Messages

3376

X / Re: X8. I didnt like it all that much.

« on: September 28, 2009, 02:22:42 AM »

I had not considered differing versions of the same music track when I made my list.  Otherwise we're missing the disc-based X3, both Xtremes, and MHX.  Should have probably snuck Command Mission in there somewhere too.

I have to admit I did kinda like the disc-based X3 boss intro, though.  There was something strangely hypnotic about it.

If you just take the opening 10 seconds of Live & Learn and loop it, it's still a better boss theme than X3's.

No argument here.

I think you're severely over-estimating my opinion of the X3 boss tune.  I ranked it 6th out of 9.  And numbers 8 and 9 on that list I considered garbage.  As I said earlier, X2 is the only "dignified" boss tune that I consider arguable as compared to X3.  And even in that instance there is no doubt in my mind that X2 is better composed than X3's trained monkey jingle, it's just a matter of how they fit as a boss BGM.

The difference is that X was revived at the end of X5, Inafune thought X5 was going to be the last one, and had to change Z1 to realign with X6.

Which was done prior to release.  And it is rather naive to assume that it is not normal for games to see storyline changes over the course of their development.  Hell, Copy X didn't even exist until the last month of development (estimated by Aizu, producer of the Zero series and president of IntiCreates).

Inafune didn't produce X5, either, so failure of its sequel to conform to Inafune's presuppositions isn't much of an argument.

It's a platformer where power ups usually only help you to apply less skill. I'm stereotyping the game, yes, but that's the point. Is it my fault as the gamer if the developers don't warn me beforehand?

Failure to conform to your own stereotype IS your fault and noone else's.  Your attitude towards power-ups is not only elitist but downright false.  We've already covered numerous other required instances of them in the franchise.  Not to mention we are talking about a franchise which debuted with an easily missed yet absolutely required power-up (which is, again, not the case in X6 as there is never one single power-up that is required, only one from a pool of other options).  I'm sorry but your argument couldn't be more weak.  EVERYTHING is possibly missed, and NOTHING is absolutely required.  You merely need one out of over half a dozen options.  That is more than adequate.

I'm playing the game normally, not handicapped, and yet I lose because the game's layout was poorly planned.

This argument is not applicable to Gate's Lab 2.  Disabling your default abilities is by definition handicapped.  Your default abilities in X6 are those of the Falcon Armor.  If you are playing Unarmored, you are playing handicapped.  Never from the first second of gameplay, under any circumstances whatsoever, is it ever necessary or advantageous to do so.  Even in X5 Unarmored X had benefits.  It has none in X6.  If you are playing unarmored and do not realize that you handicapped yourself, you are not paying attention.

But in the scenario in which we speak, it should be because there's really no good reason why it shouldn't be.

You realize that by such logic the very 2D nature of X8 is a game flaw?  Then there's the lack of charging and sliding in MM9.  Or the 1st-person angle in Metroid Prime.

If you are not a game developer then your opinion on how similar a sequel should be means nothing.  No amount of precedent invalidates the option of a new direction, ever.  Assuming otherwise only sets yourself up for failure.

Or I wanted to go back to the stage select? If I'm correct, pressing select brings you back to the title screen.

It's called, "Use Previous Data".  Jeez, man, you're criticizing over unexpected obstacles when you don't even know your way around the Load Game menu screen?

In X6's case, on the other hand, it's more of "oh, too bad, you're just unlucky."

Let's go over the checklist for this scenario:
-Did not complete Shadow Armor
-Did not complete Blade Armor
-Did not defeat Nightmare Zero
-Did not defeat Blizzard Wolfang
-Did not find Jumper
-Despite sucking this badly did not consider the Ultimate Armor code

You are permitted to remove one, and only one, of the latter 3.  Anything else invalidates the scenario.
That's pretty damn unlucky.

Again, I'm referring to Gate's Lab 1.  Your argument is invalid in Gate's Lab 2 as your default abilities get you through that.  Only through forsaking them do you get stuck.

I dislike Brawl.  

You are dead to me (barring the unlikely event that it's because of Mewtwo's absence).

Excusable though, since the final stage shows Sigma's mugshot instead of Zero's helmet.

That was my logic, yeah.

3377

Zero / Re: About Omega

« on: September 28, 2009, 01:42:05 AM »

Yes, so avoid the jump-in, and avoid everything. The book had it right, it was just my paraphrasing that was sloppy, since I wasn't really familiar with the move when I threw that out there, and wrongfully presumed that jumping in would involve a jumping slash rather than a standing one.

Well, that certainly clarifies things.  Thank you.

Thanks for the nitpick, but I didn't specify on bosses. Zero isn't a boss, as established earlier in this thread, so what he can do to a boss physics-wise isn't equal to what they can do to him. It was just a rough example of making a combo from a combo. I'll try harder next time.

I'm somewhat of a stickler on how "combos" impact a boss's Damage Barrier only because, if you disregard it, combo talk is irrelevant seeings how you can rapid-fire everything into oblivion.  You can likewise saber-combo into infinity with Model OX by using Shinkuujin to kill the lag from the third slash (useful if you have hacked for Model OX during the Guardian Base attack; damn ZX's lack of New Game Plus).

Ever since Z2 Inticreates has been crafting boss damage barriers to allow for combo attacks, and this is especially key to dealing damage effectively in ZX/Advent.  So when people speak of combos in the context of Inti's post-Z2 games, it's hard for me to not lean towards bosses.  Such physics would seem especially relevant to the Ranbu; Zero is not a boss but does have a damage barrier (as does pretty much any playable MegaMan character), which Ranbu disregards until completed.

3378

Rockman Series / Re: How did you get interested in Mega Man?

« on: September 28, 2009, 01:23:22 AM »

MegaMan 3, waaay back in the day.  It was challenging (back then) without being frustrating, and the easily manipulated password system let me start basically anywhere and anyhow I wanted.

3379

Rockman Series / Re: Out of all the villains...

« on: September 28, 2009, 01:21:03 AM »

Copy X.  Not only is he the typically evil genocidal lunatic, but he rationalizes it so effectively that he rallies heroes to his cause.  Makes him the most dangerous villain the series ever saw in my book.

An honorable mention goes to Great Redips as I believe he was the most powerful.  Nobody else ever had X, Zero, and Axl on the ropes all at the same time.  Taking on the first two at once is pretty much suicide in and of itself.

3380

Gaming / Re: Super Smash Bros. Thread

« on: September 27, 2009, 03:51:54 AM »

Definitely feel like Smashing.  If the Legendary man is on, guess I'd better get ready for a challenge.

3381

Gaming / Re: What defines 'Hard Mode'?

« on: September 26, 2009, 07:00:24 PM »

Bosses using their ultimates at 50% got annoying mainly because of the music change.

So incredibly true, especially with how quickly a boss falls to 50%.  The second half tends to last longer due to their ultimate moves involving invulnerability time.  I really wish you could turn that music change off, the normal boss fight music is so much better.

3382

X / Re: X8. I didnt like it all that much.

« on: September 26, 2009, 06:05:11 PM »

True, the opening cutscene states "barely escaped with their lives", but I'm not sure how many game characters besides Isoc consider it likely that Zero survived.  X is eternally hopeful, I'm sure, but his reaction at seeing Zero seems to indicate that the worst had at least occurred to him.

3383

X / Re: Megaman X6. No parts. Shadow Armor. Gate 2....

« on: September 26, 2009, 06:01:44 PM »

That actually works with your charged buster either Unarmored or Ultimate, too (Falcon's shot is too small IIRC), provided you fire at point-blank range of course.

And I use Magma Blade for High Max, as well.  The weapon just kicks too much ass.

3384

News and Announcements / Re: Happy 1 year anniversary, Swiss Bank Account 19-871-217!

« on: September 26, 2009, 05:59:31 PM »

I never said you should.  But if you're going to respond to somebody's post, you need to acknowledge their context.  I was speaking of button loss, and on R&F for Super Famicom, there IS no button loss.  You're going from SFC to SFC, or in other words, you went nowhere.

3385

X / Re: X8. I didnt like it all that much.

« on: September 26, 2009, 05:29:59 PM »

Well, in-game characters are often morons for reasons of plot development.

LoL, but you and I have been over this in many a topic, and it's clear we're getting nowhere! 

Hey, we're reminding ourselves of kickass music, that's ALWAYS getting somewhere.

Hey, it says ZERO STAGE 2 on my X1-X6 Collection Soundtrack, so that's what I call it!  

Yeah, and Brawl refers to Crystal Flash as Power Suit Samus.

Although in all fairness I didn't take that close a look at the X1-6 track list (I do have it lying around somewhere), so that was a good point.

You rate X3's boss theme a LOT higher than I do, as I think it's the worst...in possibly all of MM.

Well, that's what I think of X5's.

But, as said by others, I don't think a boss theme necessarily needs to go anywhere.  X3's is repetitive, and that's why I kicked it down lower (I hate X8's second part, too, so X2 is the only "dignified" theme that X3's outclasses in my book), but it is hard-rocking enough that it gets the blood pumping.  That, to me, is critical for a good fight theme (why do you think I'm so obsessed with Live And Learn in Smash?).

3386

Zero / Re: Was Copy X really evil?

« on: September 26, 2009, 05:20:15 PM »

The only difference between him and the original is that he is a jerk and everyone knew it. X has probably killed as many Reploids as the copy during the Maverick Wars, and God knows what happened in the Elf Wars. We've been bored to nausea with X whining about Reploids killing each other, but in the end he still pulled the trigger and by the time of his sealing he didn't give a damn about his moral struggle anymore.

X fought and killed when necessary, not when convenient.  There's a world of difference.  And "he didn't give a damn about his moral struggle anymore" is flat-out contradictory to Z1, as it is X himself who states his lack of caring as bothering him.

3387

Gaming / Re: What defines 'Hard Mode'?

« on: September 26, 2009, 05:06:05 PM »

2 had down+jump for dash and one of the most agile airdashes in the series, which I don't remember if X starts with.

He doesn't, though Zero does.  X gets ye olde 3-way air dash capsule from Volt Catfish's stage, which is an easy walk-in.

3388

News and Announcements / Re: Happy 1 year anniversary, Swiss Bank Account 19-871-217!

« on: September 26, 2009, 05:01:49 PM »

And, again, proper momentum.  That's why one playing Xtreme2 generally doesn't give a damn about dash-jumping.  In Xtreme1 it's a more valid complaint because there's no alternate.  Xtreme2, that's not the case.

... there was a dash button in R&F.

Get equipped with:
-Localization history.

I didn't say R&F, I said MM&B.  MM&B exists on only the GBA.

3389

X / Re: X8. I didnt like it all that much.

« on: September 26, 2009, 06:07:09 AM »

Even though Zero Stage 1 is pretty bland in itself, it still sets the mood a lot better than the X4 Final Stages.

The problem is that ship already sailed because they re-used it as the second Stage Select theme, and for the Zero Virus reveal cutscene.  The tune is repetitive enough in itself, so I really feel that was uncalled for.  Nor do I feel the extra bit for stage BGM contributed any to the atmosphere.

LoL, and there is NOTHING bland about RAVE ZERO STAGE 2 music.

Call me nitpicky, but I don't consider that Zero Virus music.  I consider that Sigma music.  

However, X4 had one of the worst boss themes in the X series, IMO.

My personal opinion, so far as generic boss themes go:
X8 (first part)>X1>X7>X6>X4>X3>X2>X8 (second part)>X5

X5's is just entirely too screechy, not to mention slow, for me to consider it good fight music.  If it was the villain making a speech, maybe...  But it just doesn't get me in the mood to blow anything up, other than my speakers if the fight lasts too long (which unfortunately happens easily in X5 on Xtreme mode).

As for Zero, the "needs to be deeper" shpiel is what I think of X3's.  Pretty much every other Zero theme we've ever heard IS deeper, so X3's comes off as unfitting to me.  Heroic, sure, but it just sounds like it should belong to a different character.  Darkesword's Beamsaber Beat helped me warm up to it a little better, but I still think that most any other Zero theme is superior (granted I also don't think that's saying a lot as pretty much every Zero theme kicks ass).

3390

News and Announcements / Re: Happy 1 year anniversary, Swiss Bank Account 19-871-217!

« on: September 26, 2009, 05:57:40 AM »

When you have proper air-dash momentum, which Xtreme2 does but the PS1 lacks, that is not a problem.

X4 & X5 had a Dash Button.

They did not have default walking and dashing saber attacks.  Or proper air-dash momentum.  And it took us until ZX before we ever saw all three of those in the same title again.

Double tap dashing is for Turtles In Time, not X.

You're preaching to the choir on that one.  Never once did I, or will I ever, defend a double-tap dash.  The mention of MM&B was not a compliment to it.  It was an example of how not to handle a button loss, whereas Xtreme2 handled it excellently.

3391

X / Re: X8. I didnt like it all that much.

« on: September 26, 2009, 05:49:32 AM »

I don't think that, barring Xtreme1, there is such a thing as an X-series game with a bad soundtrack.  However, much as I liked X8's I do have to admit that variety was not its strong point.  Almost the entire game outside of Lumine uses the same style and instruments.

That said, loved the Boss, Ride Armor, Intermission, and many others.

The only good things about X6:
Blaze Heatnix's BGM and Final Sigma theme.

*ZEE UPPERCUT!!*
You forgot Gate's Lab.

X4's soundtrack was just way too high pitched for my own tastes, especially compared to the SNES soundtracks.  Both X & Zero's opening themes are not even close to being as awesome as their opening themes from the SNES X games.

I resent that.  X's X4 theme is among the best, with only Command Mission and X2 being in the same league.  Zero's is pretty solid as well.  Beats the hell out of X3's.

See, there's another problem I had with X4's music too; the Final Stages.  They. Are. So. Bland.

Not as bad as Zero Virus stages.

Between that, X, and positively horrendous standard boss theme, it's very tempting for me to dismiss X5 as the worst main-series soundtrack.  But it has a lot of redeeming points.  Awesome Sigma, Zero, and special boss themes, and two SNES remixes.  "First half" of the stage themes (though I detest the fact that I can describe X5's stages that way) is all-around good, too.

3392

News and Announcements / Re: Happy 1 year anniversary, Swiss Bank Account 19-871-217!

« on: September 26, 2009, 05:37:47 AM »

Explain how assigning Classic-series slide commands to dash constitutes a "god awful control scheme".  Damn better job than MM&B did of coping with button loss.

The game still controls better than PS1.

3393

X / Re: X8. I didnt like it all that much.

« on: September 26, 2009, 05:01:44 AM »

It's a neutral term, Bag, could be good or bad.  Most associate a bad expansion with jumping the shark, yeah.

X5 wasn't wrong to expand the formula, but it implemented those expansions horribly.  X6, Xtreme2, and X8 did an undeniably better job.  I'd dare say that even X7 did, it just failed in the physics and level design departments.

3394

Zero / Re: Was Copy X really evil?

« on: September 26, 2009, 04:56:45 AM »

At first, it seems like it, but then I started thinking about it from an unbiased perspective.

Copy X is only protecting the humans, in his own way.  The Reploid mass murder argument falls flat when you realize that Reploids are merely robots; sentient (for the most part) robots, but only robots.  From what the people in MMZ4 said, they had a great life under Copy X; his death and Weil's takeover was probably the worst thing that could have happened to them.  As far as they know, Zero's as bad as Weil.

Thoughts?

No bias is fair, no compassion is ruthless, and the line between them is exceedingly thin.

Copy X's own position clashes with his policy, a robot labeling robots as inferior citizens, which in itself makes you wonder about his rationale.  Though he himself is devoid of fear in his line of thinking, his actions manipulate the fear of others to rally them to his cause.  A cause justified by labeling others as "sub-human" and handing out senseless accusations to excuse their destruction in a time of crisis.

Reminds me of Hitler.

Just because someone is charismatic doesn't mean they're not evil.  In fact such people are considerably more dangerous than a non-charismatic evil person could hope to be.  Atrocities such as this are justified by demeaning the victim, and that's the giveaway.  They think for themselves, they're part of society, but they're not human, so it's okay.  They're the inferior race, and the superior race is justified in whatever they decide to do with them.

For exactly this reason, I hold Copy X as not only evil, but the most evil villain the MegaMan saga has ever seen.  Because it's not just what he can destroy or what he can rule, it's his potential to corrupt the masses, to sway good people to the point that they honestly believe in the wrong side.  Thus we have the Big Four.

3395

Gaming / Re: What defines 'Hard Mode'?

« on: September 26, 2009, 04:37:11 AM »

But upgrading invalidates the challenge of beating a Hard Mode, IMO, same problem with DMC.

Well, this is where differing answers to the topic title kick in.  To me, Hard Mode is about more challenging enemies, not a more crippled player.  A truly challenging game should remain challenging even when using its arsenal to its fullest, IMHO.  Again, X6 is my prime example of how to do it, while both Zero and ZX are an example of how not to.

My preferred play style is all-out.  I don't enjoy knowing that my enemy is pulling any punches, but I hate even more being forced to hold back myself.  Thus I do not appreciate any mode which forces such limitations.  I don't believe that Hard should translate to Handicapped.

3396

X / Re: X8. I didnt like it all that much.

« on: September 26, 2009, 04:31:48 AM »

I said 4 tanks, didn't specify what type.

And X4 actually does have 4.  2 Energy, 1 Weapon, 1 EX (the doohicky that lets you start with 4 lives instead of 2).

3397

X / Re: Best and Worst Armors?

« on: September 26, 2009, 04:30:43 AM »

I too dash with L ever since Zero.  But R still doesn't feel comfortable for use as an alternate weapon, hence my use of the Switch setup (or moving sub-weapon to X in ZX).  Works fine as a Giga, though.

I was talking about the highest difficulty /hard modes when referring the Xtreme games, meaning their Xtreme modes.

"Xtreme" mode in Xtreme2 is actually a good deal easier than the solo missions; you have both characters from the get-go and twice the Life Ups and Tanks to aid you.

As for Xtreme1, "Normal" and "Hard" are more accurately referred to as parts 1 and 2.  And, again, Xtreme mode simply merges them.

Gareth does crazy damage

He receives as crazy as he gives, oddly.  Gareth is the kind of battle that will likely be short one way or the other.  Kinda like Omega with a normal life gauge in ZX.

Also, HOLY WTF!? That's insane...I should definately get 100% on Legends2 sometime.

If 100% includes weapon upgrades, then yeah, plan to have no life for a long, long time.  You can spend a damn long time camping on Shining Laser alone.

One more thing I like about my namesake: 3rd-level upgrades aren't nearly as insane as most of the others.

if you turn around after your 1st slash, you automatically do the 2nd slash in that direction, I think it was X5/X6 only but I'm not sure.

You're correct, that was new to X5.  You can also turn around after the 2nd slash to perform it twice.

3398

X / Re: Megaman X6. No parts. Shadow Armor. Gate 2....

« on: September 26, 2009, 04:21:35 AM »

Nope, you need Hyper Dash.  Shadow's power is insane but its lack of an otherwise standard mobility feature is the tradeoff (kinda like Gaia's slow dashing speed; air-dash is more of a standard in X6 than it was in X5).

If you want to clear X6 without parts, you want Blade (hell), Zero, or Ultimate.

3399

X / Re: X8. I didnt like it all that much.

« on: September 26, 2009, 04:15:25 AM »

I think 4 is even comparable to 1-3, barring the inclusion of a close-range character.  Up until that point it was still 8 weapons, 8 Life Ups, 4 Tanks, and a single armor, the end.  At X5 they started some major (poorly executed) expansions to the formula in regards to what kind of arsenal you're gathering.  Every game since has had its own take on those expansions.  But outside of different visuals and physics, the general build of X4 is very much in line with the SNES titles.  Arguably you could even consider it a more conservative title than X3 in terms of how close it stays to the core series formula.

[required]

3400

X / Re: X8. I didnt like it all that much.

« on: September 26, 2009, 04:05:18 AM »

I'm sure if X6 was initially intended, they wouldn't have killed Zero a second time only to revive him in the next installment. I'm well aware of the fact the Zero series fixed this.

I'll again reiterate that X is as dead as Zero in X5.  I'm not sure by what logic it is assumed that only X's creator would take measures to ensure his survival when we know as stated fact that Zero's creator was already involved in the virus-colony plot.

Wow, your defense of X6 seems blinded by your bias.

A bias towards what?  What bias of mine does X6 serve?

Or are you simply saying that I'm defending X6 because I'm biased towards X6 itself?  Because besides being ignorant of my own concessions as to the game's flaws (Sentsuizan, Nightmare System, and my personal annoyance with garbage compressors), that's really just an argumentative way of saying that I have a personal opinion.

I'm no speed-runner, and I certainly don't care for no-damage runs

You're preaching to the choir.  Who's making assumptions about who now?  Outside of Metroid games the only time I've ever come close to speed-running is MM9.  And if you think I give a damn about no-damage runs (outside of X8, for that nifty note in the Records screen), you know nothing about my play style.

or don't know what I'm hell I'm talking about.

You don't if you claim that X6 is unclearable as unarmored X.  That is not an elitist attitude, it is fact.

If you're going to attach minimalist run strings to that statement, you need to say so.  And that's an argument I've already been over.  Long story short: Part of a minimalist run is determining what the minimum requirements actually are.  If you can't do that then you have no business attempting it.  The same as no reasonably intelligent individual should be conceding their default equipment in any game without first thinking about the consequences.  You speak as if the casual player will be attempting the game unarmored and there is really no reason they should be doing so.

Sorry I'm unclear, but my point is that X6 is lacking the polish most of the other games have in which you're not required to use missable/skippable items.

I realize that full well.  Let me be equally clear.  No other game, sans X5, makes every item in the game skippable.  There are bound to be concessions, which even as you yourself stated encourage creativity.  Thus by your own admission we are talking about a differing style, which is not a flaw.  Neither is less valid than the other.

But is this exactly fair for players and fans who come into the game expecting it to be like the first 5

5 was nothing like the first 4.  Not to mention I fail to see how unexpected cross-game differences are unfair.  Every title is to be judged on its own merits; MegaMan games are actually unusual in how similar they are.  That still doesn't mean that knowledge of previous titles is a free pass to future titles.

I was forced to game over myself

...because your Select button was dead?

Highly unlikely, but the fact that you CAN get stuck shows that the game was unrefined to some degree.

I believe we already tackled this with MM1 and MM8.  MM3's incidents are insignificant by comparison as they involve draining multiple weapon bars (you have to be out of both Jet and Coil to get stuck in Doc Robot's Gemini Man) for no particular reason, as they have nowhere near enough realistic use outside of those obstacles to expect such.