The Marvel vs. Capcom 3 Topic (ITS MAHVEL 3 BAYBEE)

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Offline OBJECTION MAN

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Reply #2300 on: November 15, 2011, 02:43:43 PM
As big of a fighting game fan as I am, I don't think I'm sold on this still. I might actually just skip it.


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Offline Satoryu

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Reply #2301 on: November 15, 2011, 09:33:44 PM
I just tried out Galactus mode. It's very silly.


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Offline Flame

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Reply #2302 on: November 15, 2011, 10:22:49 PM

...When Larry the reploid accountant goes maverick of his own accord, he's certainly formidable during tax season, but he isn't going to provide X the challenge needed to make him grow as a warrior and reach his potential.


Offline AquaTeamV3

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Reply #2303 on: November 15, 2011, 10:59:24 PM
Oh wow, the article was actually written by Clockw0rk.  Still holding out for Classic MM as DLC...

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Offline Solar

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Reply #2304 on: November 15, 2011, 11:41:05 PM
The game is now in my hands. See you guys online!


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Offline AquaTeamV3

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Reply #2305 on: November 16, 2011, 12:55:59 AM
Dang, I won't have this in my hands until around early December. :/  Oh well, I'll have the strategy guide to tie me over until then!

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Offline Protoman Blues

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Reply #2306 on: November 16, 2011, 08:17:13 PM
Haha, there's a tournament for this game at my comic book shop on Saturday!



Offline Satoryu

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Reply #2307 on: November 16, 2011, 08:50:34 PM
Wow these achievments are demanding. If you don't buy Jill and Shuma, you have to complete every single mission. Now I was able to do everyone's first 7 no problem, and I was able to do all 10 of Hulk's, but these missions seem much tougher than vanilla's. Compound that with all the time requirement ones, and the 5 ranked wins in a row (unless I can grind it out with someone), I think I might skip the 100% achievements this time. I'll do what I can though. I'll get all the endings and artwork and such for sure.


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Offline Ninja Lou

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Reply #2308 on: November 18, 2011, 10:13:23 AM
Saw the complete list for the character costume DLC. I must say I just might have to get Jim Lee's Jean Grey. Also looks like (if they decide to do it) there will be no character DLC till at least sometime after March.


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Offline AquaTeamV3

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Reply #2309 on: November 18, 2011, 02:46:59 PM
Saw the complete list for the character costume DLC. I must say I just might have to get Jim Lee's Jean Grey. Also looks like (if they decide to do it) there will be no character DLC till at least sometime after March.

I heard a rumor a couple of days ago that there would be 4 new DLC characters by the end of the year, and one of them was a member of the X-Men.  While a little questionable, it's something that I could see happening.

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Offline Ninja Lou

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Reply #2310 on: November 20, 2011, 11:59:01 AM
So I was at the New York comic con when they announced the heroes and heralds mode, and while they explained it to us I saw X on one of the cards. I turned to PB and told him, "Damn it X is a card probably means he won't be a character in the game now". Then later on we find out that X is just a skin for Zero. I shake it off and hope for MegaMan. Well now that is out the window too. Someone was able able to rip the images for the cards right off the DVD and there is MegaMan. Mind you if that is the complete set then none of the cards included have any of the current characters on them (Ryu, Cap, Morrigan, Etc).
http://shoryuken.com/2011/11/19/heroes-and-heralds-cards-ripped-from-umvc3-disc/

Now if that's how they did it and characters that are not going to be in the game are cards then I guess I can hope for Trigger or Exe at this point. Well technically PB and I can still hope for Protoman since he wasn't a card, hell maybe even get Roll back.


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Reply #2311 on: November 20, 2011, 04:52:54 PM
Also Vent, Aile, and Geo, even if they are a bit more obscure.

But looking at true post-development DLC (not this unlock-flag stuff that Capcom usually pulls), I don't think the rule-out logic holds.  I mean, all characters on the game disc were long since revealed, right? (victory images have been file-ripped)  So they decide to use NPCs for their cards, which is in itself a matter of variety to the presentation and not of necessity.  So what about that stops them from revisiting a character who appeared on the cards?  X is already bending that "rule" anyway seeings how he is both a card and a character skin.

Speaking of which, am I the only one on the internet who realizes that X's varying armors make visual distinction from Zero's alternate skin a complete nonissue?  Yeah, just throwing that out there.  I'm not saying they'll do it, but I am saying that the so-called fans are foolish to give up so easily.  X went from the top of the polls to "ruined forever" for absolutely no reason, and we wonder why Capcom doesn't believe in the Mega Man fanbase.

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Reply #2312 on: November 20, 2011, 06:57:26 PM
I swear, the internet is too hung up on this "character referenced in game = not joining the roster" and it's really silly. Especially now in the day of DLC and companies going for whatever can make them the fastest buck/fan demand backing this up.



Offline The Great Gonzo

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Reply #2313 on: November 20, 2011, 07:30:07 PM
Quote
X went from the top of the polls to "ruined forever" for absolutely no reason, and we wonder why Capcom doesn't believe in the Mega Man fanbase.

It's not okay to feel that X getting reduced to his pal's alt. was severe half-assing at best? (And "absolutely no reason"? Seriously? There's already been quite a few reasons that don't amount to endless whining)

Between that (good points raised in favour of an NPC becoming playable aside) and rumours that some form of MM will be playable in SFxT (Lupinko's "blue hobo" hint is not encouraging in the slightest), I sincerely doubt MM will ever see the light of UMvC3.



Offline Solar

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Reply #2314 on: November 20, 2011, 08:19:00 PM
I swear, the internet is too hung up on this "character referenced in game = not joining the roster" and it's really silly. Especially now in the day of DLC and companies going for whatever can make them the fastest buck/fan demand backing this up.

Yeah, that annoys me too. Background and ending cameos, references, colors for someone else, and a card are one thing though, but making that character an entire new model only to use it as a costume for a totally different character? That's soul crushing. I'm not saying X's chances are 0, but I'd be lying if I said they don't feel like it.



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Offline Hypershell

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Reply #2315 on: November 21, 2011, 04:57:40 AM
It's not okay to feel that X getting reduced to his pal's alt. was severe half-assing at best? (And "absolutely no reason"? Seriously? There's already been quite a few reasons that don't amount to endless whining)

Between that (good points raised in favour of an NPC becoming playable aside) and rumours that some form of MM will be playable in SFxT (Lupinko's "blue hobo" hint is not encouraging in the slightest), I sincerely doubt MM will ever see the light of UMvC3.
I'm not saying they should be content, I'm saying they gave up too easily.  The vast majority of people who want X in the game no longer believe it to be possible, solely because his unarmored form is Zero's alternate (and Frank's, but nobody cares there due to the more derivative nature).  Seeing that kind of lack of imagination among X's so-called fans is sickening to me.  I cannot describe in words how much I would love to see either Command Mission or X1 Full Armor X as a DLC character just to watch the eggs rot on their faces.  It may be unlikely, but disregarding the authors for one moment and speaking solely in the context of the game's structure, there's no reason it couldn't happen.

If people really want X, then as long as DLC additions are still on the table, they should be continuing to push for him.  Instead, they're content to throw their arms in the air and walk away, because every reference to him is one more reason he was "ruled out" in their own minds.  It's pathetic.  For X's own fans to be so disloyal to him, it will only convince Capcom that they are not worth listening to.

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Offline The Great Gonzo

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Reply #2316 on: November 21, 2011, 05:22:15 AM
I'd be more inclined to think that many of the people who went "oh well, better than nothing" were the ones who gave up; I saw more than a few "this is how you make X distinct from Zero" comments.

Honestly, I'm not sure what good continuing to push for X's proper inclusion in UMvC3 will do, if all it amounted to was an alt. It's possible we might get something better next time, but those chances aren't looking too good--especially if one of the PR guys told us to be happy with what we got (yeah, PR, but still). That would discourage anyone, I'd think.



Offline Jericho

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Reply #2317 on: November 21, 2011, 06:39:13 AM
Thing is at this point, no one has explicitly stated that being referenced in this game via alt or card is a strict de-confirmation of any appearances down the road, especially when DLC is still being planned and discussed with the catch of being tied to initial game sales.

All this means is that people should chill and get ready for when that happens to show support when the right venue comes up instead of gushing about everywhere unrelated and giving the net a bad impression of the fandom.

On another note, the biggest reason I back X over any incarnation of Megaman at this point is because in the gameplay engine they have going here, he would really shine between his mobility, weapons, and chargeable weapons being a mechanic. I should link to a move set I scrub theorized together just to give ideas of how versatile the character could be in the game. Check it out. The only other stand alone Megaman that comes close to his potential alone is Megaman.EXE.



Offline Protoman Blues

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Reply #2318 on: November 21, 2011, 06:49:06 AM
I swear, the internet is too hung up on this "character referenced in game = not joining the roster" and it's really silly. Especially now in the day of DLC and companies going for whatever can make them the fastest buck/fan demand backing this up.

They're hung up on X more than anything, and again Capcom has no one to blame but themselves. I've said it before and I'll say it again, that's what happens when you treat your customers like utter [parasitic bomb] and offer no compensation. Hahahaha, and as for "companies going for whatever can make them the fastest buck/fan demand backing this up," please see below...

It may be unlikely, but disregarding the authors for one moment and speaking solely in the context of the game's structure, there's no reason it couldn't happen.

If people really want X, then as long as DLC additions are still on the table, they should be continuing to push for him.  Instead, they're content to throw their arms in the air and walk away, because every reference to him is one more reason he was "ruled out" in their own minds.  It's pathetic.  For X's own fans to be so disloyal to him, it will only convince Capcom that they are not worth listening to.

LOL! If by "disregarding the authors for one moment and speaking solely in the context of the game's structure" you mean "ignore the fact that Capcom ignored the DLC in the original $60 dollar game and forced their customers to buy a brand new $40 Expansion pack which in turn made said $60 purchase 100% useless" I'll be honest....I personally find that kinda hard to disregard. But that's just me.

I mean honestly, what about this MVC3 series gives you any sense of hope or reason it could happen? The very game itself is almost concrete, Phoenix Wright-able evidence that they have 0% interest in utilizing their DLC system. They charge $60 for the bare-minimum'd first game, ignored the game's structure, then made that very purchase obsolete by releasing this version of it. Realistically, what that shows is that the only chance of seeing X or any other MM character in a MvC3 fighting game is if they release another brand new $40 game and make UMvC3 useless. I mean, they've already stated that they have no plans at this moment to utilize DLC for characters at this time. Again, not concrete evidence but considering UMvC3 itself, it's pretty clear that Capcom is interested in giving the fans of this game the bare minimum and essentially screwing them out of as much money as possible because they know that people are going to buy it regardless.

And you think that Capcom thinks MM fans are worth listening to? X was the top polled character, showing that most of them actually do care, and he wasn't in the game anyway but a skin & card. So because X fans don't start a 100,000 X Fans Strong To Get Mega Man X in UMvC3 Facebook page, they're disloyal? Because they don't think he'll be put in the game based on the evidence already clearly shoved in our faces for $40 after already spending $60, X fans are disloyal? As of now, all that's being shown is that Capcom already doesn't give a [parasitic bomb] what MM fans think. People are still furious over how they were treated, and they've been offered zero compensation to make up for that, except for a brief statement from Seth Killian for fans not to give up hope on the MM franchise.

Keep in mind too, I don't even think putting X in UMvC3 in anyway would help ease fan anger over how they were treated. They want more than X in a fighting game. As insanely happy as it would make me, they want more than another downloadable 8-Bit Classic series MM game. They want a new high end game, and both the intelligent fans & the Capcom business executives know that there is little to no profit in making one right now.

Also keep in mind, I'm an optimist. I don't think the franchise in done with in any stretch of the imagination. However, what the overly optimistic and depressed pessimistic don't seem to realize is that the series is no longer profitable and people outside of the MM fanbase have little to no interest in the franchise anymore. I don't care that X isn't in UMvC3, because it doesn't [tornado fang]ing matter in terms of both X fandom or the future of the MM Franchise. It's a goddamn fighting game. And this one is still a $40 expansion pack that makes the first game absolutely useless. I'm much more upset about that than X not being in the game, in terms of the MvC franchise. In terms of fighting games, I'd love another TatsuCap. So people who are complaining that X is not in a fighting game and think it has anything to do with the franchises' history are just as foolish as people who think that X fans are disloyal for not pushing for him to be a DLC character harder after they've already ignored both his #1 polling & the fact that Capcom has ignored the DLC in the previous $60 game.



Offline Jericho

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Reply #2319 on: November 21, 2011, 07:12:54 AM
Totally agreed with you on the overall post content PB, but I'm talking on the front of wanting X as a playable character in MVC3 for more than just visual lip service from Capcom in regards to the state of the franchise. I'll have something more coherent to post when I get some sleep though. XD



Offline Flame

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Reply #2320 on: November 21, 2011, 09:14:58 AM
Wow, PB. Wow.

I just cant help but agree with all that.
I especially agree on the purchases thing. Capcom has basically had the Fanbase pay 100 dollars for this game, and [parasitic bomb] is it shameful. people that complain about those complaining always say "your just complaining over X being in the game?" but in most cases anyway, its more than about Just X, its really just about MvC3's handling as a whole. They made you pay 60 bucks for what amounts to a beta, and then 40 bucks more for the finished version. And even then, it involves on-disc DLC doesnt it? Which is even worse. So they will have you pay MORE to unlock content already on the disc. (or partial content, Im not too sure, Is it just the DLC skin victory images and [parasitic bomb]? or are the skins there too?)

Also- I was actually pretty pissed at Seth's comment in response to people claiming being trolled by Capcom over the Mega Man Franchise having so many cameos in MvC3 but no actual Mega Man.

So basically, he's telling us to shut up and accept what we got? People aren't allowed to feel trolled when Capcom has offered no explanations other than shoving cameo after cameo in our faces, but no actual blue Super Fighting Robot?


...When Larry the reploid accountant goes maverick of his own accord, he's certainly formidable during tax season, but he isn't going to provide X the challenge needed to make him grow as a warrior and reach his potential.


Offline Satoryu

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Reply #2321 on: November 21, 2011, 09:20:19 AM
On another note, the biggest reason I back X over any incarnation of Megaman at this point is because in the gameplay engine they have going here, he would really shine between his mobility, weapons, and chargeable weapons being a mechanic. I should link to a move set I scrub theorized together just to give ideas of how versatile the character could be in the game. Check it out.

There's a difference between being versatile and absolutely over equipped. Your X would be so many different kinds of broken. The only way he could be any more God Tier is if he wasn't a low health character and had a teleport.

The charging of each and every special move really did the number. I like that you would like X to import that aspect of himself over from the games, but it's just too much. Having quarter circle and half circle special moves in the same direction didn't help either. I've told you about that before; you wouldn't get the input you wanted half the time. Not to mention your X is a memory whore. Flipping between every single armor would be way too demanding on the system.

There were some ideas in there that would be very interesting in a game like Marvel. The Gravity Well effects are some of them, but they sound too good to be regular special moves. That's like if Ammy or Joe's slow hypers were just specials. That [tornado fang]ing dog would be even more cheap than she already is. And Crystal Wall OTGing makes so much sense I completely overlooked it in my movelist and I should totally fix that.That's a not so subtle hint that I want you to read that because I am genuinely curious as to what you have to say.


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Reply #2322 on: November 21, 2011, 10:23:13 AM
Also- I was actually pretty pissed at Seth's comment in response to people claiming being trolled by Capcom over the Mega Man Franchise having so many cameos in MvC3 but no actual Mega Man.

So basically, he's telling us to shut up and accept what we got? People aren't allowed to feel trolled when Capcom has offered no explanations other than shoving cameo after cameo in our faces, but no actual blue Super Fighting Robot?

Honestly, I have no problem with the cameos in UMvC3 because again, I don't think it matters regarding the state of the franchise. In the long run, cameos are usually a nice thing to see. As a comic fan, I absolutely love the Days of Future's Past poster that shows Mega Man still alive & kicking (which makes sense in the Sentinel's Future considering that he's a robot). I mean, the MM franchise has two representatives, whereas I still don't see either Fokker or Rouge from my lovable Power Stone franchise anywhere on the roster, or even close to being there. As for the X skin, again I really find the game itself more offensive than that.

The cameos are most likely honestly meant to be something fun. It's something the writers & game designers, people who have absolutely nothing to do with what's happening to the MM franchise right now, wanted to throw in. It's really just bad timing as well as the fact that again Capcom has offered no compensation for their business holocaust regarding MML3, and trust me when I say that simply putting X or any other MM character in UMvC3 would not be enough. In regards to the MM franchise, UMvC3 has nothing to do with what's happened or what will happen. No matter what cameos are in the game, no matter what new characters they put in the game via DLC or Admantium Marvel vs. Capcom 3 $40 expansion pack disc, the MM franchise will still remain in it's current dire straights.

However, in terms of people complaining about X's fighting game debut denial or the fact that Rock's not even playable when he was in the previous MvC games (plus the poster), this is what Capcom is going to deal with for a long time, and it's sad that the Capcom Unity people, fans of other Capcom franchise's, and those of us who aren't as upset as them have to deal with it. But when you treat your customers like [parasitic bomb], they are in a shitty mood cause they've essentially been covered in [parasitic bomb]. I think what REALLY irritates fans more than anything, without a lot of them even knowing it, is that after what they did with MML3, and hell after paying $100 for a fighting game, they don't really want to support the company anymore but they know that Capcom has them by the balls when it comes to their favorite types of games to play. This is why Capcom doesn't have to offer any sort of compensation for the MML3 debacle, because despite them covering you with [parasitic bomb] they know people are still coming back to them, because gamers are just as much addicts as crack users. The initial launch of the 360 is proof enough of that, because I don't think there's another product in the electronics world than can have a 56% failure rate at one point, and still continue to sell even after it breaking 2 or 3 or 8 times.

tl;dr

So essentially, the short version regarding the UMvC3 trolling is, it's really not trolling and don't sweat the small stuff like that. Cameos are in for fun, not douchebaggery, and there's really no malice behind it. However, don't forget what kind of company you're dealing with now. Don't forget what they did, and observe what they continue to do.



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Reply #2323 on: November 21, 2011, 04:38:29 PM
There's a difference between being versatile and absolutely over equipped. Your X would be so many different kinds of broken. The only way he could be any more God Tier is if he wasn't a low health character and had a teleport.

The charging of each and every special move really did the number. I like that you would like X to import that aspect of himself over from the games, but it's just too much. Having quarter circle and half circle special moves in the same direction didn't help either. I've told you about that before; you wouldn't get the input you wanted half the time. Not to mention your X is a memory whore. Flipping between every single armor would be way too demanding on the system.

There were some ideas in there that would be very interesting in a game like Marvel. The Gravity Well effects are some of them, but they sound too good to be regular special moves. That's like if Ammy or Joe's slow hypers were just specials. That [tornado fang]ing dog would be even more cheap than she already is. And Crystal Wall OTGing makes so much sense I completely overlooked it in my movelist and I should totally fix that.That's a not so subtle hint that I want you to read that because I am genuinely curious as to what you have to say.

Remember, I prefaced my comment with a scrub theory monster comment. I made that X sometime before I even started doing things with my side project and understood what makes a fighting game character reasonable. If anything, that's more about how overall moves or mechanics with the character could work than a guideline to what X should be entirely about. He'd be broke as [parasitic bomb] like that. XD

On your interpretation of X, I like it honestly, but I feel like X has too many weapon options that can be creatively played with for his normals to just be regular kicks and punches. You do a better job of mapping moves to command normals though. Why I didn't think of things like Fire Wave being a b.H input is beyond me, but now I'm very tempted to steal that and redo my initial move set here on RPM. XD

Overall, I've always kinda seen him as this high mobility pixie character (750K - 900K - better than Zero but still somewhat under average) with tools because that's what he's always been about in the series. I also kinda wanted to design something that was the antithesis of Dante in the game, a "Swiss army knife" that can play all styles but does zoning best (versus Dante's focus on rushdown). People don't realize how much potential X has as a fighting game character just because he follows in the archetype of Megaman in MVC2 & prior and that's something that needs to be shown off in these move sets more. All imo of course.

tl;dr

So essentially, the short version regarding the UMvC3 trolling is, it's really not trolling and don't sweat the small stuff like that. Cameos are in for fun, not douchebaggery, and there's really no malice behind it. However, don't forget what kind of company you're dealing with now. Don't forget what they did, and observe what they continue to do.

Pretty much the main train of thought I'm on and what everyone else should try to see right here.



Offline Solar

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Reply #2324 on: November 21, 2011, 05:42:01 PM
tl;dr

So essentially, the short version regarding the UMvC3 trolling is, it's really not trolling and don't sweat the small stuff like that. Cameos are in for fun, not douchebaggery, and there's really no malice behind it.

Pretty much. Like you've said, Capcom are not doing it to make MM fans angry, MM fans are doing that to themselves, HOWEVER, it IS Capcom's fault entirely that that happens because of how they've handled the situation.


Also, on the whole $40 expansion thing and Capcom having no interest in using its DLC, personally I don't mind that much. The way I see it, those are $20 less that I have to pay for all characters (if they were going to keep their prices the same it'd be 5*12=$60 for the characters alone), plus it comes with more stages (although as good as they look, none of them are truly new), and system and balance changes. It's also way more convenient for gatherings/tournaments, because if Jill/Shuma were any indication, chances are I wouldn't be able to play with half the new characters every time I go to my weekly tourney -.-

Now, whether all that stuff should've been in the original version in the first place is another argument. Still, I'm sure you know how companies work; even if the ones making the game would've wanted that, the guys at the top of the company make it impossible.


My life is currently bears and Jojos and everything is great.