Topic: A Mega Man NES style Fan Game

[IQ-0]

Since we on the subject about Sandman puns, throw in an enemy that attacks with a Singapore Cane or maybe Sandman himself attacks with one as an alternate attack in reference to Sandman the wrestler.

[fifthindependent]

I've now made Sand Man's stage accessible, but not everything that has been suggested previously has been implemented although I have plans to do so.  What's different with this version besides that than what was there previously?

- Stages now have more diverse tiles.
- Bugs are fixed.
- Buster Boost does not make the Mega Arm auto aim anymore, instead it picks up items you aimed it toward.
- Mega Arm now blasts through enemies on the final blow and continues instead of returning.
- Music rendering is maybe more faithful to the NES style because I changed the resampling type but I couldn't tell the difference.

http://www.fifthindependent.com/SECRETOMGLOL/MMR.zip

As always, if you have any suggestions, ideas or whatever, tell me them and I'll be glad to implement them if they sound good.

[N-Mario]

Just a suggestion, but maybe you can do an update system for your fan game instead of us having to re-download the game. I know its possible because IWBTB has done it, and I'm 90% sure that was done with MMF2. 
The reason I haven't done it yet is because I'm still in the development stages. Though your fan game is a lot farther anyway. :-/


I don't know, I'm just thinking about something..... Something that would help in progress I guess.

[fifthindependent]

I would like to do that but I don't know how.  I suppose I'll ask on the Clickteam forums.

I was also experimenting with online connectivity in MMF2, I'm wanting to make MMR have an online two player mode but I don't know how I would pull this off with the pause menu being integral to the game.

EDIT: I've got the auto updater thing half working, but it's sort of tripping up.  I will let you guys know when it works and is uploaded.

Posted on: April 02, 2012, 05:52:55OK I managed to get it to update/add files when they are available on my server.  You'll no longer have to download it manually.    Just be sure to unzip it as I don't know what will happen if it tries to update in the zip file.

http://www.fifthindependent.com/SECRETOMGLOL/MMR.zip

[N-Mario]

The blocks are nearly impossible in Sand Man's stage. They need to stay a tad longer, but not too long. I kept jumping, and I still fell on the spikes near the end of the first phase. I don't think I even have time to slide or dash before jumping off of them.

[fifthindependent]

OK I decreased their animation speed from 44 to 36, hopefully that helps.

[kuja killer]

I've run into a major bug it would seem, in prye man.

I got very very far through the level, and got beat, never used it yet, but i saw a ladder to go down, but i didn't yet, i just kept on going right, with no clue what was going to happen since it was my first time ever...and the screen went right into nothingness, couldnt turn back..so i kept going but there was still nothing on screen...and eventually i just got stuck permenately forever with no where or way to go...

http://postimage.org/image/go5lsj47h/

[Zan]

OK I managed to get it to update/add files when they are available on my server.  You'll no longer have to download it manually.    Just be sure to unzip it as I don't know what will happen if it tries to update in the zip file.

For some reason the updater makes it impossible for me to play the game. It keeps trying to redownload Rockman.exe, prompting a reboot of the game which does nothing more than repeat the process ad infinitum. Might I suggest giving the player choice of wanting to update or not?

[fifthindependent]

That's weird, it's doing the update forever loop for me as well.  I will have to look into this and try reuploading the file.

I've run into a major bug it would seem, in prye man.

Did this happen right after you picked up the part for Beat?

[kuja killer]

yea, saw the little icon of the wing, and got it. I never used it though.

I just kept walking to the right instead of going down the ladder right next to the icon...cause i was just curious, ya know ?? And it just ended up making me go into nothing-ness..and i was forced to just close the whole program..

oh...and the very start of the level..i dont know what or how it happened but...sliding got disabled for whatever reason, and i couldn't continue ...but luckily i had rush jet to bypass a sliding part.

[fifthindependent]

OK it wasn't updating the EXE correctly because there were copying file sharing issues.  I've put a band aid on it for now.  Download the file one more time.   

http://www.fifthindependent.com/SECRETOMGLOL/MMR.zip

As for Pyre Man's stage, did you by any chance die before the stage did that to you?

[N-Mario]

In megaman games you can slide over 1 tile gaps. However it seems he kind of stops over them in your game.

Sometimes the items float in the air when enemies drop them. I don't know how to reproduce it. it just happens. :-/

If you slide, then pause, and unpause, he slides slower.

[kuja killer]

no...i never died a single time while playing the stage for my first time...

try it yourself...get to that point in the stage where there's a ladder...walk to the right...dont go down....you find beat and pick it up...you keep going right and see another ladder...ignore it and keep going right...and the screen scrolls right...into blank emptyness....just keep running around and your just stuck forever...

im not lieing, that screenshot was my proof. I dont have the time to test it again right now..

[fifthindependent]

In megaman games you can slide over 1 tile gaps. However it seems he kind of stops over them in your game.

Sometimes the items float in the air when enemies drop them. I don't know how to reproduce it. it just happens. :-/

If you slide, then pause, and unpause, he slides slower.

The first thing will take me a little bit to fix, but I plan to fix it nonetheless.  The second thing I already noticed, but I myself and dumbfounded as to why it occurs.  I have my ideas, but I can't figure out for the life of me why it happens.  I fixed the third thing but I won't be releasing an update until I fix all of this in this post.

no...i never died a single time while playing the stage for my first time...

try it yourself...get to that point in the stage where there's a ladder...walk to the right...dont go down....you find beat and pick it up...you keep going right and see another ladder...ignore it and keep going right...and the screen scrolls right...into blank emptyness....just keep running around and your just stuck forever...

im not lieing, that screenshot was my proof. I dont have the time to test it again right now..

I'm not saying you're lying, I'm just trying to get a feel for when the problem occurs.  I have a good idea of how it happens, but I'm not sure why it occurs.  I am fairly certain it is also causing Mega Man to be unable to slide even though it seems entirely unrelated.

[Splash]

Not Found

Sorry, but you are looking for something that isn't here.

I want to download, but I keep getting this.

[fifthindependent]

Oh, yeah, sorry about that.    I changed the URL because I decided it's not much of a secret anymore with someone having already uploaded a Let's Play video of it.  Try this URL instead.

http://www.fifthindependent.com/programs/MMR.zip

[Splash]

Well. What can I say about Sand Man's level.
Dissapearing platforms look nice. They hard, yes, but not if playing as Bass. 
Snake mini-boss isn't hard, just tedious, because her tail often appear behind her head.
I like how Sand Man uses Sand Shield after being hit, although, if you shoot him when he shot, he won't activate his shield.

[fifthindependent]

I could slow the disappearing green blocks down further if they're still too hard.

Sand Man actually uses his shield if you fired and/or your arm is sticking out from firing and he's not jumping or shooting which is supposed to be his weakness in his pattern.   Bass has it easier here as well because he doesn't stick his arm out as long if he doesn't have the buster boost equipped.

[Zan]

Well, well, I've successfully crashed the game:



Destroyed the catcher, making it drop a big life recovery which restored my life to max. Subsequently the game froze up with the background elements still animating. The menu was inaccessible.

OK it wasn't updating the EXE correctly because there were copying file sharing issues.  I've put a band aid on it for now.  Download the file one more time.

The update loop still happens from time to time. From what I can tell, a small pop up window is supposed to appear saying Rockman.exe updated. But it doesn't, and the Updater.exe keeps running in the background. Only by either opening or deleting these newly created updater files have I been able to break the loop.

I'm not saying you're lying, I'm just trying to get a feel for when the problem occurs.  I have a good idea of how it happens, but I'm not sure why it occurs.  I am fairly certain it is also causing Mega Man to be unable to slide even though it seems entirely unrelated.

You can always just put a wall there.

[fifthindependent]

Destroyed the catcher, making it drop a big life recovery which restored my life to max. Subsequently the game froze up with the background elements still animating. The menu was inaccessible.

I think I may have fixed this, but I'm not entirely sure, it seems like there's some glitches and bugs that only happen when the game is built into an EXE.

The update loop still happens from time to time. From what I can tell, a small pop up window is supposed to appear saying Rockman.exe updated. But it doesn't, and the Updater.exe keeps running in the background. Only by either opening or deleting these newly created updater files have I been able to break the loop.

I think I fixed this as well, I made it show a bunch of popups in the process of it replacing Rockman.exe and it got stuck in a loop but now it isn't... but you never know, it could still be present, I have a limited means of testing things like this.

You can always just put a wall there.

I could, but then it wouldn't be faithful to the limitations of the NES which I'm trying to get to as close as I can.  The parallax would be possible by doing a horizontal scroll region, but if I put walls there, they would also scroll with the parallax image.

Also, I put in the option to run the game in 256 colors mode, so that fades on minibosses and the screen and other such things look more authentic to the NES format, if you pick it instead of true color mode.  However, it runs more slowly on certain computers because it's impossible for hardware acceleration mode to be active during this.  I think it's just slower computers that this happens on, but it could be fast computers as well.  I went ahead and put it in so you guys can test it if any of you have good computers and get back to me on it.  If it doesn't work smoothly even on fast computers I'll just remove 256 color mode.

[Zan]

Another minor thing that's been bugging me in Pyre Man's stage is that buster shots and mega arm break on the top of the screen; it's near impossible to fight the metools up there. Similarly, Rock's jump mechanics appear to be different that high up; you cannot clear the same distance as before. I'm not sure how the actual games handle this, though.

I think I fixed this as well, I made it show a bunch of popups in the process of it replacing Rockman.exe and it got stuck in a loop but now it isn't... but you never know, it could still be present, I have a limited means of testing things like this.

From what I can tell, it appears to function properly now.

I could, but then it wouldn't be faithful to the limitations of the NES which I'm trying to get to as close as I can.  The parallax would be possible by doing a horizontal scroll region, but if I put walls there, they would also scroll with the parallax image.

Upon review, I see what you mean with the horizontal scroll making it impossible to add a wall there. Maybe a fade to black during the previous screen transition would allow you to remove the scrolling background before getting to the Beat item? Although that wouldn't eliminate the same issue occurring on the left side as well. From my own experiments, the forbidden transition occurs 100% of the time when using Rush Jet to go where you shouldn't go.

In regards to being faithful to NES limitations. Would you be willing to listen to remarks about palette limitations being breached?

[fifthindependent]

Another minor thing that's been bugging me in Pyre Man's stage is that buster shots and mega arm break on the top of the screen; it's near impossible to fight the metools up there. Similarly, Rock's jump mechanics appear to be different that high up; you cannot clear the same distance as before. I'm not sure how the actual games handle this, though.

I can try to modify this a bit.  I have an idea how to modify both things.

From my own experiments, the forbidden transition occurs 100% of the time when using Rush Jet to go where you shouldn't go.

Ah yeah that clears things up, I was able to reproduce the glitch myself doing that.  I forgot to make the Rush Jet limited to how high it can go off screen so it doesn't pass the invisible obstacles off the top of the screen.

In regards to being faithful to NES limitations. Would you be willing to listen to remarks about palette limitations being breached?

Yeah I would be willing to listen to these.  Sometimes I overlook the palette limitations of four palettes per background and sprites, each with three colors and a transparent color.

Also, if any of you downloaded or updated yesterday or today, download this version of the updater as it can't update itself now since I fixed some problems with it where it shouldn't need updated ever again.

http://www.fifthindependent.com/programs/mmr/Updater.exe

[Zan]

Ah yeah that clears things up, I was able to reproduce the glitch myself doing that.  I forgot to make the Rush Jet limited to how high it can go off screen so it doesn't pass the invisible obstacles off the top of the screen.

You might also want to know that you can repeat the same glitch in Ghost Man's stage at the first screen transition, and invoke a second variation (for the vertical screen transition that occurs later on) which allows you walk above the stage.

Yeah I would be willing to listen to these.  Sometimes I overlook the palette limitations of four palettes per background and sprites, each with three colors and a transparent color.

As you know, every palette requires it's first entry to be "transparency". In sprites this results in the background tiles being shown, but for the tiles themselves this would show the wash color instead. Since the wash color appears to be black, the palette you're using for the clouds (4 colors without black) could not be feasible on NES.

[OBJECTION MAN]

Yeah I would be willing to listen to these.

I think this is a first. We have a guy who really cares about authentic quality for once. It's refreshing.

Zan's explanation is pretty much the basic foundation of all NES styled graphics. We can discuss it in greater detail on MSN sometime. Though, as far as I know, at least for MMF1.5, there is no way to get a true authentic palette system going. With careful planning though, it might be possible to get as accurate as we can.

[fifthindependent]

You might also want to know that you can repeat the same glitch in Ghost Man's stage at the first screen transition, and invoke a second variation (for the vertical screen transition that occurs later on) which allows you walk above the stage.

I think I fixed this for everything except maybe what you mentioned in the second variation as I wasn't sure where you meant.  I tried jumping over a wall in Pyre Man's stage with the Rush Jet and I wasn't able to.  I also fixed the jumping and shooting off the top of the screen for sure.

As you know, every palette requires it's first entry to be "transparency". In sprites this results in the background tiles being shown, but for the tiles themselves this would show the wash color instead. Since the wash color appears to be black, the palette you're using for the clouds (4 colors without black) could not be feasible on NES.

Yeah you're right, you've got a good eye for detail there.  I changed this as well.

I think this is a first. We have a guy who really cares about authentic quality for once. It's refreshing.

Yeah I'm doing it as a sort of challenge to myself and also I figured if I was going to do it in NES style I might as well do the whole shebang.

Zan's explanation is pretty much the basic foundation of all NES styled graphics. We can discuss it in greater detail on MSN sometime. Though, as far as I know, at least for MMF1.5, there is no way to get a true authentic palette system going. With careful planning though, it might be possible to get as accurate as we can.[/qupte]
Yeah MMF2 doesn't have a way of doing a palette system either, although it can be faked with careful planning.  I can do color replace and already have and I loaded the actually NES palette into every frame of the game and put it in 256 colors, although this is turned off when hardware acceleration mode is on as Direct 3D8 doesn't support 256 colors.