Messages

651

X / Re: Why does everyone hate Mega Man X6?

« on: August 14, 2011, 09:42:03 PM »

Was X5's story all just Inafune's work, though...?

In that case you're presenting the conversation out of context.  If the entire game's localization is shoddy, which it clearly is, then common sense (not so common, I know) dictates that face-value is unreliable.  And face-value is the only way you get "Zero lied and X is a moron".  It's also the same way that one establishes that Erasure was centered around a reploid bathroom.

A single word being exchanged for one that sounds similar is an understandable typo, and not comparable to an insane line being spoken and accepted without question. And while the entire translation is bad, it's more in the sense of being hard to understand than being factually incorrect.

If you want to know why that passage is ridiculed, I'll tell you: Because people see what they want to.  It is the inverse of "Zello", which is to say people assume poor translations where it suits them (Sigma actually was suffering slurred speech), and deny them in the same manner (Zero and X are in the same boat in terms of their surviving X5).  It's not the passage that is being ridiculed, if it was then translation errors would be the first thought to pop up.

I don't know what you're used to, but when I think translation errors I think typos and awkward grammar, not changing the story. It's happened, but it's uncommon.
Though I was surprised to find out people thought Sigma's slurred speech was an error, considering how blatant it was. Sometimes it's just not possible to lay it on thick enough...

What's being ridiculed is the concept of Zero surviving.  X5 showed us both X and Zero as good as dead.  X5 showed us X's creator saving him.  X5 told us Zero's creator was "out there" somewhere.  And X5 told us that three years later (retconned), Zero is still out of the picture.

What happened was that the audience bought into Inafune's negligence sense of finality, and assumed that Wily was content to leave Zero in a scrap heap for a century.  Well, the notion that he wasn't shouldn't be all that surprising, so I'm sure Capcom felt justified in their search for more money.

Then there is to add to that the fans who thought that X should be carrying the series solo. *clears throat* Sorry.

I don't think people would have minded about Zero coming back again if they had just seen an explanation other than "I hid to repair myself".

652

X / Re: Why does everyone hate Mega Man X6?

« on: August 14, 2011, 01:46:33 PM »

So? What we've been talking about this whole time is whether it's surprising that people ridiculed that passage in the translation, and that it desperately needed work. Not that it was the only flaw of the game, or that it was the fault of the original writers.

653

X / Re: Why does everyone hate Mega Man X6?

« on: August 13, 2011, 10:25:21 AM »

The player also sees Zero ask Light if he knows who repaired him.

Is that dialogue optional, and possible to miss?  Certainly.  But so is X and Zero's reunion in and of itself.  For that matter, so is Light repairing X in X5 (play as Zero, and X is believed to be dead), which is not referenced in X6 outside of the above-mentioned conversation between Light and Zero.

True enough. But finding the Light capsule as Zero takes more know-how than finding Zero. And if you found the capsule as X at any point, you cannot see that conversation unless you play the game again. Even then, that doesn't guarantee you'll see it.

Might be more personal opinion, but I'd also say it's poor design to not even hint that a lie has been spoken in a conversation (with a few exceptions like setting up for a big Reveal much later in the story, which is not the case here), and with X & Zero they seem to just accept what's being said without questions nor hesitation.
If we go with your alternate interpretation instead of the common "lie" one, I feel that the meaning is too subtle and rephrasing is needed.

654

X / Re: Why does everyone hate Mega Man X6?

« on: August 13, 2011, 12:11:21 AM »

It is when there's nothing to project from.  For five games straight the hologram has appeared only within capsules, never free-roaming.

I didn't mean it made sense to the player as in "what is canon", more in the way of "I guess that would work, even in the real world". It doesn't hurt the suspension of disbelief.

Double-standard.  You just named the exact problem everyone has with Zero's revival.

I'm taking care to note this as something that mostly concerns players who don't think a step beyond the surface (which is embarrassingly frequently the case for me, myself) - as the problem isn't in what actually happens, but what the player sees.
The player doesn't actually see Light repair X, it's just more-than-strongly implied. But s/he WILL see Zero claim to have repaired himself, which is at best improbable (he was a torso and an arm), at worst impossible (he was dead.).

I'm sure Zero still required a few touch-ups after he woke up (why else wouldn't he have surfaced beforehand?).  He's not lying, it's just that he himself only knows part of the story, so that's all he can tell.  He's not saying "this is how I survived", he's saying "this is what I was doing after I had legs again".

It's not that X doesn't realize this, either, it's that he's in the same boat.  Neither X nor Zero knew for sure how they survived.  Zero took a shot in the dark and said that Light fixed them.  He was half right.

An interesting interpretation, and it looks perfectly valid, but certainly not something that came to mind when I saw the exchange.

655

Entertainment / Re: The RPM Boob Tube Thread (56k warning)

« on: August 10, 2011, 10:52:00 PM »

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_sLMWE_6Uo[/youtube]

wat

656

X / Re: Why does everyone hate Mega Man X6?

« on: August 10, 2011, 04:52:45 PM »

To be honest, if they don't get it right they aren't doing their job as professional translators.
Carpe Fulgur (2 people) has one guy that knows japanese well and one that writes english well. The translated script goes back and forth between them to make it well-written but also correct, and they make sure to consult the original writers about tone and intent etc. What excuse does Capcom have, to be any worse than 2 semi-amateur guys?
Although that last doesn't apply much to their modern day work, and I suppose there just weren't that many jp-speaking people back when X6 was ported.

657

X / Re: Why does everyone hate Mega Man X6?

« on: August 10, 2011, 02:44:06 PM »

He wasn't lying. He was mistranslated.

That just shifts the blame from the writers to the translators.

You know, looking back at that "repaired myself/waited 'til I recovered" bit. I may be wrong, but US-Zero could be referring to self-repair systems; in a way, that could mean the same thing as what was originally said.

I always thought of it that way, but it's not much less preposterous than taking a wrench with his one arm and fixing the rest of his body. Nanites can do an awful lot but they're not magical...

658

X / Re: Why does everyone hate Mega Man X6?

« on: August 09, 2011, 11:27:58 PM »

Zero Space is every bit as "at the surface", when you consider it's our only justification of why Light can operate outside of a capsule.

A hologram being projected isn't all that surprising, and the physical actions happen off-screen, so I don't think the average player is going to think much about that being a problem. Especially compared to a good-guy character (Zero) outright lying (repaired himself) on-screen, which is really rare.

659

Entertainment / Re: The RPM Boob Tube Thread (56k warning)

« on: August 08, 2011, 12:13:03 PM »

[youtube]KrFstbXJD5U[/youtube]
Meanwhile, in a parallel universe not far from ours...

660

X / Re: Why does everyone hate Mega Man X6?

« on: August 08, 2011, 10:53:00 AM »

It's certainly not the first instance, but it's still a flaw to leave it unexplained... and unlike those you mentioned, this one is fairly major since it's right at the surface where even casual players who don't stop and think more deeply about the game will spot it.

661

X / Re: Why does everyone hate Mega Man X6?

« on: August 06, 2011, 03:18:03 PM »

You're only saying that because X's name is in the title.

And because I've played as him up to that point in the game, so I've only seen things from his perspective.

X and Zero were in the exact same battle in X5.  The circumstances behind their damage were the same.  X is repaired by his creator.  Zero is seen by X before X is shot, yet Zero is not found after X is repaired.

So what do you THINK that means?

X6's opening shows that they both went up against Sigma and states that they "barely escaped with their lives".  If you are unfamiliar with the scenario beyond that then you are in no position to judge.  You can't gauge how plausible a given scenario is if you don't know the setup.  In fact, ignorance of X5 actually works in the player's favor, since only X5 when taken alone suggests the idea that Zero was dead rather than missing at all.  Even so, nobody bothers to take notice that in X5, X is only alive due to deus ex machina.

My problem isn't believing that Zero was mysteriously missing and repaired by an unknown entity, it was that "So are you X. So are you." isn't enough on its own to make this clear.
Of course, if it replaces the "I hid while I repaired myself" thing we english-speakers got, that's a good step on its own...

EDIT: But looking at Zan's post now, it seems I was either hallucinating last night or he edited it, and it looks rather more helpful now. Different source of translation?

662

X / Re: Why does everyone hate Mega Man X6?

« on: August 05, 2011, 09:12:26 PM »

If it had been in X6 I might've agreed that the conversation made the implication obvious.

663

X / Re: Why does everyone hate Mega Man X6?

« on: August 05, 2011, 06:58:42 PM »

When is that seen?

664

X / Re: Why does everyone hate Mega Man X6?

« on: August 05, 2011, 06:35:53 PM »

Zero brushes off X's question by saying the circumstances are the same. If X survived, so did Zero. It's as easy as that. Do remember in X5 that Zero's body vanished.

Well yeah, but it'd be more easily understood if X's body had vanished as well. I mean, of course X is alive, that's not really unexpected at all.

665

X / Re: Why does everyone hate Mega Man X6?

« on: August 05, 2011, 06:14:55 PM »

....

Not really...

I can kinda see how that could be implied by that exchange, but more than anything it looks like some sort of meta-humour.
Anyway, I thought you had to be playing as Zero to see Isoc mention Zero being alive? Or was that in the intro? I always figured he was talking about the Nightmare copies.

666

News and Announcements / Re: Capcom Asking For Megaman Fans & Cosplayers to Leave SDCC..?

« on: August 05, 2011, 10:19:26 AM »

http://kotaku.com/5827958/capcom-is-charging-for-a-3ds-demo
Oh [parasitic bomb] capcom what are you doing

667

X / Re: Why does everyone hate Mega Man X6?

« on: August 05, 2011, 10:09:07 AM »

Zero's resurrection isnt as cheap as you think, when you take into consideration what the game actually tells you about it. (Zero admits to Light that he does not know who repaired him, and Isoc claims to have seen Zero alive)

Of course, both those bits of dialogue are missable...

668

Fan Creations / Re: Jayster's Music

« on: August 05, 2011, 09:32:14 AM »

I like it, although I don't think I played any NES games that sounded so much like an Atari game

669

Gaming / Re: Batman: Arkham Asylum/Arkham City

« on: August 02, 2011, 06:55:34 PM »

Pre-order costumes.


Supposedly these can all be unlocked ingame, though you only get to use them in challenge mode.

670

Gaming / Grandia Creator Takeshi Miyaji Dead at 45

« on: August 01, 2011, 10:02:59 AM »

http://www.andriasang.com/e/blog/2011/08/01/miyaji_death/

671

Off The Wall / Re: Reposted Picture Thread (56K Warning)

« on: July 31, 2011, 03:34:39 PM »

What's he doing with that eliacube?

672

Gaming / Re: Chantelise - from the makers of Recettear

« on: July 30, 2011, 09:30:16 AM »

Nah, there's no connection story-wise or anything, just a few references to Recettear (which EGS made after Chantelise; Carpe Fulgur just went with the more technically interesting game to bring over first).

673

Gaming / Re: Chantelise - from the makers of Recettear

« on: July 30, 2011, 12:48:19 AM »

You could already download it from the Carpe Fulgur page though.

Posted on: 2011-07-26, 14:56:33wo anysay, game is out.
$7 and change
this is acceptable

http://www.carpefulgur.com/drakblog/?p=16 says there are a few minor technical changes from the original version; font system works better, joysticks are supported better, later bosses were touched up

674

Gaming / Re: Castlevania

« on: July 28, 2011, 11:12:19 PM »

On the other hand, if they're not doing the '99 game now, when would they ever?

675

DASH / Re: It's dead, Jim.

« on: July 27, 2011, 10:50:06 PM »

If L2 goes for high prices like that, It means there are people who liked it. People who WANT it, and if there is so much demand for L2, then what does that say about L3?

What I was saying is that the demand for rare copies of an old famous game does not give a good indicator of the demand for a new addition to the series, since it wouldn't be old, famous, or rare.

Then what was the whole deal with putting in so many Legends cameos? Tron, Volnutt and the Servbots had mroe camoes in non mega man games than Zero and Rock combined.. What more does Capcom need to convince them to make L3?

I think that was just Capcom hauling in the money from those Legends fans who were so keen to get recognition that they'd support even marginally related products.