Topic: Ancient Theories/Fanon

[The Great Gonzo]

I didn't expect anyone to touch this thread again. 

Yeah, I did get a fangirl vibe from Boco, the way you put it; really, Sigma hitting on X before attempting to tear him to shreds? I haven't gotten that far in the SNES version (PSP--beaten), so I can only imagine it was a very creatively interpreted loose thread or something...

As for their calling X "Megaman", blame the marketers. Maybe they thought they were the same robot, or just didn't care.

I recall having very odd arguments with Boco, such as whether Protoman was genuinely evil to begin with (she insisted he was and even wrote a fanfic where he branded Dr. Light as something akin to a brainwashing bastard).

Blame MM3/5?

[Gauntlet101010]

I remember Boco's translations ... so they weren't too accurate after all?

  I still say X's full name is "Megaman X".  Even though it adds to the confusion between classic and X, it's still the official work on his name.

[Zan]

Just wondering, with the two translation documents up at gamefaqs, are the Japanese transcripts correct?

Also, I noticed MegaMan X Complete on the translation site, any chance we'll be seeing the X games redone again?

Huh What I still say X's full name is "Megaman X".  Even though it adds to the confusion between classic and X, it's still the official work on his name.

Full name RockmanX / MegamanX. But everybody in the setting, with the exception of three or so people just knows him as X. Instead of just converting "Rock" to "Mega", localization took it a step further by making instances where "X" is turned into "MegaMan."

[Bag of Magic Food]

Maybe they thought they were the same robot, or just didn't care.

Maybe they should have been the same robot.

[TDOMMX]

Blame MM3/5?

I'm more inclined to blame Ruby Spears.  I pointed out the fact that there were impostors in those games, but her response was "WHAT ARE YOU ON?!?"

Just wondering, with the two translation documents up at gamefaqs, are the Japanese transcripts correct?

I would assume so; the entire game is in katakana and hiragana (no kanji), so I doubt she messed any of that up.  With my current knowledge of Japanese, I might eventually be able to make such a transcript myself once I zero in on the text in the Japanese version.  On that note, if I revisit the project, I will not be editing the US version as I had in the past - Japanese source material all the way.  My currently-inactive pet project gave me the skills to add variable-width fonts and edit graphics in SNES games, so it'd be possible (unless I run up against some really funky compression).

Maybe they should have been the same robot.

Nope.  If we're talking about fanon, my theory would be that the original Megaman did something horrible at the end of the original and had to be destroyed.  Why else would Dr. Light stress that X be thoroughly tested before being activated?  He seemed pretty adamant in the prologue: "If 'X' were to break the first rule of robotics, 'a robot must never harm a human being', <b>the results would be disastrous and I fear that no force on earth could stop him</b>."  Granted, I know that the ending of Megaman 7 was entirely made up, but that doesn't change the fact that Dr. Light's message sounded panicky (by the way, that was English in the original version, so there are no translation errors).

Also, I noticed MegaMan X Complete on the translation site, any chance we'll be seeing the X games redone again?

That has yet to be seen.  At the moment, it's there because the projects section records every (announced) project that we have ever touched.  If it was my name instead of Darkside, you would see Ys II, Felghana, the NNL stuff, etc. On that note, it's a bit of a pity that my work on Haru no Ashioto and Wind went unreleased, and my name was stricken from the ef staff list since I recused myself in January (I was sick at the time and the RKS project was beginning to hit full stride, so I had to make a choice).  I'm still credited in the ef Supah Preview (God, I hate that name...), so I'm not sour about it.  Besides, GipFace did a pretty good job building on my work, from what I had seen, so there are no hard feelings.  I'd like to return to that project, but I'm not about to leave my guys high and dry, especially not anytime soon.

Whoops.  Tangent.  Anyway, since Maverick Hunter X was already released, I'm wondering whether or not I should bother revisiting the project - MHX was superior in every way (barring the campy dialogue).  My staff is interested, to say the least, and RKS easily has more text than Megaman X-X3 combined.  Once the full version of RKS is out, I'll make my decision.  Mint already reports that he and Tanin are interested in tackling it.  If I can find another translator, then it might just happen.

[VixyNyan]

With my current knowledge of Japanese, I might eventually be able to make such a transcript myself once I zero in on the text in the Japanese version.

Saving you some time and trouble here. ^^

[Gauntlet101010]

Maybe they should have been the same robot.

Seconded.  It woulda been simpler this way and possibly better.  'twas not to be though...

[Bag of Magic Food]

On that note, if I revisit the project, I will not be editing the US version as I had in the past - Japanese source material all the way.

Does that include translating the instruction manual?  That's like half the story right there.

Seconded.  It woulda been simpler this way and possibly better.  'twas not to be though...

Heck, every Megaman series should star the exact same Megaman.

Wouldn't that be simple

[VixyNyan]

Does that include translating the instruction manual?  That's like half the story right there.

Here's the manual for translating, from RPM to the fans. ^^

[Dr. Wily II]

Heck, every Megaman series should star the exact same Megaman.

Wouldn't that be simple

... Funding needed right here.

[TDOMMX]

Saving you some time and trouble here. ^^

I was well aware of these, actually.  I showed this page to Mint after I presented my credentials when our groups first teamed up (note that RKS is a joint project between Darkside and Zeppy - I can't (and have no intention to) take full credit for it).  That's when he and Tanin expressed interest in reviving the project.  Still, I appreciate the thought.  Thanks.

What I meant in my last post was dumping the script in Shift-JIS and running it through a parser to make sure that Boco's transcript is 100% accurate.  Flat-out romanizations are easy.  Converting loanwords and names is the hard part (and, if katakana is capitalized, that saves a lot of time when I skim the output).  I could romanize the whole thing using the images, sure, but that'd be time-consuming and I'm occupied with other things at the moment (RKS full version, reformatting my laptop, and preparing for my university graduation next week).

As for every Megaman series starring the same character:  that'd be a bit boring.  You need variety (one of the reasons why Adam Sessler can't stand Megaman games - Capcom doesn't really seem to know where to innovate).  Plus, wouldn't it be odd if Megaman Zero was the original Megaman?  That's make the Megaman X series a total mess...

[VixyNyan]

I can help you with the Japanese text, including the Shift-JIS, if you like. ^^

[Zan]

Anyway, since Maverick Hunter X was already released

I don't think X1 really needs a retranslation (except for the story in the manual), the game is simple enough and appears to be localized correctly when compared to even Boco's work. Of the SNES games it's X2 and X3 that seems to suffer the most from localization. Of the PSX games, I think X5 is the most needed, followed by X6. But I reckon that in hacking terms, X1~3 would be far easier. And I guess after all those years it'd be nice to have the foundation of the series at least solidified.

Also, I share the sentiments that the instruction manuals for X1~3 need to be retranslated. There's some nice material that should be there, like some details to X's schematics and the rewritten version of the X1 warning that talks of worrying and Wily. And in X2, all the stuff revolving around Zero's attempted resurrection by Cain which ended in failure. Half the story right there, indeed.

X1's manual is a bit odd though. The manual of the SFC version is actually incomplete. It seems Capcom of America made up Cain's Journal for the American release, but the subsequent Japanese port for PC included an altered version of the journal. Apparently they made an American fabrication canon by changing it to their liking.

Seconded.  It woulda been simpler this way and possibly better.

I don't think so. What should have happened is that Capcom should have explained it properly right away without localization trying to change it.

[Bag of Magic Food]

Plus, wouldn't it be odd if Megaman Zero was the original Megaman?

Yeah, that would be the big plot twist!  The new Zero is the old Megaman, and the new Megaman is the old Zero, after they got involved with some kind of brain switch machine!

[Gauntlet101010]

We can top that off with the Master from Legends being none other than Dr. Wily (who was also Sigma the whole time)!

[The Great Gonzo]

I'll go with the Master being an alien (but still human), myself.


I've spent two days lurking around Angelfire, after finding out that it had a search function (something Tripod doesn't seem to have. One point for Angelfire!). My goal? To find as much old Megaman stuff as possible, be it minor or major. (Which, admittedly, is less "theories" as it is "they didn't even care when they wrote this") Turns out there was a lot of interesting material there, amongst all the RPGs that weren't updated since the day they went up and horribly designed pages, the only purpose of which seemed to be to murder my eyes.

http://angelfire.com/theforce2/megaman/ - Claims Protoman was brainwashed by Dr. Wily.

http://mmxz.zophar.net/ - Not on Angelfire, but found though it. Apparently confuses Protoman's personality with Bass's.

http://angelfire.com/wv/sOnIc/mm.html - Bungles the plots of MM3-6 and 8 (slightly; "EVIL" wasn't really a spirit). Would you have ever guessed that Protoman was the Big Bad of MM6?

Quoted in case the site ever goes kaput:

Megaman III -  NES, Game Boy, PC

Not again. Dr. Wily doesn't know when to give up. Can Megaman defeat him again, This time, Megaman will have a little help from his new dog, Rush, and his best friend, Roll.

Megaman IV - NES, Game Boy

Will Dr. Wily ever give up or is he going to create these robots till the end of time? Megaman must go defeat even harder robots like Toad Man and Dive Man and Skull Man and make the world a safer place.

Megaman V - NES, Game Boy

Dr. Wily has created a brother for Megaman named Protoman. Sometimes, Protoman will help Megaman. Others, he will try to defeat Megaman as much as possible. Can Megaman defeat both Protoman and Dr. Wily?

 Megaman VI -  NES

Dr. Wily strikes again, and so does Protoman. But, Megaman has more help this time. Megaman will use Beat, his pet bird, to get to places and use Rush as super armor.

http://angelfire.com/mb/megaman1/ - Confuses Megaman with X. Lots of horrible low-res pics and animated sprites on crack.

http://angelfire.com/mo/giants/ - Mentions Metool's Megaman Rockworld, Mega Boy's Megaman Homepage, and Realm of Megaman X--all defunct.

http://angelfire.com/ultra/megamanworld/ - Has a page devoted to the RM3/MM3 prototype.

http://angelfire.com/ult/ace/batton.html - Details the creation of a newsprint Battonton; there's more on the site itself.

http://angelfire.com/ex/megazero/ - Claims X is Mega, without giving any evidence. (Something quite a few people on Angelfire did, actually. Megaman-is-X, supergifs, and grainy official art were all recurring themes)

http://angelfire.com/dragon/megamanbass/ - Devoted to Megaman and Bass; refers to King as "King Robot".

http://angelfire.com/games/calc/mm.txt - Description of a calculator fangame.

http://angelfire.com/games/megaman1/infopage.html - Says Protoman "vanished in an accident" and was "tricked" by Dr. Wily (Wily didn't trick him; Proto was just grateful). Also uses a pic of Volnutt in reference to the original Megaman (which Cannon Spike also did...).

http://angelfire.com/games5/gizmonics/ - "Megaman X Nightmare" demo; the link to the demo doesn't work.

http://angelfire.com/nt/okenet/rockdata.html - Uses Megamix pixel art; their data is off. Just read Elecman's bio.

http://angelfire.com/games3/mmx0/comics.html - Contains info on the series up to Zero. (Only once did I see ZX mentioned on all of Angelfire)

http://angelfire.com/biz4/t87megaman/index.html - Vile X Lab. Closed.

http://angelfire.com/comics/mmo3/ - A fan comic with original designs.

http://angelfire.com/anime5/megaman-zero-project/ - Creates a factless story about Protoman's presence in the X series. (I don't remember if it was a fanfic-oriented site or giving the "facts")

http://angelfire.com/comics/tamm/ - A strange sprite comic with awful grammar.

http://angelfire.com/falcon/favoritestuff/ - Arbitrarily connects Ruby-Spears Megaman with Astro Boy. (OK, Classic I could understand...but RUBY-SPEARS?!)

http://angelfire.com/rpg2/megamanultama/ - Contains a few fangames. (I didn't test them to see if they still worked)

http://angelfire.com/hero/protozero/ - An odd sprite comic; plot feels very DBZ-ish, from what I read of it.

http://angelfire.com/anime5/thelair/mmarchive.html - Detailed site; includes info on the Jazwares figure and the Ruby-Spears production (which is really just his two cents on both matters, but no one else was talking about them...)

http://angelfire.com/games3/megamanX/ - Claims Protoman was the Big Bad of MM4. (I can't get the link to work, so don't bother with it. You'll just get 404'd.)

http://angelfire.com/me4/fanworks/mfw/main.html - Contains a translation of the X5 manga (no scans, just text).


All in all, I've got a slightly better idea of what the fandom looked like back then...at least on Angelfire. (R.I.P., Geocities) Whaddya think? (By the way, I wouldn't have touched this thread again if Vixy hadn't said it was all right. Thank you )

[Gauntlet101010]

Actually that RM3 proto info is worth getting.  *YOINK*!  

Not all of these are really from "the day", some were just poorly made.  Anything from 2002 forward was not back in the "dark ages".  And much of the info from the 90's was VERY innacurate and more in the spirit of the thread.

And some of these links are now broken links ... bandwidth maybe?  

Other examples might include the Sinister 6.  Especially the Nostalgia section I set up there.   http://sinister6.com/nostalgia/index.html   Basically, that's all of Ice's old stuff from 97 up until they moved to PMM and changed the layout.  While the site made it out of the MM "dark ages", there are still pages there that show it's age ... mostly in that nostalgia section.  Pages back then were more about having a bit of fun and not being too concerned with "canon".  

http://www.mmhp.net/ Mandi's site is a survivor of that bygone era.  If you read through it, parts of it show it.  I haven't looked at the "Mega Musings", but I think that would hve a good degree of old fanon in it.  

My own site is another survivor and has some antique things in there (you know, aside from just being a "Megaman Team" - a very old idea that's obscure now).  Although my own fanon is tucked away out of sight since I don't support my old ideas anymore. 

[Flame]

Wow...

http://angelfire.com/mb/megaman1/

this site almost made me vomit...

[Rin]

Wow... this site almost made me vomit...

      Zero

Although Zero could be put in the next section of this page, I thought it was important enought to give her her own section.

Anyways, Zero came into action in the X series and looks pretty cool, and is a good character to use in the game.

Ha ha, oh wow.

[The Great Gonzo]

Not all of these are really from "the day", some were just poorly made.  Anything from 2002 forward was not back in the "dark ages".  And much of the info from the 90's was VERY innacurate and more in the spirit of the thread.

Those were the oldest I could find, sadly; I remember one site with a date earlier than 2000, and...there was nothing on it. (I think it might've been another neglected RPG.)

And some of these links are now broken links ... bandwidth maybe?

The hell? I thought I typed everything properly...

I thought it was important enought to give her her own section.

I didn't notice that.


With Gauntlet's words in mind, I'll be searching for even older sites. Which turned out far less successfully than hoped. Closest I got was this: http://www.geocities.com/TelevisionCity/Station/3196/Mega-Sonic.html (By the way, what were your old theories like?)

Edit: http://maelgrim.tripod.com/Rockman1.html - Found Maelgrim's site.
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Arena/2944/ - Looks like M. Sipher's page (pre-King Weasel Productions?), but I don't think he ever went by "dix" (the e-mail address given).

[Flame]

http://www.darkmessiah.delum.net/index.html

not quite ancient, But I figured d drop this here. it was a really good, (in my opinion) Idea of Forte in the X series. It DOES include the cataclysm hypothesis, where Zero kills off the original cast, but the guy made an interesting twist on how Zero entered his capsule for the 100 year sleep. and of how Forte is put in the X series. it never continued since its last update almost 3 years ago, but it was still good I think.

[Bag of Magic Food]

http://angelfire.com/wv/sOnIc/mm.html - Bungles the plots of MM3-6 and 8 (slightly; "EVIL" wasn't really a spirit).

Dr. Wily has created a brother for Megaman named Protoman. Sometimes, Protoman will help Megaman. Others, he will try to defeat Megaman as much as possible.

LOL

Would you have ever guessed that Protoman was the Big Bad of MM6?

Yeah, he really "struck" at me with that Energy Balancer he threw.  Luckily I dodged it, claimed it for myself, and used it to beat that evil red dude's forces!

[The Great Gonzo]

I never did find Proto in MM6...that EB would've helped out. Selfish bastard!

As for the sites...I think I'm really grasping at straws here.

http://us.geocities.com/EnchantedForest/Dell/1361/joel_mega_man_home_page.html Hasn't been touched since 1997. Oddly, Protoman is listed as both an ally and an enemy of Megaman; they also claim that Sigma built all the Mavericks.

http://us.geocities.com/megajosh30/main.html God knows when this place was updated (the "Stories" section only goes up to Legends 1, so that's a hint). States that Dr. Wily attacked people with his robots long before Protoman was built (did they confuse the Classic series with The Protomen?).

"Megaman Central" - I don't have the link (it's dead anyway), but I do remember it stating that Megaman and co. lived in "Giga City" (did Capcom ever name the place where they live?).

http://www.geocities.com/Yosemite/Geyser/7968/home.htm - MegaMan 2000. It looks like it's got some good stuff on there, but it's all in Spanish (the English section of the site is completely different). Seems to only go up to MMX6.

Not really old, but there's still some great stuff on here (a lot better than what I've dredged up): http://megaman.robotvaudeville.com/ Gotta love how NP mispells the Fake Bad of MM4's name as "Cassock", and how Gamefan theorized that Double would be playable in X4. Yeah. DOUBLE.


Most of those links came from the Megaman Homepage. There were quite a few broken links in the "Classic" section...

[Bag of Magic Food]

Did you try archive.org on all of them?

[The Great Gonzo]

Did you try archive.org on all of them?

Archive.org hates Geocities.

Really, I was just focused on the sites that were still up. I checked some others, and there was nothing interesting there. I'll look some more in a bit.