 on: September 18, 2011, 12:12:17 AM
Hmmm. Weeell, I suppose he does fit in alright.


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