RockmanPM Forums
Other Things => Gaming => Topic started by: Protoman Blues on March 30, 2009, 02:07:21 AM
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Dear SEGA,
Never stop making SONIC games.
Your Fan,
PB
And here's why. As I was gorging my ears on lots of Sonic songs last night, something hit me when I had the will to Fight The Knight. The Will to Fight The Knight. THE WILL TO FIGHT! THE! KNIGHT! WILLLLL TOOOO FIGHTTTTT, IN A WURLD...*ahem* Sorry bout that. Anyway, while listening to Sonic music, all my problems with whatever game seems to just wash away, which is unique. The music for Sonic games are among some of the best game tracks ever created, whether or not the game is way past cool, awesome, good, sub-par, sucks, or unplayable. Despite all the flaws of Black Knight, I throughly enjoyed playing the game. Despite people's outright hatred of Sonic Unleashed, to which they even complained about him going too fast, I [tornado fang]ing loved the hell out of it, even despite the Werehog, which I grew to like. I'm even willing to go back and try Sonic 06, since my only sexperience with the game is the Demo at a PS3 event.
So, you know what? I'm content with Sonic games being the way they are. I'll just simply keep hoping for a return of Sonic CD/3&Knuckles Way Past Coolness, but for the most part, I'm content.
LoL, feel free to post your own reasons, if you have any. 8)
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while i do agree Sonic music is great, i can't possibly agree with that being the reason to churn out games. music isn't that influential to me. half the time, i can't hear it over the voice acting, anyway. never, ever, EVER, would i buy a game solely for its soundtrack. i'd do the smart thing and just pirate the CD off the interwebs.
it's a shame. Sonic Team seems to put a lot of effort into its music and graphics. too much, really, as they forget about the most important part of the game: the gameplay. and i've given up hope on there being a truly great Sonic game. yeah, we got Mega Man 9. yeah, we got Street Fighter IV. yeah, we even got a black president. but i'm sorry. Holding Out for a Hero is only going to lead to disappointment.
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Music is one thing Sonic Team can normally get right. Sonic 06 was a friggen abomination and yet its soundtrack was amazing.
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Aside from the fact that I don't own any current generation consoles, the reason I don't have any interest in the newest installments of Sonic is the fact they throw in gimmicks that aren't of any interest, like the Werehog in Sonic Unleashed. (I did like the music of that game enough to download the OST, haven't quite listened to it all since each track is extended to over 10 minutes of length, and have several variants.)
I watched a playthrough of Sonic and the Black Knight, the game itself didn't interest me, the music was okay.
Not enough to get me to find an OST download to listen to it in it's entirety though.
What I miss about the old days of the Genesis though, is the side scrolling, all these 3D ones are in a different perspective, loses some of that platforming goodness with this new layout.
I say that if they want to show off awesome graphics, but have that good ol' charm of the classics, they should create a 3D environment, and play it out in 2D gameplay, with an occasional twist or turn, cause seriously, one long stretch of a level would be quite the hardware whore, so you've gotta fill in the rest of the environment somewhere.
And the music, oh boy, I love Sonic music, S&K had bad ass tracks, it did indeed.
I just don't like all the "new rock" they throw into the new games, I know someone must enjoy it, but it's just not Sonic in my ears.
Oh god I just made a rant didn't I?
*Delete delete delete*
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Dear Sega,
Seriously, what?
Your Fan, Sky.
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Dear Sega,
whenever I had the choice between Nintendo and Sega, I picked Nintendo.
Love, me.
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Dear Sonic,
I left a Chilidog in the microwave for you, but you'll have to climb inside to get it.
Yours Truly, Grounder Tails.
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In the microwave? NOT FRESHLY MADE!? Tails is so [tornado fang]ing cheap.
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Dear
Sega Sonic Team:
You did it for NiGHTS.
You did it for Samba De Amigo.
Now do it for Billy Hatcher.
Your Fan, BreakTargets.
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Dear Sonic,
I left a Chilidog in the microwave for you, but you'll have to climb inside to get it.
Yours Truly, Grounder Tails.
inb4 "It's a trap!"
Dear Sega,
You've got the formula decent one game, and then murder it the next. Sonic Adventure 2 was a masterpiece with the Sonic and Shadow sections, and decent with the rest. Sonic Heroes was a gameplay [tornado fang]-up. Shadow the Hedgehog was decent. Sonic '06 was screwy to no end. Sonic Unleashed wasn't perfect, but it definately had things going for it. PLEASE break the trend i'm seeing with the mainstream games with the next game!
Your major Sonic series fan, Rikoh.
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Guys, if you're going to send letters to Sega/Sonic Team, AT LEAST do it like they did for Sega's official magazine back in the day! 8D
Yo Sega!
I understand that Sonic is your "go-too" brand in order to generate some nice capital for other projects. If it weren't for the kids and "truly devoted" Sonic fans buying your games, who knows if you'd have the money to generate the likes of Ryu ga Gotoku(Yakuza), House of the Dead, or partner up with Platinum Games so that we can have games like MadWorld and Bayonetta? I can understand that much. You're going to keep making Sonic games. Or rather, you HAVE to keep making Sonic games.
But all the same...as one who remembers the "glory days" (the 16-bit era), I can't stress how disappointed I've been with the brand, as of late. Sonic Unleashed and The Black Knight both seem to indicate that you seem to want to do more Sonic than what is due. If you really want to do other, interesting things with the Sonic brand, that's fine. However, I say, take a cue from Nintendo: they have no problem giving us plenty of spin-off games starring Mario and/or his various friends. But the "straight-up" Mario platformer experience remains largely autonomous and "pure", as it were.
So, I ask, why not do the same for the Sonic series? You already have a number of spin-off "ideas", past and present, that could stand to work. Sonic the Fighters and Sonic Battle were both nice ideas for Sonic and pals in a fighting game. Sonic Shuffle was a nice "party game" of its own (though I can't imagine you messing with that, now that you have Mario & Sonic at the Olympics to meet your party game needs). Tails Adventure was a nice, "Metroid-like" game that could easily be the stuff of awesome, if handled correctly. And I'm sure the likes of Knux and Shadow (so help me...) can be used in interesting ways themselves, if allowed.
But really...the bottom-line is, spin-offs of this nature are created for this purpose. So that you shouldn't have to "mess" with the classic Sonic formula, in any way.
So, really...for the love of all that's good. Stop trying so hard with trying to "re-launch" the brand, and just focus on doing more to take it back to where it should be. Less werehog, less sword-play, and more to revive Sonic's momentum-based, pinball-esque nature. ...Please?
Sincerely,
Concerned Sonic-fan, Viewtiful Ben
P.S. - If you ever had the interest of allowing Naoto Oshima and Artoon to have their own shot at making a Sonic game, that'd be nice, too. Oshima was the one who gave us Sonic CD, after all, so I'd like to think that maybe he could stand to give us such a game again...
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Dear Sega,
^what Ben said.
Sincerely yours, Flame.
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Dear Sonic,
I left a Chilidog in the microwave for you, but you'll have to climb inside to get it.
Yours Truly, Grounder Tails.
IT'S A TRAP!
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Dear Sonic Team and Sega,
Thanks for discovering Crush 40. Music alone does not a game make; sell Sonic to Nintendo.
Dear Nintendo,
There is a series that can and did once rival the Mario name; that series is the Sonic series. Build it back up to what it once was; a fun, fast, addictive platformer with 30-second to 1 minute long levels where the best stages had surreal backgrounds and tilesets, catchy music, and Special Stages that were the challenge of the game that got you playable Super forms and the good ending.
You can Ninten-do what Sega of Japan won't let other companies, not even BioWare, do.
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^ what he said
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Dear Sega.
Where the hell is Jet Set Radio 3? I've given up on Sonic for a bit, but if you can make your sweatshop team in the basement crank out something incredible (see the post by Ben above), I'll be there day one. Also, less rock more Hideki Naganuma/Sonic CD JPN/Sonic3K please? Also also, Valkryia Chronicles. Need. MOAR. XD
Sincerely,
Jericho
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Dear Sega.
Where the hell is Jet Set Radio 3?
Probably won't be made until whatever is left of Smilebit (they're largely a part of the force that makes Yakuza games, now) can be bothered to make a new game.
But really, that's the only way I'll be even open to the idea of a sequel: the original team needs to come back and work their magic. There's NO other way.
However, Sega DOES have the power to work with Treasure, and make a new Guardian Heroes (or at least, another Guardian Heroes-style brawler that's NOT attached to Bleach) a reality.
Get Production IG (Wario Land Shake) to help out with the sprite work, and leave Treasure to craft the fan-favorite formula that we all love very dearly. MAKE THIS HAPPEN, SEGA! GYAT DAMMIT! :W
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Music alone justifies the Sonic games, this is true.
That being said, something that neither Sonic nor Mario ever did was to make a 3D rendition of the 2D gameplay. Mario went the open-ended route, Sonic went the extra-mechanics route. Both saw their fair share of humiliation (I don't think highly of Mario Sunshine). But seriously, maybe Sonic doesn't need to be innovative? Maybe, just maybe, the old formula applied to the 3D plane, nothing more and nothing less, wouldn't be a bad idea. You know, actual platforming, spin-dashing through walls, running across water, zone-specific stunts, extra character abilities that were fun/useful without being mandatory, SUPER SONIC IN STAGES, that kind of stuff.
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Music alone justifies the Sonic games, this is true.
That being said, something that neither Sonic nor Mario ever did was to make a 3D rendition of the 2D gameplay. Mario went the open-ended route, Sonic went the extra-mechanics route. Both saw their fair share of humiliation (I don't think highly of Mario Sunshine). But seriously, maybe Sonic doesn't need to be innovative? Maybe, just maybe, the old formula applied to the 3D plane, nothing more and nothing less, wouldn't be a bad idea. You know, actual platforming, spin-dashing through walls, running across water, zone-specific stunts, extra character abilities that were fun/useful without being mandatory, SUPER SONIC IN STAGES, that kind of stuff.
I'm on my Wii and can't be bothered to edit your post so you can the focus I'm going for, but Super Mario Galaxy not only laughs at this statement, it's mooning you from the moon as well. XD
Seriously, off the top of my head, there's:
- Dino Pirahna in Good Egg
- All of Gusty Garden Galaxy
- All of Sand Dune Galaxy (with the first star having one of the best literal applications of point A to point B sidescrolling platforming in a while)
- Certain Freezeflame Galaxy stars (race, Hot & Cold Collide)
- Melty. Molten. Motherfukken. Galaxy. (Delicious gaming crack. More so for a platformer whore like me. XD)
- All of the Bowser/most Bowser Jr. levels, especially the magnificent Center of The Universe.
And lots more that I have to play & remind myself of.
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[tornado fang], why am I doing this and not playing Galaxy again? XD
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A good point (damn the economy for my not having Galaxy), but you could just as easily take segments of Sonic games to say the same. Especially the first Adventure. I meant the game as a whole.
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Mmm...now that I finished Madworld...(aside from playing its Hard mode now), I should get my ass to Luigi Galaxy and NMH Bitter Mode XD
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A good point (damn the economy for my not having Galaxy), but you could just as easily take segments of Sonic games to say the same. Especially the first Adventure. I meant the game as a whole.
Oh, well, I did want to just say all of it honestly, but that'd only be partially true (mostly true). The only way for you to see what I mean is to play it.
There's a reason why I have it next to only SMB3 as the culmination of the best elements of platforming.
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Video related to thread. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hik-TeGQIn0)
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Sonic Adventure 1 was a good start for Sonic, although it'll be harder for it to make the transition to 3D simply because it is faster-paced. The good news is, though, that even the "fast" segments of the Genesis games were, in their own ways, "on rails" like Sonic Adventure would occasionally force the player into (see: Windy Valley). Look back at Chemical Plant, Stardust Speedway, Hydrocity, even Emerald Hill; you could go VERY fast, but you had relatively little control at that point. So what the 3D Sonic games need to do is still have that speed, but give up the control and make the settings eye-catch more. Then, put the control back in the player's hands for the platforming segments (save for its glitches, see: Final Egg).
Mario, being a slower-paced game based largely upon jumping, more easily made the transition to 3D. Sonic Team could learn from looking at its platforming task designs, then adjusting Sonic's jump mechanics and stages to that standard.
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Sonic Adventure 1 was a good start for Sonic, although it'll be harder for it to make the transition to 3D simply because it is faster-paced. The good news is, though, that even the "fast" segments of the Genesis games were, in their own ways, "on rails" like Sonic Adventure would occasionally force the player into (see: Windy Valley). Look back at Chemical Plant, Stardust Speedway, Hydrocity, even Emerald Hill; you could go VERY fast, but you had relatively little control at that point. So what the 3D Sonic games need to do is still have that speed, but give up the control and make the settings eye-catch more. Then, put the control back in the player's hands for the platforming segments (save for its glitches, see: Final Egg).
Disagree a bit with this statement.
See, what's still essentially the problem with modern Sonic games, is that they try to focus all on speed, and think that's the "return to Sonic's roots" that we've been waiting for.
And...that's wrong. Simply put.
There was much more that made the "glory days" of Sonic's 16-bit era what they were. It was solid level design married to a tight physics engine, which all did more to play up to Sonic's "pinball-like" nature. In the old days, you had to "earn" the right to make Sonic go fast...by the time you did so, you felt proud of yourself that you were able to get to that fast.
As long as modern day Sonic Team does NOT get that, they'll never make a Sonic game that TRULY goes back to Sonic's roots, either 3D or 2D. That's why the tagline has been worthless since they started touting it around Sonic Heroes, and will continue to be so.
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In the old days, you had to "earn" the right to make Sonic go fast...by the time you did so, you felt proud of yourself that you were able to get to that fast.
As long as modern day Sonic Team does NOT get that, they'll never make a Sonic game that TRULY goes back to Sonic's roots, either 3D or 2D. That's why the tagline has been worthless since they started touting it around Sonic Heroes, and will continue to be so.
Agreed up until this point.
See, they're already making you, "earn your speed", and they're doing it through inane Gimmicks and those god-forsaken Boost Rings.
On top of that, enemies now have health bars. Sonic Unleashed did a little bit to alleviate this during the day stages, but that benefit was equally destroyed by the blur effect of the Dash Boost and the poor camera angle, not to mention floaty jump physics.
And as far as "earning your speed", yeah, okay, I will grant you that memorizing the stage layouts of the S3&K and Sonic CD stages is the reason why I (or any other gamer, for that matter) can get through stages in record times. I'll grant you that.
But at the same time, even the beginner players got to feel that speed by way of stage design, especially in Sonic 2 where Emerald Hill and Chemical Plant Zone had loop-de-loops that made your jaw drop, skill level regardless. In fact, there was more skill and reward in how you landed after those segments than in actually obtaining the speed.
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Agreed up until this point.
See, they're already making you, "earn your speed", and they're doing it through inane Gimmicks and those god-forsaken Boost Rings.
On top of that, enemies now have health bars. Sonic Unleashed did a little bit to alleviate this during the day stages, but that benefit was equally destroyed by the blur effect of the Dash Boost and the poor camera angle, not to mention floaty jump physics.
All in all, though, you're just doing more to elaborate on what I'm talking about.
Gimmicks. Married together to bad physics, bad camera AI and etc.
These are the things that are just proof to how modern ST does NOT get it. They rather just add on to the long-standing problems the series has, without adequately addressing that which should be fundamental things to make a solid Sonic game (or hell, just a solid game, period).
And as far as "earning your speed", yeah, okay, I will grant you that memorizing the stage layouts of the S3&K and Sonic CD stages is the reason why I (or any other gamer, for that matter) can get through stages in record times. I'll grant you that.
But at the same time, even the beginner players got to feel that speed by way of stage design, especially in Sonic 2 where Emerald Hill and Chemical Plant Zone had loop-de-loops that made your jaw drop, skill level regardless. In fact, there was more skill and reward in how you landed after those segments than in actually obtaining the speed.
What I'm trying to get at though, is that "earning" the speed came from being able to actually utilize the level, the solid physics engine, and Sonic's own momentum, all to your advantage.
That much was definitely present in the older games. As time has gone on, in this modern era, it either hasn't been so much of a part, or just utterly passed-over.
But hey, it is what it is, when it comes to modern Sonic. Won't be buying any more Sonic games, unless a) they get their act together, or b) AM2 makes a new "Sonic the Fighters". 8D
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Dear SEGA,
Please get your arses in gear and make a [tornado fang]ing SONIC GAME! :W
GAP
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All in all, though, you're just doing more to elaborate on what I'm talking about.
Gimmicks. Married together to bad physics, bad camera AI and etc.
These are the things that are just proof to how modern ST does NOT get it. They rather just add on to the long-standing problems the series has, without adequately addressing that which should be fundamental things to make a solid Sonic game (or hell, just a solid game, period).
What I'm trying to get at though, is that "earning" the speed came from being able to actually utilize the level, the solid physics engine, and Sonic's own momentum, all to your advantage.
That much was definitely present in the older games. As time has gone on, in this modern era, it either hasn't been so much of a part, or just utterly passed-over.
But hey, it is what it is, when it comes to modern Sonic. Won't be buying any more Sonic games, unless a) they get their act together, or b) AM2 makes a new "Sonic the Fighters". 8D
I thought we might have been clashing on how the player "earns their speed," but I don't think we even disagree on that.
But even then, a beginner player should still be able to get a darn good time. In fact, it should be like Sonic CD; get unlockables via Time Attack (and not ranking, **** ranking).
And OH GOD, SONIC THE FIGHTERS.
In a collection called Sonic GEMS.
GEM?! Nuh uh! No!
EDIT:
No, you know what I'd buy from Sonic Team?
Tails' Adventure 2. For the DS and/or PSP. That, I would buy.
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Tails' Adventure 2. For the DS and/or PSP. That, I would buy.
I would buy this myself, personally. Along with a console release of SegaSonic the Hedgehog (Please bring this to the VC Sega!)
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http://gameoverthinker.blogspot.com/
Ep. 21, y'all. Bob actually made a very, very good case for Sonic's cool factor staying in its own '90s era.
I disagree, though. I think Sega actually made a cool character that could stay timeless. And I don't think Shadow sucks, although the lack of characterization and the eternal immaturity Sonic Team seems to have given him does not help at all.
Even so, gameplay. Gameplay. And yes, maybe 2D is the only way to go, although I think maybe zipline and event coding might still allow for occasional forays into the 3D environment.
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I thought we might have been clashing on how the player "earns their speed," but I don't think we even disagree on that.
But even then, a beginner player should still be able to get a darn good time. In fact, it should be like Sonic CD; get unlockables via Time Attack (and not ranking, **** ranking).
Agreed.
And OH GOD, SONIC THE FIGHTERS.
In a collection called Sonic GEMS.
GEM?! Nuh uh! No!
Hah! Say what you will, but even the likes of denizens from SRK.com can agree that Sonic the Fighters had its merits. If AM2 was given the tap to make a sequel, I'd likely would get behind such a game. AM2 is one of the few "houses" within Sega that delivers consistently, even when it comes to "tie-in" games. 8D
Furthermore, the whole notion of the collection being called "Sonic Gems" is, of course, left up to the eye of the beholder.
CD? A definitive gem. The 3 Bare Knuckle/Streets of Rage games (in the JP version)? DEFINITELY gems, even if they're not the least bit related to Sonic.
However....Spinball GG? Tails Sky Patrol? Sonic Drift 2? Sonic R? 8D Yeah, no.
No, you know what I'd buy from Sonic Team?
Tails' Adventure 2. For the DS and/or PSP. That, I would buy.
Agreed, again. I would love it very much, if they made a sequel to the Metroid-like Sonic game they crafted. Plus, after so long of being reduced to Sonic's lil cheerleader all over again, maybe another solo role will up his street cred again.
However, without Aspect (the original developer of that game), I dunno how I would feel about such a game in other's hands.
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Disagree a bit with this statement.
See, what's still essentially the problem with modern Sonic games, is that they try to focus all on speed, and think that's the "return to Sonic's roots" that we've been waiting for.
And...that's wrong. Simply put.
Gotta agree there. It's not just about running around, even if the whole dash mechanic in Sonic Rush was awesome. Sonic is a platformer, period. You're not ALWAYS running. You never were. And every game critic and their dog jumps on any moment in a recent Sonic game when you're not. They don't help matters either.
And yes, "return to roots" tagline is worthless. When's the last time we spin-dashed through a wall?
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What we need is to bring bavck that gameplay balance that Sonic possessed in the nineties.
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When's the last time we spin-dashed through a wall?
when's the last time we spindashed period? he can't even do it in the Storybook games or Unleashed. and i don't know if he had it in 06. instead, we get the Homing Attack.
Dear Sega,
Downplay the Homing Attack.
Signed,
Some Guy
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When's the last time we spin-dashed through a wall?
Windy Valley post-tornado, Sonic Adventure 1.
...er, at least I did.
Hah! Say what you will, but even the likes of denizens from SRK.com can agree that Sonic the Fighters had its merits. If AM2 was given the tap to make a sequel, I'd likely would get behind such a game. AM2 is one of the few "houses" within Sega that delivers consistently, even when it comes to "tie-in" games. 8D
Furthermore, the whole notion of the collection being called "Sonic Gems" is, of course, left up to the eye of the beholder.
CD? A definitive gem. The 3 Bare Knuckle/Streets of Rage games (in the JP version)? DEFINITELY gems, even if they're not the least bit related to Sonic.
However....Spinball GG? Tails Sky Patrol? Sonic Drift 2? Sonic R? 8D Yeah, no.
Agreed, again. I would love it very much, if they made a sequel to the Metroid-like Sonic game they crafted. Plus, after so long of being reduced to Sonic's lil cheerleader all over again, maybe another solo role will up his street cred again.
However, without Aspect (the original developer of that game), I dunno how I would feel about such a game in other's hands.
Well, I was only referring to Fighters, but yeah, the other games are a mixed bag, too, come to think of it.
But Tails' Adventure is far and away a great deal. Sonic CD and Tails' Adventure are reason enough to own that game.
I don't know, I actually think Sonic Team could do really well with Tails' Adventure 2. They seem to like really cheesy storylines and extra characters; this might actually be a good way to have Tails and Marine/Cream/Wave/Big or maybe even some other lesser known characters work as a team and allow for co-op play.
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What we need is to bring bavck that gameplay balance that Sonic possessed in the nineties.
Not likely going to happen, unfortunately.
See, the thing that's probably MOST important to note is that, Sonic was as good as he was in the nineties, because he was made of the sum of great parts. Without those parts, he doesn't amount to much.
Naka and his original game code. Oshima and his character designs. Yasuhara and his level design. These are (arguably) the three main cornerstones that made Sonic what he was. All of the "Blast Processing" campaigning, the "hip" mascot character, marketing and all that? Wouldn't have meant a hill of beans if these three guys didn't have their hands involved in the project, and then came together to deliver something truly special.
Now-a-days, all 3 of those guys are off, doing their own thing, leaving Iizuka and the rest of modern Sonic Team to piddle along, and just churn out more Sonic games for kids to beg their parents to buy for Christmas.
It's basically the same thing for why Square Enix should probably NEVER do another Chrono game. Without the original people involved, it would likely end up being just something that would just sully the legacy of Chrono Trigger, and who wants that?
[spoiler]...as if that "new ending" didn't tick me off enough...[/spoiler] bVd
I don't know, I actually think Sonic Team could do really well with Tails' Adventure 2. They seem to like really cheesy storylines and extra characters; this might actually be a good way to have Tails and Marine/Cream/Wave/Big or maybe even some other lesser known characters work as a team and allow for co-op play.
No! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! Don't give them ideas! 8D
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Oh, but I must! It's a character flaw, you see!
Besides, how often is it we get a Castlevania/Metroid/whatever-esque game with co-op?
And cute, fuzzy forest creatures?
Wielding bombs?
EDIT: Funny story, I actually predicted Sonic Advance 2's final boss, Sonic Riders, and the use of super attacks (including Super Sonic) in SSBB.
My last idea was for the Chaos Emeralds to shapeshift into various elemental (or not) weapons. I doubt that one will happen, although I do seem to recall some Sonic X figures that used the emeralds as part of some kind of weaponry...
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Well, I guess I might as well search for the next cool thing from Sega. I just hope amongst all the [sonic slicer]ing crap they dish out, they finally create a Sonic game that even an old Sonic fan enjoy but also while it may not satisfy everyone, at least it will good game that will have its place among the classics. Till then, Sonic and some Storybook games and the kick ass music that still have going for them.
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when's the last time we spindashed period? he can't even do it in the Storybook games or Unleashed. and i don't know if he had it in 06. instead, we get the Homing Attack.
Well, you could do both in the Adventures. Whoring it for better speed was necessary for some of the emblems in the first, but it was pretty forgettable in the second (in fact it can screw up some of the stunts; "rolling around at the speed of sound" my butt).
Windy Valley post-tornado, Sonic Adventure 1.
...er, at least I did.
Good memory. I just jump the thing.
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Spindash was fun to use in SA2 at certain points just to gather some quick speed, but otherwise it was mostly useless, which is a shame.
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EDIT: Funny story, I actually predicted Sonic Advance 2's final boss, Sonic Riders, and the use of super attacks (including Super Sonic) in SSBB.
Who didn't see Sonic's final smash as Super Sonic? What else was he going to do? Run around and circles and cause a tornado to blow everyone away? Call in Tails to crash the Tornado into the field, causing a screen wide explosion?
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Who didn't see Sonic's final smash as Super Sonic? What else was he going to do? Run around and circles and cause a tornado to blow everyone away? Call in Tails to crash the Tornado into the field, causing a screen wide explosion?
The music could've changed to Sonic 1's Boss Music, and Dr. Eggman would have wrecked house with his Wrecking Ball formation. 8D
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Who didn't see Sonic's final smash as Super Sonic? What else was he going to do? Run around and circles and cause a tornado to blow everyone away? Call in Tails to crash the Tornado into the field, causing a screen wide explosion?
Actually, yeah, that one. Especially considering Mario wasn't going to use a Starman but rather used some vague never-before-seen fire attack, so a number of people thought Super Sonic would be a no-show.
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Evidently those people were running dinosaur computers that cannot stream media: Super Sonic was featured in Sonic's announcement video.
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Before that trailer. Although I had no idea Sonic would actually be in Brawl. Just that, if Sonic had to have some sort of uber special attack and ever made it into SSB, it'd be Super Sonic.
Can't blame people for thinking Super Sonic wouldn't be playable when he hasn't even been playable in the course of regular stages. Super Sonic could have been a final cutscene-only thing.
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The absence of Super Sonic is only true of platformers, though (see Sonic Riders). And actually Brawl doesn't even change that, given that Smash Balls don't appear in SSE (SAKURAAAAAI!!!).
Likewise, Starman is not really comparable to Super Sonic. It's a generic short-term invulnerability, and one which Smash already included anyway. That'd have been like giving Sonic the star item box. Super Sonic is not merely a status change but an alternate form, able to be maintained indefinitely depending on rings, and allowing flight when gameplay permits (hovering and large jumps when it does not).
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That's all true; I'd still prefer a Starman over Mario Finale, though. /wii
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Starman rocks but Super Sonic is the [metal blade].
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That's all true; I'd still prefer a Starman over Mario Finale, though. /wii
Rainbow Mario if anything, still though the Mario Finale was great for sheer wow factor (see E3 2006 Reveal trailer) and it's pretty freakin' cool gameplay wise. Then there's the fact that the only logic Smash has to follow is it's own. I'd have been saying wat every time Mario did a FS and got a more powerful Starman when Bowser's friggin' goin' Super Sayajin. XD
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Mario Finale just needs more power. Otherwise, it's pretty awesome, and the "OH YEAH, HEE YAAAAAAAAAAA" before it is [tornado fang]ing priceless!
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Mario Finale can be pretty damn evil if you trap someone with it, the problem is that's very difficult to do due to its long lag time (not to mention the fact that everyone and their dog whores Final Destination on random Wifi).
If anything Giga Bowser was the Final Smash I was disappointed with. It really is too short and your attacks could stand to be much stronger. And it's not like Bowser couldn't have used a better power boost, either, seeings how his speed and size make him a pain to use.
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