Author Topic: Disappointments with Legends 3? Here.  (Read 10711 times)

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Offline Ramzal

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Disappointments with Legends 3? Here.
« on: October 01, 2010, 08:35:09 AM »
Because of the lack of ability to put any opinion of the opposite in the other Megaman Legends 3 thread, and at fact of being -banned- for a week for it. I've decided to place a thread outside of main threads. While the game is not out yet and little critiquing can be done from that, there still can be the opposite opinion because that's...well, you know. Only fair. While I am glad that there is a Legends 3 in development, I find myself being brought back to Legends 1, and 2 along with my thoughts on the series itself. Besides it's ability to tell a story in game, it wasn't too great outside of carrying the name "Megaman." The controls were stiff, the textures were terrible while they could have been made better, and the gameplay was rugged. Honestly if it didn't have the title "Megaman" on it, it would not get the shine it does get now.

I'm also a bit surprised at the hype behind it around the forums. I do in fact get that we are all Megaman fans. I am too. I like the idea of Legends 3, without a doubt. However it's a bit strange that people are willing to shell out a large amount of cash for the system and the game alone for reason, given what kind of game it was if you would take the fan appeal out of it. Now, that is not to say that Legends 3 will be like the other two. While enjoyable, the game had more than enough problems than it's share and could have been made better on the second go-round. Capcom used the "if it isn't broke don't fix it" application it is known for. Personally, I am a bit worried this will carry on in the third game. While I understand that people are excited about a game they've waited years for, it seems that obsession has caused any other opinion to automatically be non-factual or irrelavent despite local evidence. For fan hype that's been around, I can personally say my anticipation for the game has decrease.

Not to sound in offense, it sounds as if there is a tinge of social pleasure from it. I understand, it is a game we've all been waiting for. I understand that we want it badly. However, I am disappointed with the fact that  it will not be coming out for a current generation console that cost plenty and more than enough revenue would be made. I am not attempting to crash the "Celebration" as it is cause (No offense, but it's a video game, guys. Common.) But I am merely stating my opinion and would like other -senseable- opinions whether they be agreeing with my own or against. Then again, this is the internet. No such thing as free speech depending on situation and location.

Offline Protoman Blues

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Re: Disappointments with Legends 3? Here.
« Reply #1 on: October 01, 2010, 08:46:34 AM »
Question. Do you own every system?

In fact, I'll throw this out there. Who here owns every current gen game system, handheld and console alike?

I do!

Offline KoiDrake

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Re: Disappointments with Legends 3? Here.
« Reply #2 on: October 01, 2010, 08:58:55 AM »
Every game should be made for PC, that way I would have a slightly bigger chance to play any of these new stuff. Also, damn you PB :(

Offline Ramzal

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Re: Disappointments with Legends 3? Here.
« Reply #3 on: October 01, 2010, 09:01:38 AM »
Question. Do you own every system?

In fact, I'll throw this out there. Who here owns every current gen game system, handheld and console alike?

I do!

Actually, yes I do.

Offline Protoman Blues

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Re: Disappointments with Legends 3? Here.
« Reply #4 on: October 01, 2010, 09:06:26 AM »
Actually, yes I do.

So then we could get the game no matter what system it came out on. But what about those who don't own every system, like us? They'd have to shell out money for a new system anyway, no matter what system it came out on.

Offline Ramzal

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Re: Disappointments with Legends 3? Here.
« Reply #5 on: October 01, 2010, 09:13:00 AM »
However the majority of gamers who decide to keep up with modern gaming have either a Wii or a Xbox 360/Ps3. And what about them? Do what is being done for "No more Heroes." or Spider-Man Shatterd Dimensions. Look at the Spiderman games in general. In public opinion, they tended to be not so great, however the recent succeeded highly and sold on multiple consoles while taking chances on whether or not anyone would even want the game after Web of Shadows. Release it on multiple consoles or announce the possibility of it being on multiple consoles in the future. Widen the spectrum of purchase to increase sale potential. It's a basic sales strategy. When you bring out a product that hasn't been touched in a long time, and only one reasonable way to get it, you are alienating out more of the people who could have it with current resources.

Offline MrBaryl

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Re: Disappointments with Legends 3? Here.
« Reply #6 on: October 01, 2010, 09:17:37 AM »
Im getting Legends 3 because it's a series that I like, not because it has the word "megaman" in it, even if it takes me months to get the console I'll know it is for something I want.

Damn, the controls were stiff yet I enjoyed both games, not counting my R2 and L2 buttons didn't worked! ůVů

Offline Protoman Blues

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Re: Disappointments with Legends 3? Here.
« Reply #7 on: October 01, 2010, 09:22:41 AM »
However the majority of gamers who decide to keep up with modern gaming have either a Wii or a Xbox 360/Ps3. And what about them? Do what is being done for "No more Heroes." or Spider-Man Shatterd Dimensions. Look at the Spiderman games in general. In public opinion, they tended to be not so great, however the recent succeeded highly and sold on multiple consoles while taking chances on whether or not anyone would even want the game after Web of Shadows. Release it on multiple consoles or announce the possibility of it being on multiple consoles in the future. Widen the spectrum of purchase to increase sale potential. It's a basic sales strategy. When you bring out a product that hasn't been touched in a long time, and only one reasonable way to get it, you are alienating out more of the people who could have it with current resources.

And they all own a DS or DSi, and they will all buy a 3DS, no matter if it's $250-$300.

Odds are, no matter what system Legends 3 game out on, it would have the same selling issues as most MegaMan games do.

Offline Mirby

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Re: Disappointments with Legends 3? Here.
« Reply #8 on: October 01, 2010, 09:23:09 AM »
I have a DS Lite.

That is all I have.

And I'm happy with it. But I'd be willing to upgrade to a 3DS for this, and for many other games, simply because of the hardware and portability.

With that said, I'll try to stay out of this topic.
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Offline MrBaryl

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Re: Disappointments with Legends 3? Here.
« Reply #9 on: October 01, 2010, 09:28:38 AM »
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I don't own any of those consoles and I can go and play a wii for 1 hour and play a lame game if I want to, that's why I always liked portable consoles instead of the home models, heck I got other stuff to spend money on.

Offline Ramzal

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Re: Disappointments with Legends 3? Here.
« Reply #10 on: October 01, 2010, 09:33:46 AM »
And they all own a DS or DSi, and they will all buy a 3DS, no matter if it's $250-$300.

Odds are, no matter what system Legends 3 game out on, it would have the same selling issues as most MegaMan games do.

However, what if someone does not have a DS or DSi? And remembered Legends on the gaming platforms? It's kind of not fair to make that jump, however I can see why Capcom would not want to make a blue-ray game from the cost of it as well as changing the areas in Legends to high def would be a challange for Capcom, however DmC4 did so perfectly. However, who is to say that it will have most selling issues that most Megaman games have? It is possible that won't be an issue if it is advertised correctly and widely along with constant trailers, and good gameplay. Capcom needs to get Megaman's name out there like it did for MegaMan 9 for it to be successful.

Also, there's an issue I wanted to bring up before. The 3ds is under question of whether or not it will be safe for gaming at all. While watching 3d movies, people have mild senses of discomfort, headaches, dizziness or eye strain. In a game like Megaman, you are constantly being shot -at-. Light energy balls being shot at you. For a prolonged amount of time, that can put a large strain on the retina, rods and cones of your eyes with prolonged gameplay, namely without the use of 3d glasses which minimize that strain.


@BarylTDF:

That's one out of how many situations others have? Most buy home stations because they can play on their own time in comfort. Handhelds are cool because they are usable while on the go.

Offline Mirby

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Re: Disappointments with Legends 3? Here.
« Reply #11 on: October 01, 2010, 09:35:36 AM »
The 3d issues are resolved with the slider that adjusts it, Ramzal. Miyamoto specifically requested that it be an analog slider for that very reason. Not everyone perceives images the same way, which is the issue with 3D movies. There is only one setting.

With the 3DS, one can adjust it in real-time and see the effects instantly. Or turn it off completely.

Thus, the problem is resolved.
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Offline MrBaryl

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Re: Disappointments with Legends 3? Here.
« Reply #12 on: October 01, 2010, 09:37:40 AM »
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SOLD! and sonic stay away from me

Offline Ramzal

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Re: Disappointments with Legends 3? Here.
« Reply #13 on: October 01, 2010, 09:44:07 AM »
The 3d issues are resolved with the slider that adjusts it, Ramzal. Miyamoto specifically requested that it be an analog slider for that very reason. Not everyone perceives images the same way, which is the issue with 3D movies. There is only one setting.

With the 3DS, one can adjust it in real-time and see the effects instantly. Or turn it off completely.

Thus, the problem is resolved.

Actually...no. Miyamoto isn't exactly very good at biology obviously. >_> When there is energy or light projected, your eye adjusts to that light and it takes time. With 3d, it's multiple lights, colors and needless to say pop effects into it. Which requires your eyes to adjust either quicker or slower. If you were to have the 3ds at an angle that is not okay for your eyes, I am 100% sure you will receieve discomfort. If you adjust it, that is more time your eyes have to analyze it and adjust which comes with more discomfort than before. To go from 3d to no 3d in a blink of an eye will do at least a day in eye discomfort as well. Unless you have the eyes of Superman himself that is. So, why would you buy a system with the risk of direct discomfort due to multiple light source and more money for a game that may do it as well because constant LIGHT effects coming towards you would require your eyes to adjust. Answer: <MarsAlienFromInvaderZim> Because it's cool...


As proof. Hold a light to your eyes. Dim it or turn it on and back off rapidly for at least one minute. Constantly. If your eyes don't hurt, buy a 3ds.

Offline Mirby

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Re: Disappointments with Legends 3? Here.
« Reply #14 on: October 01, 2010, 09:46:26 AM »
Question: have you tried the 3DS's analog slider yet? Has anyone?

We won't know how well it works until we try it for ourselves.

I'm sorry, but right now it seems to me like you're trying to point out all the possible flaws and/or failures of the 3DS and why a console would be a better choice for DASH 3 because of that. That's just how it seems to me.
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Offline Ramzal

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Re: Disappointments with Legends 3? Here.
« Reply #15 on: October 01, 2010, 09:48:36 AM »
Question: have you tried the 3DS's analog slider yet? Has anyone?

We don't know how well it works until we try it for ourselves.

A few guys have actually.

"Kotaku writers including myself tried the 3DS at E3. I played and played and viewed several enjoyable games and videos in 3D. While I noticed that a direct viewing angle was needed to appreciate the 3D effect, I did not experience any optical or physical discomfort. Others on the team said that one or another of the games did make them feel queasy if viewed from the wrong angle. Actively messing with the slider that controls the intensity of the systemís 3D effect by swiftly switching it up and down many times did leave one of our team members with a two-day eye ache. Moving it gently left another one of us with no such ailment. Most people I spoke to who had tried the system did not complain of discomfort, but none of us has played the 3DS for more than a few minutes."

Which the majority needing glasses due to eye degradation, your chances of discomfort increases. Also, as I said, try the light experiment. Why would I buy a system that makes me feel sick or discomfort? I want Legends 3, but I won't want it that much.

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Re: Disappointments with Legends 3? Here.
« Reply #16 on: October 01, 2010, 09:48:58 AM »
Let's not forget those who are already photosensitive.  Flashing light patterns can trigger convulsions in some individuals, and if coupled with eye strain and discomfort that some receive from watching 3D movies, then that could be problematic when gamers suddenly drop to the ground in epileptic fits.

I have no plans to buy the 3DS at any time, as due to the gradual loss of my sight in my right eye, 3D effects are hit or miss at times.

Offline Protoman Blues

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Re: Disappointments with Legends 3? Here.
« Reply #17 on: October 01, 2010, 09:56:25 AM »
However, what if someone does not have a DS or DSi? And remembered Legends on the gaming platforms? It's kind of not fair to make that jump, however I can see why Capcom would not want to make a blue-ray game from the cost of it as well as changing the areas in Legends to high def would be a challange for Capcom, however DmC4 did so perfectly. However, who is to say that it will have most selling issues that most Megaman games have? It is possible that won't be an issue if it is advertised correctly and widely along with constant trailers, and good gameplay. Capcom needs to get Megaman's name out there like it did for MegaMan 9 for it to be successful.

Also, there's an issue I wanted to bring up before. The 3ds is under question of whether or not it will be safe for gaming at all. While watching 3d movies, people have mild senses of discomfort, headaches, dizziness or eye strain. In a game like Megaman, you are constantly being shot -at-. Light energy balls being shot at you. For a prolonged amount of time, that can put a large strain on the retina, rods and cones of your eyes with prolonged gameplay, namely without the use of 3d glasses which minimize that strain.

And what if they put it out on a PS3 or 360 and someone didn't own it? Same with the Wii. MegaMan games are, for the most part, going to sell primarily to us, the fans, and the rest will either pick it up or not, depending on how well Capcom markets it more so than the system it's on. If anything, Trigger being in TatsuCap & Tron being in MvC3 is a decent enough promotion as it is.

Honestly, if you think about it, it makes sense even from a marketing standpoint. The 3DS will sell a fuckton of systems no matter how much they charge for it, because gamers gonna have it. It also has no competition for its sales either, unless Sony comes out with the PSP2 for next year's E3.

Offline Ramzal

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Re: Disappointments with Legends 3? Here.
« Reply #18 on: October 01, 2010, 10:07:02 AM »
And what if they put it out on a PS3 or 360 and someone didn't own it? Same with the Wii. MegaMan games are, for the most part, going to sell primarily to us, the fans, and the rest will either pick it up or not, depending on how well Capcom markets it more so than the system it's on. If anything, Trigger being in TatsuCap & Tron being in MvC3 is a decent enough promotion as it is.

Honestly, if you think about it, it makes sense even from a marketing standpoint. The 3DS will sell a fuckton of systems no matter how much they charge for it, because gamers gonna have it. It also has no competition for its sales either, unless Sony comes out with the PSP2 for next year's E3.

In that sense, an N-gage would have sold perfectly. At the time of it's release, others were not. But it failed. Mainly because not many people wanted the hardware. And even then, that's the case for anyone with any system, dude. It doesn't matter if it's DSi, Psp, Ps3, 360 or Wii. Not everyone has every system, true. However what about the people who don't want a 3ds but want Legends? Same story. At the end of the day, it's not avalible to anyone outside of the people who are willing to put their eyes or health at risk at this point. Namely if you don't have 20/20 vision. That's worse because your eyes can't absorb the light equally. And glasses? Say hello to magnified 3d light fed right to the retina. Soooo here's what is being looked at.


3ds:
Unkown Price
Possible retina damage
Possible rod and cone damage
Possible seizures.
Possible stomach sickness.
Not built well for people with one eye or unequal eyesight.
Magnified intensity of light through glasses, increasing the chance for damage.
Not good for people with one eye.

I don't think Megaman Legends 3 is really worth all that. Even at risk. I like the game, love it's release, but really? I like my eyes.

Offline Gotham Ranger

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Re: Disappointments with Legends 3? Here.
« Reply #19 on: October 01, 2010, 10:18:06 AM »
I am disappointed in you who disappoints me.

Offline Mirby

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Re: Disappointments with Legends 3? Here.
« Reply #20 on: October 01, 2010, 10:19:51 AM »
And that's why you can just opt to turn the 3D off.

Also, I don't think it was meant to move up and down quickly like that. Slowly is better for the change is more gradual. Of course there's possible damage to the eyes and stuff, but only if you use the hardware incorrectly.

Same with if you look at a laser light. Possible blindess due to using the product in a manner inconsistent with the original intent.

As for stomach sickness and the other things, back to my first sentence. That's why you can turn the 3D off.

As far as I know, the 3D is purely a visual gimmick. As such, it is completely optional for use.
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Offline Ramzal

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Re: Disappointments with Legends 3? Here.
« Reply #21 on: October 01, 2010, 10:27:57 AM »
If you can turn it off...why in the name of fire would you -buy- it then? It's a 3ds. Not a 2ds. You're buying it for the 3d effect. For that much they may as well release a copy for the DSi. And I agree that moving it up and down would be better gradually, however that doesn't change much. Your eyes still have to adjust and it's no different than staring into a lightbulb while dimming it slowly. And as I stated before, users of it did turn it downward to adjust it. However, I doubt they were so dumb to constantly change it quickly, but rather slowly to see the difference and still felt the effects. The 3d glasses are made to protect you from such effects to a degree, however not perfectly. I'm guess I am picking at the 3ds's flaws in opposition as to why it should be on current consols. It's the best arguement there is. I am certainly not going to hate the idea just to hate it. That's stupid.

However I am not going to love the idea of getting the game and the 3ds simply because it's new and different.

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Re: Disappointments with Legends 3? Here.
« Reply #22 on: October 01, 2010, 10:28:28 AM »
In that sense, an N-gage would have sold perfectly. At the time of it's release, others were not. But it failed. Mainly because not many people wanted the hardware. And even then, that's the case for anyone with any system, dude. It doesn't matter if it's DSi, Psp, Ps3, 360 or Wii. Not everyone has every system, true. However what about the people who don't want a 3ds but want Legends? Same story. At the end of the day, it's not avalible to anyone outside of the people who are willing to put their eyes or health at risk at this point. Namely if you don't have 20/20 vision. That's worse because your eyes can't absorb the light equally. And glasses? Say hello to magnified 3d light fed right to the retina. Soooo here's what is being looked at.

LoL, you cannot compare an N-Gage to an actual gaming system. It was doomed to fail from the beginning, just like the PSPGo! or the Virtual Boy. And those people who want Legends 3 but don't want a 3DS are going to suffer. That's how it works. What if someone wanted Halo but doesn't want a 360, due to the glaring problems it had when it came out? Exclusives are exclusives, no matter how you look at it.

Quote
3ds:
Unkown Price
Possible retina damage
Possible rod and cone damage
Possible seizures.
Possible stomach sickness.
Not built well for people with one eye or unequal eyesight.
Magnified intensity of light through glasses, increasing the chance for damage.
Not good for people with one eye.

I don't think Megaman Legends 3 is really worth all that. Even at risk. I like the game, love it's release, but really? I like my eyes.

Honestly, this topic should be named Disappointment with 3DS, since that's your main complaint. Fear of the 3DS.

Offline Ramzal

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Re: Disappointments with Legends 3? Here.
« Reply #23 on: October 01, 2010, 10:36:31 AM »
Quote
LoL, you cannot compare an N-Gage to an actual gaming system. It was doomed to fail from the beginning, just like the PSPGo! or the Virtual Boy. And those people who want Legends 3 but don't want a 3DS are going to suffer. That's how it works. What if someone wanted Halo but doesn't want a 360, due to the glaring problems it had when it came out? Exclusives are exclusives, no matter how you look at it.

The N-gage, Pspggo!, virtual boys' were all gaming systems. They all have their own reasons for failing, truthfully, but they all had not competition at the time is the point. And yes, exclusives are exclusives. However the jump from platform to 3ds is a huge one. Halo did jump to PC from 360, however it was still for the 360 mainly for the main series. Smart move by Bungie. Rather than trying to make a portable Xbox and then releasing a Halo game for it.

Quote
Honestly, this topic should be named Disappointment with 3DS, since that's your main complaint. Fear of the 3DS.

The jump to 3ds is what is important as Inafune has shown and announced. If it weren't then I wouldn't be having this discussion. I don't fear a 3ds. I am pretty sure I can reduce it to it's basic elements after three to five hours in a lab. :D I do however think my eyesight and health > Legends 3. I am not willing to go and bring harm to myself just to play a video game. By the way, how's that putting your eyes to a light for a minute straight while flicking the light on and off going? It's about the same effect.

Offline Protoman Blues

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Re: Disappointments with Legends 3? Here.
« Reply #24 on: October 01, 2010, 10:49:47 AM »
The N-gage, Pspggo!, virtual boys' were all gaming systems. They all have their own reasons for failing, truthfully, but they all had not competition at the time is the point. And yes, exclusives are exclusives. However the jump from platform to 3ds is a huge one. Halo did jump to PC from 360, however it was still for the 360 mainly for the main series. Smart movie by Bungie. Rather than trying to make a portable Xbox and then releasing a Halo game for it.

No, they pretty much have the same reason for failing: nothing to offer the majority. And how is it huge? It's jumping to a system which is guaranteed to sell millions.

Quote
The jump to 3ds is what is important as Inafune has shown and announced. If it weren't then I wouldn't be having this discussion. I don't fear a 3ds. I am pretty sure I can reduce it to it's basic elements after three to five hours in a lab. :D I do however think my eyesight and health > Legends 3. I am not willing to go and bring harm to myself just to play a video game. By the way, how's that putting your eyes to a light for a minute straight while flicking the light on and off going? It's about the same effect.

Clearly you do fear the 3DS, or rather the damage it's going to do to your eyes. The problem isn't the game, it's you. I have no problem with 3D, or especially with a system with which we don't know fully how it's going to look, even though last I heard the vast, vast majority of people who covered it at E3 and so on said it looked phenomenal.