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Rockman & Community => Rockman Series => Original => Topic started by: Irregular Ass-R-Us on August 15, 2013, 12:25:27 AM

Title: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Irregular Ass-R-Us on August 15, 2013, 12:25:27 AM
Hi guys. I was wondering, why do some of you hate or dislike Rockman 7? I don't see anything wrong with it really, to be honest its my third favorite Rockman Game. It had a great soundtrack,gameplay,bosses and difficulty ( i am a lover of hard games that kick your ass). I would like to hear your thoughts and ideas.
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Flame on August 15, 2013, 12:27:11 AM
Bob and George sprite comics.

Maybe that's just me though...




Also the localization.
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: ViperAcidZX on August 15, 2013, 12:30:23 AM
I still haven't gotten around to finishing it, and I forgot my password... -u-' So far I think it's okay.
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Protoman Blues on August 15, 2013, 12:58:45 AM
People probably hate it because it's an SNES MM game that's not Mega Man X.

Personally I love the game!

Also related:
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5YOZuBzY0sE[/youtube]
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Flame on August 15, 2013, 01:03:48 AM
People probably hate it because it's an SNES MM game that's not Mega Man X.

Personally I love the game!

Also related:
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5YOZuBzY0sE[/youtube]
so was MM and Bass, and people- wait people hate that one too... But thats more for difficulty reasons.
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Protoman Blues on August 15, 2013, 01:16:34 AM
Well I didn't like the soundtrack to MM & Bass, I'll say that much.

That and the pathway thing. Oh, and the Blues treatment.  -_-
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Flame on August 15, 2013, 01:22:52 AM
Which soundtrack? SNES or GBA? Personally I prefer the GBA. I think the SNES soundtrack is terrible, a result of putting too much in the visual department.
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Police Girl on August 15, 2013, 01:24:08 AM
Which soundtrack? SNES or GBA? Personally I prefer the GBA. I think the SNES soundtrack is terrible, a result of putting too much in the visual department.

There's only one good song from the SFC soundtrack.

Coldman's stage.

But yeah, graphics are beautiful in R&F, can't say the same about the music or the level design. And honestly its more of a Bass game than a Megaman game. Since its easier to play as Bass than it is as Megaman.
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Sakura Leic on August 15, 2013, 01:24:39 AM
Well I didn't like the soundtrack to MM & Bass, I'll say that much.

That and the pathway thing. Oh, and the Blues treatment.  -_-
Yeah I agree that they were really kicking him way too much, seriously being chopped in half?!
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Protoman Blues on August 15, 2013, 01:30:16 AM
Which soundtrack? SNES or GBA? Personally I prefer the GBA. I think the SNES soundtrack is terrible, a result of putting too much in the visual department.

I'm not fond of either, really. I like GroundMan's stage a lot, but not the instrument choice. It sounds SO much better in 8-bit!

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pnUbJxu7_ZI[/youtube]
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Phi on August 15, 2013, 02:15:31 AM
edit: nevermind, thought the title said Rockman X7
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Cherrykorock on August 15, 2013, 02:35:32 AM
Because its not as polished and impressive as Megaman X in every way.
Personally its probably my favorite Classic Megaman game but it is terribly flawed.

From an objective stand point the animation is awkward.
The soundtrack while one of my favorites airs on the cartoony side which turned off people who had played X and X2.
Megaman was bigger meaning he had less room to jump making the game annoying for veterans of the NES games. Though the proportions are more or less accurate to the World series.
Also like the World series people didnt seem to like the 4 bosses, mini stage, then 4 bosses gimmick.
Most of the sound effects were awful.
And then there are about a million little things that people like to nit pick like Cloud man having 4 fingers on one hand, rush search in general, junk man, etc.

With all of that said most people just cant see past the flaws and enjoy it for what it is.
An extremely fun and satisfying adventure that has a lot of heart.
If i remember correctly i think the game was made in only 3 or 4 months.
If that is the case that just amazes me how much they did in that amount of time.
It also makes me wonder how much more it could have been improved with more time in development.
But like i said im not sure about that as i dont have the greatest memory haha.
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: OBJECTION MAN on August 15, 2013, 03:10:48 AM
The sprites are too big resulting in cramped screen space. As a result it felt slower and clunky. Otherwise I enjoyed it, with it's additions and further developments of series features.

Overall I felt 8 was much more balanced in screen size and speed.
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Satoryu on August 15, 2013, 05:05:34 AM
Mega Man 7 is my favorite Classic game. So it does really sadden me that so many people take issue with it. I think it's terribly underrated.

The bigness of the sprites never hampered gameplay for me. I was never in a situation that I didn't have enough room to move around or an enemy was approaching from offscreen too fast. And because the sprites are bigger I'd say the game moves very fast. Mega Man goes flying when he slides in that game. MM8 is the one that feels slow to me, until you buy Hyper Slider.
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Protoman Blues on August 15, 2013, 05:07:09 AM
The weapons in MM7 were fantastic. And I must also say [tornado fang]ing SUPER RUSH ADAPTER KICK ASSSSSSSSSSSS!!!  8)
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Police Girl on August 15, 2013, 05:20:00 AM
Man, I've never had an issue with MM7, the music is great, the graphics are bright and colorful, the game introduced both Auto and Bass, and overall it just feels like a natural advancement of classic Megaman formula.

It was definitely a step up from how bland the 8-bit games had gotten by the time 6 had rolled around. Though I might just take more issue with 5 and 6 because of them doing the two castles thing like MM4 did, but not having two different songs in each castle (That and the two castle thing had gotten really tiring in 6). Unless they were strapped for time there really is no reason they couldn't have done two more songs.

Anyway, I'm getting off track here. MM7's still probably my favorite of the classic games. Hopefully we get it on the Virtual Console this year along with the rest of the Megaman games.
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Nexus on August 15, 2013, 10:12:12 PM
Megaman/Rockman 7 really isn't bad, it's just different while still sticking to the familiar system without odd or too-drastic changes. As we've shown, a lot of people here seem to like it and probably liked it back when it came out too. Not my favorite game, but it's better than others in the series for me.

This is just theory from seeing some of the more vocal hate years ago in other places, but perhaps the reason why some people give it so much crap, aside from the bigger and sometimes awkward-looking characters, is that at the time, it wasn't Megaman X. Even for what 7 brought to the table in terms of new features (which the X series would semi-replicate on their own accord, like the Shop system finally being implemented as of X8 and even sooner if you count the Xtreme titles), X was the leaner, meaner, faster and more 'badass' thing at the time. Who gave a whatzawhosit about Rock's sliding and Rush Coil when X could just scale the wall and then dashjump a gap with precise ease? Super Adapter? What's that, I can't hear you over the armor ability of charging every single Maverick weapon!

Of course, in retrospect and hindsight, people are more willing to separate the two now and see them for what they are, which is why 7 is seen a bit more positively nowadays. Most of the hate's shuffled onto 8 in recent years for its more questionable design choices, or Capcom's second cash-in of the retro craze via 10 (or Capcom in general, but that's beside the point).
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Irregular Ass-R-Us on August 15, 2013, 11:57:40 PM
Very good points guys  :). I too think that the screen was a bit cramped and the animations were a little weird. But i am happy to see people that like the game. I agree pretty much with Nexus since he took the words out of my mouth. I am making a Rockman X engine at the moment but i think i will remake Rockman 7 with some upgrades and change some stuff. But overall i think it is a amazing game that is underrated and should deserve the same amount of praise that Rockman 2 and Rockman 3 did.
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Zan on August 16, 2013, 02:46:31 AM
Quote
Most of the hate's shuffled onto... Capcom's second cash-in of the retro craze via 10

Which is just sad. R10 is an improvement on R9 in almost every way, and Inti Creates truly put heart into its development.
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Cherrykorock on August 16, 2013, 03:41:05 AM
I havent heard about anyone hating 10.
Its an awesome game!
My only dislike is that its 8 bits but thats kind of the point for that game.
Megaman 9 succeeded because of the retro nostalgia.
Megaman 10 succeeded because it was fun, creative, legitimately difficult, and imo had outstanding level design.
The soundtrack was hit or miss but at least had its own unique style and didnt try to be Megaman 2.

I dont hate megaman 9 but its my second least favorite game in the series.
It did everything in its power to regress an already stagnant series in a near dead genre.
The games saving grace was a good weapon line up and a few good tunes.

And this is coming from someone who has a guilty pleasure for Megaman X7.

Im not trying to say 9 deserves hate, just that it receives more praise than games like 7 and 8 which at least tried new things.
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Police Girl on August 16, 2013, 03:50:27 AM
You summed up my thoughts about 9 exactly, it was an okay game but it did all it could to take steps backwards in the series, going back to 8-bit, simplifying the graphics to MM2 style, cutting the slide and such, re-using music from MM2. Its not a bad game per se, its just not a very good game.
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Nexus on August 16, 2013, 08:52:36 AM
Which is just sad. R10 is an improvement on R9 in almost every way, and Inti Creates truly put heart into its development.

Unfortunately I haven't had much exposure to either besides some choppy emulation that I never did much with, so I can't personally judge. I've seen a lot of people [sonic slicer] about how Capcom was just trying to cash-cow with 9 and 10, but for some reason other places just tend to ignore the improvements 10 seems to of made and then turn around and praise 9 for being like 2.

I guess it's just something I should chalk up to 'it's the internet'.  :\
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Cherrykorock on August 16, 2013, 12:57:16 PM
Fans for the most part were more complacent with the idea of 9 being in 8 bits simply because it had been over 10 years since we had a classic Mega Man game. And at the time it was kind of cool and bold to make a game in that style. when 10 was released it was seen as a lazy cop out to make money. Much like how people dismissed Sonic 4 before even playing it. and yes it was lazy of them to put the game in that style again however the game is extremely well made, well thought out, and for the most part fun to play. people continue to judge a book by its cover in essence.
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Irregular Ass-R-Us on August 16, 2013, 01:19:27 PM
I think Rockman 10 should have been a 16 bit improved version of 7 with the features that 10 has.
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Cherrykorock on August 16, 2013, 05:56:48 PM
I think Rockman 10 should have been a 16 bit improved version of 7 with the features that 10 has.
I would prefer if they used the RnF sprites then.
Still 16 bit but a lot nicer to look at.
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Sakura Leic on August 16, 2013, 06:52:48 PM
I would prefer if they used the RnF sprites then.
Still 16 bit but a lot nicer to look at.
I thought that was 32 bit.
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Flame on August 16, 2013, 08:29:49 PM
I thought that was 32 bit.
the PS megaman games (and more or less every 2D game afterwards, including the Zero and ZX series) are on 32+ bit systems, allowing them more freedoms, but most of the sprites still use only 16 colors. Why do you think that RnF was able to use Mega Man 8 assets on the Super Nintendo? because they are well within the limits of what the Super Nintendo can handle. of course, things like backgrounds couldn't be nearly as detailed as in 8, but they still got the point across. (the music also suffered a bit as a result)
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Fxeni on August 16, 2013, 08:48:58 PM
I never hated Rockman 7. I always did prefer playing the SNES X series games, but 7 was just fine.
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Irregular Ass-R-Us on August 16, 2013, 09:18:47 PM
I would prefer if they used the RnF sprites then.
Still 16 bit but a lot nicer to look at.

Quite true, maybe they should have done Rockman 9 with 16 bit Rockman 7 graphics and Make Rockman 10 with Rockman and Forte graphics.
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Cherrykorock on August 16, 2013, 10:34:47 PM
Honestly with the classic series the graphics dont matter.
Sure it looks nicer but minus a few bits here and there 7 8 and RnF didnt really play too differently from the Nes games .
Which is a valid reason people cite when criticizing those games.
Mmx took full advantage of what the Snes was capable of.
Mm7 not so much.
This is why the Psx games let fans down as well.
Neither 8 or the X series really took advantage of the newer hardware at the time
Ironic as they dont look as aged as many Psx games.
Perhaps, for once, capcom was onto something!
Hahaha.

Also concerning the Megaman sprites in Mm8 and RnF Megaman's colors are slightly less vibrant.
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Irregular Ass-R-Us on August 18, 2013, 01:36:28 AM
Its true that despite the graphics nothing is the drastically different. But at least its more refreshing to see different graphics rather than the norm 8 bit graphics. The different graphics kind of make you feel that your playing a different game but your not.

Its true that Rockman 7 didn't take more advantage of the super famicons power. But at least it tried.

The PSX games i think were actually really cool. I really liked X4. Didn't really like X5 because it felt depressing and boring but it was good. X6 was my personal favorite since it had fixed most problems of X5, had cool stages (not all),Amazing soundtrack that is addictive and a Good and interesting Story,

I didn't like the pre-CG stage graphics though. They look kind of out of place and look bland to me. The Super Famicon games had much better and brighter levels that looked beautiful.
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Protoman Blues on August 18, 2013, 07:15:48 AM
The Wily Castle 1 stage music is extremely underrated. At least I think so!
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Irregular Ass-R-Us on August 18, 2013, 09:07:04 AM
I agree. That soundtrack deserves more praise. I also love the boss theme.
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Cherrykorock on August 18, 2013, 04:56:10 PM
The Wily Castle 1 stage music is extremely underrated. At least I think so!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jv1jNfsOcS0&feature=youtube_gdata_player
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Gauntlet101010 on August 19, 2013, 02:03:46 AM
I just don't like the flying skull or Wily's final form.  What bothersome bosses!
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Cherrykorock on August 19, 2013, 02:10:01 AM
Well i am pretty sure they specifically designed the final boss to almost require the use of an E-tank.
As a kid I usually needed 2 or 3.
Also at least a W-tank as well.
Only thing I didnt like was how NO ONE told me Danger Wrap had a second mode of attack.
I found out on accident that pressing down and shoot places it on the ground.

It also was kind of dick/funny with what happens when you hit Turboman or Springman with the Thunderbolt.
Best one being if you hit Freezeman with the Freeze Cracker.
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: MacDaddyMike on August 20, 2013, 06:07:52 PM
For me it was a lot of the little things that just kept adding up.
- Sprites were too large, game felt cramped
- Story was annoying and took me out of the gameplay
- Bass was a boring character
- Too many hidden items, no need for a 2-page menu in a classic MM game
- Sound effects were awful
- Most of the music was boring
- Status effects (burn, freeze, goo'd, etc.) were a bad idea
- The "get weapon" explanation scenes with Dr. Light were cringe-worthy
- Final boss is outrageously imbalanced

As for R&F
- Loved the music, you guys is crazy, the percussion effects were off the hook (Ground, Tengu, opening stage, Auto's Shop and the Data CD tunes were my favs)
- While I wasn't a fan of the 4-4 split in MM7, I actually liked the setup in R&F, where you get a choice of three at the start but whichever one you beat opens up another three
- Weapon set was the best since MM4
- Interesting boss fights with more complex patterns than most in the series
- Graphical style took some getting used to in getting the jump distance correct, but I loved the look, visually
- Looking for CDs was fun
- Okay, King Stage 2 is one of the most ridiculously difficult and unfair stages in the history of the series...I have no defense for this one, actually
- I liked how playing as Rock made the bosses easier, whereas Bass had an easier time with the stages
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Da Dood on August 20, 2013, 06:15:46 PM
I don't see a lot of hate for MM7 as much as people just liking the 8-bit games better.

My favorite thing about MM7 is that it's full of secrets. Each stage has one or two hidden items that are usually pretty unique. I can never play this game and not collect 100% items, it just doesn't feel like a complete MM7 experience without everything.

The graphics do bother me, but only because there could have been so much more to the level design. The platforming is always really safe in this game. They don't take a lot of risks because you can never see enough of the screen. I mean, check this out...

(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-TIkgKaY4yo8/Te6gUHBaDJI/AAAAAAAAA9w/o8jldWmiZ9s/s320/mmac_f.jpg)

The walls and floor take up half the screen. There's so little space to move around, it's almost like Game Boy.

I love the game, though. Mega Man was all about X in the mid '90s, but I thought it was amazing that they were releasing a new classic Mega Man. Also lots of fun with passwords. All Robot Masters available at the start is something I wish MM8 offered.
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Irregular Ass-R-Us on August 20, 2013, 09:43:01 PM
^ This i agree with fully. Also some people think that if Rockman is not in 8 bit than it is bad which is clearly not true.
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Gauntlet101010 on August 20, 2013, 09:48:18 PM
Another possible negative to the game is that the boss weaknesses make the bosses super, super easy.
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Cherrykorock on August 21, 2013, 01:00:20 AM
Another possible negative to the game is that the boss weaknesses make the bosses super, super easy.
Not as easy as 1, 2, or 3 at least.
Thats actually more of a plus to me.
Makes having the right weapon feel more rewarding.
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Gauntlet101010 on August 21, 2013, 02:58:24 AM
Not as easy as 1, 2, or 3 at least.
Thats actually more of a plus to me.
Makes having the right weapon feel more rewarding.
It's not really a negative to me either, but it's one I've heard tossed around about the game.
Title: Re: Why do people hate Rockman 7 so much?
Post by: Cherrykorock on August 21, 2013, 03:32:10 AM
It's not really a negative to me either, but it's one I've heard tossed around about the game.
I guess hardcore gamers would take issue with that.
But at least they have wily machine 7.
Which isnt that hard when you know how his shots work.
I like that even if you know how it works it keeps you on your toes. :3