RockmanPM Forums
Rockman & Community => Rockman Series => X => Topic started by: Treleus on February 20, 2012, 08:48:15 AM
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[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3h_bx0PLxWg[/youtube]
Man, I love listening to that theme. It's powerfully bombastic, really upbeat, and reeks of awesome, not unlike the fact that Zero returns to the series in X2 with a vengeance. He matches X shot for shot and brings in a dramatically new element to the series: the Z-saber. People thought Zero was cool in X1? He just got way cooler in X2, and he's here to stay. God, he's so cool.
If you know me, then you're probably aware that's a fact I've come to begrudge recently. As I've reflected on where the Mega Man franchise has gone since Mega Man X, I came to feel like the franchise's 2D experiences have never gotten much better than the early half of the X series, and its level of story engagement not much better than what X1 or X4 had to offer. We got a good taste of more open-world gameplay that emphasizes talking to NPCs and using melee weapons in the Mega Man Zero and ZX series, and with those games came a greater and more consistent emphasis on individual dialogues with a small ragtag band of freedom fighters (or guardians/mercenaries in the ZX games) and predictable philosophical banter with every single enemy you fight--and they all spout the same high-and-mighty insane **** about creating a new world by destroying the current one. For me, none of those things feel like refinements of what I enjoyed best from the SNES X games: a tight, engaging plot with minimal dialogue and an equally tight and engaging game design. And I think all those things that the 2D experience has evolved thus far ('cept for the style of storytelling perhaps) can be traced back to Zero's return in X2.
As much as I loved the way he returned in X2, his glorious fanfare, nice redesign with new saber weapon, and a thrilling chance to fight him and all, I don't think he should have come back because his sole reason for doing so was to derail what was so well laid down in X1: X's journey to grow and discover his destiny. By returning in X2, X's destiny was immediately boiled down to having to destroy Zero--something that was unceremoniously pointed out to us at the end of X3, and something that was, uh, well, already accomplished in X1. X4 had virtually nothing to do with X other than to inadvertently allude to his hypothetical 180 Face Heel Turn in Mega Man Zero with a single ending cutscene. X5 actually ended up culminating X3's ending wiiiiith ... a somewhat lame rehash of X2's fight between X and Zero. Impressive? Eh.
Story contentions aside, what about the fundamental game experience? Zero had star appeal ever since he saved X from Vile in X1. Everybody loved him, everybody thought he was super cool (myself included), some people thought he was a girl, and naturally everyone wanted to play as him. Everyone wanted to be Zero. X would never come to match that mystique for the rest of his career, and to me that's one of the biggest failures of the X series in terms of story and game planning, as well as basic character development. To me it's also a sign of immature storytelling, but the Rule of Cool has a powerful way of offsetting those kinds of imperfections, and many might've rationalized that Zero died before his time and deserved to steal the spotlight. That aside, though, what did Zero eventually bring to the X series that changed everything? His saber. Before X2, Mega Man was generally all about jumping and shooting. Shoulda been called Jump n' Shoot Man X introduced dashing and wall-kicking, but X4 finally changed the game with all-saber gameplay. As an added bonus, you got to play as Zero! FOR THE ENTIRE GAME! Holy ****, son. It just got real. You were playing as the badass you always wanted to be, and MAN is his saber not nearly as strong as it was in X3. And he can't shoot a thing out of one buster anymore, let alone two. Well, okay, that makes sense. Wouldn't want to make the game too easy, right? And we can't just cut X out altogether, right?
To cut a long story short, I don't really hate Zero, and I don't begrudge people for liking him so much and how he impacted the series. But I think he should've stayed dead in X1, at least until another series like Mega Man Zero rolled around after the X series had a sound, satisfying conclusion (X5 wasn't it). Despite Inafune's subtle intentions, the X series started with and was supposed to be about X, and we know that because that's what we ended up getting with X1. It was a solid experience that set up a very particular theme, tone and focus for the rest of the series: X's growth and potential as a person, and how he resolves that with the burden of being a Maverick Hunter in a society full of crime and uncertainty. Zero died for all that. Would the game have been much different had X been Zero instead? Or had Zero never died at all? Well, in the first case, that would've cut out the character that served Zero's function in X1, so unless they always intended for there to be a personal parallel character to whoever you played as, the story and the experienced would've turned out much different. Maybe even less impactful. Or maybe they could've switched places, and (Mega Man) X's death in Zero's place would've served as symbolic to the new direction the franchise would go. As for the second case, they would've continued to be brothers in arms, not unlike Mega Man and Proto Man. I wouldn't have had a problem with that if they treated Zero more or less like they treated Proto Man: a secondary character that had relevance to the story and you could sometimes play as or borrow his stuff.
My basic point is by having both X and Zero as playable heroes in the same series, the focus for storytelling and game design is halved to ill effect. Especially when one of the more central guys on the team likes the not-main-character more and intends to make him the star at main-character's expense. Saber combat is cool and all, but I like it much better when it's synthesized with the kind of gameplay evolution that followed X1 with X2's double busters and air-dashing and X3's cross-charge with up-dash. I just think it better belonged in another spinoff series.
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As much as I like what became of both characters over time, I think I really do agree with you, especially given how the Zero series turned out and ZX series still found a need for a Zero like experience instead of emphasizing what made the X and Zero duo dynamic (and X's gameplay) so nice in the first place.
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especially given how the Zero series turned out
?
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?
Honestly, (and this is probably going to be a very unpopular opinion) I feel like Capcom wrote themselves into a hole regarding handling how to handle the old stalwarts X & Zero and needed a new hook to bring in a new gen into the robot side of the franchise, hence the Kamen Rider ZX series. Problem with that is, on the game play side of things, we still wind up playing a Zero like experience as the fused form of Model X and Z is pretty much a weakened Zero series Zero, X is just a catalyst to play as one of four other established molds with some variance but no real "new" elements or surprise to themselves, and the X model itself isn't even relevant as the game locks you from playing the character in any meaningful way until post game while dictating in story that the characters never use raw X post ZX fusion and aside from being overpowered due to game mechanics, there's nothing there but traditional Jump 'N Shoot Man shenanigans. Story wise, it's the continued adventures of X, Zero and the past heroes played out by people mostly unrelated to their legacy and with no desire to really learn of the past endeavors. It just feels like things are living in a bubble and nothing besides the creepy omen that initiates these conflicts and the Biometals have any sort of relevance at times. The theme of the series is pretty much "screw destiny", but as it stands, it always boils back down to a legacy that was best explored when these characters were their own person instead of enablers for randoms.
Basically, ZX as a series right now feels like watered down Zero with none of the intrigue potential. Advent did a lot to try and change this up but with no further continuation, it remains hard to see how much further this series would go with its mold.
At this point though, I'm probably griping over nothing and wanting something different from what's established at current, while using the best theme in the series (Main Megaman/Robot character's desire and thus the player's desire to get stronger and more capable in comparison to the threats about and equal in caliber to the senior character) to push it forward. Maybe I'm just a fanboy for the robots, but eh, it's just never been as good to me as it was when it was X-Zero-Sigma and their dynamics.
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Agreed. The narrative resolution of the ZX series just boils down to a cliched "screw destiny, kill God" setup propped up by an emphatic, but unnecessary restatement of Mega Man Zero gameplay. Why play as any other character when you can just play as X or Zero? Or Omega? The multiple Biometal forms just felt like needless customizations, each with their own very specific and almost exclusive uses against certain bosses or terrain traversals. They're glorified Maverick weapons bundled with specific armor upgrades. The game never really puts you in sustained situations that make you think, "Well I should definitely use HX in this area" and led you into a fun use of a given Biometal. HX is arguably the most useful of the four Biometals with the airdashing and tornado move. I remember totally wasting that Area K miniboss by stunning it with the
Storm Tornado tornado move and then wacking at the head until it split in two. Beyond that, I never used it. Or any other Biometal much. It was more fun and familiar to just stick with ZX or X, once you unlocked him.
I feel like they could've taken some cues from Zero's fighting-game-moves system and used that to facilitate how you used X's Maverick weapons. Hitting the start button to select your weapon or cycling through them with the L/R buttons in the heat of battle were pretty unwieldy methods of using X's 8 weapons. Having customizeable button combinations for activating this move or that would've made using Maverick skills easier, quicker, and more fun, opening up more room for stage designers to legitimately challenge players without frustrating them or giving them weapons they'll little often use on average. Couple that with the ability to store your max charge level--for two busters--and you could bust out super-charged combos. Cross-charged combos even. Some of these special moves might even become unique legacy moves for X that can be carried into sequels, kinda like how Zero always has that ground pound move or the Kuuenzan spinning air blade move.
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I think that Zero earned his spot in X2. Both X and Zero are great. Period.
Trying to change what is already established might not go well with many fans. As for me, I don't really care what happens as long as I am satisfied in the end.
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Honestly, (and this is probably going to be a very unpopular opinion) I feel like Capcom wrote themselves into a hole regarding handling how to handle the old stalwarts X & Zero and needed a new hook to bring in a new gen into the robot side of the franchise, hence the Kamen Rider ZX series.
Oh, ZX. Yeah, it had... some issues. I thought you were saying MMZ itself was lame.
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I think that Zero earned his spot in X2. Both X and Zero are great. Period.
Trying to change what is already established might not go well with many fans. As for me, I don't really care what happens as long as I am satisfied in the end.
So it this just fixes a bunch of stuff that was wrong/broken, you'd be satisfied with some welcome retconning/remaking?
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So it this just fixes a bunch of stuff that was wrong/broken, you'd be satisfied with some welcome retconning/remaking?
Yes. I am an open person. I just respect things for what they are.
If Zero becomes more popular with the fans and more significant than X in story, I'll live with it and just play the games. I'll do the same when it is the other way around.
If I like, dislike, or become impartial to something, I'll keep it real everytime.
Edit: Removed something that I already said.
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Something similar happened to Sonic with Shadow.. And that's for another time.
Well, I do agree with you on some cases, but there's the thing that's been bugging me: If there was no Zero, or he was a different character.. Would Mega Man Legends/Mega Man Battle Network exist? That strikes me as odd when Network Transmission centered around this particular character, albeit in a different universe entirely.
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Something similar happened to Sonic with Shadow.. And that's for another time.
Not that similar.
Well, I do agree with you on some cases, but there's the thing that's been bugging me: If there was no Zero, or he was a different character.. Would Mega Man Legends/Mega Man Battle Network exist? That strikes me as odd when Network Transmission centered around this particular character, albeit in a different universe entirely.
Odd question, since Zero has nothing to do with Legends and Battle Network is non-canon. He amounts to a cameo end boss in Battle Network Transmission and a spot in the show, but that's about it.
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:\ I do not like this ZX bashing, at all. Leave ZERO-ZX out of this anti-Zero vendetta of yours, it has nothing to do with it. The matter at hand is the X-series and its lack of main character emphasis, not what comes after.
Also,
Battle Network is non-canon.
Battle Network is totally canonical, both to itself and the other Rockman series. Furthermore, I'm pretty sure Gaia was thinking from the perspective of game development .
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X series is really the only issue in terms of character focus...
Zero series is about Zero, and ZX sort of splits it a bit since neither X or Zero are at the forefront as much as Vent/Aile and Serpent/Albert/PnP...
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:\ I do not like this ZX bashing, at all. Leave ZERO-ZX out of this anti-Zero vendetta of yours, it has nothing to do with it. The matter at hand is the X-series and its lack of main character emphasis, not what comes after.
You seem rather annoyed or rather threatened.
Where did you get the Zero-ZX bashing? If I don't like them, I have my reasons, but this thread doesn't have anything to do with either outside of possible examples I'd like to use. And I'll cite those examples as I please.
Actually, wait a minute, they have one crucial shared aspect to the X series: Zero! So they're both just barely in the purview of this discussion, but again, I don't have a problem with Zero being in Mega Man Zero. The series is legitimately about him.
This isn't an anti-Zero vendetta per se. This is a pro-X dialogue where I identify Zero, as he was implemented in the X series, as a problem in that context. I'm not saying Zero shouldn't ever be in the X games as a playable character. I just think it'd be best that if he did exist in the X games, it would be either as a copy/rough equivalent of X for co-op and story purposes OR as an NPC for just story purposes. If I want to play a game about Zero, I'll play Mega Man Zero. If I want to play a game about X, I'd prefer it if it's mostly about X, not mostly about Zero.
Also,
Battle Network is totally canonical, both to itself and the other Rockman series. Furthermore, I'm pretty sure Gaia was thinking from the perspective of game development .
Battle Network is not in the Mega Man to Legends canon, so Zero's existence in any series between that has no logical bearing on Battle Network's universe. And how does Zero in particular magically affect game development?
Story intricacies aside, ZX is pretty much just Mega Man Zero: Part 2 if only for gameplay alone. For a combination of X and Zero in Model ZX, he looks mostly like Zero to boot. Traditionally X gameplay is the after-game unlockable.
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I dont think canon means what you think it means.
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Not that similar.
Odd question, since Zero has nothing to do with Legends and Battle Network is non-canon. He amounts to a cameo end boss in Battle Network Transmission and a spot in the show, but that's about it.
Zero did have a major role in Network Transmission under the "Zero Virus" scheme before the true boss was revealed. Plus I'm sure this had something to do with both the game's development per-say, story and gameplay wise. Battle Network IS an alternate universe, but Zero still made quite an impact on both universes, why did Dave and Lan know each other in 2 if he never appeared in 1 at all?
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I must be missing something. Never played any BN past 1, so tell me: does some parallel-universe fuckery happen that somehow connects the BN universe to the X universe, or was BN in the same universe as that and Classic/Legends/Zero/ZX all along?
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The BN/SF series happen in another universe, but that doesn't make them non-canon, just irrelevant to the X universe, that's what everyone has been saying. You don't seem to know what canon means.
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You seem rather annoyed or rather threatened.
Where did you get the Zero-ZX bashing? If I don't like them, I have my reasons, but this thread doesn't have anything to do with either outside of possible examples I'd like to use. And I'll cite those examples as I please.
I have no problem with it per say, but if such heavy critics about the series are going to be voiced (by you and others), I'd rather it occur in a new thread where I can properly address everything without derailing this one. The topic here is to address the ill-focus of the X-series in both plot and gameplay, not one's dismay of everything else.
Battle Network is not in the Mega Man to Legends canon, so Zero's existence in any series between that has no logical bearing on Battle Network's universe. And how does Zero in particular magically affect game development
Canon is the total body of works that is officially recognized as true. Battle Network isn't any less true than the X or classic series, and vice versa, they're just on different continuities. Besides, they do even share concepts from time to time, and are all part of the greater Rockman mythos. For example, events in Battle Network 2 and Star Force explain those of Mega Man X5.
In terms of game development, the complete removal of Zero from the X-series would certainly have affected the plot and characters of Battle Network Transmission. Likewise, with the X-series plot steering into a different direction, the ultimate envisioned future of Mega Man Legends would not be as it is today. So certainly, if Zero did not exist, things would be different. But we're not talking about complete removal of the character, as you said. What we should instead focus on is on how to make the X-series more complete, without removing the values it has now.
This is a pro-X dialogue where I identify Zero, as he was implemented in the X series, as a problem in that context. I'm not saying Zero shouldn't ever be in the X games as a playable character. I just think it'd be best that if he did exist in the X games, it would be either as a copy/rough equivalent of X for co-op and story purposes OR as an NPC for just story purposes. If I want to play a game about Zero, I'll play Mega Man Zero. If I want to play a game about X, I'd prefer it if it's mostly about X, not mostly about Zero.
Is the problem really the implementation of Zero and not instead the implementation of X? X himself was the focus of the first three games, but those titles did not have has much story presentation as the ones that came after. Had X been given 'equal' focus in those we'd still have the same Zero, but we'd have a deeper, more fleshed out story overall. To give focus back to X and ignore Zero wouldn't do the series much good either, it'd just be different, not better.
That same, Maverick Hunter X did a superb job in taking what we had, and adding to it. For once we truly saw X as the main character. Had that series continued, I have no doubt we'd have seen similar improvements in X1-3, even if some of those improvements are actually Zero orientated. See, X3 is a rather odd title being all about the virus but not at all being about Zero. Much the same, X4 covers a lot of Zero's past, but ignores the virus. In my opinion, this needed to be addressed in the never-to-be-now remakes.
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Oh come on, guys. You know what I was trying to say. The canons of BN/SF and the other Mega Man series are separated, but nevertheless official. I was never trying to say BN was unofficial. That's retarded.
EDIT: Oh hey, I wonder why I didn't do this before:
:\ I do not like this ZX bashing, at all. Leave ZERO-ZX out of this anti-Zero vendetta of yours,
>>Zero X2 Theme<<
Man, I love listening to that theme. It's powerfully bombastic, really upbeat, and reeks of awesome, not unlike the fact that Zero returns to the series in X2 with a vengeance. He matches X shot for shot and brings in a dramatically new element to the series: the Z-saber. People thought Zero was cool in X1? He just got way cooler in X2, and he's here to stay. God, he's so cool.
As much as I loved the way he returned in X2, his glorious fanfare, nice redesign with new saber weapon, and a thrilling chance to fight him and all,
"Enjoyed" is probably a better word that "loved"
To cut a long story short, I don't really hate Zero, and I don't begrudge people for liking him so much and how he impacted the series.
Just sayin, guys.
Besides, they do even share concepts from time to time, and are all part of the greater Rockman mythos. For example, events in Battle Network 2 and Star Force explain those of Mega Man X5.
Please explain.
In terms of game development, the complete removal of Zero from the X-series would certainly have affected the plot and characters of Battle Network Transmission. Likewise, with the X-series plot steering into a different direction, the ultimate envisioned future of Mega Man Legends would not be as it is today. So certainly, if Zero did not exist, things would be different. But we're not talking about complete removal of the character, as you said. What we should instead focus on is on how to make the X-series more complete, without removing the values it has now.
Technically I'm not even talking about complete removal. Just removal starting from after X1.
Is the problem really the implementation of Zero and not instead the implementation of X? X himself was the focus of the first three games, but those titles did not have has much story presentation as the ones that came after. Had X been given 'equal' focus in those we'd still have the same Zero, but we'd have a deeper, more fleshed out story overall. To give focus back to X and ignore Zero wouldn't do the series much good either, it'd just be different, not better.
Along with overall better characterization of and more story for X, I'd take either "Zero dies for good" after X1 or "Zero sticks around as either a co-op sidekick or NPC". I'm ambivalent about whether to cut Zero's saber gameplay and make him a rough X clone (like Protoman is to Mega Man), keep it as is, improve/alter it somehow, or give it to X as is or altered somehow. Most people probably don't want Zero's saber gameplay from X4 on to change at all, but seeing as how we've got Mega Man Zero, I wouldn't miss it much. I might like to see X get a stronger one-or-two-hit saber like how Zero's worked in X3, but even that I'm not sure about.
That same, Maverick Hunter X did a superb job in taking what we had, and adding to it. For once we truly saw X as the main character. Had that series continued, I have no doubt we'd have seen similar improvements in X1-3, even if some of those improvements are actually Zero orientated. See, X3 is a rather odd title being all about the virus but not at all being about Zero. Much the same, X4 covers a lot of Zero's past, but ignores the virus. In my opinion, this needed to be addressed in the never-to-be-now remakes.
Incoming Whiny MHX Tirade WARNING WARNING
Having watched a playthrough of MHX, I wouldn't call the final product a "superb" job of adding to what was already there, because X just sounds like an idiot and a mindless killer most of the time, constantly repeating how everyone's a Maverick. Also, he's apparently a really gullible git. Who walks up to somebody in a mech when you can still clearly see the guy's hands on the levers? Dolt. And why was Vile such a pushover? It's like the fight against CF-0 at the beginning of X2. It's supposed to be this GIANT MECH and he goes down with like 3 charged shots. Easily placed ones too. I preferred the unwinnable fight against a mech suit twice your size from X1. At least then X goes down because he's overpowered, not because he's a moron.
The only time I thought the script really could've shined were X's exchanges with Storm Eagle and Boomer Kuwanger. Most of the other Mavericks also had good dialogue and voices, with the exception of the obligatory flamboyantly gay hairstylist/curator character in Launch Octopus. Other nitpicks include how Mark Gatha growls every time he reaches his third charge level, the unimpressive look of the upgraded buster shot (is there a name for that?), and switching the extremely memorable rematch with Vile from the first Sigma Stage to the third stage. I could understand how the director might've thought that would've been more appropriate, especially since they also wanted to promote Vile's eminence in the bad-guy hierarchy a little more, but some of the little things that made that scene really awesome were lost in the transition, like X's rematch with the mech (where maybe he could've visibly damaged the mech this time if he gets the buster upgrade beforehand, or used a specific Maverick weapon) and how Zero blows his containment pod before leaping onto the Ride Armor's back. Yeah, I didn't really mind Zero looking cool then, and I would've minded it even less if the game made me feel like X has gotten at least as strong enough to peel the paint off of Vile's mech. Or cause some smoke or something. Vile could still win before getting his mech trashed, but you know.
The story really could've come to a head with the exchange between X and Sigma, but I felt it was cut short and drowned out by GATHA'S ABRUPTLY LOUD YELLING. I think I have more of a problem with the voice direction that I do with Gatha's talent, since I appreciated his performance in X8 a bit better, but even in Command Mission I didn't really like his vocal delivery that much, so Gatha = 1, Voice Director = ???. Voice talent aside, it didn't really seem like a dramatic climax in the conflict between X and Sigma's characters so much as a loud buildup to what everyone was expecting anyways: a final boss battle. And this is after just listening to X crying havoc Maverick all the time. I don't have a problem with being angry, but I wasn't at all convinced by either Gatha's performance or the script. I just wasn't impressed.
WEAPON GET or ... something. I dunno
Speaking of X3's virus, that's another thing that I think should be rewritten. Rather than treating the virus like a legitimate threat and explanation for Mavericks, the virus should've just been a propaganda scheme perpetrated by Doppler. Makes a lot more sense and makes a better story.
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YES
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YES
WHY
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Because I like Zero...s'all. I don't need to express myself in a wall of text.
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because X just sounds like an idiot and a mindless killer most of the time, constantly repeating how everyone's a Maverick.
...it's been a while since I played MHX, but IIRC all of the Mavericks were clearly, well, Mavericks. And X does try to avoid fighting quite a few of them before they declare that they're obeying Sigma no matter what.
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Because I like Zero...s'all. I don't need to express myself in a wall of text.
Point taken. A sentence or two to carry the conversation would've done fine, but a one-word response kinda asks to be poked fun at.
I liked him until he became popular enough to warrant two series starring, well, him. Now I'm just a little tired of how cool he is and want to have X actively compete for my interest. Plus I miss firing off double shots and getting armor upgrades to sweet SNES tunes.
...it's been a while since I played MHX, but IIRC all of the Mavericks were clearly, well, Mavericks. And X does try to avoid fighting quite a few of them before they declare that they're obeying Sigma no matter what.
My problem with that is what could've been decent glimpses of the relationships X had with these Mavericks are too quickly brushed aside to get to the fight. I don't normally like large sequences of text interspersed too frequently in my fighting game, but these were different. Look at Storm Eagle. You don't even really know why he's fighting X, and once the fight's over, there's no meaningful after-dialogue about why Storm did what he did. Spark Mandrill proposes that X is wrong about what he's doing, but nothing comes of that. Apparently Boomer Kuwanger and X were good friends, and that's the last we hear of that. These were titillating glimpses of character in the classic, memorable, but otherwise throwaway bosses from X1, and I felt like a little more could've been done with that to develop X's character, taking us for a ride in his psyche and the emotions he's supposed to experience--as the first of his kind to do that, but the only one who could supposedly think more deeply about than anyone else.
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I wouldn't put too much stuff in the conversations with the bosses. Even in the ZERO-games they've always been unimportant snippets, that needed to be quick and short in anticipation of the battle.
You're right, though, in that MHX did make several changes in presentation compared to X1 for the worse. Some of those can be chalked up to taste, though.. Removing the containment capsule streamlines the scene, if you ask me. But VAVA not being completely immune to any damage really diminishes the point of these battles. It's nice thing to play around with in a newgame+ sort of thing, but not for the first playthrough.
What I'm instead referring to when I speak of a superb job focusing on X, are the scenes with Dr. Right from Day of Sigma and the ending, as well as a consistent mention of X's limitless evolutionary potential.
Anyway, what I was getting at before is that you should see both the original and remake as complementary resources. They're not mutually exclusive; together they make the whole of the story. It would be best if any changes for the remake contradicted with the original as little as possible. So really, let's not rewrite the whole thing just because you think the story should have gone differently. That would be a different story, not the one we came to love. Think instead of how we could keep it the same, but more streamlined and expanded in the right direction.
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It sounds like what you're asking of me is to rewrite the X series without rewriting it. Zen koan'd!
What I would want is to incorporate some or most of those important, memorable elements from the original series--the stuff that didn't suck or failed to make sense--and better present it in a new way. It would capture some of the memorable feelings of those games, referencing them in a way, but encapsulating them in a new experience. For example, reusing the Variable X theme for X at key points in the remade franchise. Or using the ending and credits theme from X1 in the corollary remake. I want to build for a similar nostalgic feeling, but with a new story. It'll be up to the fans to decide whether they like it or not, so I'd better do my best to do what I want and make something people will enjoy and warm up to.
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Well, Variable X WAS used in X6 when you find Zero... In a more upbeat tone. Which was kinda neat, since it was paralleling his death in X1, but this time with the opposite.
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Although the implication there was that it was Zero's theme...
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Same might be said of the American intro for X5, although that could go either way.
No, I meant using the Variable X theme to mark some dramatic moment or action in X's progress as a Maverick Hunter or as a person, rather than it being typecast into Zero's death theme. Some people have argued that the theme belongs to scenes with both X and Zero, but in wanting to emphasize X more, and in lieu of a defined theme for him that persists across different games/series, I'd rather it belong more to X than Zero. Perhaps it could refer to X while coincidentally involving Zero in the given scene, but all the same I'd like it to hold to its original name.
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I've always seen that track named "demo", never Variable X, in any of the official OSTs. I've always associated the theme with Zero myself.
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Evidently, it was the name for the track in the Capcom Music Generations compilation of X1-X6. Even when it's attributed to Zero: http://www.youtube.com/results?search_type=search_videos&search_query=variable+x&search_sort=relevance&search_category=0&page=
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The X1-6 OST clearly labels it Demo. Variable X just seems like a fan-given name.
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Thats funny. Is that video where the "Variable X" name comes from? I always thought it was called Variable X.
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The OSTation does seem to be the only place where you see it. Wherever they got it from, this is what they have to say about it:
NOTE: This is X's theme, which was rehashed as both Zero's Return and Zero's Death scene theme for Mega Man X6 and Mega Man Maverick Hunter X respectively, which has caused a lot of confusion over the years. This was done mostly due to the fact that the theme didn't serve the purpose it did in Mega Man X where X is still discovering his potential and seems to be insecure of this. Maverick Hunter X sees a rather optimistic X thus making the theme's original purpose obsolete.
If you think about it, it makes sense. Zero's theme already plays out when he saves X those two times in Mega Man X, and when X expresses his discouragement in his own abilities after being beaten by Vile, that theme starts playing. Zero gives him the uplifting pep talk, wherein he says X may grow as strong as he is some day, and they both continue their respective missions. This plays again when Zero is dying, but like the first scene of the game where he appears, he again talks about how much X has grown, and "maybe [he] can defeat Sigma." This galvanizes both X and the player to realize their true potentials, defeat Sigma, and beat the game. The way it's used makes the intent of the theme pretty clear, even though most remember it for when Zero dies, and so it gets typecast as Zero's death theme.
Then again, you could also argue that the theme is meant to accent and accompany the camaraderie these two hunters share, and given how it's used throughout the rest of the series, it clearly gets associated with that definition: the American intro to X5 basically sets up how that camaraderie will be tested once again, and the same theme accents Zero's reuniting with X in X6. However in Xtreme's intro, it plays that theme while showing and talking about X, and then switches to Zero's X1 theme when showing him, so there's that too.
There's elements of both purposes in that one song as it's used throughout the series, and if we're going by game count, it's 3 to 2, but I prefer the name and associated intention of Variable X. That's just me.
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2 months since last post, but it's not like much gets posted around here anyways...
I think Zero plays a huge part of the problem surrounding X's character development, but he himself is not the problem. Personally, I think the biggest problem is either:
A) the result of different interpretations of X's character (I can't prove this)
B) the lack of a developed personality X is supposed to progress towards in the first place
At first in X1, Zero is what X is supposed to become. Then in X2, he comes back, so obviously they're going to have to distinguish between two characters with defining differences. However, this contradicts the point of the first game: to become like Zero. The solution? Have X gain SOME Zero-like qualities post-X1, but not all of them. For starters, X has always been about pacifism, while Zero is about business. X pre-X1 is naive and way too idealistic, so if not in after X1, then at least throughout the series, X becomes more realistic with fighting Mavericks, but not to the point he forgets his ideals (or maybe even lose them only to regain them again).
The SNES games did this right because, back in the days, it was mostly "show, don't tell". Seeing how they had little dialogue and centered on a guy who singlehandedly took out armies of Mavericks and their badass commander Sigma, you'd think the guy have some spine and a little hardened personality, right? In X2, X starts off the story as THE 17th commander (originally Sigma): he's starting to become badass, and even the X-Hunters know not to underestimate the person who fell Sigma in X1. In X3, Doppler too does not underestimate X based on the last 2 games. Basically, even in the little dialogue that was given, X was portrayed as someone to be reckoned with, so naturally he had a cool factor, even with Zero right next to him.
Sadly, with technological advancements, when they weren't spending all their cutscene budget/story time on Zero, the devs decided they wanted to flesh out X's naivety because they couldn't the last 3 games. Unfortunately, it's now already the fourth+ installment. You could say that, after X1, X wasn't even developing as a character anymore: he just became a static, idealistic nice guy that contrasted with badass, straight-to-business Zero. Anything X accomplished was pretty much forgotten and everyone just treated him as "some hunter". You'd think after stopping 3+ wars, people would give the guy some respect? On top of that, X4~X6 decided to focus on Zero's origin story, while X7~X8 were dedicated to Axl's origin story. So in other words, after the SNES trilogy, X got completely shafted in terms of plot development.
Mega Man wasn't ever really much about storyline, but I always believed a game could still have a good story and memorable characters through show, don't tell. If Samus could do it, why not X? Instead, the writers decided to simply stick to what's already established rather than possibly changing X for the better.
If I could change things, what would I do? For starters, give X more badass time post-X3, the guy looks like a pussy until the Zero series when he's "dead". It's fine if he's naive here and there, but at least SHOW that X eventually becomes more realistic and experienced as a war veteran. It shouldn't take X7 for him to figure it out that maybe talking can't fix everything and that innocent civilians are dying while he sits at base doing nothing. Thankfully, X8 didn't suffer this nonsense.
With Zero returning in X2, ideally the series would focus on their development as partners: what one lacks, they gradually gain by learning from the other. X learns to be realistic from Zero, but Zero learns to understand that there's more to just slicing up the bad guys. And if introducing Axl is such a necessity, at least introduce him during a point where X is also a respectable badass who eats Sigmas for breakfast.
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X8 was a pretty good X portrayal.
But so was X6. X5 was here and there, it was ok, but X6 I think, is definitely one of X's best characterizations. No nonsense hunter, hardened by the events of X5, with a sharper look to his eyes, and carrying Zero's saber.
I'd say post SNES, X wasnt TOO bad, X4 he was a bit too naive, but he wasnt stupid naive. Just well, yknow, trying to put the brakes on a war between peacekeepers that was started over misconceptions, before the casualties start mounting on either side. While naive to think The Repliforce would just lay their weapons down, you cant blame him for trying.
X5 he was pretty good, had his innocence, but didnt want to waste time when he was on a timer, and therefore had to be a little less idealistic and a bit more... aggressive? Not quite sure how else to describe it. he wasnt taking any nonsense, or at least trying not to.
X6 I mentioned already, and X8 too. he was straightforward with Maverick Hunting, not letting his ideals get in the way of what he knows is the only way to them in the first place. (except for when enemies play mind games with him)
it's X7 that just came right the [tornado fang] out of nowhere, and was never mentioned again. Big Lipped Wheel Gator moment indeed.
Even Command Mission had pretty good characterization for X, although not changing facial expressions kind of didnt help too much. (but Gatha's wonderful acting more than makes up for it. "YOU... YOU... MAVERICK!!!" )