Topic: Best and Worst Armors?

[Hypershell]

In a possibly futile attempt to re-rail the topic, I forgot one of Keno's posts when I was typing up responses earlier.

All of Zero's techniques were awesome. I'm willing to go so far as to say X5 had the best weapon set for Zero.

They're powerful but they're also unoriginal.  Every one of Zero's X5 attacks are derived from X4's, with the exception of Dark Hold which is a Time Stopper reference.  He doesn't have any new attacks at all.  But I will say, a damaging air-dash with the ability to slant was pretty cool.  It also works nice with Hyper Dash as it forces a longer air-dash length.

Yea, & then they couldn't've added shot eraser & other such things to armors.

Oh, yes they could have.  The same as they incorporate Shock Buffer into the armors, as well as that, Saber Plus, and Shot Eraser into Black Zero.

[AquaTeamV3]

They're powerful but they're also unoriginal.  Every one of Zero's X5 attacks are derived from X4's, with the exception of Dark Hold which is a Time Stopper reference.  He doesn't have any new attacks at all.  But I will say, a damaging air-dash with the ability to slant was pretty cool.  It also works nice with Hyper Dash as it forces a longer air-dash length.

Zero's moves in X5 feel slower as a whole as compared to X4.  You can't cancel into them from any of your slashes, and they tend to leave you wide open in some cases (W. Shredder, anyone?).  Zero's Hisuisho and Messenko were nice, and twin dream was interesting to play around with.

[Soultrigger]

W. Shredder completely sucks. It even removes the ability to Dash-cancel your slashes.

Best armor: X2. Double Buster = Instawin
Worst armor: Max (X3). Nothing useful about it except the Up Air Dash, but Mach Dash eclipses it (chargeable, faster, invincibility frames, a Down Air Dash for safety) with the only downside that you can't really control the distance.

Did anyone else notice the gimped Air Dash physics after X3? I'm glad they fixed that later with Model H/Hx, but geez.

[Pringer X]

In a possibly futile attempt to re-rail the topic, I forgot one of Keno's posts when I was typing up responses earlier.
They're powerful but they're also unoriginal.  Every one of Zero's X5 attacks are derived from X4's, with the exception of Dark Hold which is a Time Stopper reference.  He doesn't have any new attacks at all.  But I will say, a damaging air-dash with the ability to slant was pretty cool.  It also works nice with Hyper Dash as it forces a longer air-dash length.

The problem with X6's attacks for Zero were that half of them had ammo and were more of a combination of moves and weapons from previous X games involving Zero, and X's weapons themselves in that one. They were also altered from X4 so that they ended up being even more useful. Up+Triangle in X4 was a jumping fire slash, while X5 had a jumping lightning slash that also rained lightning from below, which was useful in taking out enemies coming in from up AND down. Not to mention not ALL of the attacks were just copy/pastes, just the double jump, and the Up/Down combinations.

[Hypershell]

W. Shredder completely sucks. It even removes the ability to Dash-cancel your slashes.

Since when does removing an obvious physics exploit suck?

Did anyone else notice the gimped Air Dash physics after X3? I'm glad they fixed that later with Model H/Hx, but geez.

The entire fanbase noticed the lack of air-dash momentum in PS1.  But if you think H/HX was the one to fix it, you need to get equipped with Xtreme2.  Badly.

The problem with X6's attacks for Zero were that half of them had ammo and were more of a combination of moves and weapons from previous X games involving Zero, and X's weapons themselves in that one. They were also altered from X4 so that they ended up being even more useful. Up+Triangle in X4 was a jumping fire slash, while X5 had a jumping lightning slash that also rained lightning from below, which was useful in taking out enemies coming in from up AND down. Not to mention not ALL of the attacks were just copy/pastes, just the double jump, and the Up/Down combinations.

Check your numbering, which are you talking about?  Paragraphs are nice for that.

X5?  Yes, ALL of them are copy/paste.  W-Shredder is Shippuga performed by your dash shadow.  C-Sword is Kuuenzan with a crescent effect.  F-Splasher is Hienkyaku made into an actual attack, albeit a good one, but it's still sprite re-use with an effect pasted over.  Messenko is of course a souped up Rakuhouha, although I'll not criticize that one since Zero without ground-punching is like X without charging (DAMN YOU, INTI!!!).  E-Blade and Quake Blazer are elemental swaps of Ryuenjin and Hyouretsuzan, and the earlier has significantly shorter reach (screw the lightning, I don't jump into the air to attack stuff below me).  Tenkuuha was switched to a Power-Up Part (for the better, IMHO), leaving Raijingeki as the only X4 special absent from X5.  Twin Dream is a nerfed version of X's Soul Body, and Dark Hold is MM2's Time Stopper.

That's everything but the Z-Buster, one of the few original sprites in the game.  Nice to have for completion's sake, but it's crapily made (modeled after the wrong buster, and they couldn't even get the "other" model right as the colors are off), and near worthless in execution.

[Flame]

Since when does removing an obvious physics exploit suck?

Lol, thats true. Although I never used the dash cancel exploit in X4-5... it was much easier in X6, since Zero did a side swipe first, instead of an overhead one.

And even then, It wasnt really necessary, Zero was pretty good in X6... (button mapping aside) Especially his buster. I was surprised how many times I used it.

[Hypershell]

Very true.  There's very little in X6 that the combination of Z-Buster and Ensuizan cannot annihilate.

[Flame]

Very true.  There's very little in X6 that the combination of Z-Buster and Ensuizan cannot annihilate.

Most definitely. especially if you have saber items equipped

[Satoryu]

Since when does removing an obvious physics exploit suck?

when you speedrun and don't yet have Ultimate X.

[Hypershell]

Figures.  Speedrunning ruined MM9 for me...

[Elpis TK31]

The entire fanbase noticed the lack of air-dash momentum in PS1.  But if you think H/HX was the one to fix it, you need to get equipped with Xtreme2.  Badly.

Xtreme2 was on gameboy, it's not fair to say it fixed airdashing.
Because it didn't change dick for X7 wich airdashing was still gimped...I'm not sure about X8.
I haven't played it in quite a while, but if it fixed it, it was the one to fix it for the future, not Xtreme2.

All in all, HX did a better job at Airdashing than any other MM game, save X3 w/Foot Chip.
It's like Z3~Z4 did a way better job at double jumps, allowing them after a Dash, wich Zero couldn't do from X4~X8 but Forte could >.>

-Elpis

[Align]

Now if only we can get the ability to do all 3 maneouvers... dashjump+double jump+airdash.

[Flame]

That's broken.

[Align]

Really?

[Flame]

I would think so. unless like X3, you can get iup to that by upgrades and power ups.

[Elpis TK31]

Why does it seem that broken = bad to most people?

OIS has got to be the most broken gameplay mechanic in years (it provides with pwnage of bosses faster than some Ultimate modes of Zero series) and I love it more than anything.

I would love to see Dashdoublejumpairdash someday. But I 'm quite content with just Airdashing in Dashjumps and not HAVING TO STAND STILL while performing a double charge shot.

-Elpis

[Flame]

Because even with OIS, Serpent is somewhat annoying in his second form. (thank god for Hx tornado here)

Its bad because it is overpowering a character from the start. theres nothing wrong with it if you EARN it, but othewise...

[HyperSonicEXE]

After having learned to use OIS, it's not anymore broken than using a boss' weakness in the old games. Which is essentially what that was supposed to replace.

It's also a freakin' pain in the tail to use. ZXA got rid of it, but replaced it with Boss Forms that were far, far worse.

[Hypershell]

OIS is fun to use, but I kinda resent the fact that it amounts to quick "insta-flicks" on and off when attacking.  Locking in it (after a charge-up akin to Model A's Giga) would have been more reasonable.

Xtreme2 was on gameboy, it's not fair to say it fixed airdashing.

It is entirely fair.  Soultrigger said "after X3", which by definition encompasses multiple consoles.  Xtreme2 was released after X5, thus it fixed the broken air-dash physics of the previous two PS1 games.  That future developments failed to heed such a fix does not undo the fact that the fix existed.

I'm not sure about X8.

Are you kidding?  Zero's GROUND dash is gimped in X8, much less air.

if it fixed it, it was the one to fix it for the future, not Xtreme2.

X and ZX series are made by different development teams.  That ZX games feature superior air-dash physics in no way guarantees that a future X-series title would.

It's like Z3~Z4 did a way better job at double jumps, allowing them after a Dash, wich Zero couldn't do from X4~X8 but Forte could >.>

Case in point: X8 was released after Z3.

And on the topic of double-jumping, Z3/Z4 is superior for distance, but it fails in height.  No amount of dashing can fix that.

Why does it seem that broken = bad to most people?

OIS has got to be the most broken gameplay mechanic in years (it provides with pwnage of bosses faster than some Ultimate modes of Zero series) and I love it more than anything.

Very true.  Although I enjoy the proper use of a Double Charge Wave, but that's just me.

I would love to see Dashdoublejumpairdash someday. But I 'm quite content with just Airdashing in Dashjumps

To be fair, we don't have dashjump-airdash.  We have dashjump-airdash-hover.  Quite broken, and awesome.

and not HAVING TO STAND STILL while performing a double charge shot.

I don't mind if speed and firepower of the shots are sufficient, as they were in X2 (but most definitely NOT in X3).  I'm more concerned with using both arms in a double charge shot, which has never been done since X3.  Inti does some pretty low-frame attack animations, so it really shouldn't have been too hard for them to do alternate buster frames for Model X.

[Satoryu]

Are you kidding?  Zero's GROUND dash is gimped in X8, much less air.

distance doesn't mean [parasitic bomb] when you can spam. and his dash jump is unchanged.

To be fair, we don't have dashjump-airdash. 

X2 has dash jump-charged Speed Burner-air dash.

[Soultrigger]

But if you think H/HX was the one to fix it, you need to get equipped with Xtreme2.  Badly.

Okay, I forgot about Xtreme2. Chillax.
And next time, don't assume I don't have it. Because I do. >_>

[Keno]

Why does it seem that broken = bad to most people?

Well, easy = bad when it comes to games, & broken = easy, so broken must equal bad.

[Hypershell]

I resent that.  There are easy games that are damn fun.  MM3, X4, and the ever-awesome Xtreme2 come to mind.  And one cannot deny the absolute win of taking out some frustration on the Smash Bros. CPU in a 2.0 Damage all-explosives match.

Not to mention the entire Zero series is dirt-simple to a completionist who does his replays on Ultimate Mode (yeah, I can strut my stuff in 100-point run for Levi's minigame with the rest of 'em, but that's not how I play for fun, and fun is the whole point of games).

Okay, I forgot about Xtreme2. Chillax.
And next time, don't assume I don't have it. Because I do. >_>

I said, "if", therefore assuming nothing.  And this is RPM, I have to deal with otherwise respectable members who foolishly deny themselves such awesome greatness.

(*smacks PB* PLAY IT!!!)

[Flame]

Well, easy = bad when it comes to games, & broken = easy, so broken must equal bad.

For once, I kinda agree with you on this one. A game should be challenging enough that it lasts a good while, while not lasting forever.

[AquaTeamV3]

Well, easy = bad when it comes to games, & broken = easy, so broken must equal bad.

[spoiler][/spoiler]
Broken and easy are two different things.  IMO, the most fun games are the ones that are easy to learn but hard to master.