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HyperSonicEXE · **on:** April 05, 2009, 01:08:08 AM

http://kotaku.com/5198261/star-fox-creator-wont-do-a-barrel-roll-on-wii

'He also says Star Fox fans like furries.'
"The Wii is a bit more of a toy, I think."

Oh no he didn't. Oh. NO. HE. DIDN'T.

Star Fox and Starfox 64 were among the greatest games to grace their respective consoles. I don't know what the heck he's thinking making those statements when he's actually spot-on on a few other key concepts that have destroyed the Star Fox franchise, like:

'Wiimote control also doesn't appeal to him...'
"Whenever I speak to Miyamoto about Star Fox, he says it's not meant to be just a flying, sci-fi shooting game. It's meant to be anything we want to think up. But the core fans don't want that(...)"

Look, I'm not going to lie to you guys or Cuthbert or anyone else, for that matter; there are rabid fans of the Star Fox franchise that do like anthropomorphic content far more than the average person. But to stereotype and dismiss a series on the basis of fandom like that is exactly the thing that kills the fun and revenue in a lot of great series (including, Final Fantasy VII).

Thoughts, people. Especially about a lack of Starfox Wii now for AT LEAST 2 years, probably more. If ever.
Me? I'm seething just a little.

VixyNyan · **Reply #1 on:** April 05, 2009, 01:20:34 AM

Star Fox is one of my most favorite series. I actually liked Assault, Adventures and Command, and that says a lot.
If they want to do a sequel, Command will ruin that a bit, since everyone has aged by so many years, story-wise.
They could create a game that's either based on their children, or make some kind of prequel with inspirational ideas.

HyperSonicEXE · **Reply #2 on:** April 05, 2009, 02:10:25 AM

Quote from: Vixy on April 05, 2009, 01:20:34 AM

Star Fox is one of my most favorite series. I actually liked Assault, Adventures and Command, and that says a lot.
If they want to do a sequel, Command will ruin that a bit, since everyone has aged by so many years, story-wise.
They could create a game that's either based on their children, or make some kind of prequel with inspirational ideas.

It's a wonderful series. And I know it's not just me if Sakurai devoted 3 SSBB roster spots to Star Fox. I like it a lot, too; Fox is a perfect balance of Mario's heroism and Sonic's cool factor without going to either extreme. The upgraded Arwings and general progression of technology and cast has kept the series fresh after all this time and even after some shaky games.

I'm with you, Vix, I still liked Assault and Adventures.
Command...eh. But I did have fun with it, and it made James McCloud playable, so I can't complain.

That's another thing; I think they'll probably just choose the default, tame route of Starfox Command and continue from there. Personally, though, I would like to see more about the Wolf O'Donnell/James McCloud rivalry. Heck, I'd like to see James become a secret race/mission/boss, then become a series regular. Before Command, calling his status dead or alive into question worked for the series, but now, after being playable against the final boss, it's time to resolve his role once and for all. Any more dragging that plot point out, and it'd just be a cheap cliffhanger (and as Mega Man fans, we know how draining those are).

Quote from: CephiYumi

I do like the series but there's also plenty of other stuff to play ^^

True, but there just aren't many shmups, if any, that are more fun than Star Fox. It's explorative, multi-pathed, cheesy sci-fi goodness at its best.

Sky Child · **Reply #3 on:** April 05, 2009, 02:16:58 AM

Because this matters, right?

Acid · **Reply #4 on:** April 05, 2009, 02:20:54 AM

Remember your childhood? When talking animals were just talking animals?

Gaia · **Reply #5 on:** April 05, 2009, 02:41:06 AM

Quote from: Acid on April 05, 2009, 02:20:54 AM

Remember your childhood? When talking animals were just talking animals?

Pretty much until either the first walking anthro was introduced, Sonic or someone else. :p

Aresian · **Reply #6 on:** April 05, 2009, 02:46:48 AM

Quote from: Sky Child on April 05, 2009, 02:16:58 AM

Because this matters, right?

It matters to the fans. That establishes right in it's ownsome as a viable discussion. *shrugs* I would hope you think so aswell.

"People like those furries a little too much." this has always remained true though.

Jericho · **Reply #7 on:** April 05, 2009, 04:50:50 AM

Just wait until I can post in this topic properly... Expect a Jelly expositional complete with facts, nostalgia fueled sermons & a lot more. /Wii

And for the record, Dylan, StarFox SNES Engine Programmer from Argonaut... Say what you will about how you aren't fond of working on the series, or trolling the Wii & gamers who happen to like the series... Your words mean nothing considering EAD aped the [parasitic bomb] out of the original design in just the second entry. Let's not forget what kinda stuff can be pulled off with the silly Wii Remote on a series like this.

TL;DR: I'll wait for EAD to tell me the series is dead before I get concerned.

Protoman Blues · **Reply #8 on:** April 05, 2009, 04:53:08 AM

Quote from: Acid on April 05, 2009, 02:20:54 AM

Remember your childhood? When talking animals were just talking animals?

Wasn't that before the internet?

Either way, opinions are like PB vs. Ninja Lou. In the end, I always win!

STM · **Reply #9 on:** April 05, 2009, 05:07:29 AM

This guy wasn't behind Starfox 64... you know, the one people actually liked? Just let him moan like the creator of Devil May Cry did when talking about Bayonetta.

Jericho · **Reply #10 on:** April 05, 2009, 05:09:53 AM

Quote from: STM on April 05, 2009, 05:07:29 AM

This guy wasn't behind Starfox 64... you know, the one people actually liked? Just let him moan like the creator of Devil May Cry did when talking about Bayonetta.

I was waiting for your response honestly. Well played.

HokutoNoBen · **Reply #11 on:** April 05, 2009, 05:33:40 AM

Quote from: Aresian on April 05, 2009, 02:46:48 AM

It matters to the fans. That establishes right in it's ownsome as a viable discussion. *shrugs* I would hope you think so aswell.

But still, it shouldn't really matter. This is basically nothing more than the opinions of a guy talking out of his ass. As is noted above, he's not even responsible for what most herald as the crown jewel of the series (64). Hell, let it be said that the LAST game he was involved with, was Command, on the DS. Y'know, the rather crappy game that most people probably have reserved as the "black sheep" of the series.

In short, this is little more than some thing on the level of a guy like Itagaki talking trash about Tekken/Virtua Fighter/DMC/etc. There's no real reason to care about what he's saying, much less get all butt-hurt over it.

Furthermore, just because HE'S not interested in making a Star Fox game, in no way means that the series is "doomed", much less that Nintendo can make a new game on their own (or get another party to make it for them). In fact, if Command was the last sample of what he can do with the product, then it's perhaps for the best that he's not involved. Really, the only questions should be are when it's going to come, how it's going to be done, and (most importantly, imo) WHO is making it.

Get EAD on a game, do more to take us back to where the series SHOULD be (awesome space battles in [tornado fang]-awesome space fighters), and it will just be a thing of beauty.

Also, something from GAF that deserved to be shared:

HyperSonicEXE · **Reply #12 on:** April 05, 2009, 05:40:32 AM

All the same, I can't help but be concerned when we haven't heard anything about another Star Fox game for a while, and knowing that Nintendo has gone through Rare, Namco, and now these guys trying to lend Star Fox to someone capable.

And for Starfox Command, they force-fed the stylus control.
Which would lead me to worry about Starfox Wii, except that Dylan did denounce the right things in that statement.

So I'm hoping that if, IF, by some chance Nintendo gives Star Fox to these guys again, there might be some hope. If it's in some other company's hands...who knows. Now, if it could go back to an internal studio? That'd be great.

...I think.

HokutoNoBen · **Reply #13 on:** April 05, 2009, 06:00:11 AM

Quote from: Aldo on April 05, 2009, 05:40:32 AM

All the same, I can't help but be concerned when we haven't heard anything about another Star Fox game for a while, and knowing that Nintendo has gone through Rare, Namco, and now these guys trying to lend Star Fox to someone capable.

It's just a thing that happens a lot in this industry. Star Fox is certainly not the only Ninty franchise that has been traded off to different "hands", as it were.

Various Mario spin offs were handed off to the likes of Hudson (Mario Party) and Camelot (Golf). Even Zelda was handled by Capcom & Flagship, who did the Oracle and Minish Cap games.

I'd like to think that, eventually, Nintendo will either a) stop toying around, and just get EAD to do a game or b) if the case happens that Namco gets the go-ahead again, they'll do the DAMN THING this time around. Honestly, I was hoping more along the lines of "Ace Combat (with Furries this time)" when it came to Assault, instead I got what everyone else did with that game.

So again...if Namco is the one, they had oughta bring their A-game. Quite honestly, I can't stress it enough...the StarFox brand is precariously close to being in modern-day Sonic's territory. Whatever could be in the pipeline HAS to change the course, if the legacy is to be restored to what it had from the original, and especially SF64's legacies.

Quote

And for Starfox Command, they force-fed the stylus control.

Possibly so, but as one who tried as such, let me tell ya. Even playing the game with something closer to "traditional controls" (using Action Replay Codes) does NOT improve the game that much. It's still a pretty lackluster game, as a StarFox title or otherwise.

STM · **Reply #14 on:** April 05, 2009, 06:58:23 AM

Quote from: Viewtiful Ben on April 05, 2009, 06:00:11 AM

So again...if Namco is the one, they had oughta bring their A-game. Quite honestly, I can't stress it enough...the StarFox brand is precariously close to being in modern-day Sonic's territory.

"Being"? No, no... they crossed that line and flew passed Sonic the second the decided Star Fox Command was going to be a gigantic furry fanfiction. Come on, you can't possibly think THIS:

Quote from: Loosely Paraphrased Script from Starfox Command

Fox: Okay, we have a deadly group trying to attack Corneria. We should probably attempt to--
Slippy: FOX, DID YOU APOLOGIZE TO KRYSTAL?!
Fox: --No. Anywa--
Slippy: FOX YOU SHOULD APOLOGIZE TO KRYSTAL SHE LOVES YOU!!

...is any good. I mean, yeah, I smirked with Star Wolf and their antics ("Panther's taking you out on a hot date!" or "Hey! Missile! You Suck!") but when most of the story missions pretty much shot down any notion of a story just so two damn foxes would [tornado fang]/backstab each other, never mind the game was pretty garbage to begin with, they've far shot passed Modern-Day Sonic in terms of lack of quality.

I also wasn't a fan of Furry SOCOM in Assault.

HokutoNoBen · **Reply #15 on:** April 05, 2009, 07:22:46 AM

Quote from: STM on April 05, 2009, 06:58:23 AM

"Being"? No, no... they crossed that line and flew passed Sonic the second the decided Star Fox Command was going to be a gigantic furry fanfiction. Come on, you can't possibly think THIS:

...is any good. I mean, yeah, I smirked with Star Wolf and their antics ("Panther's taking you out on a hot date!" or "Hey! Missile! You Suck!") but when most of the story missions pretty much shot down any notion of a story just so two damn foxes would [tornado fang]/backstab each other, never mind the game was pretty garbage to begin with, they've far shot passed Modern-Day Sonic in terms of lack of quality.

Riddle me this, though, STM my friend:

Was Command at least fully PLAYABLE? As far as, no serious glitches or things of that nature?

That's not even something that a number of modern-day Sonic games can truly claim, ESPECIALLY Sonic 06; speaking of which, that particular game's got just as bad of a storyline (if not arguably worse).

I'll agree that Command was a bad game, just like Sonic 06 was a bad game. But if it came down to it, I would give Command the edge in being a "less crappy" game than Sonic 06. If that means any thing in the least...

Besides, I'm willing to give the Star Fox franchise more of a "benefit" as opposed to Sonic, because, well, for one, it has had fewer games, and furthermore, it's been changing hands between devs over the course of years, from game to game.

If the case were to happen that even EAD couldn't deliver on a Star Fox game, then I would think that Fox McCloud is in the same place as modern Sonic.

STM · **Reply #16 on:** April 05, 2009, 07:29:26 AM

I love how people still use Sonic 06 as a measuring stick. Yes, we all know the game is a walking piece of fail, yet it's the one everyone goes to as soon as Sonic needs a good flogging. Never mind Unleashed came and pretty much slapped everyone silly.

Those touch controls also made Command questionably playable. There's a few instances where what happened on screen didn't exactly make piloting any worth, usually regarding dodging and shooting at the same time, or the questionable capacity of lock-on. Title wise, one's a flagship mascot, another one... well... really isn't and has much smaller, niche fan base. Both have a questionable furry constituency that should definitely be burned in a fire, though. As for EAD, I think it's a bit worse that EAD won't even bother with the franchise than make a terrible game. Another franchise somewhat lacking here would be Kirby... at least on consoles. Where's that Kirby Wii, hm Nintendo? Oh, 2010? I look forward to the 2011 number next year, then.

Protoman Blues · **Reply #17 on:** April 05, 2009, 07:35:05 AM

But didn't the majority of people hate Sonic Unleashed? And the Black Knight as well? And Chronicles?

Gotham Ranger · **Reply #18 on:** April 05, 2009, 07:43:14 AM

Quote from: PBPB on April 05, 2009, 07:35:05 AM

But didn't the majority of people hate Sonic Unleashed?

Yes.

Quote

And the Black Knight as well?

Yes

Quote

And Chronicles?

Yes

Quote from: Jericho on April 05, 2009, 05:09:53 AM

I was waiting for your response honestly. Well played.

Aww, Jericho loves you

STM · **Reply #19 on:** April 05, 2009, 07:49:02 AM

Actually, Unleashed was pretty well received, strong media bias and idiot hivemind GAFers aside. Most people complained about the Werehog, sure, but some quickly double took when they just played through it. The other complaints I've seen around Unleashed would be that it's too fast (then stop boosting, moron.) or that it's too slow (...I'm not going to even comment on this one.) Chronicles was blasted hard for being largely cheap (but a very good job at writing... shame the rest of the game reeks of half-assed BioWare stuffing) and Black Knight... well... that one was pretty much doomed from the start. Releasing it so close to Unleashed Wii hurt it much more too.

Gotham Ranger · **Reply #20 on:** April 05, 2009, 07:54:17 AM

On the subject of Star Fox, I gotta say I didn't like Star Fox Command. It was okay, but I didn't like the drawing on the map to get to enemies, I didn't like the closed arenas because it was just you kicking ass and no one else which was always fun when you've got everyone going "OH MY GOD SAVE ME" and I just didn't generally like the Shadow The Hedgehog-esque choose your own story stuff

Protoman Blues · **Reply #21 on:** April 05, 2009, 07:56:05 AM

With both Sonic 06 and Star Fox Command, it was gameplay, not story, that made me never want to play the games.

HokutoNoBen · **Reply #22 on:** April 05, 2009, 07:59:07 AM

Quote from: STM on April 05, 2009, 07:29:26 AM

Never mind Unleashed came and pretty much slapped everyone silly.

...In what way?

Granted, it was probably the first decent console Sonic in years, but how much was that to say, when we had everything ranging from Sonic Heroes, Shadow and 06 before hand, as "precedents"?

It, like Black Knight, still had the problem that they weren't THAT good of games. They were just "better", compared to what we had to deal with before-hand.

Quote

As for EAD, I think it's a bit worse that EAD won't even bother with the franchise than make a terrible game.

Well, keep in mind, the different EAD teams are all busy with their own functions, ranging from Aonuma's team keeping Zelda on lock, to Kimura focusing on DS development. Probably the only one who could stand to make a game of Star Fox 64-calibur (or better), is EAD Tokyo. And , realistically speaking, Tokyo is probably busy making a follow-up to Mario Galaxy, or something else, to probably be bothered with StarFox at the moment.

If I was wrong, and they were actually doing something SF related, and were ready to at least start the hype train by E3 this year, I'd be pleasantly surprised. But at the same time, I'm not expecting as such. Or at least, not for a good, long while.

Quote

Another franchise somewhat lacking here would be Kirby... at least on consoles. Where's that Kirby Wii, hm Nintendo?

To be fair, you need to holla at HAL, rather than just Nintendo. They're the ones who "quietly" canceled the original GC game, just as quietly moved it to the Wii, and have just been...well, quiet, regarding the game, entirely.

Obviously, they still have a mandate, as Super Star's remake delivered, and the fans responded in kind. They'd need only to just be more forth coming with information...

Protoman Blues · **Reply #23 on:** April 05, 2009, 08:02:45 AM

They need to focus more on StarTropic 3 anyway!

Gotham Ranger · **Reply #24 on:** April 05, 2009, 08:04:20 AM

Quote from: PBPB on April 05, 2009, 07:56:05 AM

With both Sonic 06 and Star Fox Command, it was gameplay, not story, that made me never want to play the games.

Well, the story of both are pretty damn bad, but with Sonic 06 is was alot of the gameplay. SFC had pretty firm gameplay that could've used some tweaks. Co-op would've been awesome

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Can't let you do that, Dylan Cuthbert!

Aresian