GENERAL COMIC BOOK THREAD (MANGA NOT ALLOWED)

Rin · 216311

0 Members and 4 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline Bueno Excelente

  • Diddlyboodlyzoodly
  • Master's Unit
  • *
    • Posts: 3839
    • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Reply #1100 on: October 28, 2011, 03:30:31 PM
I like Spider-MJ for no reason whatsoever than for the fact that it's kinda hot. I'm enjoying this in a Spider-Man 3 situation. (Seeing as I honestly hated the first two movies, and I had so much fun with the way 3 didn't take itself seriously at all). Normally, superhero events nowadays are synonimous with [parasitic bomb]. There are few that can be salvaged at all. This one, for all the crap it was, didn't really bother me in a way that shits on Marvel continuously.

Seriously, stuff like World War Hulks or Fear Itself are much worse. This seemed pretty self-contained, and it left no cliffhangers. Just a few unexplained things which we'll deal with in the coming issue.



Offline Protoman Blues

  • Green Lantern of Sector 1337
  • RPM Knight
  • ****
    • Posts: 31343
    • Gender: Male
  • Searching for Wanda
    • View Profile
Reply #1101 on: October 28, 2011, 08:17:12 PM
I enjoy Spider-Man 3 as well, but it's an awful movie. Lots of movies don't take themselves seriously and are better than Spider-Man 3. As for superhero events being synonymous with [parasitic bomb], that's mainly an Earth-Marvel thing lately, as most of DC's big events and Cosmic-Marvel have actually been really good as of late.

This whole thing was not only stupid, but only served to remind me of the two worst Spidey events in history, OMD/OMiT and The Clone Saga. Having MJ in this story was 100% pointless other than the fact to once again tease the fact that they're not together anymore. In fact them being together, or at the VERY least separated due to a logical, non-devil reason, would've actually made this story better, due to the added concern of her well-being/being transformed into a giant spider creature, coupled with the relief of her "immunity" due to being around Peter so long (still a stupid reason, but whatever). MJ being able to actually see and feel what it's like to be Peter would've offered a whole new perspective on their relationship, whether together or intelligently seperated. Instead, all the thing did was what they do now with her character, and that's tease their [parasitic bomb] breakup in the hopes of keeping Spidey fans reading this [parasitic bomb] comic so that maybe they'll undo their [parasitic bomb] breakup, which they most likely won't for a long time.

And yeah, Fear Itself is a much worse event. It doesn't make this [parasitic bomb]-fest any less shitty.



Offline Pyro

  • Wielder of the Chaos Force
  • Neo Arcadian
  • *
    • Posts: 1821
    • Gender: Male
  • Boo yeah!
    • View Profile
Reply #1102 on: November 02, 2011, 06:45:58 PM
...ANNNNNNND it looks like Carlie Cooper dumped Peter Parker and there was much rejoicing! (If I'm reading the reactions from the fanbase right.) I didn't know much about the character but she did feel so forced after the marriage retcon. This a good or a bad thing?

Come and read some Thoughts of a Platypus


Offline Protoman Blues

  • Green Lantern of Sector 1337
  • RPM Knight
  • ****
    • Posts: 31343
    • Gender: Male
  • Searching for Wanda
    • View Profile
Reply #1103 on: November 02, 2011, 08:30:05 PM
Well I found her character pretty pointless, as well as drawn differently in just about every issue, so we'll see where this goes.



Offline Waifu

  • Ultimate Despair
  • Master's Unit
  • *
    • Posts: 2693
    • Gender: Male
  • Kanako, the Moriya Shrine Goddess
    • View Profile
Reply #1104 on: November 03, 2011, 05:40:35 AM
I just wonder why every Superman expy gets a deconstruction? Whether it is Supreme or the Plutonian, the superman expy gets taken apart or at elast analyzed for good measure. I am not bashing on Supes but why does he get deconstructed?



Offline Flame

  • The obsessive
  • RPM Soldier
  • ****
    • Posts: 16013
    • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Reply #1105 on: November 06, 2011, 07:25:29 AM
[spoiler= Suicide Squad 3]

I wasnt aware Harley had herself a Joker style makeover involving bleached white skin and the like; or as The Batman's Joker likes to call it, "Perma Clown"[/spoiler]

...When Larry the reploid accountant goes maverick of his own accord, he's certainly formidable during tax season, but he isn't going to provide X the challenge needed to make him grow as a warrior and reach his potential.


Offline Quickman

  • Crystal Clod and
  • RPM Sorcerer
  • ****
    • Posts: 29820
    • Gender: Female
  • Classy clod
    • View Profile
    • B. Roth Arts
Reply #1106 on: February 02, 2012, 05:37:34 AM


Offline Protoman Blues

  • Green Lantern of Sector 1337
  • RPM Knight
  • ****
    • Posts: 31343
    • Gender: Male
  • Searching for Wanda
    • View Profile
Reply #1107 on: February 02, 2012, 05:53:07 AM
It could be good. It could also be really bad.

We'll see!



Offline Quickman

  • Crystal Clod and
  • RPM Sorcerer
  • ****
    • Posts: 29820
    • Gender: Female
  • Classy clod
    • View Profile
    • B. Roth Arts
Reply #1108 on: February 02, 2012, 05:57:10 AM
I'm on the fence.  The fact that it's about a different character has my hopes up for something pretty decent, but... it's a sequel.  That's where I pause.


Offline Waifu

  • Ultimate Despair
  • Master's Unit
  • *
    • Posts: 2693
    • Gender: Male
  • Kanako, the Moriya Shrine Goddess
    • View Profile
Reply #1109 on: February 03, 2012, 02:39:15 AM
DC decides to go through with Watchmen 2.

Well, sort of.  Discuss.

I am pretty much  on Alan Moore's side on this, this is complete [parasitic bomb] and DC cannot come up with original content on their own accord. They have to rely on Moore's ideas from 25 years ago to make them some money.



Offline Protoman Blues

  • Green Lantern of Sector 1337
  • RPM Knight
  • ****
    • Posts: 31343
    • Gender: Male
  • Searching for Wanda
    • View Profile
Reply #1110 on: February 03, 2012, 03:25:18 AM
It's more a prequel than a sequel. But I'm going in with an open mind.



Offline Flame

  • The obsessive
  • RPM Soldier
  • ****
    • Posts: 16013
    • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Reply #1111 on: February 03, 2012, 03:31:13 AM
I suppose this fits here best-

you guys have got to read this.

http://english.bouletcorp.com/2012/02/01/darkness/

this is a comic that was made in 26 hours for a contest. And it's still freaking amazing.

...When Larry the reploid accountant goes maverick of his own accord, he's certainly formidable during tax season, but he isn't going to provide X the challenge needed to make him grow as a warrior and reach his potential.


Offline Ramzal

  • B-Class Hunter
  • *
    • Posts: 296
  • Don't sweat the technique.
    • View Profile
Reply #1112 on: February 05, 2012, 08:18:03 AM
It was [parasitic bomb]. It was the Spidey-MJ thing I hated the most about it, because they're still [tornado fang]ing doing it. They're still dealing with the whole Spidey-MJ bullshit scenario of teasing that they'll get back together, which they won't, and what makes it worse is that she literally serves no purpose in the [tornado fang]ing story other than to tease this fact.

I can see what you mean about the Spider-MJ thing but I actually kind of liked Spider-island. If for the fact that it focused on him being Peter Parker is what makes him important more than Spider-Man. He's got the powers and all, but his mind is his most dangerous weapon. The way they've been writing Spidey lately has him working more on his personal life and actually making use of his own abilities outside of the super-powered ones. (And honestly, an intelligent super hero that doesn't pull a Hank Pym or Reed Richards is needed badly.)

I think they've been doing a great job writing him, but a poor job lately in trying to mess with his love life. Carlie was... terrible. And honestly, I don't see why him and MJ should get back together. I don't even understand why they are together in the first place, short of Peter not fully understanding her and her keeping him interested for that much. But then again, I think Gwen was as good as it got for him. Someone who was his intellectual equal as well as romantically willing to meet him half way... ... ... Not counting those two kids of hers. Which was plain stupid.

Avenger X-sanction, I am not liking. If for anything I wish Cable would just kill himself and be over with it. I am tired of the whole "BUT I KNOW THE FUTURE!!!" bs with him.

Something that bugged me about Marvel though... why is it that Captain America never took an active stand against the view against Mutants or against the government making Sentinels?



Offline Pyro

  • Wielder of the Chaos Force
  • Neo Arcadian
  • *
    • Posts: 1821
    • Gender: Male
  • Boo yeah!
    • View Profile
Reply #1113 on: February 05, 2012, 04:44:37 PM
I am pretty much  on Alan Moore's side on this, this is complete [parasitic bomb] and DC cannot come up with original content on their own accord. They have to rely on Moore's ideas from 25 years ago to make them some money.

Moore's in not much of a position to criticize DC considering that "League of Extraordinary Gentlemen" used Victorian Age (and later) characters. Not that it makes it less a worthwhile story but those who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.

I can see what you mean about the Spider-MJ thing but I actually kind of liked Spider-island. If for the fact that it focused on him being Peter Parker is what makes him important more than Spider-Man. He's got the powers and all, but his mind is his most dangerous weapon. The way they've been writing Spidey lately has him working more on his personal life and actually making use of his own abilities outside of the super-powered ones. (And honestly, an intelligent super hero that doesn't pull a Hank Pym or Reed Richards is needed badly.)

Well, the fact that Peter made deal with the devil realllllllllly undermines him as a hero. Spider-Man is all about responsibility but Pete couldn't live with the guilt over what happened to Aunt May and instead of accepting responsibility for the consequences of his actions (revealing your secret ID on national television is never a good idea though we have Iron Man to thank for it, I guess but Peter still listened), he took the easy way out. Joe Quesada wants to try to spin this as a noble sacrifice on the part of Peter and MJ but I don't think the fandom's buying it. Hell, he should have let JMS go the extra mile and bring Gwen Stacy back. Why does Peter need the baggage when Mephisto can erase the guilt for something as trivial as marriage?

For as brilliant Spider-Man is now compared to previous eras, the stain of "One More Day" will not go away until a far more capable editor (maybe Marvel should have Jim Shooter on speed dial) retcons the mess out of existence. So until that day I will hold fast in my belief that Ben Reilly was the real, original Spider-Man and "Peter Parker" was the clone.

Maybe radioactive spider bites make people more brittle.

Come and read some Thoughts of a Platypus


Offline Ramzal

  • B-Class Hunter
  • *
    • Posts: 296
  • Don't sweat the technique.
    • View Profile
Reply #1114 on: February 05, 2012, 07:36:50 PM
Moore's in not much of a position to criticize DC considering that "League of Extraordinary Gentlemen" used Victorian Age (and later) characters. Not that it makes it less a worthwhile story but those who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.

Well, the fact that Peter made deal with the devil realllllllllly undermines him as a hero. Spider-Man is all about responsibility but Pete couldn't live with the guilt over what happened to Aunt May and instead of accepting responsibility for the consequences of his actions (revealing your secret ID on national television is never a good idea though we have Iron Man to thank for it, I guess but Peter still listened), he took the easy way out. Joe Quesada wants to try to spin this as a noble sacrifice on the part of Peter and MJ but I don't think the fandom's buying it. Hell, he should have let JMS go the extra mile and bring Gwen Stacy back. Why does Peter need the baggage when Mephisto can erase the guilt for something as trivial as marriage?

For as brilliant Spider-Man is now compared to previous eras, the stain of "One More Day" will not go away until a far more capable editor (maybe Marvel should have Jim Shooter on speed dial) retcons the mess out of existence. So until that day I will hold fast in my belief that Ben Reilly was the real, original Spider-Man and "Peter Parker" was the clone.

Maybe radioactive spider bites make people more brittle.

You know, I'm on the edge about One More Day. It was poor in execution, but I get it. Peter making a deal with Mephisto was not the best thing he could have done. At all. It turned everything out for the better in his life, but there are worse things heroes have done. I.E: Iron-man releasing Norman Osborn and being--for all intents and purposes responsible for every death Norman caused from that point on, and even his war profiteering. I can't understand Iron-man's decision on that. However I can understand Peter's better. He did not make a deal with Mephisto that would cause actual suffering to others, and the time he made that deal (Which he never would have made, if Mary Jane hadn't talked him into it. She had admitted that he would never say yes unless she convinced him to do so) his life was ruined beyond all recovery.

The stress of what his family was going through as well as what he has done to them with the best intentions would cause someone to act out of their normal character. That's natural human reaction to pressure and stress. You can only push so far until someone breaks. And the fallout from that could have been much worse. Shadowland's story with DareDevil shows how bad that can get.



Offline Pyro

  • Wielder of the Chaos Force
  • Neo Arcadian
  • *
    • Posts: 1821
    • Gender: Male
  • Boo yeah!
    • View Profile
Reply #1115 on: February 06, 2012, 02:13:10 AM
It still feels forced (regardless of whether the reaction was "human" or not) because Joey Q wanted the marriage magically annulled and picked the laziest plot contrivance in history to do it. 'Sides, in the case of Daredevil, he didn't make any pacts with Satan to get his life "back."

Come and read some Thoughts of a Platypus


Offline Ramzal

  • B-Class Hunter
  • *
    • Posts: 296
  • Don't sweat the technique.
    • View Profile
Reply #1116 on: February 06, 2012, 04:46:45 AM
But nearly killing people close to you is better? I'm not arguing that the execution was poor. It was. However, I can still understand Spidey snapping the way he did. (Then again, I was never one for the Mary Jane and Peter Parker marriage to begin with.)



Offline Pyro

  • Wielder of the Chaos Force
  • Neo Arcadian
  • *
    • Posts: 1821
    • Gender: Male
  • Boo yeah!
    • View Profile
Reply #1117 on: February 06, 2012, 05:25:34 AM
But it still goes against everything Spider-Man is supposed to represent, "With great power comes great responsibility." 

Peter as always suffered for it because of his Uncle Ben's death, then Captain George Stacy, then Gwen Stacy, then Harry Osborn, and so forth but became a better hero because of it. The second he made that deal with Mephisto, he essentially undermined fifty years of heroism (and come to think of it, we never knew what the hell Mephisto got out of the deal.) There were probably a dozen better ways to tell the story; Peter pretty much said his good-byes to Aunt May in Amazing Spider-Man #400. Let her die. Have Peter and MJ mourn and mutually agree to go to Dr. Strange to have their marriage magically annulled via a massive mindwipe as what happened to "One Moment in Time." It would have a bitter pill to swallow but at least it wouldn't have the stain of Satan's sweaty palms over it. But Joe Quesada had Spider-Man take the easy and irresponsible way out.

I will say it once more for effect, Ben Reilly was the true Spider-Man.

...and even without him, Scarlet Spider is still one heck of a read.

Come and read some Thoughts of a Platypus


Offline Ramzal

  • B-Class Hunter
  • *
    • Posts: 296
  • Don't sweat the technique.
    • View Profile
Reply #1118 on: February 06, 2012, 12:30:20 PM
And I agree with May dying. He can even take her dying. The problem was that it was indirectly her fault for getting shot and that on top of everything caused him to act outside of his nature. That is nothing if not basic human functions under high amounts of stress and pressure. Add ontop of the fact that his spouse encouraged it.... it is not unreasonable that he would do anything possible to fix that problem. Beside that,  his action did not bring any harmful implications to anyone but himself and Mary Jane who agreed to it. At that point, it almost becomes a non-issue.

Yes, Spider-man does represent "With great power comes great responsibility." However, that mantra has also included his strong unwillingness to take a life. He has killed at least 9 people -directly- with his actions. Two in which he's done with his bare hands. So.... that isn't the first time he's gone against that---even what his Uncle would expect out of him. Peter's own realization of that when he blamed Iron-Man for  his unmasking shows that. He admitted that if he said that to his uncle, Ben would retort with : If Iron-Man jumped off a bridge, would you do it too? Peter's responsibility is to his family...but he also extended it to every living person. Which he has admitted that he doesn't even tend to recall saving a number of people. Given how unselfish he's been in his life, it is not uncalled for to make a completely selfish action.

The divorce aspect of it... I agree with you was 100% childish way to do it. Namely when they had no clear reason FOR divorce short of the fact that Mary Jane has commitment issues or issues with dealing with something Peter Parker is. Or for that matter, being angry at him for saving lives and not appreciating it due to the fact that she felt dwarfed in comparison and inferior. (If you don't believe me, read when Spider-man moved into Stark Tower. No, really. She's upset more that she's called "Spider-man's Wife" and not noticed for her acting or modelling.) If a divorce was going to happen, it should have just up and happened, and for all intents in purposes have Matt Murdock help with the process/explain it to the two of them.



Offline Protoman Blues

  • Green Lantern of Sector 1337
  • RPM Knight
  • ****
    • Posts: 31343
    • Gender: Male
  • Searching for Wanda
    • View Profile
Reply #1119 on: February 06, 2012, 08:27:06 PM
No. It was not indirectly her fault for her getting shot. Everything that happened prior to One More Day was 100% his fault. Even with all the pleading in the world from MJ & May, Peter unmasking himself to the world was the absolute stupidest thing he's ever done in his life, because above every other superhero he knows first hand what happens when psychos find out who you are under the mask. First. Hand. And there was NO reason for him to do it. None. At all. The Registration Act just wanted them to reveal their identities to SHIELD & the Govt., not everyone. He should've known EXACTLY what was going to happen when he removed his mask, and it did happen because Marvel decided to make Peter an absolute [tornado fang]ing moron for a stupid event comic.

One More Day is the culmination of about 4-5 years of horrifyingly awful Spidey writing, from the Gwen Stacy thing to the Other to Civil War. It was a perfect exclamation point on the sad sad state of my favorite Marvel hero, a hero so poorly written that in the end it showed he had NO responsibility at all, from moronically unmasking in Civil War for the sole purpose of an event comic to having all his horrifyingly bad writing & problems caused by it magically erased. It undermines everything he was all because of horrible writing, terrible event comics, and Quesada wanting Spidey not to be married.

Spidey comics are indeed a whooooooole lot better now. Sure, I didn't care for Spider-Island that much, but you bring up reasons why you do, which is good. That's what comics are all about. As much as I didn't care for Spider-Island, it doesn't even come close to the god awful Spider-Man comics before One More Day. The fact that they are now better is both good and bad because them being much better is obviously good, what's bad is that them being much better has absolutely NOTHING to do with Peter not being married to MJ. It has more to do with the fact that THEY'RE ACTUALLY WELL WRITTEN COMICS!!!



Offline Pyro

  • Wielder of the Chaos Force
  • Neo Arcadian
  • *
    • Posts: 1821
    • Gender: Male
  • Boo yeah!
    • View Profile
Reply #1120 on: February 07, 2012, 12:20:55 AM
What do you think of the new Scarlet Spider comic?

Though I didn't care much for Kaine and wanted Ben Reilly to come back somehow (I really dislike how Spider-Island teased his return and gave us a huge fake-out in return) it's not too bad. There's potential in Kaine --who largely acted the way he did because he was dying of clone degeneration and didn't give a damn-- now that he's healed, and I am interested to see when the Parker gene for heroism starts kicking in.

Come and read some Thoughts of a Platypus


Offline Protoman Blues

  • Green Lantern of Sector 1337
  • RPM Knight
  • ****
    • Posts: 31343
    • Gender: Male
  • Searching for Wanda
    • View Profile
Reply #1121 on: February 07, 2012, 12:32:15 AM
Comics that remind me of the Clone Saga are always harder for me to judge. Personally, I didn't like it all that much cause I really don't care about the character. Plus I really don't like the new suit. But we'll see where it goes.



Offline Ramzal

  • B-Class Hunter
  • *
    • Posts: 296
  • Don't sweat the technique.
    • View Profile
Reply #1122 on: February 07, 2012, 03:26:44 AM
No. It was not indirectly her fault for her getting shot.

When she supported the idea of him removing his mask, she accepted the fact that she would and could be put in the line of fire. She admitted this in  Amazing Spider-Man 532 page 23. 24, 25. (Depending on where you got your print. (God I am a nerd....super nerd. But I have my stack of comics in order. :P)

"Every day prosecutors and judges and governors and senators go to work. Knowing their loved ones may be jeopardized by their work. But they don't wear masks to work. Do you know why? Because their loved ones want it that way. Because they would rather die than see the fact they love, the face that gives so much to the world, covered in shame. Some things are worth the risk, Peter. You're one of them."

She encouraged him to unmask when he was very unwilling to do so. It is not her fault. No, (Poor choice of words) however she did enable for this to occur even when MJ was on his side about not unmasking at first. May took the risk and she was almost killed over it. In fact, he was ready to withdraw his money and leave instead of unmasking until she stopped him the next morning. His aunt put herself in that situation and gave him bad advice with good intention.

Quote
Everything that happened prior to One More Day was 100% his fault. Even with all the pleading in the world from MJ & May, Peter unmasking himself to the world was the absolute stupidest thing he's ever done in his life, because above every other superhero he knows first hand what happens when psychos find out who you are under the mask. First. Hand. And there was NO reason for him to do it. None. At all. The Registration Act just wanted them to reveal their identities to SHIELD & the Govt., not everyone. He should've known EXACTLY what was going to happen when he removed his mask, and it did happen because Marvel decided to make Peter an absolute [tornado fang]ing moron for a stupid event comic.

I agree and disagree. When it comes down to it, it was Peter who took the action itself. So we agree there. It was stupid as hell for him to do it, another point we agree on. However, Peter's case was different. He was under the protection of Tony Stark while living in the tower. Tony manipulated him rather than talked to him about it. He used his family against him and put him in the corner. Page 15/16:

"I want you at my side, Peter. But I need you as both Peter...and Spider-Man. Openly. I'm saying that because of my position. I have to make sure everything is on the up-and-up. That means that the only way that Peter Parker can work with me--is if Spider-Man unmasks."

"It's not me asking, Peter. If you DON'T unmask, you'll be like the other powers who defy the law. Wanted criminals. Hunted. Jailed. Not just you, but MJ and your aunt, because they'd be considered accomplices. If you turn against the law, I can't have you with me. I won't be able to protect you...or your family."

He was clearly manipulated and not even given the choice to just give his identity to S.H.I.E.L.D. But rather the choice to either go all in, or be arrested and his family jailed. That gives little to no room but to either run, or fight and be caught and watch his family pay for it. Damned if you do, Damned if you don't.

Quote
One More Day is the culmination of about 4-5 years of horrifyingly awful Spidey writing, from the Gwen Stacy thing to the Other to Civil War. It was a perfect exclamation point on the sad sad state of my favorite Marvel hero, a hero so poorly written that in the end it showed he had NO responsibility at all, from moronically unmasking in Civil War for the sole purpose of an event comic to having all his horrifyingly bad writing & problems caused by it magically erased. It undermines everything he was all because of horrible writing, terrible event comics, and Quesada wanting Spidey not to be married.

Agreed. My point is that Peter's reactions to these situations are understandable. Not -correct- but understandable for someone put in the situation when never asked to be. Not that OMIT is great. I'd rather use that as toilet paper rather than...whatever one's select toilet paper may be.

Quote
Spidey comics are indeed a whooooooole lot better now. Sure, I didn't care for Spider-Island that much, but you bring up reasons why you do, which is good. That's what comics are all about. As much as I didn't care for Spider-Island, it doesn't even come close to the god awful Spider-Man comics before One More Day. The fact that they are now better is both good and bad because them being much better is obviously good, what's bad is that them being much better has absolutely NOTHING to do with Peter not being married to MJ. It has more to do with the fact that THEY'RE ACTUALLY WELL WRITTEN COMICS!!!

Agreed again. I do like what happened in OMIT or OMD, or BND for the most part. I took BND in stride for the sake of the idea of Peter trying to get his life back together...which took too long for Big Time to start and was painful. The Gauntlet however was enjoyable as well as Grim Hunt.  As far as MJ goes, I simply don't think they should have been married at all given her commitment issues and selfish levels of herself.

But you are right, those stories could have happened just as easily WITH them married and it would have meant little difference outside of less Carlie. In which...who really cares about her? I mean...really? Overall can we agree to one point? Joe Quesada should have just stuck to art and drawing rather than involving himself in plot points, writing or character direction? On a different note, I finally got around to reading and finishing Annihilation series... Marvel needs to make more quality like this and no more crap like Fear Itself.



Offline Pyro

  • Wielder of the Chaos Force
  • Neo Arcadian
  • *
    • Posts: 1821
    • Gender: Male
  • Boo yeah!
    • View Profile
Reply #1123 on: February 07, 2012, 05:20:08 AM
Comics that remind me of the Clone Saga are always harder for me to judge.

As strange as it sounds, I actually have a fondness for the Clone Saga (despite it being a train wreck) and plan to get all the trades as they come.

Should I have my head checked? :P

Come and read some Thoughts of a Platypus


Offline Protoman Blues

  • Green Lantern of Sector 1337
  • RPM Knight
  • ****
    • Posts: 31343
    • Gender: Male
  • Searching for Wanda
    • View Profile
Reply #1124 on: February 07, 2012, 06:26:57 AM
When she supported the idea of him removing his mask, she accepted the fact that she would and could be put in the line of fire. She admitted this in  Amazing Spider-Man 532 page 23. 24, 25. (Depending on where you got your print. (God I am a nerd....super nerd. But I have my stack of comics in order. :P)

"Every day prosecutors and judges and governors and senators go to work. Knowing their loved ones may be jeopardized by their work. But they don't wear masks to work. Do you know why? Because their loved ones want it that way. Because they would rather die than see the fact they love, the face that gives so much to the world, covered in shame. Some things are worth the risk, Peter. You're one of them."

She encouraged him to unmask when he was very unwilling to do so. It is not her fault. No, (Poor choice of words) however she did enable for this to occur even when MJ was on his side about not unmasking at first. May took the risk and she was almost killed over it. In fact, he was ready to withdraw his money and leave instead of unmasking until she stopped him the next morning. His aunt put herself in that situation and gave him bad advice with good intention.

Oh, I know what she said, and again it doesn't matter. Peter was right and if he had half a brain, or was written to have one, none of what Aunt May said should've mattered because he's not a prosecutor, judge, governor, or senator. He's a superhero and he deals with supervillains & psychopaths with super powers AND HE PISSES THEM OFF WHILE KICKING THEIR ASS. Not to mention the fact that the person he cared about and loved the most in the past was not only put in harm's way when his identity was revealed, but she was murdered. Despite what the god awful story writing of that Gwen Stacy event would have you believe, the whole point of her dying was a lesson of how important the mask is. Like the point of DC's Identity Crisis was to show how dangerous it is if someone knows who you are behind the mask, Gwen Stacy's death was the result of what happened when one of the psychopaths he fights found out who he is. Hell, Venom is another lesson in the regard. What made Venom such a dangerous and unique villain is that when he first arrived, he wasn't out for money or power or domination of the city. He just hated Spider-Man and would torture him by threatening his loved ones, and he could do this because HE KNEW WHO HE WAS. No matter what the hell Aunt May said to him, she didn't have to experience what Peter has while fighting these psychos. And it can all be traced back to the simple lesson of Spider-Man itself is that with his power came a responsibility. The mask is not a mark of shame, like she suggests. It's a sign of his responsibility.

Quote
I agree and disagree. When it comes down to it, it was Peter who took the action itself. So we agree there. It was stupid as hell for him to do it, another point we agree on. However, Peter's case was different. He was under the protection of Tony Stark while living in the tower. Tony manipulated him rather than talked to him about it. He used his family against him and put him in the corner. Page 15/16:

"I want you at my side, Peter. But I need you as both Peter...and Spider-Man. Openly. I'm saying that because of my position. I have to make sure everything is on the up-and-up. That means that the only way that Peter Parker can work with me--is if Spider-Man unmasks."

"It's not me asking, Peter. If you DON'T unmask, you'll be like the other powers who defy the law. Wanted criminals. Hunted. Jailed. Not just you, but MJ and your aunt, because they'd be considered accomplices. If you turn against the law, I can't have you with me. I won't be able to protect you...or your family."

He was clearly manipulated and not even given the choice to just give his identity to S.H.I.E.L.D. But rather the choice to either go all in, or be arrested and his family jailed. That gives little to no room but to either run, or fight and be caught and watch his family pay for it. Damned if you do, Damned if you don't.

Haha, again I know what was said. It's one of the many reasons that I hate Civil War so much, because not only do people act out of character but because it shows Peter as a moron. Again. One, Tony Stark has pretty much never been a model of responsibility, which Peter should've known. Two, that's not a manipulation. It's a threat and Peter should know the difference. He only realized how stupid his decision was after it was too late. Again, no responsibility. Peter is many things, but he's not an idiot and Civil War depicts him as one.

Quote
Agreed. My point is that Peter's reactions to these situations are understandable. Not -correct- but understandable for someone put in the situation when never asked to be. Not that OMIT is great. I'd rather use that as toilet paper rather than...whatever one's select toilet paper may be.

It's really only understandable if you consider how much of a moron Peter was throughout what just happened. He made every stupid decision possible and then wished away his stupidity and made his life better and sparkling fresh again. It undermines everything about the character. There's no responsibility. There's not even really any shreds of intelligence, and Peter is SMART. It's one of the reasons I like him as a character so much, because he's suppose to be responsible and intelligent, and nothing about what he did was that. Aunt May convinced him to do this. Tony Stark convinced him to do that. MJ finally convinced him to make a deal with the devil. What they all have in common is that it was still Peter's decision to make and every time he chose the stupider, less responsible choice. The only reason it's understandable is because at that point the writers made it where he absolutely had no choice AND nothing to lose by doing it and everything to gain.

Quote
Agreed again. I do like what happened in OMIT or OMD, or BND for the most part. I took BND in stride for the sake of the idea of Peter trying to get his life back together...which took too long for Big Time to start and was painful. The Gauntlet however was enjoyable as well as Grim Hunt.  As far as MJ goes, I simply don't think they should have been married at all given her commitment issues and selfish levels of herself.

But you are right, those stories could have happened just as easily WITH them married and it would have meant little difference outside of less Carlie. In which...who really cares about her? I mean...really? Overall can we agree to one point? Joe Quesada should have just stuck to art and drawing rather than involving himself in plot points, writing or character direction? On a different note, I finally got around to reading and finishing Annihilation series... Marvel needs to make more quality like this and no more crap like Fear Itself.

Their marriage, in the long run, was irrelevant. However, what it said to a lot of nerds out there is that if you stick with it, take the hits with some stride and be responsible, you may come out on top. MJ was the hot model that nerds wanted, and that eventually Peter got. Sure, it wasn't done in the best of ways, but the point of it was that she was his rock. She was his reward after all the crap he went through. Not that she's a thing, mind you, but rather that she's who he came home to at night. Yeah, she had commitment issues and was selfish. It's one of the reasons why they actually worked so well as a couple. They could play off each other very well, considering how responsible Peter is.

Regardless, a good writer can easily work around or with something like this. Hell, Spider-Island would've worked better if they were still married, because MJ now gained a much better understanding of what its like to be him and have his power and see him first hand save the city. If they were even separated or divorced, it would've made Spider-Island a lot better because it could've helped on the road to recovery. The point of him not being married to MJ is the same point that created the whole Gwen Stacy bullshit story; they can't make Peter look too old. Carlie is useless and I really don't like her character at all, not to mention I swear she looks different with every artist that draws her. But yeah, Quesada is a horrible writer and doesn't understand Peter's character at all.

And yes, Annihilation is possible my favorite Marvel event. I love Cosmic Marvel so much. Fear Itself was absolutely garbage.

As strange as it sounds, I actually have a fondness for the Clone Saga (despite it being a train wreck) and plan to get all the trades as they come.

Should I have my head checked? :P

To each their own. I wouldn't wipe my ass with it.