The Official Pokemon Heart Gold & Soul Silver Discussion Thread

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Offline Akamaru

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Alright. I'll be online at that time. :d

EDIT: Wow... That was way too close for my comfort. I beat you by only two things: My new member of the team had Hydro Pump and I guess right in bringing out Outrage at that time. If not, your Fire & Dragon pokemon would have brought me down so fast and easily...


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Offline TheOnly

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I didnt know Salamance can learn hydro pump, and I got luck with a few of them critical hits as well. But other hen that, daaang, still have work to do. XD

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Offline Dr. Wily II

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Well, it seems Akamaru has been breeding Hydro Pump on Salamence... *makes note*
(Yes, Bagon learns Hydro Pump through breeding.)


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Offline Akamaru

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Well, it seems Akamaru has been breeding Hydro Pump on Salamence... *makes note*
(Yes, Bagon learns Hydro Pump through breeding.)
No! Damn! My poke rival learned a trump card of mine!  >w<

God knows how long it took me to do this. The right nature, transfer the right IV, and have the move Hydro Pump. I breed so many of them, that I am so sick of breeding.  O:<


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Offline TheOnly

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That was like a slap to the face with the white glove. -.-"

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Offline Sakura Leic

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Okay I finally reduced my team to six pokemon and have nick names and moves for all of the them.

Feraligatr: Posiedon
Nature: Adamant
Moves: Aqua Tail, Crunch, Earthquake, Swords Dance
Item: Not decided

Absol: Artemis
Nature: Adamant
Ability: Super Luck
Moves: Nightslash, Psycho Cut, X-Scisor, Swords Dance
Item: Focus Lens

Blaziken: Vulcan
Nature: Adamant
Moves: Sky Uppercut, Blaze kick, Shadow Claw, Earthquake
Item: Expert Belt

Lucario: Fenrir
Nature: Modest
Moves: Dark Pulse, Aura Sphere, Calm Mind, Psychic
Item: Not decided

Roserade: Demeter
Nature: Calm
Ability: Poison Point
Moves: Synthesis, Energy Ball, Shadow Ball, Sludge Bomb
Item: Leftovers, Black Sludge, or Shell Bell.

Salamence: Bahamut
Nature: Adamant
Moves: Fly, Dragon Claw, Earth Quake, Dragon Dance
Item: Not decided

So what do you guys think and do you have tips on items, moves or stuff like that?

Current playthrough: Chrono Trigger and God Eater Ressurection


Offline Hypershell

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Gotta run for Smallville, Sakura, but I promise I'll take a look at your team later.

Says the guy who used Ttar and Dragonite against a UU team.
In all honesty, I truly feel that Single Battling tiers mean jack in Doubles.  Case in point: Wobuffet.  Further case in point: I may have taken an Uber against 'maru, but it was paired with an NU.

My usual team is literally all over the tier list, consisting of one Uber, one OU (DRAGONITE POWER, naturally), one BL, two UU's, and one NU.  When I fought 'maru I was missing a UU, but then he only saw half of my usual team members anyway.  The fourth 'man to finish him off was my in-game Dragonite, who I brought along by mistake.

So I have to ask: am I a horrible person?
Yes.  Because if you're actually a good Double battler, bringing down an all-Uber team is pretty simple.  They're usually assembled by people who have no clue what they're doing and as such relatively simple to beat.  I once brought down a Dialga by having Rotom para-fusion it to death.

Of course, this is coming from somebody who will bring snakers in Mario Kart DS into a Battle course and wait for them to do something that crashes their game, so I don't know how much my word means to you.

The two-Uber teams you're seeing now are probably a result of people prepping for Nintendo's latest tournament.  That's their new limit, although they still outright ban the promotionals.  Of course, their definition of "Uber" is a little narrower than Smogon's.  IE: Latios is legal as long as you're not carrying Soul Dew.

Honestly, why are all Rock-moves so crappish?
Yet another reason I take Smogon with a grain of salt; they regard Stone Edge as a stable of physical attackers.  As far as good Rock moves go, Power Gem's decent, but it's not available to many 'mans.

I find it hilariously ironic that pretty much everybody who plays PokeMon competitively shoots for the same individual values, 31s all around.

If everybody's going for 31 IVs in Speed and whatever attacking/defending stat(s) your PokeMon uses, then where's the individuality?
I find it funnier that Nintendo enforces no law of averages with IVs.  Everyone claims that a 'man with 3 or 4 31's was probably hacked, but I know for a fact that does not work in reverse, because I once caught a 'man with *FOUR* 0's, and the remaining IVs in single digits.

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Offline Sakura Leic

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Okay thanks Hypershell.

Current playthrough: Chrono Trigger and God Eater Ressurection


Offline Akamaru

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What I notice is that most of your pokemon are that they are power hitters with the right natures, but weak on the defensive side. In other words, you have to hit first or chances are, your pokemon will be One Hit KO. An example is that all my members of my team are 250 SPD or faster. If your team doesn't have anyone as fast, you're going to regret it.

I would recommend Choice items like Choice Scarf. It will increase a stat by 50% at the cost of only using 1 move. An example is my level 20 Gengar has 60 SPD. if I give it Choice Scarf, it will increase its SPD by 30 points, for a total of 90. But like I said, the cost is that you can only use one move and with a weak-ish pokemon on the defense, its going to be hard.

That's all I can say. There is also the regular items like Life Orb that 1.3x your attacks for 10% of your health or Expert Belt, which will increase Super Effective moves by 20%. These would be better for you, since I notice that a lot of your pokemon has Calm Mind or Swords Dance.


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Offline Sakura Leic

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Hmm I see, that would be a good idea since the only real speed hitter I got would be Salamence while most of the others, theoretically since I have started training them yet, only barely hit it.  I need Will to give me the Power Items, and TMs after I fight the elite 4 for massive amounts of cash to buy Vitamins.

Current playthrough: Chrono Trigger and God Eater Ressurection


Offline Akamaru

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Oh yea, forgot to mention. Get rid of Fly for your Salamence. With the extra turn you give by going up, I can switch my pokemon for another one that has a resistance to Flying. That or my pokemon gets stronger by putting up a weather effect like Rain or Bulk Up. For the Salamence's case, replace it with another attack like Stone Edge or maybe a Sp. Att. move like Flamethrower/Fire Blast or Draco Meter. Do so with any other pokemon that you may have that has Dive or Dig.


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Offline Sakura Leic

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Okay I'll replace it with Flamethrower.

Current playthrough: Chrono Trigger and God Eater Ressurection


Offline Solar

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Absol: Artemis
Nature: Adamant
Ability: Super Luck
Moves: Nightslash, Psycho Cut, X-Scisor, Swords Dance
Item: Focus Lens

No Sucker Punch? Absol's speed is mediocre you know =/


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Offline Sakura Leic

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Hmm maybe that would be a better subsitute.

Current playthrough: Chrono Trigger and God Eater Ressurection


Offline Solar

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Sword danced Sucker Punches are great for sweeping, although I guess it could get predictable and the other person would start using stat up moves until you run out of PP.


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Offline Sakura Leic

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Hmm would my team be a bit better if I replaced one with a Metagross?

Current playthrough: Chrono Trigger and God Eater Ressurection


Offline Akamaru

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Depends. TheOnly's Metagross is the hardest for me to defeat. Since 2 members of my team are Dragon, the Steel typing is really hard to defeat. And oh god, his Bullet Punch... The move took down two other of my pokemon. However, since there are a lot of Fire moves, you team could be taken down due to too much Fire weakness. Good thing your team doesn't have that, so if anything, it could replace Roserade since both have the same weakness in that regards.


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Offline Sakura Leic

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I see, so how about a Impish Natured one with Meteor Mash, Zen Headbutt, Earthquake and Agility?

Current playthrough: Chrono Trigger and God Eater Ressurection


Offline Akamaru

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Sounds good. Not sure about Agility. Even with a beneficial Nature and 31 IV in speed, its speed will only reach up to about 260, so with Impish Nature, it won't be able to reach that or be fast enough in general. Why don't you go like the mentioned Bullet Punch, which always strikes first and has a STAB or Reflect or Light Screen to up your defense? Although, if you go for the defense moves, you might wanna consider Rest. You should know the benefits and risks with that move.


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Offline Sakura Leic

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Hmm yeah I guess Reflect would be a good choice.

Current playthrough: Chrono Trigger and God Eater Ressurection


Offline Hypershell

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Metagross is a force to be reckoned with, but I'd think twice before using Rest.  These days the game is just too offensive to risk sleeping for two turns.  It's also setup bait if you don't have Sleep Talk (and even if you do, there's a 1/3 chance Sleep Talk will choose Rest and do nothing anyway).

Well, as promised, Sakura, here are my thoughts on your team members:

Feraligatr:
Nice, although you'll need an opponent reasonably slow to get the jump on them.  I would HIGHLY recommend axing Crunch for Ice Punch (Platinum/HG/SS Move Tutor).  You have plenty of Ghost/Dark attacks in your team already and no Ice attacks.  Feraligatr isn't really fast enough to get the jump on a Dragon, but it's still nice coverage against Flying and makes Grass think twice before trying to set up.

Absol:
Super Luck, nice.  Sucker Punch, as previously suggested, is a great idea since it'll compensate against faster opponents, and Absol has the attack strength and STAB to use it exceptionally well.  I'm not sure how much good Psycho Cut will do you; Absol's defenses are poor and his speed not impressive; he should not be staying in battle against a Fighting type.  Ever.  For the same reason Swords Dance's usefulness is a bit limited; you need to be darn sure that it's safe to power-up (on the other hand, Sucker Punch when you know an attack is coming and Swords Dance when you know one isn't could work well).  I would also seriously consider Superpower (Plat/HG/SS Move Tutor), as it'll prevent Absol from being completely walled by a Steel type.

Blaziken:
If you're not running any non-attacking moves, Blaziken may be a good candidate for a Choice item.  Your team consists mostly of medium-speed heavy hitters, so you might want a Choice Scarf here to mix things up.  Blaziken could work great as a revenge killer (be aware, with Adamant and not Jolly, there is the off chance that some of the exceptionally fast Pokemon, if also having a Speed boosting Nature, may outrun you anyway; this includes Jolteon, Aerodactyl, Crobat, and Mewtwo).  Consider Flare Blitz/Brave Bird; I know recoil is a concern, but that level of power and accuracy can be well worth it.

Lucario:
Plenty of room to experiment here, since there's a lot that Lucario can do.  Since you're going the special route, Vacuum Wave, Dragon Pulse, and Flash Cannon are all alternatives you might want to consider.  Calm Mind is great, but I'd consider axing Psychic.  Lucario is completely immune to Poison, and if stuck against a Fighting type, you'd be better off switching to Salamence than pushing a bad position.  Also, with plenty of resistances and Calm Mind to boost Special Defense, Leftovers may be a good choice for an item.

Roserade:
Sleep Powder is definitely worth considering, since it gives you something for Roserade to do against virtually anyone (barring Insomnia and Lum Berry), and can make a nice opportunity for setup.  Your ideal item from your choices is Black Sludge; Shell Bell's healing is inferior and Black Sludge will make your enemy think twice before using Trick (this is uncommon but it can REALLY screw you over if the user is holding something bad).

Salamence:
As said, ditch Fly.  Outrage/Fire Blast/Earthquake/Dragon Dance Salamence is pretty much standard, but it is devastating nonetheless.  You're basically running that with two substitutions for reliability over power.  Dragon Claw over Outrage avoids leaving you locked in exchange for only 2/3 the power.  IMHO Outrage is well worth it but it's up to you.  Flamethrower over Fire Blast is accurate, but since you're investing in physical power and lack STAB, you really could use Fire Blast's extra strength.  And 85% accuracy is better than most of the other power moves, so it is worth considering.  I'd certainly understand if you don't want to risk a miss, but even with a weakness on your side, Flamethrower may take a good couple of hits to bring down some of the bulky Pokemon like Bronzong.  For an item I'd go with an attack booster like Dragon Fang, Muscle Band, or if you can risk the recoil, Life Orb (common item in "standard" play, but I personally would not recommend it since Salamence is defensively valuable to your other team members, like Absol and Lucario).

Overall:
As mentioned earlier you could use some work-arounds for your Speed issues.  Priority moves, Thunder Wave support, Choice Scarfing, that kind of thing.  Your team is overall very straightforward attacking.  The stat-ups are nice but some status annoyers could help you.  You have no attacks of either Electric or Ice, both key offensive types, and an over-abundance of Dark/Ghost attacks, which besides their affect on Normal and Fighting are otherwise identical.  You really do not need 5 of your 6 Pokemon to all be carrying attacks geared towards the same two types of opponents.  On the plus side, Lucario and Salamence have some great synergy, being able to cover each other's weaknesses.  In fact, you're pretty good on type variance as a whole, although something to resist Electric (to cover Feraligator) and/or Flying (to cover Roserade and Blaziken) attacks might be helpful.

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Offline Sakura Leic

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Hmm yeah those are some very great suggestions Hypershell. I was very worried about the fact that I had no Ice attacks, Electric not so much since it's only really effective against flying and water type pokemon which Ice and Grass can take care of most them.  If I come across a Ice/Water type I'll use a Fighting type and I'm pretty sure I won't fight a Gyarados or Pelipper anytime soon if ever.  Though I'll also be experimenting with other pokemon eventually and will be sure to teach Gardevior Thunder Bolt or Thunder.

I didn't really consider Rest for Metagross since it's not right for a pokemon with so much power to be sleeping...except for a Mammoswine with a Chesto Berry I guess.  Plus I need it to counter Will's Metagross since it has Explosion instead of Magnet Rise.  Plus frying it with Blaziken and Salamance should give me an edge though his team is built for mostly speed.

His team consists of Jolteon, Espeon, Absol, Tyranitar, Metagross and the dreaded Garchomp which he named Katsu, which is the japanese word for victory according to him.  I'm guessing my team might stand no chance against them especially if you didn't give me those move chance suggestions.

The other 4 pokemon I was considering besides those 6 were Metagross, Gallade, Gardevoir and Mammoswine.

Current playthrough: Chrono Trigger and God Eater Ressurection


Offline TheOnly

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*sigh*, Akamaru, I didn't expect that Charizard to bust a foucus blast on me, after that blow, I sorttaknew I was gonna lose. XD . Other then that, good battle.

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Offline Akamaru

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What surprised me is you bringing out 4 new pokemons on me. Truth be told, I just taught my Charizard that move today. I was having trouble with Steel types lately that I decided to have a few Fight moves. Sucks that I still don't think I can defeat Hypershell yet... However, I aim to please and surprise. I Am going to need new trained pokemon soon or your going to memorize all my team's moves.  >3<


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Offline Tickle Buffalo

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His team consists of Jolteon, Espeon, Absol, Tyranitar, Metagross and the dreaded Garchomp which he named Katsu, which is the japanese word for victory according to him.

lol google translate

Also yeah your team is slow as hell and half of them will probably get killed in one hit. Priority/Scarves everywhere = super good idea. And switch SD to DD on Feraligatr. Or swap him for a Gyarados, Gyarados is way cooler anyway.

Quote
The other 4 pokemon I was considering besides those 6 were Metagross, Gallade, Gardevoir and Mammoswine.

You actually might wanna use Mamoswine, tbh. Just so you can ruin To Win the Garchomp. Ice Shard, hoooooo.