Okay, this i can not understand.
If you have seen already i did a youtube video where i used top spin.
Missed it?
Now, as you can see it works just fine. But, i tried it on Genesis version and the Gameboy version and it worked even better.
So, what i can't understand why everyone is so negative against the weapon. It kills almost anything with 1 spin.
The Nes version i can understand , my guess is that first they wanted it to lose energy on impact, but it was buggy and instead of taking 2 bars of energy it could take the whole thing. This was fixed in Genesis version and the Gameboy version.
If Top Spin was fixed in say Megaman 3 V.1.1 would you use it?
While we are on the subject of weapons, is there any weapon in Classic Megaman series you said:
This weapon is useless it's not going to help me in anyway.
But, it turns out that weapon if used after training kicks more ass then the Metal Blade.
I actually think that Top Spin was really great weapon, and the one (besides shadow blade) I used the most, yeah really only downfall to it was that energy consuption in NES MM3, but with some practice even that can be avoided.
Top Spin doesn't waste energy if the enemy is weak to it. It kills the enemy in one hit, you spend one energy unit and you don't take damage.
It OHKOs 19 out of 38 enemies and 2 bosses, being the primary weakness to an additional 3 bosses. This is not a bad weapon in any sane world. Power Stone is bad.
I think the main argument against Top Spin is that there are safer ways to deal with enemies than going ballerina in their face. It's hard to argue with that.
Wait, who ever said Top Spin was useless?
Quote from: Quint on April 25, 2010, 08:24:17 PM
But, it turns out that weapon if used after training kicks more ass then the Metal Blade.
Nothing beats Metal Blade. Nothing.
Well, i never said Metal Blade was useless.
But, it can't one shot a few things Top Spin Can.
There is one thing you can do with Top Spin that you can't with Metal Blade.
Spin to next screen. 8B
And spin to the beat of the music~
Quote from: Quint on April 25, 2010, 10:24:05 PM
But, it can't one shot a few things Top Spin Can.
....it can one shot Metal Man. It's so powerful it can one-shot it's creator.
SPIN TO THE NEXT SCREEN! That was hilarious.
IT ONE SHOTS WILY?!?!? Well, it his his weakness... I think...
I must investigate this further, I shall test every single enemy/boss ingame on normal/hard with Top Spin and see what it's Super Effective against.
Might want to turn on either infinite energy, infinite lives, or both. So you can survive the testing. ^_^
I know: why don't we have somebody Top Spin this house (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=drF4gS6RkC0&feature=related), to see if it holds up better than it did against the Metal Blade? 8D
rofl nice find!
Quote from: K.G. Inafunbags on April 25, 2010, 11:33:30 PM
I know: why don't we have somebody Top Spin this house (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=drF4gS6RkC0&feature=related), to see if it holds up better than it did against the Metal Blade? 8D
Looks more like Wheel Cutter than Metal Blade.
Quote from: Mirby on April 25, 2010, 11:02:28 PM
IT ONE SHOTS WILY?!?!? Well, it his his weakness... I think...
I think it's 2 hits actually, but when positioned correctly the second hit will come a frame after the first. Search Snake does the same damage to Wily's Gamma.
Quote from: Quint on April 25, 2010, 08:24:17 PM
The Nes version i can understand , my guess is that first they wanted it to lose energy on impact, but it was buggy and instead of taking 2 bars of energy it could take the whole thing. This was fixed in Genesis version and the Gameboy version.
My theory was that MegaMan was supposed to bounce away from the enemy on every impact, whether or not that enemy was immune, but they weren't able to get the "bounce away" routine to kick in before the "get hurt" routine most of the time. It just seems unfair that you would have to get hurt from using Top Spin before you know it's ineffective.
Using up all the energy is another thing that makes it bad for beginners. If you know why it happens, you can avoid it: Just don't use it on an immune enemy while you're flashing from hit damage, or on a Robot Master while it's flashing from hit damage. As long as you're inside an enemy while spinning, the game will keep deducting Top Spin energy every frame, and it won't be interrupted by another hit until you stop flashing. This is also why it's "super effective" on the MeggerClones and Dr. Wily's final form after you've been hit: Fortress bosses don't get invincibility flashing, so the game deducts from
their energy once every frame, making the actual amount per hit pretty moot at that speed.
But however it was meant to work, the Genesis and Game Boy games changed Top Spin just enough to still resemble the NES version's workings but without the quick drains, making it easier for beginners, but a little more boring...
Quote from: Da Dood on April 25, 2010, 08:46:34 PMI think the main argument against Top Spin is that there are safer ways to deal with enemies than going ballerina in their face. It's hard to argue with that.
Ballerina?! Tatsumaki-Senpū kyaku, surely. ;)
Personally, I'm a fan of melee moves, so I don't mind taking an extra risk to use them. Charge Kick, Break Dash, and Top Spin are awesome moves, and like any fighting technique, you have to take range and timing into account. Once you've done that, these weapons become a very effective part of Mega Man's arsenal.
Quote from: Protoman Blues on April 25, 2010, 10:56:17 PM
....it can one shot Metal Man. It's so powerful it can one-shot it's creator.
Isn't that only in easy mode? I thought it took two shots to kill Metal Man otherwi--
*decapitated by Metal Blade*
I love Top Spin for being one of the most unique weapon/attack from the series.
If there's a useless or worst weapon that would be Spark Shock, Power Stone, Plant Barrier, and the likes of Super Arm/Deep Digger.
qzecwx says it's an excellent weapon in MM3. Check out his videos of Rockman Peercast 2, or his videos "Top Spin doesn't suck" and "Top Spin still doesn't suck". Good explaination there.
Or Quint's own thread; he did a complete playthrough using Top Spin as much as possible. Be prepared to set aside about 80-90 minutes if you want to watch the whole thing though.
Even after seeing that video, my opinion on the Top Spin hasn't changed much. Sure, it may be a good weapon to use against average joe enemies that take one hit to kill, but it definitely sucks against bosses, since you, yourself, will take damage in the process.
You're not supposed to be using non-weakness special weapons on bosses anyway!
Yea, in the end Top Spin CAN be used. It can also take down some enemies with 1 hit.
So, in some stages it can be quite useful. Like in Shadow Man's Stage.
Think of the video as a analyze video where i test what enemy/boss it can be used against.
That's what I saw it as; a way to show what enemies it works best against and which ones it does nothing at all to.
It's be interesting to investigate Top Spin futher in the other games (MM2 GB and WW). Then you can show the improvements made to it.
But, I hate to say it, that vid does not show Top Spin being very effective ...
Try it out! Experiment! If i give you a wooden sword would you say it's useless?
My video is showing you that this and that enemy you can use Top Spin on. It is very effective against some enemies and not effective against some enemies. You can thus plan AHEAD if you plan on doing a run of Megaman 3, go for Top Man first, and play trough with special weapons.
That way "Oh, yea Top Spin works good here" use it there kind of way. Stop being so negative!
And sure, Gauntlet101010 if there is at least 1 or 2 more people that want it then i will glady play WW and MM2.
Gah, and to think I made a complete damage chart for all those games once. I'll have to dig that up again sometime.
I know one was made one for the Wily Wars. I still have it on the Mechanical Maniacs.
http://themechanicalmaniacs.com/articles/MWCodesnData.php
At least it charts the bosses.
Quote from: Zan on May 02, 2010, 01:54:02 PM
You're not supposed to be using non-weakness special weapons on bosses anyway!
True, but that also applies even if it's being used on Shadow Man and the Doc Robot that's using Heat Man's data.
Aight, i decided to check on Megaman II on Gameboy, first i tried a couple of weapon game genei codes on VBA.
None worked.
So , i tried a Password Generator. It kicks me to the capsule room.
Anyone know of a weapon code that only gives me the Top Spin?
I am still checking around on Google for codes.
http://themechanicalmaniacs.com/Downloads.php - go to the bottom.
You can use Save State master to use Top Spin in any level by editing a save state. Use the REW gameboy emulator. However, it might bump you to the teleporter room after you win. Can't recall exactly.
Sadly, Top Spin really is useless against bosses from MM2 here. Still, you can use it throughout any level.
Also, if anyone wants to prove the Sakugarne is not useless, feel free to use the same technique.
Okay i gave it a spin. HGB goes way too fast on my computer, none of the settings i changed fixed it.
And REW worked fine, until i used the save state and then re-loaded it caused it too crash.
So i tried save state it before entering a boss, that worked , but it turned the stage select screen blank.
There's no helping glitches that happen. Remember: you're not actually supposed to even have Top Spin at this point. But, more levels means more chances to show Top Spin's good, right?
Gimme a moment, I'll try to make something.
Edit: Okay, here's a few saves that put you at the start of all the levels not normally playable using Top Spin.
Okay, i put all of the save states in the folder, loaded em up.
The first one worked fine, but it gave me all weapons.
Which is fine, but the rest of the save states just pause flashes.
When i try it myself same issue. It pause flashes, even i didn't pause myself. Maybe it's the emu and my computer?
I use WinXP with duo core. HGB goes in Mach 5 when i run it. xD
It should work. I tested ALL of them myself. I'm on Windows 7 and had to use XP Virtual Machine to use Save State Master so you should actually be able to use it BETTER than me.
I'm using REW12STX. Everything works fine on my end. Maybe you should try renaiming the save ste in question to .st0 and see if it's just being in the first slot that does it? Since it all works for me, it can't be file corruption or anything like that.
REW12STX?
The first save state works fine, it's the rest of the save states that get's the Pause flash.
Ima give it a few more tries.
That's the version number.
Okay, I resaved them all (accessed the hacked saves and then re-saved so REW is the one doing the save state writing, except for the first one). But the very last one is simply MM at the teleporters with no changes made. If it can't load even that something's wrong on your end.
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???? (http://audiobookkeeper.ru/book/8061)347 (http://cottagenet.ru/plan/1045)Bett (http://eyesvision.ru)Bett (http://eyesvisions.com/better-eyesight-magazine-better-eyesight-1926-05)???? (http://factoringfee.ru/t/1466073)???? (http://filmzones.ru/t/1459107)XVII (http://gadwall.ru/t/1745495)???? (http://gaffertape.ru/t/1378213)???? (http://gageboard.ru/t/1437531)lang (http://gagrule.ru/t/1241633)Elie (http://gallduct.ru/t/1653092)Cham (http://galvanometric.ru/t/1664518)SieL (http://gangforeman.ru/t/1686156)Desi (http://gangwayplatform.ru/t/1704281)Load (http://garbagechute.ru/t/1713541)???? (http://gardeningleave.ru/t/1612138)???? (http://gascautery.ru/t/1765828)Spec (http://gashbucket.ru/t/1778433)Jenn (http://gasreturn.ru/t/1812629)Eliz (http://gatedsweep.ru/t/1569268)Zone (http://gaugemodel.ru/t/1859275)???? (http://gaussianfilter.ru/t/1708329)woon (http://gearpitchdiameter.ru/t/1414565)
???? (http://geartreating.ru/t/1442585)???? (http://generalizedanalysis.ru/t/1445746)Love (http://generalprovisions.ru/t/1548521)Jewe (http://geophysicalprobe.ru/t/1558174)Kaha (http://geriatricnurse.ru/t/1557530)OZON (http://getintoaflap.ru/t/1608439)XVII (http://getthebounce.ru/t/1432426)???? (http://habeascorpus.ru/t/1543053)Jame (http://habituate.ru/t/1383892)???? (http://hackedbolt.ru/t/1408542)Walt (http://hackworker.ru/t/1688644)???? (http://hadronicannihilation.ru/t/1380237)Pend (http://haemagglutinin.ru/t/1385331)Mich (http://hailsquall.ru/t/1382160)???? (http://hairysphere.ru/t/1466434)???? (http://halforderfringe.ru/t/1442608)Drea (http://halfsiblings.ru/t/1553514)???? (http://hallofresidence.ru/t/1470085)???? (http://haltstate.ru/t/1610260)???? (http://handcoding.ru/t/1651390)Real (http://handportedhead.ru/t/1702647)Caro (http://handradar.ru/t/1715799)RETA (http://handsfreetelephone.ru/t/1773382)
???? (http://hangonpart.ru/t/1612172)Love (http://haphazardwinding.ru/t/1703788)???? (http://hardalloyteeth.ru/t/1347927)???? (http://hardasiron.ru/t/1350908)???? (http://hardenedconcrete.ru/t/1385897)Migu (http://harmonicinteraction.ru/t/1382755)Jose (http://hartlaubgoose.ru/t/1382252)???? (http://hatchholddown.ru/t/1655137)Circ (http://haveafinetime.ru/t/1548349)Circ (http://hazardousatmosphere.ru/t/1548387)Fall (http://headregulator.ru/t/1549274)???? (http://heartofgold.ru/t/1728966)???? (http://heatageingresistance.ru/t/1531280)???? (http://heatinggas.ru/t/1588489)???? (http://heavydutymetalcutting.ru/t/1386230)???? (http://jacketedwall.ru/t/1056970)???? (http://japanesecedar.ru/t/1308909)???? (http://jibtypecrane.ru/t/1714316)???? (http://jobabandonment.ru/t/1355013)???? (http://jobstress.ru/t/1565092)Beni (http://jogformation.ru/t/1382685)???? (http://jointcapsule.ru/t/1489828)???? (http://jointsealingmaterial.ru/t/1381771)
???? (http://journallubricator.ru/t/1595845)???? (http://juicecatcher.ru/t/1378004)???? (http://junctionofchannels.ru/t/1474273)(197 (http://justiciablehomicide.ru/t/1351779)???? (http://juxtapositiontwin.ru/t/1283918)???? (http://kaposidisease.ru/t/1351086)???? (http://keepagoodoffing.ru/t/1240058)???? (http://keepsmthinhand.ru/t/1308631)???? (http://kentishglory.ru/t/1381793)???? (http://kerbweight.ru/t/1564942)Rich (http://kerrrotation.ru/t/1369547)???? (http://keymanassurance.ru/t/1346926)???? (http://keyserum.ru/t/1566366)Raco (http://kickplate.ru/t/1664730)Zone (http://killthefattedcalf.ru/t/1783737)Rick (http://kilowattsecond.ru/t/1413958)Suns (http://kingweakfish.ru/t/1703789)???? (http://kinozones.ru/film/1945)???? (http://kleinbottle.ru/t/1491183)???? (http://kneejoint.ru/t/1469945)Memo (http://knifesethouse.ru/t/1779941)???? (http://knockonatom.ru/t/1582138)???? (http://knowledgestate.ru/t/1617364)
Zone (http://kondoferromagnet.ru/t/1549882)Zone (http://labeledgraph.ru/t/1548701)Clin (http://laborracket.ru/t/1916001)Unde (http://labourearnings.ru/t/1969382)Zone (http://labourleasing.ru/t/1549830)XIII (http://laburnumtree.ru/t/1376815)Elli (http://lacingcourse.ru/t/1456972)Intr (http://lacrimalpoint.ru/t/1662955)Barb (http://lactogenicfactor.ru/t/1720128)Theo (http://lacunarycoefficient.ru/t/1383614)???? (http://ladletreatediron.ru/t/1245162)???? (http://laggingload.ru/t/1388734)???? (http://laissezaller.ru/t/1351399)???? (http://lambdatransition.ru/t/1579451)Zone (http://laminatedmaterial.ru/t/1783692)Zone (http://lammasshoot.ru/t/1827544)Dymp (http://lamphouse.ru/t/1382594)???? (http://lancecorporal.ru/t/1302533)???? (http://lancingdie.ru/t/1250116)???? (http://landingdoor.ru/t/1276252)Zone (http://landmarksensor.ru/t/1711804)???? (http://landreform.ru/t/1386006)???? (http://landuseratio.ru/t/1352735)
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Clea (http://nameresolution.ru/shop/1151323)???? (http://naphtheneseries.ru/shop/574881)???? (http://narrowmouthed.ru/shop/462203)???? (http://nationalcensus.ru/shop/1056228)???? (http://naturalfunctor.ru/shop/576843)Warh (http://navelseed.ru/shop/103407)Tref (http://neatplaster.ru/shop/455956)Wind (http://necroticcaries.ru/shop/185212)wwwc (http://negativefibration.ru/shop/639987)Powe (http://neighbouringrights.ru/shop/648999)???? (http://objectmodule.ru/shop/470942)Bosc (http://observationballoon.ru/shop/97125)Inte (http://obstructivepatent.ru/shop/457702)Arms (http://oceanmining.ru/shop/570797)Fris (http://octupolephonon.ru/shop/571639)???? (http://offlinesystem.ru/shop/149817)???? (http://offsetholder.ru/shop/203931)Love (http://olibanumresinoid.ru/shop/203690)Luck (http://onesticket.ru/shop/581884)???? (http://packedspheres.ru/shop/584006)???? (http://pagingterminal.ru/shop/687768)???? (http://palatinebones.ru/shop/685286)???? (http://palmberry.ru/shop/690006)
Rush (http://papercoating.ru/shop/585125)Disc (http://paraconvexgroup.ru/shop/690636)???? (http://parasolmonoplane.ru/shop/1172394)???? (http://parkingbrake.ru/shop/1172368)???? (http://partfamily.ru/shop/1176665)???? (http://partialmajorant.ru/shop/1174212)???? (http://quadrupleworm.ru/shop/1543715)???? (http://qualitybooster.ru/shop/1543257)Lion (http://quasimoney.ru/shop/597147)???? (http://quenchedspark.ru/shop/842711)Flex (http://quodrecuperet.ru/shop/1075246)Bari (http://rabbetledge.ru/shop/1080584)???? (http://radialchaser.ru/shop/359363)???? (http://radiationestimator.ru/shop/511386)CeBI (http://railwaybridge.ru/shop/636232)???? (http://randomcoloration.ru/shop/904083)???? (http://rapidgrowth.ru/shop/1061430)Char (http://rattlesnakemaster.ru/shop/1311950)???? (http://reachthroughregion.ru/shop/1239030)Supe (http://readingmagnifier.ru/shop/515783)???? (http://rearchain.ru/shop/878547)Roma (http://recessioncone.ru/shop/878443)???? (http://recordedassignment.ru/shop/1033715)
???? (http://rectifiersubstation.ru/shop/1057145)???? (http://redemptionvalue.ru/shop/1064435)???? (http://reducingflange.ru/shop/1687226)???? (http://referenceantigen.ru/shop/1694639)???? (http://regeneratedprotein.ru/shop/1770320)Lore (http://reinvestmentplan.ru/shop/1775845)???? (http://safedrilling.ru/shop/1821337)???? (http://sagprofile.ru/shop/1062009)???? (http://salestypelease.ru/shop/1854337)???? (http://samplinginterval.ru/shop/1880207)Inte (http://satellitehydrology.ru/shop/1915307)???? (http://scarcecommodity.ru/shop/1495009)Jean (http://scrapermat.ru/shop/1532701)???? (http://screwingunit.ru/shop/1499569)???? (http://seawaterpump.ru/shop/1617772)???? (http://secondaryblock.ru/shop/1450761)Magn (http://secularclergy.ru/shop/1493824)???? (http://seismicefficiency.ru/shop/365400)???? (http://selectivediffuser.ru/shop/403003)???? (http://semiasphalticflux.ru/shop/405752)Enjo (http://semifinishmachining.ru/shop/1692679)CHIM (http://spicetrade.ru/spice_zakaz/557)CHIM (http://spysale.ru/spy_zakaz/557)
CHIM (http://stungun.ru/stun_zakaz/557)???? (http://tacticaldiameter.ru/shop/485246)???? (http://tailstockcenter.ru/shop/496322)???? (http://tamecurve.ru/shop/500550)Lost (http://tapecorrection.ru/shop/505034)Musk (http://tappingchuck.ru/shop/489842)???? (http://taskreasoning.ru/shop/501346)???? (http://technicalgrade.ru/shop/1849424)???? (http://telangiectaticlipoma.ru/shop/1899853)???? (http://telescopicdamper.ru/shop/1918701)???? (http://temperateclimate.ru/shop/792545)Mich (http://temperedmeasure.ru/shop/890516)???? (http://tenementbuilding.ru/shop/983021)tuchkas (http://tuchkas.ru/)???? (http://ultramaficrock.ru/shop/983425)Walt (http://ultraviolettesting.ru/shop/485577)