RockmanPM Forums
Other Things => Gaming => Topic started by: LightningKitsune on January 04, 2010, 08:09:09 PM
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I'm on a roll folks.
OKAY. SO. Metroid. The series, characters, etc.
Discuss.
Also I'm gonna say it now. [tornado fang]ing Meta Ridley.
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"The Last Metroid is in captivity. The Galaxy is at peace..."
Posting my 100% run, because I'm so lazy~ >U< (http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=D755396F6D7201BC)
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Also I'm gonna say it now. [tornado fang]ing Meta Ridley.
I loved the first battle with him in MP3. That [parasitic bomb] was awesome.
I liked MP1 best. I have trillogy, so ive got the Wii controls. i must say, they make P1 a lot easier I think. (especially with the Morphball jump making the ball puzzles easier)
Dont like MP2 much for some reason- and 3 is pretty cool too.
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MP3 was the only Metroid game to not have an underwater section.
Except the first one, but that hardly counts...
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Was Prime Pinball underwater at any point?
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Was Metroid 2?
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Brilliant series. I can't decide between Super and Prime as my favorite, but I love pretty much all of them (except the original and Return of Samus... o-O).
And I still can't mockball for my life.
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You know, Chozo ghosts always seem to scare the [parasitic bomb] outta me for some reason. when you walk in the room and it goes dark and quiet for a second before the music starts up, then the ghosts appear, that part is freaky.
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Super Metroid and Zero Mission are my favourites of the series, by far.
As for the Prime games... well, the first one is my favourite of the bunch. Prime 2 had it's moments, but I wasn't fond of the ammo count in any way or form. The third one was too much on the linear side.
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I liked MP1 best. I have trillogy, so ive got the Wii controls. i must say, they make P1 a lot easier I think. (especially with the Morphball jump making the ball puzzles easier).
Just a little stupid fact, they [tornado fang]'d up the Wii port of MP1's Graphics when porting Wii Controls over. The little things that the Ice and Plasma Beam do (Ice has mist come off of it and freezes when charged, and Plasma has embers come off of it.) Are missing. But that doesn't really matter when you can still enjoy awesome new control scheme.
Come to think of it, I actually own EVERY Metroid game (Save Pinball and Hunters, along with a copy of the original (But I have it on Zero Mission anyway, so meh.).)
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Super Metroid is easily my favourite.. and dare I say it, I liked Prime 3 more than Prime 1.
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Super Metroid and Zero Mission are my favourites of the series, by far.
As for the Prime games... well, the first one is my favourite of the bunch. Prime 2 had it's moments, but I wasn't fond of the ammo count in any way or form. The third one was too much on the linear side.
Agreed. NONE of the other games so far had an ammo count with the beams. Why just this one? (Unless I'm missing something.)
I managed to grab the 75% ending on Prime 1, only because there were a few scans I missed...
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Was Metroid 2?
I think Metroid 2 had little pools of water, and there were big regions full of magma you could dive into until you beat enough Metroids.
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I managed to grab the 75% ending on Prime 1, only because there were a few scans I missed...
You missed Items, because Prime doesn't give endings based on scans.
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Metroid Prime 2 has a much better beam system than the other Prime games because you actually have a reason to switch weapons. A reason which doesn't involve those damn doors. If I opened you once, I'm still going to be capable of opening you next time I'm back. Just stay blue instead of wasting my time, srsly.
If you disagree with me you are wrong and also probably a communist.
PS if the only reason you don't like ammo in the game is because previous Metroid games have not had ammo you are a double communist.
I liked MP1 best. I have trillogy, so ive got the Wii controls. i must say, they make P1 a lot easier I think. (especially with the Morphball jump making the ball puzzles easier)
spiderballguardian.jpg
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Wasnt the spiderball guardian Thardus..? I dont remember now.
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This series is damn amazing. That said, I seem to have a thing for the dark horse in the legacy, Prime 2. Something about that game really caught me and won't let go. While I do share a few criticisms with those who have them against certain things in the game, it's currently tied with Super Metroid as my favorite Metroid game.
Wasnt the spiderball guardian Thardus..? I dont remember now.
He's talking about the actual guardian boss from Prime 2 here. I actually really liked that one myself. XD
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Looking VERY forward to Other M.
I could never get into the Prime games. If nothing else, they, along with pretty much every other FPS now-a-days, only succeed in making me sick.
Hopefully, Sakamoto, his dudes and Team Ninja can stand to deliver. Been far too long since Samus and I got together. 8)
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Would be nice to know how they got Ridley onto the B.S.L.
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Wasnt the spiderball guardian Thardus..? I dont remember now.
I'm not talking about that Spider Ball guardian, I'm talking about the Spider Ball Guardian. Who is also a Spider Ball guardian.
God damn Metroid is deep.
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The one in MP2, in the tiny arena with the acidic air(?) and the boss bouncing all over the [tornado fang]ing place being all LOLOLOLO YOU CANT HIT ME BUT I CAN HIT YOU like an [dark hold]. I hated that boss so much on hard mode.
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That's the Boost Ball Guardian.
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The one in MP2, in the tiny arena with the acidic air(?)
congrats, you've just described all of dark aether until you get the light suit.
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Most of the boss arenas aren't tiny.
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Metroid Prime 2 has a much better beam system than the other Prime games because you actually have a reason to switch weapons. A reason which doesn't involve those damn doors. If I opened you once, I'm still going to be capable of opening you next time I'm back. Just stay blue instead of wasting my time, srsly.
I still fail to see the point in having an Ice door followed by a Plasma (Or Wave) Door, In the same Hallway. Theres almost no Blue Doors later in the game.
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Originally, I've said I liked Prime 3 more than Prime 1. But after giving it more thought, I like sequence breaking too much. So Prime 1 wins that fight for me. I still prefer both over 2, though.
As for favorite Metroid period, Zero Mission. Super at a distant second.
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I still want a game after Fusion. After all, Samus just blew a federation conspiracy and space station sky high, with the help of a military mind which knows many secrets of the federation, They arent going to be exactly happy with her. Actually, they are most likely going to try to kill her.
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Well, we've got Other M coming soon. (Which takes place between Super Metroid and Metroid Fusion) So maybe something after that?
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Stop me if anybody's already asked this question, but why did the Metroid series undergo a major hiatus during the N64 and GBC era?
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If memory serves, Prime 1 was going to be for the N64. Other than that, idk.
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They didn't know how to translate the series into 3D. Miyamoto was the one who suggested first person when Retro started developing Prime for the Cube.
Edit: Source. (http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php?story=16389)
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That's the Boost Ball Guardian.
Oh yeah. The spider ball guardian just rolled around on a track. That one was kind of fun, honestly...
My bad.
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They didn't know how to translate the series into 3D. Miyamoto was the one who suggested first person when Retro started developing Prime for the Cube.
Edit: Source. (http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php?story=16389)
Miyamoto suggested First Person?
Expect that new LoZ to do much the same.
Really, though, the hardest parts about translating Metroid to 3D would be managing enemy swarms and how the player would see where the heck Samus is going/jumping to. They got the latter down well, but the former still needs work. Thus I think why Metroid: Other M will shift between Third and First Person.
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I still want a game after Fusion. After all, Samus just blew a federation conspiracy and space station sky high, with the help of a military mind which knows many secrets of the federation, They arent going to be exactly happy with her. Actually, they are most likely going to try to kill her.
Some would, some wouldn't.
Assuming the likes of Keaton (read the manga, boys and girls, its canon) are still in charge, Samus still would likely have more than a couple of people who would be ready to be at her aid, even if some generic, "corrupted military personnel" are after her hide. Probably in interest of keeping her alive, because of the Metroid in DNA, if nothing else.
What I think would be interesting to see, though, is if she may be forced to make some rather interesting partners as a result of her being forced on the run. Imagine if things worked out, such that she and Ridley are forced to work together, for instance! 8D
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Well, we've got Other M coming soon. (Which takes place between Super Metroid and Metroid Fusion)
It does? When was this said?
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It does? When was this said?
Sakamoto said himself in the 1up interview back around E3?
1UP: So is this being positioned as a spinoff game? Or is it really the next game in the series -- Metroid 5?
YS: It's part of the flow, storywise, between Super Metroid and Fusion.
- http://www.1up.com/do/previewPage?pager.offset=1&cId=3174587&p=44
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Ahhh, okay. Awesome to hear then.
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It does? When was this said?
*gives PB ZEE UPPERCUT!!*
How the F*@#!!! did you forget the awesome M3 Mother Brain image during the trailer?
I still want a game after Fusion.
Will never happen unless somebody has the sense to restore the Power Suit. Fusion Suit blows, that's the way it is. You can't tell me someone in Big N doesn't realize that when all involved with Metroid have collectively abandoned it for 5 games now; going on 6 with Other M.
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I doubt the suit has anything to do with it.
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*gives PB ZEE UPPERCUT!!*
How the F*@#!!! did you forget the awesome M3 Mother Brain image during the trailer?
I focused on the gameplay too much?
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Fusion Suit blows, that's the way it is.
Get the [tornado fang] off this forum, you [tornado fang]ing piece of [parasitic bomb].
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Get the [tornado fang] off this forum, you [tornado fang]ing piece of [parasitic bomb].
Whoa whoa WHOA. No. Just no.
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while I have to agree I dont like the Fusion suit all too much, Its not THAT bad, its just different since were used to having Bulky armor on Samus. Although I agree I dont really like it too much.
*in b4 Hitomi*
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I honestly don't care about what the suit looks like.
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To me, the Fusion Suit was more a victim of it being in the position it is in. It's introduced in a game that's technically so far off in the timeline (to the area in the canon which has not been touched on yet), that for right now, it can be "conveniently" ignored. They'll have to deal with it by the time they're actually willing to CROSS that bridge (or maybe we might get it as secret costume in Other M!).
I didn't have much of a problem with the suit. It's sleeker, and just does a lot to flow with some one who's basically a Space Assassin. I just wished it could have been that Orange and Yellow you see at the end all the way through, instead of starting with blue. Blue is not really a "Samus" color, in my eyes. 8D
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(or maybe we might get it as secret costume in Other M!).
...didn't they do that in Prime 1?
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yes, and it was awesome.
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You all know my opinion on Samus' suits ^^
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Blue is not really a "Samus" color, in my eyes. 8D
Still better than the varia's dirty yellow and maroon, though.
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Red and Yellow/Orange has always been what I've established as being Samus's "colors". It's like Mario to his Red n Blue and Link to his Green. You see those characters associated with those colors, and you just get used to it.
The Blue was the main thing I didn't care for when it came to the Fusion suit. It makes it seem like she's trying to be Rockman. 8D
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It makes it seem like she's wearing a messed up fusion suit over a yellow power suit.
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Well, the second upgrade got it to a nasty green and purple. But that wasn't really all that Bad. I mean, it was orange at the very end...
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Red and Yellow/Orange has always been what I've established as being Samus's "colors".
That doesn't make it look any less ugly.
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Those colors only really work on the actual power/varia suit. On the fsion suit... Not so much. I preferred it over the blue and yellow, but it still looked weird.
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Considering you already jumped from the "traditional" yellow/red/orange scheme into purple, not to mention your first game appearance included green hair, I don't think color limits are too strict. Samus can be whatever color she wants. If anything a previously unseen suit color makes the Fusion Suit a little easier to swallow, at least then it feels more original. By the end of the game, you're orange-over-yellow, which gives me the impression that the suit design is pretending to be something it isn't. Of course, with fighting your fully powered self the whole damn way, pretty much the entire game gave me that vibe.
Blue is if anything the most pleasant of its colors for me. I just think that, color irrelevant, the Fusion Suit looks like a sack of alien pond scum. Granted, competing with the Varia Suit design is one hell of an uphill battle.
Get the [tornado fang] off this forum, you [tornado fang]ing piece of [parasitic bomb].
Blows.
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In other news, wasn't the Phazon Suit badass?
Until MP pulled a tentacle [twin slasher] and stole it.
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You all know my opinion on Samus' suits ^^
The less the better? 8D
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In other news, wasn't the Phazon Suit badass?
Until MP pulled a tentacle [twin slasher] and stole it.
It WAS badass. I loved it. Then Metroid Prime stole it. >:[
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Hence, tentacle [twin slasher]. owob
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Function over form.
Besides that, the Chozo were bird-like; remember, their aesthetics would be different from ours.
So Samus' fearsome ultimate armor would have a cat tail and ears. >U<
Stealth, climbing up walls, falling from great heights unscathed, etc.
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The less the better? 8D
Or at least less clunky >w<
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Or at least less clunky >w<
I see what you mean, Zero Suit Cephi!
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Function over form.
Besides that, the Chozo were bird-like; remember, their aesthetics would be different from ours.
So Samus' fearsome ultimate armor would have a cat tail and ears. >U<
Stealth, climbing up walls, falling from great heights unscathed, etc.
Cat ears and tail?
Chozos were birds.
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Cat ears and tail?
Chozos were birds.
And what is the ultimate bird predator?
(In terms of cliche's, anyway.)
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Something I just remembered to mention in regards to Other M, is it just me or does it look like the coalition of Team Ninja & SPD1 are trying to make Samus truer to the acrobatic side of her nature with the amount of insane looking jumps and handling we saw in the trailer?
I'm seriously looking forward to that, especially if Super Metroid is their benchmark. *o*
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And what is the ultimate bird predator?
(In terms of cliche's, anyway.)
hawks
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MOVING ON.
Prime Trilogy with the Wiimote. Hard?
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Prime Trilogy with the Wiimote. Hard?
Not really
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MOVING ON.
Prime Trilogy with the Wiimote. Hard?
You ever played the Wii version of RE4?
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MOVING ON.
Prime Trilogy with the Wiimote. Hard?
[acid burst] easy. My first death in P1 was the Omega Pirate in the Phazon mines. And I THINK he was my last too.
P2.. havent gotten far in yet.
P3... dont remember.
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MOVING ON.
Prime Trilogy with the Wiimote. Hard?
you're kidding, right?
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[acid burst] easy. My first death in P1 was the Omega Pirate in the Phazon mines. And I THINK he was my last too.
P2.. havent gotten far in yet.
P3... dont remember.
I haven't died yet. I had to reset on Omega Pirate 3 times (Because I kept getting my Lock-On Focused on the Troopers instead of the Omega Pirate.). But I noticed you can't skip cutscenes this time around. Real [tornado fang]ing annoying.
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You guys are at least playing on hard, right?
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I'm actually planning on going through MP1 and Maybe MP2 on Veteran, then If I'm still Intrested MP3. And Hypermode when I'm ready to take a beating (Though MP1 and 3 wont be so bad in that aspect... Maybe... MP2 will be hell.)
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Using the name "Hypermode" for the higher difficulty of MP3 is such a cock-tease. I hear it and I envision a whole-game-Phaaze-mechanics mode.
Oh well, that's why we have WiiRD. 8)
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Yeah, they made 1 and 2 easier in Trilogy. The normal modes in those game are now new easier modes, the Veteran modes are the old normals, and Hypermode is the old hard mode. And the Jumpball breaks several puzzles.
3 I don't know about. I assume not much has changed difficulty wise. All I know is you can't sequence break it at all. So I didn't even try it out.
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Time to breathe some life into this.
Which of the games do you feel had the best/worse soundtrack?
Best for me would probably be Chozo Ruins from Prime 1. I love it.
Worse? Hard to say.
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Best, Prime 1.
Worst, Echoes, but not as a whole, I just hate the Temple Grounds theme. It's so out of place.
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Best: Super Metroid
My favourite song of the game would probably be the Brinstar Swamp theme (the red-ish area), or Lower Norfair.
Worst: Echoes I guess, but I haven't gotten very far to really judge it's soundtrack too much.
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Best, Prime 1.
Worst, Echoes, but not as a whole, I just hate the Temple Grounds theme. It's so out of place.
right, saying it's the worst because of a single music track. smooth.
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I honestly don't see how a single track can make the entire soundtrack complete crap.
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That's why I said not as a whole, and just picked the only track in the series that I truly hate. ::) I don't think it's a very inspired soundtrack regardless.
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Metroid and Super were the only games with decent soundtracks. The rest of the series tends to have pretty forgettable music. Except Sector 1 and Dark Samus, I guess. Those were cool.
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I'm gonna say right now.
Quadraxis = Coolest [tornado fang]ing theme in history.
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My favorite Metroid is Super, but rivalled by the first Prime.
Zero Mission and Echoes are honorary mentions, since I enjoy them more than any other Metroid, save my favs.
Echoes seems to be disliked most...strange, I found that game 10 million times more fun than corruption.
Corruption was boring, and easy. there was some good music tho, and it does have the best cutscenes in MP.
but seriously people, Emperor Ing Battle 2 or GTFO.
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I love Echoes. I think the Prime trilogy is top notch as a whole. I just think Echoes takes too long to finally pick up. I only start having fun when I fight Chykka. Up until then it's all about finding Prime 1 rehash powers and yelling at Dark Aether. But by the time I reach Sanctuary Fortress, I forget about any previous inconvenience.
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Prime 1 is my favorite of the 3, personally. Followed by 2, then 3. I would've liked 3 better if the difficulty had been more balanced; Normal is a damn cakewalk, and Veteran jumps up to controller-throwing difficulty. I was hoping they'd do something about that in Trilogy, but alas.
As far as music is concerned, I'm not really a big fan of Metroid music in general. The Edge of Phendrana kicks ass, though.
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Played and finished Prime 1.
Played Prime 2 up till the Emperor Ing.
Never touched Prime 3.
Should I get the trilogy?
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That's why I said not as a whole, and just picked the only track in the series that I truly hate. ::) I don't think it's a very inspired soundtrack regardless.
The maridia remix says [tornado fang] you.
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I would've liked 3 better if the difficulty had been more balanced; Normal is a damn cakewalk, and Veteran jumps up to controller-throwing difficulty.
I didn't notice any huge difference. The gaps between Normal and Veteran, and Veteran and Hypermode, seemed about right.
Should I get the trilogy?
I don't know if you're the collecting type, but the game is now out of print.
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Well that's too bad. Then it's just Prime 3. If it is... that is.
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I don't know if you're the collecting type, but the game is now out of print.
nice how i saw it on the shelf at my local HMV.
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I didn't notice any huge difference. The gaps between Normal and Veteran, and Veteran and Hypermode, seemed about right.
Every difficulty just comes down to using hypermode and being invincible anyway. You can't even avoid it, like every enemy uses hypermode when they see you so you need to use yours to kill them.
It's like they realised that the new controls made the shooting a lot more fun than the first two games, so they deliberately made the gameplay suck to balance it out.
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nice how i saw it on the shelf at my local HMV.
HMV's never really caught on here. However, Tim Horton's is growing in Manhattan. I tried their Hot Chocolate the other day. It was delicious!
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HMV?
Moving on. Would you want Meta Kraid in Prime 1 as opposed to Omega Pirate?
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HMV?
A CD, DVD and Video game store (mainly the first two). Most of them are only in Canada and the UK, but they are starting to appear in US apparently.
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I liked Prime 1's soundtrack as a whole really. I really like it's 'theme" best of the 3.
stage theme, hmm... The Chapel of the Elders, and the Artifact temple.
Worst? couldnt say. Haven't finished 2 and 3 yet.
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HMV's never really caught on here. However, Tim Horton's is growing in Manhattan. I tried their Hot Chocolate the other day. It was delicious!
It is pretty good, isn't it?
As for the collection, I've seen it at most Blockbusters I've been to. I know you guys have those in the US :P
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It is pretty good, isn't it?
As for the collection, I've seen it at most Blockbusters I've been to. I know you guys have those in the US :P
Yeah, I like that they use water instead of milk for their hot chocolate!
Also, hopefully Blockbusters won't be around for much longer, thanx to the glory of Netflix! XD
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There's very little of them I see anymore up here. Netflix is really dominating.
THAT'S enough of the off-topicness though.
Mother Brain from Super Metroid. Annoying or ANNOYING?
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Mother Brain from Super Metroid. Annoying or ANNOYING?
Neither
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Hi, my name is Hyper Beam. All my seizure-y goodness to [tornado fang] your [parasitic bomb] up.
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The only way I could see Mother Brain being a problem is if you're playing for lowest percent. Depending on what beams you picked, the first half would take forever. But no matter what, second half is as easy as [acid burst]. Just stay in the lower right corner, aim diagonally up, hold fire, Brain go boom.
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Interesting... Apparently, Trillogy is no longer being Published/Shipped. (http://coffeewithgames.blogspot.com/2010/01/metroid-prime-trilogy-no-longer-being.html)
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I just said that.
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Oh.
Oops.
Seems I missed that. My bad, Sato.
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Secondhand VG stores?
Pirating ahoy! Maybe Space Pirates are selling it to make a living. How else do you think they support their lifestyle? Merchandising!
Metroid the pillow! Metroid the Lunch box! Metroid the cereal! And a special item, Metroid the flamethrower!
God all I can picture now are two Space Pirates like in Spaceballs. owob
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Yknow, I suddenly remember the entries in P1 of the Space Pirates trying to reverse engineer the Power suit, And the entries of how they tried reverse engineering the Morphball... XD That was funny.
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Training Report, 07.200.08
Science Team believes the Metroids can be tamed. After several hours of trying, I believe Science Team has vapor for brains. I've lost two assistants to the wretched things.
Relevant.
Also [tornado fang]ing Meta Ridley. He was HARDER than Metroid Prime. I had all Energy Tanks and STILL got wasted. This is why God created the Wavebuster.
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I didnt think either was really all too challenging once you had their patterns down.
Lol, my hardest fight was Omega Pirate, because I... Forgot he was weak to super missile, and kept using the super wave beam. then after a game over or two, I tried super missile, and I remembered he was weak to missiles. I felt really stupid once he went down in a few hits.
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I nearly got killed by the alpha splinter once. That guy's a pain on hard.
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The Boost Ball boss from Echoes was pretty hard. Whatever it was called.
And the Alpha Blogg, thing. In fact now that I think about it Dark Samus caused me some difficulty; little did I know all I had to do was walk away from it's projectiles, not jump.
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The Boost Ball boss from Echoes was pretty hard. Whatever it was called.
..it was just called the "Boost Gaurdian"
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Boost Guardian is smalltime compared to Alpha Splinter. D:
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Not when you skip the Dark Suit and haven't gotten an early Power Bomb.
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Saying something is hard if you go out of your way to make things hard doesn't really mean much.
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No, that actually says quite a bit about the person breaking the sequence. It means they have a high tolerance of pain. Either that,or they're just plain crazy.
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Was Boost Guardian the one you fight entirely with the Morph Ball and there are no light beacons in the whole area?
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No and yes. The majority of the fight is in Morph Ball, but by no means should you stay in it the entire time. You need to whittle him down a bit with Light Beam too.
In fact, you can kill him without even having to morph. (http://www.metroid2002.com/echoes/boss_tricks_boost_guardian.php)
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Was Boost Guardian the one you fight entirely with the Morph Ball and there are no light beacons in the whole area?
you're thinkin of the spider ball guardian.
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Spider Guardian has no light beacons because you fight him in the Light World.
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yeah, well, it matches both of what he said.
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Ooh. Anyone else do the early Plasma Beam trick before going into Phazon Mines?
*raises paw*
It was my first priority BEFORE going into the mines.
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I didn't, all the more reason I dreaded the Mines first time through. Although I always dislike going through them, really.
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Ooh. Anyone else do the early Plasma Beam trick before going into Phazon Mines?
*raises paw*
It was my first priority BEFORE going into the mines.
You can't in Trilogy... Damn Bendizium Rock.
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you're thinkin of the spider ball guardian.
No, it was the Boost Guardian I was thinking of, dunno why I remember it being Morph Ball only *shrugs*
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You can't in Trilogy... Damn Bendizium Rock.
Incorrect. You can still get the Plasma Beam before you go into the Phazon Mines. You just need to go all the way to Phendrana's Edge to get a power bomb expansion before you hit up Geothermal Core. The bendezium rock was there in the original PAL version; it's harder to get the power bomb expansion you need in Trilogy, but not by much. Still entirely doable.
Edit: As an added bonus, you can also use that extra power bomb and the Plasma Beam to get to the X-ray Visor way before you're supposed to, and take out the cloaked drone that's guarding the main PB in five seconds flat with it.
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Nice.
I was reading on the Metroid wiki that it's possible to escape the Orpheon with the Varia Suit by killing Parasite Queen in a certain place.
Can we test this?
http://metroid.wikia.com/wiki/Orpheon - It's under "Trivia".
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Hmm... Interesting..
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Sounds like bullshit to me. It is a wiki after all.
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I've never heard about it, and at one point or another I've done -all- of the major sequence breaks in Metroid Prime.
Edit: That wiki is retarded anyway if I recall. Supported by this line: "Frigate Orpheon is the first of four space stations to be destroyed, followed by Oubliette, Ceres Space Colony, and the BSL Space Station."
Despite, you know, the fact that a frigate is not a [tornado fang]ing space station.
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Good point.
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Now that I think about it almost every Metroid boss leaves me with my hands hurting a little afterwards. Hunters was the worst at that. It didn't help that the bosses were more or less repeated / not that interesting.
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One word.
Thardus.
O:<
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One word.
Thardus.
O:<
I found him fun more than hard
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Thardus was rather easy.
theres a trick that can be exploited so that he can never hit you.
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Thardus is pretty damn easy. He just takes a while.
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Thardus is pretty damn easy. He just takes a while.
That's an understatement. XD
My hands were hurting after it was over.
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I found Thardus more entertaining in Trilogy.... I guess mainly because I could actually -aim.-
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Wow, Thardus was troublesome? Comments like that make me realize why Prime 3's bosses were so tame/toned down. XD
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I found Thardus more entertaining in Trilogy.... I guess mainly because I could actually -aim.-
this. really.
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Try as I might, I cannot give enough of a damn to go back to Prime Trilogy. I boot up Prime (currently in Phendrana Drifts--at the start) and I don't really care to continue. I've not started Prime 2, largely because I dislike that one for being dull (though the atmosphere and the slight fear you get from Dark Aether wasn't too bad. Seems to have relied on this too much since without it, the game's just not the same) and in Prime 3, I'm right before Meta-Ridley on the first world because I'm trying to get all the tokens here--again.
I'm thinking of maybe just selling it off to someone who may find more enjoyment than I'm giving it (it sits on the shelf collecting dust) and just rebuy Prime 3 since it's pretty cheap right now. Also, Uncharted 2 is taking precedence over it, but that's behind finishing up some other titles on my queue.
-
If you don't feel like you aren't going to play/don't want to, go ahead. Be sure you get a good price for it. XD
A question. What are your hopes for Other M?
-
What are your hopes for Other M?
They don't screw up tying it in with Fusion.
-
Isnt it supossed to be her early days? As in, when she was actually in the Federation?
-
It's between Super and Fusion.
-
Isnt it supossed to be her early days? As in, when she was actually in the Federation?
It has flashbacks I guess.
-
If you don't feel like you aren't going to play/don't want to, go ahead. Be sure you get a good price for it. XD
I don't think he was asking for your permission bro.
-
A question. What are your hopes for Other M?
To just be fun.
-
Agreed.
-
Maybe... to be not quite as hard as Ninja Gaiden 2
-
Maybe... to be not quite as hard as Ninja Gaiden 2
I'd be fine with something closer to NG2, considering the first NG is harder overall.
-
Well as long as they make it balanced hard and not unfair hard.
-
Relevant.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jluv2HxFEqs[/youtube]
-
Maybe... to be not quite as hard as Ninja Gaiden 2
insert that one time itagaki laughed at people complaining about how hard the first xbox ninja gaiden was.
-
Then expect it to be as hard if not harder. X(
Shocked at MP1's 100% ending when you had it. Yes or no?
-
No. I've become quite used to cliffhanger endings.
-
Shocked at MP1's 100% ending when you had it. Yes or no?
I've never beaten Prime 1. My reason is laziness to get the artifacts.
-
I've never beaten Prime 1. My reason is laziness to get the artifacts.
I can sympathize. I wish Samus could be all "Screw you, screw this planet, screw everything! I'm goin' back to bed."
-
I can sympathize. I wish Samus could be all "Screw you, screw this planet, screw everything! I'm goin' back to bed."
I just wish that she could walk a bit faster (but that's just me and my impatience). Anyways, on the subject of Prime Trilogy, I was making progress in Echoes the other day and [spoiler]I'm enjoying it more than Prime 1[/spoiler]
-
I need to grab a copy of 2. Hopefully I can find a Gamestop that'll carry one.
-
I have the first two Primes, plus the one for my beloved NES, but my Super Metroid has gone missing.
I am a sad.
-
I just wish that she could walk a bit faster
Roll more.
-
I love the Prime Trilogy, but I'm too busy with other games right now to even play it x__X
A question. What are your hopes for Other M?
To just be fun.
This, and also, story wise, to show why Adam's brain is worthy enough to be turned into a futuristic super computer >.>
-
Roll more.
Which reminds me that I wish we could do what Samus does in a cut-scene in MP3; instantly tuck into a ball to avoid gunfire.
But instead we get a pointless transform sequence that takes a vital full second to complete, during which you can't control your movement. Balls.
-
Haha, I JUST noticed in 3 that you can see Samus' Phazon corruption on her face when you have the scan visor equipped. (It reflects her face a bit, and she has like, these tendrils down the side next to her nose)
But I still never liked the PED suit much.
Also, I always found the fight with Meta Ridley in 3 to be possibly the best one in all 3 primes.
-
Also, I always found the fight with Meta Ridley in 3 to be possibly the best one in all 3 primes.
The one in Prime 2 was way better.
-
i particularly liked the part where he transforms into a jet
-
BOMB THE RUSSIANS
CRASH INTO THE SUN
NOW I'M DEAD
-
The one in Prime 2 was way better.
Since when was MR in Prime 2? Am I missing something?
-
He's being sarcastic.
-
Since when was MR in Prime 2? Am I missing something?
You are a dumbass.
good day sir.
-
Haha, I JUST noticed in 3 that you can see Samus' Phazon corruption on her face when you have the scan visor equipped. (It reflects her face a bit, and she has like, these tendrils down the side next to her nose)
I could've sworn those were cracks on the visor itself.
-
You are a dumbass.
good day sir.
You are a troll.
*puts "Don't feed the troll" sign up*
-
No, she's just brutally honest
-
*puts "Don't feed the troll" sign up*
You just did, dude.
-
You are a troll.
*puts "Don't feed the troll" sign up*
no, i'm just right.
-
You are a dumbass.
good day sir.
ssssshhhhh! don't tell him! 8D
-
I could've sworn those were cracks on the visor itself.
Cracks? she would be leaking air if they were cracks. Its phazon corruption.
-
True, plus I suppose it'd make no sense later on when you go into space on parts of the Valhalla. On the subject of Samus' face appearing through the Visor: For some reason the way her face looks through it in Prime 1 kinda freaks me out. She seems really bug-eyed.
-
Lol yeah.
At the 75% corruption level, she gets more tendrils down her face, and her sclera turn dark blue.
-
Japanese Metroid: Other M Website Up
http://metroid.jp/
She's saying in Japanese:
"A dream. It's as if I was watching a playback of a tragedy that really happened."
-
Lol yeah.
At the 75% corruption level, she gets more tendrils down her face, and her sclera turn dark blue.
Her pupils start glowing early on too. I think as early as 25%.
-
I believe so.
I love the "Terminal Corruption" game over cutscene.
-
I love the "Terminal Corruption" game over cutscene.
That's the one where she turns into Dark Samus, right? I can't remember since I think I only saw it once... after losing to Rundas >_>
-
Her pupils start glowing early on too. I think as early as 25%.
one of her pupils glows bright blue. (the other stays black)
-
Well, joined the wiki. Got rid of that BS about being in a certain place while fighting Parasite Queen allows you to keep your Varia. Also removed the places saying Orpheon was a Space Station. It's a Frigate. Get it? F-R-I-G-A-T-E.
::)
-
It's a Frigate. Got it memorized?
Fix'd.
Seriously though, I hope Other M turns out to be really awesome.
-
Well, graphically, it looks so. I hope the gameplay is good.
Also, SAMUS TALKS. OMG
-
you say that as if samus hasn't talked before. >.>
-
Not too much anyway. Barely.
-
Well, joined the wiki. Got rid of that BS about being in a certain place while fighting Parasite Queen allows you to keep your Varia. Also removed the places saying Orpheon was a Space Station. It's a Frigate. Get it? F-R-I-G-A-T-E.
::)
I tried editing that wiki once. Specifically, they've got some bullshit on there about how a "lotus milestone" mentioned in Prime 1 (the pirates were going to put Thardus on guard near it) had to be some kind of secret space pirate organization because it was capitalized. I pointed out in the article that a milestone is a [tornado fang]ing landmark; it was reverted within ten minutes and cited as "needless speculation."
Like I said, the people running that wiki are Retarded with a capital R.
-
I tried editing that wiki once. Specifically, they've got some bullshit on there about how a "lotus milestone" mentioned in Prime 1 (the pirates were going to put Thardus on guard near it) had to be some kind of secret space pirate organization because it was capitalized. I pointed out in the article that a milestone is a [tornado fang]ing landmark; it was reverted within ten minutes and cited as "needless speculation."
Like I said, the people running that wiki are Retarded with a capital R.
Or how bout when I mention in the Annihilator Beam article, I said how if you hack the game with a AR early and use it against Dark Samus in the first battle, you can defeat her really quickly. I was yelled at for "That's only your opinion." I even put a link to a video on it in his User page.
-
Well, joined the wiki.
Don't waste your time. Get out of there now before you get any dumber. I'm speaking from experience.
-
Care to share some? *grabs popcorn*
-
Metroid: Other M Screens since I got carried away and forgot about us having this thread:
(http://media.nintendo.com/nintendo/bin/1uWlnYoljp7ShXx3GSYw46yoU2kyoNUs/7ydABCaGXLYLWImTw00DmTHW0E9C1CEU.jpg)
(http://media.nintendo.com/nintendo/bin/FysYhPJOeCrt8xKTHNRaWGE3kL_zlskz/XhpUQ0Iki8Xr3tnc97NnEl4WWSr1AmWB.jpg)
(http://media.nintendo.com/nintendo/bin/KHAKWgjofldq0LNxmXPdwE3pF-vZHLwD/Dni1pIhlmdSP1Mm1XHjYt6TX2hkh0MZJ.jpg)
(http://media.nintendo.com/nintendo/bin/ZFuZogAUyNa884E8kalyWkdpOh2_5LV7/HTc2uG_rpxmHkEw6Hljmej9NLxkweo0z.jpg)
(http://media.nintendo.com/nintendo/bin/xw_fInbM52BndBH17kyPW4T72vDZouO2/qkRGXwo5u7eLUS34HOEDMNvklxFwFjE0.jpg)
(http://media.nintendo.com/nintendo/bin/yyjo-mVufMc57y32vlpdii3Nrj2HEjy8/a6l8hLwZA4SdpvpKyx0nUe3aM7_HSGa2.jpg)
(http://media.nintendo.com/nintendo/bin/kqVJ7QY1aWfObEmcGLUMeCPSTQNQRSWb/tYTys_-90m7j-5ulYT6N0cHyZl_1za-C.jpg)
(http://media.nintendo.com/nintendo/bin/LCbtWtjHDvg80h1lchCCwDvp6-ngsRIH/gex2r3j8dh55W-K-3ibATtQhkOMNljNU.jpg)
(http://media.nintendo.com/nintendo/bin/TN45ZzjLXzN-nXpkDKcPexkHlJoiqxXv/Xeo7UxDqGS-tGq6IOttVk_MyHkBnbvw0.jpg)
(http://media.nintendo.com/nintendo/bin/nbtBBgkBL28DF_sDQvo2YbRnckN504wE/xf_1unD_UvANHBSy_-YK2XYqqmj9lXct.jpg)
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Was I the one who reminded you?
Also, SWEET! Samus talks!
-
Wow. this thing is really switching between different viewpoints. Im curious as to how that works.
-
The premise sounds fantastic.
But I'll wait for one or two gameplay videos.
And E3 can't come soon enough.
-
Samus talks!
She's been talking since Super. |:
-
Well, actual sound speech. Voice recorded and stuff. I know about the text-only narrative of hers.
-
Well, actual sound speech. Voice recorded and stuff. I know about the text-only narrative of hers.
Again, Super.
-
Looking good so far. Be more than happy to spend time with Samus again for the first time since whenever Zero Mission came out.
-
Again, Super.
"The last metroid is in captivity"? I always assumed that was a narrator, sounded too male for Samus.
-
Yeah what. That's a male saying that, surely.
-
Kotaku's Hands On (http://kotaku.com/5479418/metroid-other-m-a-change-of-perspective)
Man, I am looking forward to this.
-
And here's IGN's. (http://wii.ign.com/articles/107/1071925p1.html)
I wasn't hyped much before, but now I can't wait for June 8)
...and I still really need to finish Prime 1 and 3.
-
Space pirates look so colorful.
-
I can't wait for Samus' realistic bounce physics
-
Space pirates look so colorful.
The first and Super weren't exactly devoid of colour if you look closely, even for their atmosphere.
Though considering the technology at the time it was perhaps only because they couldn't afford to much else. I don't know.
-
Space pirates look so colorful.
(http://img186.imageshack.us/img186/7751/arrrrd.jpg)
That dog be bright red and teal, yo.
ps more cutscenes that exactly what i felt metroid needed
and even more words that's what i play games for thanks guys
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There's a few details I'm not thrilled about, such as auto-lock on firing, which Destructoid mentioned is prone to spamming to clear out whole rooms with minimal effort. If anything, I'm more interested in the story itself than the gameplay right now. Maybe I just need to see more of it in motion that what we got from E3, but so far, the game's not really popping for me.
-
ps more cutscenes that exactly what i felt metroid needed
and even more words that's what i play games for thanks guys
I posses an untempered hatred for people who sigh and mash the buttons repeatedly in a cutscene just to get through it because they have no care for plot or exposition.
-
I would rather hate the games that don't let you skip story scenes at all.
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I posses an untempered hatred for people who sigh and mash the buttons repeatedly in a cutscene just to get through it because they have no care for plot or exposition.
Hating people for wanting to play games.
Pretty reasonable, bro.
-
There's playing and there's appreciating.
-
Oh, so you hate people who play games but just don't appreciate them like you do?
Let's hope Vixy introduces a "Most Pretentious Gamer" award this year. You'd be set.
-
Drop it, you two.
-
Samus doesn't really sound too good during the intro, does she? She's like a robot or something, just monotoning it up. Kinda makes me wonder why they changed voices. Y'think she's gonna be this bad for the whole game?
Also also they seriously need to drop this whole zero suit fanservice thing. [parasitic bomb]'s just embarrassing tbh. :/
-
Zero Suit's nice and all, but I'm sick of it. Girl's gotta show some skin and let her hair down.
-
Zero Suit makes sense if Samus is in a situation where she wants to keep her Power Suit at the ready. There's no reason it can't co-exist with a more casual outfit for her (see Metroid Zero Mission's various endings).
-
For those that haven't seen the leaked intro to Other M. Metroid Database has it. (http://www.metroid-database.com/)
Samus is SOOOO gorgeous~ :-[
-
At least the Power Suit looks less like it's made of plastic there than it does in all the screenshots I've seen.
-
Well, it shouldn't, seeings how that's all pre-rendered footage. I don't recall how the more recent in-game screenshots looked, though.
-
Is it just me, or has Samus got sum hips?
Also, a mole under the lip... yep. 8D
-
She looks less like a Japanese schoolgirl in this, which is at least an improvement.
-
Japanese schoolgirl ... improvement.
:getout:
-
Lolwhat? she looked like a japanese schoolgirl?
I dont know what japanese schoolgirls YOUR talkin bout.
Last time I checked, they didnt wear full body skintight blue outfits or big chozo armor suits.
-
Samus is obviously supposed to be Japanese. The blond hair and blue eyes just give it away, y'know?
-
Samus is obviously supposed to be Japanese. The blond hair and blue eyes just give it away, y'know?
Let's not forget the fluent English. 8D
-
Yes, because hair and eye color have -always- been so accurate in Japanese media. And let's not harbor any illusions that NoJ -didn't- tell Retro how to make Samus look for Prime 2 and 3.
She looked like a Japanese teenager in the end of Prime 2. Less so in 3, but the design still rubbed me the wrong way simply because of that plastic-looking hairdo of hers. Other M looks to be an improvement. That's all I'm saying.
-
They don't have schoolgirls on Zebes you morons.
-
She looked like a Japanese teenager in the end of Prime 2.
Im still not gettin you.
-
Yes, because hair and eye color have -always- been so accurate in Japanese media. And let's not harbor any illusions that NoJ -didn't- tell Retro how to make Samus look for Prime 2 and 3.
So, are you saying you think all schoolgirls in Japan look like anime characters? Or are you saying that Samus just looks like she has blond hair, but in real life (?) it's black?
Or... what?
-
She does look a bit Asian in Prime 2. No doubt because a Japanese woman was used as the face model.
Check here about 3 minutes in. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysExKtLvoq0)
-
She looked like a Japanese teenager in the end of Prime 2.
I thought she looked ugly as [tornado fang] in Prime 2, her model was way off, Prime 1 was even worse... its like her eyelids were a different color than her face. And she looked too Realistic in a Sci-Fi game with a more stylized approach.
-
I thought she looked ugly as [tornado fang] in Prime 2, her model was way off, Prime 1 was even worse... its like her eyelids were a different color than her face. And she looked too Realistic in a Sci-Fi game with a more stylized approach.
That's the "In America!" filter. It was jarring, but at the same time fit. Weird huh? XD
-
I've had no problems w/ MP1's ending. Ah well.
-
Best Samus is Prime Hunters Secret Ending Samus.
That is all.
-
I've had no problems w/ MP1's ending. Ah well.
I have no problems with the actual ending, its just how Samus' face looks at the end. Its just a cosmetic thing, the ending is fine. Its not like it ruins the whole game for me, MP1 is still my favorite for the most part. (I think MP2 had better music and MP3 had neater locations.)
-
Best Samus is Prime Hunters Secret Ending Samus.
That is all.
This.
-
@Kallen: Oh ok. That's ok then.
As for Prime Hunters, is it actually good?
-
Nope.
At very best it's alright.
-
Prime Hunters has the core formula of a Metroid game but is unusually repetitive. Between that and the lack of lock-on, it really feels more like a regular FPS and less like a "First Person Adventure".
That said, best Samus to me is the old NES replay/Justin Bailey code. Suitless, but still with arm cannon. A shame Zero Mission chose not to revisit that, even if Chozodia was all kinds of awesome.
-
Correct me if I'm wrong, but would the ship in Super Metroid be the remnants of the Space Pirate ship that you blow up at the end of Zero Mission?
-
Zero Suit's nice and all, but I'm sick of it. Girl's gotta show some skin and let her hair down.
To me, it's the opposite. Samus just isn't that kinda gal. It just wouldn't seem right for her to be more of a feminine character (disregarding the "faster run of the game = less clothes ending" thing, talking more about personality), when she is a pretty good example of heroism from a genderless character (genderless as in her actions don't particularly favor male or female). Probably a good time to point out the "OMG METROID IS A GIRL" surprize metroid ending as an example.
She just doesn't fit the female stereotype, at all. Not that female stereotyping in a video game is a bad thing, anyways. All about the artist's vision, yo. Even if, on occasion, that vision is somewhat voyeuristic.
-
Correct me if I'm wrong, but would the ship in Super Metroid be the remnants of the Space Pirate ship that you blow up at the end of Zero Mission?
Word of god says no, it isn't.
-
Seems like Prime Hunters' Samus head and hair on Brawl ZSS' body.
Oh yeah.
-
Personally im kinda sick of the ponytail myself.
-
Personally im kinda sick of the ponytail myself.
AH! That was the third element!
Head and Face: Prime Hunters
Hair: Zero Mission
Body: Brawl
-
Im kinda sick of the Zero suit too. not as much as the hair, but a bit.
I liked that outfit from Super Metroid.
-
Man, fans pick apart everything don't they? XD
I personally don't find anything wrong with what Nintendo's got going with Metroid, be it character designs, gameplay, or otherwise. It's a lot like Zelda where each entry is almost a total reinvention or retelling based on who's at the helm at the time, and I think Metroid especially prospers from this.
-
commandycan: Explain the previous games that had no problem showing her half naked, then. She's always been a sex object.
And you do realise I was only being half serious, right? It's more the fact that I miss each game having it's own unique ending attire. After Zero Mission came out, suddenly every game ends with the Zero Suit. Not that there's anything wrong with the Zero Suit, it's just I want to see some variety and an actual surprise in the ending. It's no fun when you know what's going to happen. Thankfully Other M is already doing a good job of rectifying this.
Also, if there was any time to put Samus back in a bikini, now would be it. Cause Team Ninja is quite familiar with the subject.
-
Your right... A different outfit each time DOES sound like a good idea.
Also, dont forget her boob job in Brawl.
-
I just wish she had the figure to go with it. She's awfully slender for her cup size in Brawl...
-
You know what could be done? Hand her over to Seth McFarlane and let's see what he can do with her looks.
Eh, I never cared about the design, the games I got ahold of were fun. Even if it's difficult to beat. I can't see why people seem to nitpick about looks. ::)
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It's the [tornado fang]ing internet, Gaia. If you haven't got used to it yet, get out.
Her boobs never seemed all that different to me. I thought they've always been in the same ball park.
-
she's always hot, so, my hand and pole is always ready for cosmetics. Srsly.
...that didn't came out right.
-
Super Metroid hands down. :W btw samus doesn't look japanese here - - >http://www.samuscentral.com/blog/samus-aran-costume-cosplay/ (http://www.samuscentral.com/blog/samus-aran-costume-cosplay/)
-
Eh, I prefer her Metroid Fusion zero suit; and not because I'm a pervert. it just looks more comfortable. now I'm off to attempt to get my freaking avatar to work. *kicks computer*
-
Super Metroid hands down. :W btw samus doesn't look japanese here - - >http://www.samuscentral.com/blog/samus-aran-costume-cosplay/ (http://www.samuscentral.com/blog/samus-aran-costume-cosplay/)
Of course she doesn't! That's some Scandinavian chick cosplaying as her! We're referring to in-game!
Yeesh...
-
We get a bit o' gameplay. (http://ca.kotaku.com/5505703/finally-some-metroid-other-m-gameplay)
the release just can't come any more sooner~
-
Can't hi-five that notion enough. Looks like Team Ninja's aid has come in handy. Samus is AGILE AGAIN. <3
-
Embed.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OrAWYvUG8N8[/youtube]
Wow, the game is really fast. And it looks awesome! ^^
-
Holy [parasitic bomb], was that Metroid Prime mode? :O
This game's looking as sweet as ever~
-
I just noticed, the theme at the end of the trailer is the title screen theme of Super Metroid.
-
God DAMN. This game is blowing my mind here. It's like I can't even form sentences after looking at parts of it.
0:57 - 1:06: Dat Platforman. 8B
-
Haha, you can go to FPS mode, but you cant seem to move around in that mode. smart move, since otherwise, many players would say [tornado fang] it and go Metroid Prime style, ignoring the work put into the other mode(s)
looks incredibly fun. And action packed.
-
Every time I tried watching that video, Firefox froze soo.... thanks for posting it here, Vixy.
Looks great. And also... HOLY [parasitic bomb] MOTHER BRAIN!
Visor mode with the flick of a wrist? Sweet!
-
Looked better than I thought it would, and I already knew the gameplay would rock.
They rerecorded the "Time to go" line during the Mother Brain fight, right? It used to sound a bit awkward, but now it actually sounds like Samus is threatening MB with a face full of Hyper Beam.
-
yeah. sounds much better.
-
Embed.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OrAWYvUG8N8[/youtube]
Wow, the game is really fast. And it looks awesome! ^^
Hot diggity DAMN!
-
Man that looks awesome. Let's hope it controls as well as it seems though.
Also, higher res version of the gameplay (http://www.gametrailers.com/video/gameplay-trailer-metroid-other/63873).
-
Well well well.
Japanese ver. of the trailer is longer w/ some extra scenes. (http://www.gametrailers.com/video/japanese-gameplay-metroid-other/63921)
Now I must change my pants.
-
Haha, you know Nintendo can stop with the trailers now. I'm already buying this immediately.
-
So you're getting SMG2 and this on day one then?
-
Dammit! (http://kotaku.com/5523120/metroid-other-m-moves-to-august-sin--punishment-slides-as-well)
Actually, the delay isn't too bad. It does give us more time to play Galaxy 2.
-
That's actually somewhat good news for me, as by then I'll probably have gotten a fair few giftcards from my B-Day to spend on it.
-
Ack! Delay? Man, now I'll have to push my visit to my best friend's back some. Not like it mattered; I've got Long Summer classes to take, now. ;^;
Gameplay looks great. Some people might call it a bit hand-holding, but it puts some of the enemies in a different axis, like reality, while the gameplay's still 2D, 3D when you need it to be.
Sick stuff, man. Beats every Metroid game ever if it turns out to be done the right way.
-
Well at least they gave a good reason...
The launch date for Metroid: Other M has shifted to Aug. 31. As you may know, this game is the product of a unique partnership between longtime Metroid producer Yoshio Sakamoto, Team Ninja and many other individuals and groups, all of whom have set very high standards for this latest installment in the series. Although it's taking slightly longer than expected to complete the project, we're confident that fans will find it to be well worth the wait.
Video game development is a lengthy and complex process. We have always put the quality of our products first, and have historically taken the time needed to make our games meet the expectations of our fans.
Hey, more time to make the product even better is always good! This also brings to mind how, in Japan, release dates are set FAR into the future to prevent delays, whereas stateside release dates are too soon, thus meaning delays. This has no bearing on anything whatsoever, I just thought I'd bring it up. Regardless of that, wouldn't you rather have a truly polished Other M than a slightly unfinished one?
-
I agree with one of the posters on Kotaku that chances are the release date of SMG2 was one of the factors in this delay as well, although I'm sure it will be time well spent getting some extra polish in there.
-
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sg2l43peTjw[/youtube]
around 1:07 there is a new cutscene of Samus trackballin' her ship.
It's ballin'.
-
That's a nice find!
I wonder if this means you fight Super Metroid's Mother Brain in 2.5D or if that's just a cutscene... the ship's nice too.
-
It's probably just a cutscene. It'd be pretty cruel of them to make you actually fight Super Metroid's final boss in the opening, unless the difficulty was cranked down, and I'm pretty sure nobody wants that.
It would be kinda cool when I think about it though. The escape sequence would definitely be interesting.
-
Not much of a fight though, is it? Max health tanks, angle up, hold down the
fire HYPER BEAM!! button. Maybe jump occasionally.
Looks wonderful though.
-
And you are invincible with the RAINBOW BEAM OF DOOOOOOM!!!!!
-
No, but to lose in that fight, you must have no hands. Or feet.
-
Pretty much.
-
Well, Woldnt it be much like Castlevania SoTN? where the first stage has you fighting Dracula as Richter, and you CANT lose?
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I suppose they could do that.
I suppose I was also thinking of the final fight in SMR, in which Samus's equipment is destroyed when Mother Brain lands the crippling blow on her. You can still die pretty easilly at that point.
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Hit up on the Japanese site (http://metroid.jp/) it has been updated w/ some small info that'll be updated and some cool shots. But the main thing, when clicking on "About the game" you'll hear a bit of a re-arrangement of the Super Metroid intro summary.
Posted on: June 04, 2010, 08:34:58
I apologize for double post, but this thread needs some bit of attention.
Alright, aside from the gameplay videos at Gametrailers and whatever sources others may have/have not seen.
I'll just link simple collections of them and one that shows the tutorial portion; and, well, we'll see how that goes. Yeah...I [tornado fang]ing can't wait for August 31st~
Metroid Database has already linked a ton of videos and 3 from them specifically showing a good consecutive flow of the demo at E3'10 (http://www.metroid-database.com/)
And this. Shows the tutorial being playing by a man w/ some sweet ass hair and one guy explaining stuff most of us already know at this point. So if one wants to skip, skip to 0:50 for the game starting w/ the cinematic intro~
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OMYc-Ho2P0g[/youtube]
Posted on: June 23, 2010, 14:26:07
I apologize for...the triple by now XD.
Gonintendo.com posted a 2 part video featurette/behind the scenes of Other M. (http://gonintendo.com/viewstory.php?id=129492)
Sadly it doesn't contain any subs for translation, so...just skim around or unless one of the japanese-familiar RPMers can pull out some perhaps new info we may learn of~ :3
Oh and the 2 part video contains new footage of Other M, such as Samus blasting the back of a Space Pirates' head~ hoho~
edit:
[spoiler](http://z2-ec2.images-amazon.com/images/P/B002C1ARJY.01._SCRMZZZZZZ_.jpg)[/spoiler]
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SO I HEARD OTHER M WILL COME TO EUROPE
SEPTEMBER 3rd
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If nothing else, I will miss Retro for their Varia Suit design. Game otherwise looks kickass, though, so I can't wait.
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CVG will supposively post a fair bit of Other M videos per day for this whole week. (http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=255393)
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If nothing else, I will miss Retro for their Varia Suit design. Game otherwise looks kickass, though, so I can't wait.
I honestly, didn't like the Varia Suit that much in the Prime games. I guess because I don't usually like bulky designs. It looks cool, though. Anyway, yeah, I definitely cannot wait until Other M comes out; August 31st is still too far away! :\
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I love bulk. Seeing something move with agility in spite of bulk to me is much more amazing than watching something streamlined that you actually expect to move quickly. I'd say it drives home the "wonders of technology" thing, but to be honest I've already caught myself in the same attitude with marine life; ie I enjoy orca whale stunts far more than dolphin stunts.
What bugs me about Ninja's Varia Suit isn't so much the line design as it is the color. The basic Power Suit is yellow. The Varia Suit is orange. ORANGE, DAMN YOU.
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well, it was like, pink or something in the original, wasnt it?
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People still play the original with the suit on?
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just sayin's all.
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What bugs me about Ninja's Varia Suit isn't so much the line design as it is the color. The basic Power Suit is yellow. The Varia Suit is orange. ORANGE, DAMN YOU.
Even though its been that way since Super Metroid (Because pink was ugly? Who knows.), I think what they're going for is trying to replicate the art/color style that Super had. Hence the very bright yellow they seem to be using.
But thats just my take on it, personally, its a damn color. I don't care as long as the game is enjoyable.
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just sayin's all.
Somewhat more serious response:
The original is basically a testament to limited NES palettes (see: Peach's hair) and unskilled dot work. And the notion of the Varia doing anything but palette-swapping only came about due to the GB not being colorized. Zero Mission, the remake of the original, leaves the Varia as an orange recolor while the "fully powered suit" grants the Varia's extra armor.
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I think they might be using the bright yellow because of how the game seems to have such a vibrant color pallet compared to the primes
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I've said it before and I'll say it again. That's not the Varia Suit in the Other M videos. It's the Power Suit. Compare it to the Super Metroid sprites of the Power Suit. They're practically identical.
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Which sprites are you looking at? In Super, the Power Suit's shoulders are triangular, where they're perfect spheres in Other M. You are correct in that it's not the Varia Suit, though. The Varia Suit has always had ridges on the shoulders. The suit in Other M doesn't have them, and the detailing is different too.
The suits have never been 100% identical between games. The Power Suit's shoulders in Other M are far different from those in Super, and both are different from those in Prime 1. The Varia Suit has even varied in the Prime series itself. The shoulders were noticeably larger in Prime 1 than in the others.
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The suit here seems to incorporate traits from the varia suit. big chest and shoulders, (not to mention the chest lights are from the varia suit) whereas normally, the power suit is not THAT bulky. though for example, the legs seem more like the power suit legs.
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Which sprites are you looking at? In Super, the Power Suit's shoulders are triangular, where they're perfect spheres in Other M.
I believe he's referring to the fact that Super Metroid (unlike, say, Zero Mission) only differentiates the change in armor appearance for screen-facing sprites, so the Power Suit appears to have rounded shoulders in profile view even though it clearly does not when forward-facing or in the status screen. I consider that developer negligence, not design.
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Two part featurette is subbed :D
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8IxtUUF-iNo&feature=player_embedded[/youtube]
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lHZFwdApitM&feature=player_embedded[/youtube]
enjoy!
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you see, that is EXACTLY the kind of spirit Capcom needs to embrace in order to evolve Megaman.
"High tech famicom game"
very insightful. Also, theres another reason for why that IS the Varia suit. the very same design is in the scene where Samus takes out Mother brain in Super Metroid. And in that scene in the original, she HAD the varia suit.
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She also had the Gravity Suit.
The gameplay of Super Metroid allows disabling your collected upgrades (sans Hyper Beam), so it actually is possible to fight Mother Brain with any suit one chooses.
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The Varia Suit has always had ridges on the shoulders. The suit in Other M doesn't have them, and the detailing is different too.
Not to mention it ain't orange.
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Guys, who cares what suit it is. We all know we won't get to enjoy it for long because that dumb [sonic slicer] is gonna stare at an explosion or something and lose all of her upgrades.. Again.
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I believe he's referring to the fact that Super Metroid (unlike, say, Zero Mission) only differentiates the change in armor appearance for screen-facing sprites, so the Power Suit appears to have rounded shoulders in profile view even though it clearly does not when forward-facing or in the status screen. I consider that developer negligence, not design.
That is what I was referring to, yes. Also, the lights on the chestplate in Other M actually are the Power Suit design--it's just on both sides instead of on the right.
As for developer negligence, yes, that's exactly what it is. However, that doesn't necessarily mean that Team Ninja didn't base their Samus model on the SM Power Suit profile view sprites.
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We all know we won't get to enjoy it for long because that dumb [sonic slicer] is gonna trip over a ladybug and lose all of her upgrades.. Again.
Fixed.
And yeah, in the end, why should the suit looking different matter any? It's like giving a damn about how Zero's helmet looks slightly different in some games. If that kinda [parasitic bomb] really gets to you, I dunno man.
And what you call negligence, I call artistic freedom.
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And what you call negligence, I call artistic freedom.
You call it artistic freedom to change designs mid-game based on camera angle?
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Across games I meant. What's done in Super is more laziness.
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I think that's what Hypershell was referring to, Sato. Super Metroid's sprite laziness being developer negligence, I mean.
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I certainly hope that was clear by my last post. I wasn't referring to Ninja's suit as negligence, my complaints against that are simply a matter of preference.
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in case noone looks at Metroid Database. One dude posted some more info from his impressions of the Other M Demo at the London Film and Comic Convention
-The controls are incredibly fluid
-The status screen contains a character menu with profiles of each person you meet. The other members of Adam's squad are Maurice, James Pierce (the guy with the mustache), K.G. Wong (glasses, team engineer). This is in addition to Lyle (demolitions) and Anthony Higgs.
-Samus' thumbs-down against Adam was part of her rebellious teen years.
-Missile expansions add only one missile
-Two mysterious upgrades are Energy Parts=0 and Accel. Units=0. (Current thoughts are these are related to energy tanks and the Shine Spark.)
-There are lots of cutscenes that cannot be skipped (at least on firsts play...).
I for one welcome new characters~ especially that supposed mustache dude (one dude at gamefaqs called him the 'dude w/ a porno 'stache).
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in before bitching about unskippable cutscenes
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The missile expansions adding only one missile might feel a bit awkward at first, but they probably had a good reason to go that way (probably game balance in general).
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Game doesn't seem to need missiles all that much. They're only available in 1st person mode aren't they? And I'm sure the cutscenes will be skippable after seeing them once, just like the Primes.
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the accel part is probably something to do with IMO, those bits where we see Samus running at real fast speed with her suit's boosters.
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Maybe the missiles upgrade straight into super missiles, like in Fusion.
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Game doesn't seem to need missiles all that much. They're only available in 1st person mode aren't they? And I'm sure the cutscenes will be skippable after seeing them once, just like the Primes.
I like the idea of less missles, Personally I rarely use them.
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Usually I'm like that too. In Fusion and the Primes, I never use missiles unless I have to. But in Zero Mission, missiles are practically required on the bosses.
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The only thing I ever really used missiles for in Prime,was for the Super missile, and the other beam specials
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Possibly because the missiles are so damn slow and inconvenient in the Prime games. They're barely better than just spamming charge shots, except for putting less stress on your fingers...
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They're only decent in Prime 1, and only if you rapidly alternate between A and Y to cancel the cooldown.
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They're only decent in Prime 1, and only if you rapidly alternate between A and Y to cancel the cooldown.
Yeah, they can be handy depending on the situation. Otherwise they mainly went into the special missiles. It wouldn't surprise me if they're not that useful here due to the way they have to be used.
In the 2D Metroids, missiles were plenty useful. Being able to spam them into targets that are stuck on a 2D plane generally helped their usefulness. Bosses in particular were rather susceptible to them (ie. being able to kill Kraid with Super Missiles in Super Metroid before he fully spawns in).
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I used the hell out of missiles in Prime 2, if only because ammo for the beams was a pain in the ass.
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Usually I'm like that too. In Fusion and the Primes, I never use missiles unless I have to. But in Zero Mission, missiles are practically required on the bosses.
I Prefer using missles in the 2D games, as they seem to dish out more damage, also because the charge shots tend to cancel out before getting the Plasma beam, which ends up making a larger shot (Spazer charge shots in Super, Wave Beam in Fusion and Zero Mission.) get cancelled out by certain enemies armor.
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(ie. being able to kill Kraid with Super Missiles in Super Metroid before he fully spawns in).
I could never manage to do that.
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Bosses in particular were rather susceptible to them (ie. being able to kill Kraid with Super Missiles in Super Metroid before he fully spawns in).
Still no match for charged Plasma Beam, though. It's amazing how quickly post-Maridia bosses go once you realize that.
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Still no match for charged Plasma Beam, though. It's amazing how quickly post-Maridia bosses go once you realize that.
Depends on the boss, not to mention the fact that there isn't exactly much post-Maridia (well, on the regular path that you're expected to take anyways).
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Now that I hear more of MANthony Higgs, i'm liking him more and more~
AWWWWWWWWWW FANCY MEETING YOU HERE, PRINCESS!
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ATX2Lom2Ho[/youtube]
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Love what I'm seeing, even in spite of the Power/Varia blender stunt.
Depends on the boss, not to mention the fact that there isn't exactly much post-Maridia (well, on the regular path that you're expected to take anyways).
Ridley and Mother Brain's second form make the point well enough. Her first requires missiles as a matter of weapon typing, that's about it.
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credits to Metroid Database
NEW AWESOME TRAILER TO OTHER M
watch for surprise
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rRMBerJtJjM&feature=player_embedded[/youtube]
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wait- what surprise am I looking for exactly?
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Nothing specific, just in short how awesome the trailer is.
Edit: then again...I guess I ruined it by saying new trailer right?
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You said Watch for surprise, but I wasnt sure what exactly the surprise was...
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Wait a damn minute.
Did I see Sylux in there?
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I didn't notice a single Sylux in there. Too much awesomeness was going around in that trailer.
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You said Watch for surprise, but I wasnt sure what exactly the surprise was...
Oh ok...well...in that case, nothing then. o.o
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Seems like Metroid: Other M is going to include a theater mode [source (http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3180610)]. Dunno if that has already been posted, but 2 hour long film if all cutscenes are connected? That's kind of neat and also starts to remind me of the theater mode that was in Metal Gear Solid 3: Substistence (or what I have heard about it).
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You know, the problem with that idea is that cutscenes in games tend to be broken up by long segments of gameplay (or short segments of gameplay if you're playing MGS2 or beyond), and don't automatically make sense when they're strung together.
Edit: I retract that statement, since apparently the developers came to the same realization and added pre-recorded gameplay footage between the cutscenes to tie it all together.
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Yeah, that prevents a gamer who hasn't played the game from understanding the whole movie thing, but I guess it would be worth the watch after a playthrough or two if you just want to understand the story better. Guess it's better than nothing, as I like to watch some cutscenes over and over again if there's a cinema thing inside the game.
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See previous post. Guess I should've finished reading the article before I said anything!
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http://kotaku.com/5600764/metroid-other-m-to-include-two-hour-movie-version-of-game
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Only 30% items on the first playthrough? I kinda hope so. Prime 3 had 75% of the stuff right in front of you.
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For us tedious completionist players a 30% count is pretty ridiculously low. I mean, who here honestly got that in their first playthrough of any other Metroid game?
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(http://i28.tinypic.com/nmjloz.jpg)
I thought Metroid wasn't very popular nowadays?
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(http://i28.tinypic.com/nmjloz.jpg)
I thought Metroid wasn't very popular nowadays?
I honestly see no competition in that poll.
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Some more footage from Comic-con
Sadly, camera control ain't the best :/
Heads up: potential to be a spoiler though. So tread.
[spoiler][youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cu20OtEgfGA[/youtube][/spoiler]
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I honestly see no competition in that poll.
If they had used Castlevania LoS maybe... But instead they chose HoD, which so far, seems to only be a mashup DL title recycling stages from DoS.
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If they had used Castlevania LoS maybe... But instead they chose HoD, which so far, seems to only be a mashup DL title recycling stages from DoS.
Again, not alot of people are very interested in that game, and from feedback of those who played it, it seems like it's recycled derivative crap. While Other M is a freaking Metroid game made by freaking Team Ninja! What's not to love?
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Again, not alot of people are very interested in that game, and from feedback of those who played it, it seems like it's recycled derivative crap.
What, LoS? LoS looks great to me.
Especially when past 3D Castlevanias rate from bad to "decent".
But yeah. Other M. Team ninja aside, its simply the way it is such a departure from Prime, both visually, storywise and in gameplay that make it so amazing.
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What, LoS? LoS looks great to me.
Especially when past 3D Castlevanias rate from bad to "decent".
But yeah. Other M. Team ninja aside, its simply the way it is such a departure from Prime, both visually, storywise and in gameplay that make it so amazing.
It's still a recycled-backgrounds-from-a-DS Castlevania inserted into an HD setting with co-op, which really doesn't bode well from what the previews say. That, against the option of putting a Castlevania with a hand by Hideo Kojima, and that really does seem like it's trying to break the mold, seems fine.
...only the poll says AUGUST releases, so they couldn't do that.
And Metroid still is the best option. Although Mafia II's looking pretty damn sweet. Anyone around here played the first one?
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1. LoS stands for Lords of Shadow, which is the Kojima-supervised next gen game in production.
2. The downloadable mashup game on XBLA is called Harmony of Despair.
3. We have a friggin Castlevania thread for this stuff (http://forum.rockmanpm.com/index.php?topic=11.0).
Any more mention of Castlevania in this thread, good or bad, will result in a thousand daggers in the face.
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1. LoS stands for Lords of Shadow, which is the Kojima-supervised next gen game in production.
2. The downloadable mashup game on XBLA is called Harmony of Despair.
3. We have a friggin Castlevania thread for this stuff (http://forum.rockmanpm.com/index.php?topic=11.0).
Any more mention of Castlevania in this thread, good or bad, will result in a thousand daggers in the face.
What's the matter with it? We're discussing it in regard to Metroid: Other M being chosen as the best game released in August, and comparing it.
Plus, this is a Metroid thread. Castlevania discussion will come about sooner or later, since both games have been pretty much the only noteable ones of its type for years (sorry Shadow Complex).
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I'm only half serious. Just saying that thread's kinda lonely and the hate you're giving the upcoming game(s?) is more appropriate there.
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Yeah, but for Castlevania to suck, we need the context of Metroid rocking hard. =P
And I actually really like Castlevania. But against a Team Ninja Metroid... well... no.
I am half-expecting a Flying Bird Leap with mid-air Morph Ball+Bombs everywhere.
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(http://img844.imageshack.us/img844/2823/zerosuitothermrender.jpg)
Look at those HEELS!!!
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(http://img844.imageshack.us/img844/2823/zerosuitothermrender.jpg)
Look at those HEELS!!!
Official art? Oh [parasitic bomb]. Up until now, they didn't ruin her in the slightest bit, but this is making me question them.
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Official art? Oh [parasitic bomb]. Up until now, they didn't ruin her in the slightest bit, but this is making me question them.
How so? The heels look like a bit much, but otherwise, its fine..
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How so? The heels look like a bit much, but otherwise, its fine..
Samus is a soldier. You think she can move around and fight bad guys in high heels?
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I hardly think the addition of platform heels to Samus's already skin-tight and extremely revealing bodysuit is earth-shattering. Besides, I doubt it'd affect the operation of the Power Suit.
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Samus is a soldier. You think she can move around and fight bad guys in high heels?
As much as she can in a skimpy pink bikini.
Its just an added design to make her look more girly I guess. it not gonna affect gameplay in any way. unless you have to learn her walk mechanics else she twist her ankle. XD
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As much as she can in a skimpy pink bikini.
Its just an added design to make her look more girly I guess. it not gonna affect gameplay in any way. unless you have to learn her walk mechanics else she twist her ankle. XD
The bikini was supposed to be a cool revelation at the end of the first game, and carried on in a "mission's over, lemme get into something more comfortable" tradition. I mean, if you went through all the crap she goes on a mission, when you went back home, you'd take a big shower and stay on your underwear lazing around for awhile, right?
And the skintight suit, as long as it works logically, would actually be a tactical upgrade for her in certain conditions where she has to move faster. We've only seen her use it in one mission so far, and it wasn't exactly because she had a choice. The Zero Suit allows her to move a bit faster and more freely, unlike the arsenal she always carries along with her. The material it's made of and the way it moves might even aid her to move instead of restricting her.
But high heels? That's the only design choice so far made for the sake of pure asthetic, and completely useless when looking at it from a logic standpoint. How are high heels going to help her in any way?
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As much as that mole she didnt have before is going to.
Honestly, we dont even know if we are going to even get to PLAY as Zero suit, it most likely will be a cutscene thing... But hey. opinions. I dont mind the heels, but If I can gripe about helmets, you can gripe about Samus' heels. :P
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As much as that mole she didnt have before is going to.
Honestly, we dont even know if we are going to even get to PLAY as Zero suit, it most likely will be a cutscene thing... But hey. opinions. I dont mind the heels, but If I can gripe about helmets, you can gripe about Samus' heels. :P
Samus' helmet works, though. Prime was pretty realistic that way. But high heels are the no-no of fighting fashion. First thing in the Metroid series that sacrifices functionality for the sake of design.
...and it doesn't even look good.
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Samus' helmet works, though. Prime was pretty realistic that way.
I think he was referring to his constant griping with Zero's helmet in X8.
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Probably.
The bikini was supposed to be a cool revelation at the end of the first game, and carried on in a "mission's over, lemme get into something more comfortable" tradition. I mean, if you went through all the crap she goes on a mission, when you went back home, you'd take a big shower and stay on your underwear lazing around for awhile, right?
They way I see it, we NEED to have another "suitless with arm cannon" mode. Sure, the Morph Ball makes no sense that way, but who cares?
And the skintight suit, as long as it works logically, would actually be a tactical upgrade for her in certain conditions where she has to move faster. We've only seen her use it in one mission so far, and it wasn't exactly because she had a choice. The Zero Suit allows her to move a bit faster and more freely, unlike the arsenal she always carries along with her. The material it's made of and the way it moves might even aid her to move instead of restricting her.
But high heels? That's the only design choice so far made for the sake of pure asthetic, and completely useless when looking at it from a logic standpoint. How are high heels going to help her in any way?
Too much Brawl logic, I think. The Power Suit has been repeatedly stated to aid, not restrict, Samus's acrobatics.
I don't see the Zero Suit as being of any tactical use. I've always just thought of it as an "underskin" to the Power Suit.
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Probably.
They way I see it, we NEED to have another "suitless with arm cannon" mode. Sure, the Morph Ball makes no sense that way, but who cares?
Too much Brawl logic, I think. The Power Suit has been repeatedly stated to aid, not restrict, Samus's acrobatics.
I don't see the Zero Suit as being of any tactical use. I've always just thought of it as an "underskin" to the Power Suit.
It's still a change from a bulky suit to a slim outfit. It may change her abilities in other ways. The suit may aid some acrobatics, but hinder others due to flexibility issues. I dunno, but since the Zero Suit's here, they gotta justify it in some way.
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How do you figure that? Just because the model exists doesn't mean we'll ever see it outside of a cutscene. See Prime 2 and 3.
As far as flexibility goes, Other M looks to be unusually physical for a Metroid game as it is, with Samus going in for a lot of grab action. Doesn't seem to be any issues there.
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How do you figure that? Just because the model exists doesn't mean we'll ever see it outside of a cutscene. See Prime 2 and 3.
As far as flexibility goes, Other M looks to be unusually physical for a Metroid game as it is, with Samus going in for a lot of grab action. Doesn't seem to be any issues there.
We don't know if the model will be played in the game. I'm just saying I don't like the heels, and they're not functional. And that the Zero Suit should offer some kind of functionality.
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I just think it's worth considering that in four re-appearances the only game to offer such functionality is the same game that had Luigi doing a Dark Hold drunken hobo dance. I don't see the Zero Suit as ever having a tactical function. It has only ever been presented as what Samus wears underneath the Power Suit; we could possibly assume it is an anchoring point for the Power Suit, but that's pretty much it. If Samus honestly intended to go into any suitless action, there's no reason she couldn't do so in casual dress (Zero Mission itself depicts such in one of its ending images). The Zero Suit, by itself, has no function.
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The Zero Suit, by itself, has no function.
We don't know that yet.
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Zero Suit should offer some kind of functionality.
... Jiggle physics?
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We don't know that yet.
May I point out that whole section in Zero Mission that the suit originated from? It was clearly meant to be a restrictive segment. Admittedly this is Team Ninja so anything could happen I suppose, but I doubt much will change aside from the heels.
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May I point out that whole section in Zero Mission that the suit originated from? It was clearly meant to be a restrictive segment. Admittedly this is Team Ninja so anything could happen I suppose, but I doubt much will change aside from the heels.
Three points are worthy.
- This is Team Ninja
- People want to play a section with unarmoured hot Samus
- This is TEAM NINJA 8D
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Other M isn't entirely done by Team Ninja alone.
In case someone forgets.
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I know, it's a collaboration.
...it's still Team Ninja. They're gonna stick boobs in there somehow, even if it's on Mother Brain's ass.
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You say that like Nintendo didn't do the same thing in Brawl. Have you ever LOOKED at Samus's suitless model?
BOINGY BOINGY BOINGY BOINGY BOINGY
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Not to mention she doesnt have her brawl rack in Prime 2 and 3 when we see her suitless.
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You say that like Nintendo didn't do the same thing in Brawl. Have you ever LOOKED at Samus's suitless model?
BOINGY BOINGY BOINGY BOINGY BOINGY
Of course. Why do you think Team Ninja accepted making this game in the first place? They see whoring her as a CHALLENGE.
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Touché.
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"Hold A and shake Wii remote repeatedly while in Zero Suit, for breast jiggling physics."
you heard it here first! 8D
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"Hold A and shake Wii remote repeatedly while in Zero Suit, for breast jiggling physics."
you heard it here first! 8D
I hope there's a way to pinch her butt by reaching out with the wiimote. =P
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Indeed, but would her ass-pinch-revenge-death-slap be able to match Roll Caskett's?
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aside from the usual, "I must make a boob physic joke on Team Ninja and UGH I hate those new heels on ZSS" thingie everyone seems to love doing despite having some imagination into some technological thought into how heels can be made into not so much a nuisance (hell, Bayonetta had heels of some sort).
Anyways, I REALLY hope those 'golden space pirates' right before ya face Ridley in Super Metroid appear in this game. I'd love to see how that battle will go. Especially the finisher~
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Throw in the black pirates from Zero Mission and we got ourselves a fight.
Samus may very well keep those heels for when the fourth Smash Bros. comes around. And it won't impact her gameplay any.
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Samus may very well keep those heels for when the fourth Smash Bros. comes around. And it won't impact her gameplay any.
LMAO! Yes exactly!!!
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LMAO! Yes exactly!!!
We don't know yet. Suited Samus in Brawl pretty much might as well be playing in heels. =P
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Random thing I just noticed. In Zero Mission, you can collect the Wave Beam before the Ice Beam. But when you do, your shots are blue as if you do have the Ice Beam. I wonder why the game was never coded with a properly colored Wave Beam. It's not like you have to do some crazy game-breaking sequence break to do it. Nothing leading to the Wave Beam requires Ice Beam. Hell, nothing requires Ice Beam, except for killing Metroids.
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Random thing I just noticed. In Zero Mission, you can collect the Wave Beam before the Ice Beam. But when you do, your shots are blue as if you do have the Ice Beam. I wonder why the game was never coded with a properly colored Wave Beam. It's not like you have to do some crazy game-breaking sequence break to do it. Nothing leading to the Wave Beam requires Ice Beam. Hell, nothing requires Ice Beam, except for killing Metroids.
I was frustrated as hell when I accidentally went all the way to Tourian, Sequence breaking my way down there (I had as little as the Wave Beam, Charge Beam, Varia Suit, and the rest of the required stuff EXCEPT for the Ice Beam. With 2-3 Energy Tanks.) Then I went back and got it. Couldn't beat Mother Brain anyway. What was really funny though is that I skipped out on the long beam, making things slightly more difficult. But I actually enjoyed playing without it. The charge effects were actually different, which I found neat. Which surprises me in that they didn't code in a normal Wave beam.
But what would've been really nice? Being able to turn off the Add-ons like in Super. That was awesome.
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A new Iwata asks Interview! (http://us.wii.com/iwata_asks/metroid-other-m/vol1_page1.jsp)
or rather, the japanese Iwata asks interview is now translated
Read read!!!
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But what would've been really nice? Being able to turn off the Add-ons like in Super. That was awesome.
I agree. I loved being able to turn off the power-ups in Super Metroid. I wish other Metroid games did that.
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[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lj3umNOJy_c[/youtube]
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That was awesome. I love how they mixed the CG scenes with the final battle gameplay/movie thing
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That was awesome. I love how they mixed the CG scenes with the final battle gameplay/movie thing
Agreed. That was a really nice touch.
Am i the only one who thinks Samus' voice fits perfectly? I was skeptical before about having her speak in this game period.
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Am i the only one who thinks Samus' voice fits perfectly? I was skeptical before about having her speak in this game period.
It's fine, I'd say. Sounds better than it did before. I could never understand why some people can actually rage over something like this. Although it's much worse with Zelda fans. ("a semi official game with terrible VAs and lame cartoon neither of which Nintendo was involved with is a perfectly legitimate reason for Zelda games not to have voice acting!")
also I'm worried there being no mention of Prime will lead to some people starting that "Prime is not canon" crap again.
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I don't think they covered Prime there because the Trilogy mostly stands by itself. It doesn't really depend on the first game for setup, and nor does RoS depend on the Primes. They concentrated on the numbered games cause they all relate to the Metroids and Space Pirates.
And yes, Samus sounds great. But that doesn't mean Link should ever talk again.
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That vid rubs off any bit o' smudge of worry I have left of Jessica Martin's performance~
I look forward to hearing it once more whenever the NA NC updates~
Oh yeah, there is supposively gonna be a new trailer of Other M to be shown at GTTV tonight at 12:30 AM Pacific time for NA television most likely.
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I don't think they covered Prime there because the Trilogy mostly stands by itself. It doesn't really depend on the first game for setup, and nor does RoS depend on the Primes. They concentrated on the numbered games cause they all relate to the Metroids and Space Pirates.
And yes, Samus sounds great. But that doesn't mean Link should ever talk again.
Well, Link wasn't meant to talk(nor be a character at all) in the first place. He was suppose to be an AVATAR!
Zelda, Ganon, and the rest of the NPC's, however, have no excuses. They really couls have good voices.
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That I absolutely agree with.
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God damn it, he set the video to private now.
I dont suppose someone managed to snag it before then, no?
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[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k1CHQ2YOFTc[/youtube]
Posted on: August 13, 2010, 11:32:51 PM
Exclusive Action Trailer (http://www.gametrailers.com/video/exclusive-action-metroid-other/702845)
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DAT NEW TRAILER!!! :V
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Well, Link wasn't meant to talk(nor be a character at all) in the first place. He was suppose to be an AVATAR!
Zelda, Ganon, and the rest of the NPC's, however, have no excuses. They really couls have good voices.
Link already talked in Sound and Drama.
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i just noticed now but the grapple beam is on the wrong arm ;__;
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i just noticed now but the grapple beam is on the wrong arm ;__;
It was originally on the right arm in Super Metroid.
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Oh nice, 3D Speed Booster and ShineSpark. Hopefully we don't have any MorphBall Shinesparking required to get some expansions.
Also, is that the ability to turn Abilities on and off? I'm liking this game more and more every time I see it.
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But that doesn't mean Link should ever talk again.
EXCUUUSE ME, Princess!
Link already talked in Sound and Drama.
Further, ever since LttP, there have been obvious instances where Link is speaking to the NPCs, his dialogue either being represented by a bunch of ellipses or a brief darkening of the screen. Link's silence is a matter of presentation, not of character, and there is a HUGE difference. It works for a text-only game where the player is expected to use their imagination, but in a voiced title, a silent hero is an uninvolved hero. And that's not who Link is. Look at Twilight Princess, he's the friendly village go-to guy, and big brother to all the kids. A character like that ceases to be believable if everyone's talking to him and he never says a word in return.
This is why I despise the "IGN Zelda mentality" of Link remaining silent in an otherwise fully voiced game. It's naive and ignorant, first of all, to claim a presentational issue as a character development issue. Further, I've seen the "silent hero in a voiced game" treatment in Dragon Quest 8 already, and it accomplishes absolutely nothing except to make the main character boring and shift virtually all focus to the supporting cast.
Posted on: August 15, 2010, 03:38:30
also I'm worried there being no mention of Prime will lead to some people starting that "Prime is not canon" crap again.
I suggest we hog-tie and castrate all people who suggest this of ANY video game series without either an extremely heavy contradiction or a developer statement as evidence. The willingness of fans to selectively ignore titles never ceases to amaze and annoy me.
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Look at Twilight Princess, he's the friendly village go-to guy, and big brother to all the kids. A character like that ceases to be believable if everyone's talking to him and he never says a word in return.
sucks for you, then. (http://kotaku.com/5611804/link-is-silent-and-nintendo-wants-to-keep-it-that-way)
a silent hero is an uninvolved hero.
I disagree.
Having him not speak is one of the things that makes him a unique character in my book. We already know that he is an established hero/warrior, and it's really up to the player to decide how exactly he relates to the situations that follow throughout the game; whether it's trying to rescue the princess or pressing onward to defeat Ganondorf. To me it's almost like having a created character, and (as cheesy as it may sound) going through the game somewhat through your own eyes. It also creates a slate for people to speculate on what type of personality Link has. And even then, Nintendo has had Link demonstrate a variety of facial expressions (like the feeling of "shock", pain, joy or nervousness).
Link is already given courage and bravery, and that should be enough.
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sucks for you, then. (http://kotaku.com/5611804/link-is-silent-and-nintendo-wants-to-keep-it-that-way)
I disagree.
Having him not speak is one of the things that makes him a unique character in my book. We already know that he is an established hero/warrior, and it's really up to the player to decide how exactly he relates to the situations that follow throughout the game; whether it's trying to rescue the princess or pressing onward to defeat Ganondorf. To me it's almost like having a created character, and (as cheesy as it may sound) going through the game somewhat through your own eyes. It also creates a slate for people to speculate on what type of personality Link has. And even then, Nintendo has had Link demonstrate a variety of facial expressions (like the feeling of "shock", pain, joy or nervousness).
Link is already given courage and bravery, and that should be enough.
I think you misinterpreted his post. He was explaining why he's for Link being silent, but he thinks the NPCs should remain silent as well to keep the illusion going stronger. I'd have to agree with him in this case.
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I think you misinterpreted his post. He was explaining why he's for Link being silent, but he thinks the NPCs should remain silent as well to keep the illusion going stronger.
Hmm... i guess you're right (this is what happens when you post right after recovering from a flu). Well, looks like my entire post went to [parasitic bomb] now in terms of the argument, huh? 8D
Either way, my opinion still stands.
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You know what's crazy? All the time I mentioned here (and other sites) that I freakin' hated Metroid so much so many times... but now... I seem to like it.
I kinda do look forward to Metroid Other M, a game for 2D (Platformer) and 3D (FPS) fans.
The only Metroid games I own so far are: Metroid Prime (also included a Bonus Disc for MP 2: Echoes), Metroid Fusion, Metroid (unlocked by using NGC GBA Cable), and Super Metroid (downloaded on my Wii).
But by far, my favorite game is "Metroid Fusion".
(http://image3.examiner.com/images/blog/wysiwyg/image/MetroidFusion.jpg)
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The willingness of fans to selectively ignore titles never ceases to amaze and annoy me.
Then they should've made X7 and the Xtreme games better! 8D
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Exclusive Action Trailer (http://www.gametrailers.com/video/exclusive-action-metroid-other/702845)
I definitely see the Varia Suit in that trailer, but strangely it doesn't have the fins on the shoulders either. Oh well. Looks like I was right, anyway... the suit she starts the game with is the vanilla Power Suit.
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Other M is starting to get more and more interesting for me.
Well my favorite games from the Metroid series Metroid Prime 1 (the original release without the Echoes Bonus Disc), Super Metroid (played this on emulator though I'm planning to download this to my Wii), Metroid Prime Triology, and the NES Metroid (played this on Metroid: Zero Mission). Though my personal favorite is Zero Mission; really did a good job recreating the NES Metroid along with the addition of items from the other games like the Speed Boost and implemented Samus' abilities like wall jumping into the game.
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My favorite Metroid is Zero Mission. The soundtrack to that game kicks ass beyond all sane reasoning.
Exclusive Action Trailer (http://www.gametrailers.com/video/exclusive-action-metroid-other/702845)
Freaking awesome in every sense of the word. 8)
Hmm... i guess you're right (this is what happens when you post right after recovering from a flu). Well, looks like my entire post went to [parasitic bomb] now in terms of the argument, huh? 8D
Either way, my opinion still stands.
Fox pretty much had it. What I'm saying is that IF they were to voice Zelda games, it'd be stupid to leave Link out of it. But I'm fine with the current presentation of Link as a silent hero in a text-dialogue game. I just don't believe that presentation works in a fully voiced game, which is something I've seen a lot of the gaming press push for. "Voice the entire supporting cast, but leave Link silent." Rubbish, I say.
Then they should've made X7 and the Xtreme games better! 8D
*gives him ZEE UPPERCUT!!*
You mean X7 and Xtreme1. Xtreme2 cannot possibly be any better without migrating hardware. Not a bad idea, mind you, but it's as good as any GBC X game will ever get.
Speaking of which, I will GLADLY take Xtreme2's dash mechanics, with the blessing that is proper air-dash momentum, over Bass's in MM10. That dash-jump lag is intolerable.
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That new Metroid trailer made me wet myself with it's sheer awesomeness. -_-
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You know what's crazy? All the time I mentioned here (and other sites) that I freakin' hated Metroid so much so many times... but now... I seem to like it.
I kinda do look forward to Metroid Other M, a game for 2D (Platformer) and 3D (FPS) fans.
The only Metroid games I own so far are: Metroid Prime (also included a Bonus Disc for MP 2: Echoes), Metroid Fusion, Metroid (unlocked by using NGC GBA Cable), and Super Metroid (downloaded on my Wii).
But by far, my favorite game is "Metroid Fusion".
(http://image3.examiner.com/images/blog/wysiwyg/image/MetroidFusion.jpg)
Gee I thought Super Metroid was the worst game ever according to you. See now, this is what happens when you actually play the game before forming a retarded opinion.
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Man, where'd all the Zero Mission love come from all of a sudden? I thought I was the only one who liked that game the most.
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I guess you never heard me talk about Metroid before. Zero Mission isn't just my favorite Metroid, it's pretty much my favorite GBA game.
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Zero Mission has always been my second favourite Metroid, to be honest. Fusion had a lot of ideas that I liked, but I wasn't a fan of the locking of sectors off (much like most people).
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Personally, I just hated the suit. But, once I buckled down and played it, yeah, it did seem a little overly linear. Still a solid title, though.
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Zero Mission was awesome but, Super and Fusion are tied for my favorite and Prime 1 is a close second. Zero Mission comes after prime 1 for me.
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I definitely enjoyed Zero Mission, but it wasn't my favorite Metroid game ever.
That still goes to Prime 1. Although who knows, maybe Other M will blow it out of the water for me.
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*gives him ZEE UPPERCUT!!*
You mean X7 and Xtreme1. Xtreme2 cannot possibly be any better without migrating hardware. Not a bad idea, mind you, but it's as good as any GBC X game will ever get.
Nope! I meant both Xtreme games, fanboy! :P
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I definitely enjoyed Zero Mission, but it wasn't my favorite Metroid game ever.
I liked Prime 2 somewhat more than Zero Mission. And Super is just all around more enjoyable thanks to not needing a Morph Ball Shinespark (Something the GBA games overdid.) In fact, I think the GBA ones would've benifited from a run button, that way theres no automatic Speed Boosting (I didn't like how it was handled in the GBA Games.)
I'm not saying that I hate Zero Mission and Fusion. But if I want to get 100% I don't want to have to go out of my way after Beating the game to find 5 more Missle Expansions that can only be obtained by tricky shinesparking (Something i've only been able to achieve once.) I'd rather it was obtainable using the Screw attack or something.
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I guess you never heard me talk about Metroid before.
I guess I haven't.
And Super is just all around more enjoyable thanks to not needing a Morph Ball Shinespark (Something the GBA games overdid.)
Uh, Fusion didn't have Ballspark. That's MZM only. Even so, there's only like four places that need it. Super's Shinespark was always annoying to do. Whenever I wanted to go sideways, the game wouldn't let me. And the fact you lose health when you do it is kinda gay. Fusion fixed all that, made it much more user friendly.
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Super's Shinespark was always annoying to do. Whenever I wanted to go sideways, the game wouldn't let me. And the fact you lose health when you do it is kinda gay. Fusion fixed all that, made it much more user friendly.
Yeah, I hated that too. I died from that once >.>. In Fusion, the fact that you didn't take any damage was nice. I hope that it isn't a pain to do in Other M, given the controller limitations.
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I don't get why Super used anything but the D-Pad to steer the shinespark. Just makes the thing more trouble than it's worth.
Morph-ball shine sparking is somewhat pointless, but I don't see it as detracting from the game either. It's used rarely enough. It just is what it is.
Nope! I meant both Xtreme games, fanboy! :P
Notify Webster: "Fanboy" has been redefined to mean, "knows how to press the Jump button in mid-air".
BAZINGA!!!
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You only need Morph Ball Shinesparking to get 100% in Zero Mission, because some items can only be obtained with it. It's annoyingly tricky to the point that I never even bothered to beat that game 100%.
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Notify Webster: "Fanboy" has been redefined to mean, "knows how to press the Jump button in mid-air".
BAZINGA!!!
Or "deals with [acid burst] poor controls cause Iris is in game!" 8)
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I was happy that I did manage to get 100% in MZM. The thing is, you had to backtrack to get everything.
It was a good under-2-hours run that I was proud of, and I can manage to do a any% casual run in 40 minutes too. Good times. x3
The things I liked with MZM was revisiting the original game but totally remade, including the map itself.
It was a completely new experience and there were some cutscenes that made the game feel exciting too, along with the GBA-quality music. ^^
And so many power-ups were added with inspiration that we know and love from Super Metroid.
Kraid was so big! XD
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Yeah, Zero Mission did rock... :D
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I was happy that I did manage to get 100% in MZM.
Did that myself too. Of course, it took me a good 3-4 hours... :\
And, despite the awkward controls for the Super Shinespark and the loss of health. I rather liked it that you could activate it when you wanted with a Run button. Something that will probably never be seen again in a Metroid game, instead opting for automatic running that is about the same speed as walking.
Uh, Fusion didn't have Ballspark. That's MZM only. Even so, there's only like four places that need it.
I'm aware that Fusion didn't have the Morphball Shinespark. But I'm mentioning that Nintendo made an awful lot of Speed Booster Puzzles in Both Fusion and Zero Mission. Personally, I'd prefer finding hidden rooms with an extra one possibly hidden under a Power Bomb Block. Or even tricky Morphball mazes, but thats just me. I think if they eliminated some of the Speed Booster Puzzles people would complain over a lack of difficulty with getting hidden items.
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Damn I look forward to playing Zero Mission and Fusion. Just by the comments here :D
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That's the main thing I liked about Prime. No Speed Booster puzzles. -_-
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Or "deals with [acid burst] poor controls cause Iris is in game!" 8)
I could care less about Iris, and I find NO problem with Xtreme 2's control.
Its just you who doesnt like the controls.
Xtreme 2 has some of the most solid controls, coupled with proper dash momentum. pressing the jump button midair for an air dash is actually easy as opposed to pressing another button for the dash. and down+jump for ground dash was not too bad either. Now, if it had been at the least a GBA game, then maybe it would have used shoulder buttons for dashing.
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I could care less about Iris, and I find NO problem with Xtreme 2's control.
Its just you who doesnt like the controls.
Xtreme 2 has some of the most solid controls, coupled with proper dash momentum. pressing the jump button midair for an air dash is actually easy as opposed to pressing another button for the dash. and down+jump for ground dash was not too bad either. Now, if it had been at the least a GBA game, then maybe it would have used shoulder buttons for dashing.
LoL, but you also admittedly like "shitty" games with "shitty" controls, so guess how valid your opinion is to me? ;)
And yes, if it had been a GBA game, then obviously I wouldn't have had a problem with the controls. The MMZ game I played seemed to control pretty flawlessly. But alas, NES controls for a SNES controller type game just sucks. No dash button = no dash jumping off walls, which sucks for an X game.
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Never said anything bout shitty controls. I can ignore a games flaws, but within the megaverse, even X7 had alright controls. it was just the dash wall kicking that was broken. (which is engine problems, not controls)
But then again, im talking to the picky guy who (besides not playing Xtreme 2 just because of his usual control setup preference) wont play X7 because X is not available from the start.
What do you do with Bass in 10 then? do you refuse to play as him because his dash uses the slide controls? (I may remember wrong- but I dont recall 10's bass having command dash)
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Never said anything bout shitty controls. I can ignore a games flaws,
Oh if but I had the energy and overall caring to peruse one of the old Sonic topics to counter this point! XD
But then again, im talking to the picky guy who (besides not playing Xtreme 2 just because of his usual control setup preference) wont play X7 because X is not available from the start.
What do you do with Bass in 10 then? do you refuse to play as him because his dash uses the slide controls? (I may remember wrong- but I dont recall 10's bass having command dash)
And I 100% admit that my reasons for not playing X7 are stubborn and entirely based upon stubborn principals. Again, to me it's like having to unlock our dear Samus Aran in her own game series. But I digress, as I shall be *shudder* forced to play that....probably Tuesday, actually! Someday next week, anyway. 8D
And in all honesty I have not played as Forte yet in MM10, so I couldn't tell you. I've only beaten it with Blues & Rock. However, if we are comparing Bass to Xtreme X, slide-dash controls were never my problem. It was not being able to dash-jump up or off of walls. Since last time I checked, Forte cannot grab & slide down walls like our beloved Maverick Hunters, so if this remains true then no I shouldn't have a problem with Forte.
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Your going to be forced to play X7? D: Why dont you get forced to play Xtreme 2 instead? Its a much better game, and you cant dash jump up walls in either of the two, so why not choose the " lesser evil "?
Also- if you admit that not playing X7 is based on a stubborn principle- Would you admit the same for Xtreme 2?
it's like having to unlock our dear Samus Aran in her own game series.
YOU PLAY AS A METROID AND UNLOCK SAMUS HALFWAY IN WHEN UMM... WHEN SHE REGAINS HER FULL POWER SUIT AFTER LOOSING IT TO A NEW MISSION. 8D
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Sooo, Fusion?
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Your going to be forced to play X7? D: Why dont you get forced to play Xtreme 2 instead? Its a much better game, and you cant dash jump up walls in either of the two, so why not choose the " lesser evil "?
Also- if you admit that not playing X7 is based on a stubborn principle- Would you admit the same for Xtreme 2?
Because said person forcing me to play X7 wants me to experience the horrors of how shitty that game really was. It's a torturous friendship we have! We're also gonna sit down and watch Dragonball: Evolution as well. XD
And no, there's a difference. I didn't play X7 because of the principal of having to unlock the main character of his own goddamn series. It had little to nothing to do with the controls of X7. I actually don't even know how awful the controls of X7 really are, because I didn't even play enough of the game to remember it. I only go by what MM expert Ninja Lou has told me.
Xtreme 2 is different. I won't play that because the control scheme sucks. It's forcing me to play an SNES controller scheme style game on a NES controller. If I wanted to play NES controller style MM games, I'd play the Classic series. Hell, on the GB, I'd pop in the far, FAR superior MM World games. Also with the Xtreme games, I also go by what MM expert Ninja Lou has told me, who's MM opinion I trust more than anyone else in the world. No matter what, no matter how terrible the control scheme is or how shitty the overall game is, Ninja Lou will suffer through it because he's a true, hardcore MM fan. So, when HE tells me the control scheme for Xtreme 2 is pretty much just as shitty as Xtreme 1, that's the only opinion I need to hear.
YOU PLAY AS A METROID AND UNLOCK SAMUS HALFWAY IN WHEN UMM... WHEN SHE REGAINS HER FULL POWER SUIT AFTER LOOSING IT TO A NEW MISSION. 8D
Was this a GB/GBA Metroid game I don't know about. In terms of portable Metroid's, I've only played The Return of Samus.
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So, when HE tells me the control scheme for Xtreme 2 is pretty much just as shitty as Xtreme 1, that's the only opinion I need to hear.
is it Lou whos making you play X7? XD
Also, DISAGREEMENT! Xtreme 2 has better controls than Xtreme 1. I strictly recall Xtreme 1 actually setting the select button for the dash. :| I havent played it in a while so I dont remember much about that game anymore though.
But control scheme aside, you cannot dash jump up walls in X7 either because of its broken engine.
I STILL say that its a stubborn opinion when Xtreme 2 is a damn fine game with the simple misfortune of being limited by its hardware. Hell, its up there on my top favorites list along with X4.
Was this a GB/GBA Metroid game I don't know about. In terms of portable Metroid's, I've only played The Return of Samus.
T'was a joke, sir.
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is it Lou whos making you play X7? XD
HAHAHA, oh dear me no. Ninja Lou is many things, but he does not believe in torture of the mental kind. He forces me to play good games, like Chrono Trigger or Perfect Dark.
Also, DISAGREEMENT! Xtreme 2 has better controls than Xtreme 1. I strictly recall Xtreme 1 actually setting the select button for the dash. :| I havent played it in a while so I dont remember much about that game anymore though.
Like I said, I trust Ninja Lou's opinion more than anyone else in regards to MM. Hell, I trust his opinion more than anyone else when it comes to pretty much gaming itself. He is an older, wiser, and much more experienced gamer than pretty much.....well I'd say everyone on RPM. 8)
Also, I said pretty much just as shitty, which means that they might be a tad better, but not enough to make me play it.
But control scheme aside, you cannot dash jump up walls in X7 either because of its broken engine.
Then I'm looking forward to this torture even less! :V
I STILL say that its a stubborn opinion when Xtreme 2 is a damn fine game with the simple misfortune of being limited by its hardware. Hell, its up there on my top favorites list along with X4.
a damn fine game with the simple misfortune of being limited by its hardware.
the simple misfortune of being limited by its hardware.
limited by its hardware.
-AC
See. Look at what I just bold quoted above. Get ready now. Pay attention...
THAT'S WHAT I SAID! THAT. WAS. MY. POINT. It is an SNES style game limited by the hardware it's on. The key word there being LIMITED, as in, the controls are LIM-IT-ED! It is that limitation why I don't play the game. Why would I play that game over any of the SNES/PS1/PS2 X series games, which do not limit my control options?
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However, my point is, you cant say its a "shitty" game when it all boils down to simply your opinion on control schemes. The game is far from shitty, and If Lou says its shitty, probably for the same reason as you- the same goes for him.
You could say, "I think it has a shitty control setup" or something similar, but you cant exactly say the game is shitty when youve never played it, and when there is not much complaint over the game being shitty. X7 for example, is generally widely accepted as being a rushed game that should have baked some extra time in the Cap-Oven.
And yet Xtreme 2, while people may berate it for its graphics or sound, (or dare I say it- control setup) otherwise is hailed as a generally good game. Maybe part of that comes from how bad Xtreme 1 was, granted, but thats still doesnt mean the game itsef isnt good. the game itself is pretty damn good. Feels just as good as the SNES games.
My overall point is really, in the end, against you calling it an overall "shitty" game just over your preference of controls... To me, its just as stubborn as the X7 deal. (except, X7 IS somewhat shitty. I like it, but I cannot deny its failures.)
...
I think we should stop arguing about Megaman now... :\
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However, my point is, you cant say its a "shitty" game when it all boils down to simply your opinion on control schemes. The game is far from shitty, and If Lou says its shitty, probably for the same reason as you- the same goes for him.
Um, actually I can say it's a shitty game, because I think it has shitty controls, thereby making it a shitty game. Isn't it amazing how opinions work that way? LoL, and as I have stressed the past 2 posts, I trust Ninja Lou's opinion far, FAR more than yours or anyone else on this board. being that he has been playing MM games before some of the people on this board, including you if I'm not mistaken, were ever born. I've known him for a good 17 years now, and if he tells me the control scheme is shitty, and that it is a shitty game, then that is all the proof I need.
You could say, "I think it has a shitty control setup" or something similar, but you cant exactly say the game is shitty when youve never played it, and when there is not much complaint over the game being shitty. X7 for example, is generally widely accepted as being a rushed game that should have baked some extra time in the Cap-Oven.
Oh but I can. If the testimony of one of my longest known MM expert friends wasn't enough to convince me, I actually watched Vixy stream it on her Justin.TV channel, and it looked horrendous, with her complaining about the controls at times during her live stream, dying due to limited shitty controls. That's now visual proof, as well as a minor complaint at times as well as a major one from my longest known MM playing friend. They have told & shown me reasons why never to play the game, and you and ShellIris have yet to provide a solid argument as to why I should play a limited game over the SNES/PS1/PS2 X series games, other than "It's got better Dash Mechanics" and "PLAY THE DAMN GAME ALREADY, PB!" XD
And yet Xtreme 2, while people may berate it for its graphics or sound, (or dare I say it- control setup) otherwise is hailed as a generally good game. Maybe part of that comes from how bad Xtreme 1 was, granted, but thats still doesnt mean the game itsef isnt good. the game itself is pretty damn good. Feels just as good as the SNES games.
Hahaha, bullshit. If it felt as good as the SNES games, I wouldn't have a problem with it. If they remade the game for the DS or PSP, or hell even the GBA, I wouldn't have a problem with it. IN FACT, THEY DID REMAKE A SNES GAME FOR THE PSP. It's called Maverick Hunter X, and guess what? I didn't have a problem with the control scheme at all! Can you guess why? 8D
My overall point is really, in the end, against you calling it an overall "shitty" game just over your preference of controls... To me, its just as stubborn as the X7 deal. (except, X7 IS somewhat shitty. I like it, but I cannot deny its failures.)
And my point is that I can call it whatever the hell I want. You yourself just said that it "has the simple misfortune of being limited by its hardware" and it is that limitation of controls (not graphics or sound) why I think it's a shitty game. I don't play X7....or soon didn't play X7....because the main character of the series, X, had to be unlocked. It has nothing to do with the controls of the game, the sound, etc. It's a stupid reason based entirely on stubborn principals, and I fully admit to it! However the Xtreme games will never be played, not due to story, character, or principals, but rather because the X style of MM game play is not suited for an NES controller, and I cannot play it like a true X game, therefore making it shitty in my opinion.
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I did like X7, but the controls were bad (example: Air Forces stage) at times. There were completely unnecessary features too. And having to unlock X was a bit dumb.
As for Xtreme, the controls can be bad. It is limited.
And if one ever needs to know the story elements included in those games, there's a handy timeline to consult.
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you and ShellIris have yet to provide a solid argument as to why I should play a limited game over the SNES/PS1/PS2 X series games, other than "It's got better Dash Mechanics" and "PLAY THE DAMN GAME ALREADY, PB!"
Surely as a Megaman fan you have to have SOME urge to play or "try em all" dont you? At least it works that way for me. I heard X7 was bad, but I wanted to play it anyway to see what I personally made of it, despite others opinions, no mater how "expert".
Also, funny, but I never found the controls to be a problem, or to limit my actions, resulting in death. Maybe I just adapted, but when i died, I died an honest death, because I made a bad play while fighting a boss.
But then again, im not Vixy. And although I would like to be it- Im no Megaman expert.
Whatever. You hate it, Me and Shelly love it, opinions opinions, we all have em.
If Shelly wants to add to the discussion he can just jump right in, but im done trying, and going to bed.
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Surely as a Megaman fan you have to have SOME urge to play or "try em all" dont you? At least it works that way for me. I heard X7 was bad, but I wanted to play it anyway to see what I personally made of it, despite others opinions, no mater how "expert".
Nope. No urge whatsoever. That's Ninja Lou. He will play every series game, no matter how much he hates it or how much it can [acid burst] him off, and he will suffer through it and beat it because he's "hardcore" like that. I am not that type of gamer. No matter how much I love a series, if a game frustrates me, I simply put it away and never touch it again.
Also, I do not have the time that my younger, less responsibility plagued youth afforded me to play games anymore. I still have to play through the Zero series (I should pick up that DS collection for my trip) and finish the Legends series (and before you jump on me for this, I never owned a PS1 and I got a PS2 later than a lot of people) and plus new games just keep coming out, like the soon to be released Metroid: Other M game. So my gaming time is somewhat limited.
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I didn't even know people still harp PB over not playing the Xtreme Games. I mean, sure, they're okay if you wanna get over their dodgy controls and enjoy Mega Man X on a bus ride or at school or something, but they're really not worth going out of your way to play.
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As I said, if you need to know what happens storywise in them, there's a handy timeline. Not that there's much to know.
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(and before you jump on me for this, I never owned a PS1 and I got a PS2 later than a lot of people)
Oh Ive never played Legends myself. I was juuuust getting into Megaman when Legends was out, and I just didnt care about it. only NOW do I regret that, considering finding a COMPLETE copy of both games costs just as much as a brand new game nowadays. And not only am I lazy, but low on cash to buy them.
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Pfft... who needs PHYSICAL copies? :D
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Pfft... who needs PHYSICAL copies? :D
Because pirating Legends 2 and Tron Bonne is a fruitless endeavor. For whatever reason, no matter how clean your rip, you're always going to get graphical errors and what not.
And of course, [tornado fang]ing ebay has jacked the prices up so ridiculously that trying to get a legit copy requires an arm and a leg.
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*looks at the usual "PB being stubborn and everyone else tying to convince him he's wrong" arguement that happens every single time Xtreme2 is mentioned*
...was I the only one to not have any single trouble with the controls at all even with the first Xtreme game and had no idea people called them shitty before?
Anyways...when was Other M coming out again?
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Anyways...when was Other M coming out again?
August 31st for NA
September 3rd for EU
September 2nd for JP & AU
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Oh Ive never played Legends myself. I was juuuust getting into Megaman when Legends was out, and I just didnt care about it. only NOW do I regret that, considering finding a COMPLETE copy of both games costs just as much as a brand new game nowadays. And not only am I lazy, but low on cash to buy them.
Well if you're ever interested, I know a store in the city that sells both of them.
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Well if you're ever interested, I know a store in the city that sells both of them.
I am VERY interested. Id always prefer to buy them in a shop or something rather than online.
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The store is called Video Games New York. It's on 6th St. and Bowery.
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a solid argument as to why I should play a limited game over the SNES/PS1/PS2 X series games
Because the game is epic. But that's your loss.
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I'll happily take that loss! XD
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I miss when this was a thread for Other M. Man, those were the days.
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I haven't seen graphical errors on DASH 2 at all.
Now Tron Bonne... I need to get ePSXe to work to play that, since pSX doesn't support it.
Anywho, Other M... can't wait for day 1 reviews.
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Well, I'm psyched for Other M, but there's only so much one can talk about a game that they're incapable of playing yet.
Or "deals with [acid burst] poor controls cause Iris is in game!" 8)
Please, if Iris were my only concern, I'd stick to my X4 voice hack and be done with it.
Never once in Xtreme2 will you cancel out of a support unit because some moron decided to leave the weapon switch on the back side of your controller. Neither so will you ever dash directly into a pit because of some inexplicable game-enforced dash-jump lag. That's two counts on which MM10's controls are a LOT shittier than Xtreme2's, and you don't see me boycotting that game.
And never forget the Ultimate Buster. It's like RMRM Blues, except in a game that doesn't otherwise suck.
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Oh God... I had forgotten all about that!
Not only is it like Blues, but BETTER. Ultimate buster can be paired with buster+ 1 and 2, speed shot, and the games rapid fire, to cause RAAAAPE. It's far better than X6's Ultimate buster.
Which is another cool thing. The game's rapid fire. Its like a MACHINE GUN
...
*re plays Xtreme 2*
Also, Save your breath Hyper- He is clearly bent on never playing it for the dash controls meaning a lack of Dash wall kick meaning he cant play it how he likes to, and because Lou thought it was as shitty as Xtreme 1. (although that is a comparison that really deserves a magical fish /Zee uppercut)
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I don't doubt it, but I get bored.
So, when HE tells me the control scheme for Xtreme 2 is pretty much just as shitty as Xtreme 1, that's the only opinion I need to hear.
Just to reiterate what Flame said, Lou is wrong. Period. Whether you like Xtreme2 and whether it is superior to Xtreme1 are two different questions. Xtreme1 has no air-dash (which adds a LOT; with proper momentum it makes dash-wall-kicking obsolete) and uses Select as a dash button, which is completely senseless.
The MMZ game I played seemed to control pretty flawlessly.
What value is there in the controls that redundant saber skills seek?
Fish Fang, FTW.
No dash button = no dash jumping off walls, which sucks for an X game.
You must really hate Hyper Dash.
And uh....Xtreme1 has an auto-dash-wall-kick. Not my idea of a good upgrade, but I'm just saying, it's there.
I actually watched Vixy stream it on her Justin.TV channel, and it looked horrendous, with her complaining about the controls at times during her live stream, dying due to limited shitty controls.
Wow. Just, wow. I never knew that Vix sucked that badly. And this is coming from somebody who found a unique way to die on MM10's Easy Mode, for God's sake.
If you're going to blame an Xtreme2 death on something, you could at least blame it on the screen size. Anybody who honestly got killed by Xtreme2's control setup, well, I can't imagine how the Zero series doesn't eat them alive.
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And uh....Xtreme1 has an auto-dash-wall-kick. Not my idea of a good upgrade, but I'm just saying, it's there.
I was just about to mention that.
So- ironically, theres more chance of PB playing Xtreme 1, other the one of the two which is actually good?
Also, may I add, in the Xtreme titles, X at least- seems faster than on the SNES, even without the dash. His normal walking speed alone has GOT to be at least 1 percent faster than usual. which makes dashing alone something not exactly necessary.
And this is coming from somebody who found a unique way to die on MM10's Easy Mode, for God's sake.
Im curious.
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Never once in Xtreme2 will you cancel out of a support unit because some moron decided to leave the weapon switch on the back side of your controller.
Use a goddamn Classic Controller then so you don't have to contort your goddamn hand to avoid the goddamn B button. Or just, you know, teach yourself not to do it. If you have enough goddamn hand control to move a goddamn Wiimote and goddamn Nunchuk at the same time in goddamn Godzilla, you should have enough goddamn hand control to not push a goddamn button.
Oh the goddamn irony of control issues.[spoiler]In case you couldn't tell, the repeated use of goddamn is meant to show how goddamn hilarious I find all this.[/spoiler]
Back to Other M for a second, now that the trailers are showing more of the game, I realize now how much more fantastic this game is going to be. For the longest time, there were only indoor areas being shown. Not that this made me think the entire game was going to be in space stations, mind you. But some of the other areas, like the fire and ice worlds, look beautiful. Why not hype up the art as well as the story, huh?
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Well I think I will purchase and enjoy Other M.
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Why not hype up the art as well as the story, huh?
Im guessing they just want the player to experience everything for the first time when they play. not have the beauty of the scenery spoiled by trailers.
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Well I think I will purchase and enjoy Other M.
To be honest... At first, I didn't really want the game, Now I do. >.>;
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I'm certainly more excited for Other M now than I was before. Visuals are looking better, as are the wider variety of environments. Confirmation of actual Varia helps, too.
Im curious.
Sheep Man's stage. I was walking along the floor where the higher route requires disappearing block jumping, and an Easy-Mode block unexpectedly appeared over my head during a jump, sending me down into a pit.
Use a goddamn Classic Controller then so you don't have to contort your goddamn hand to avoid the goddamn B button.
With the full and sole exception of SNES titles, if I wanted to use the Classic controller, I'd use the GCN controller. Regardless, NES-style Wii remote not working properly in NES-style MegaMan game is pretty hard to excuse. They couldn't use A and Minus?
Or just, you know, teach yourself not to do it. If you have enough goddamn hand control to move a goddamn Wiimote and goddamn Nunchuk at the same time in goddamn Godzilla, you should have enough goddamn hand control to not push a goddamn button.
I never said I couldn't do it, I said it's annoying. As I already stated in my previous post I have not neglected MM10 in spite of those annoyances.
And Godzilla's not that difficult. Not if you're already used to Rabbid dancing. Which apparently the majority of the gaming press is not. Control issues with Godzilla were over after the second or third stage. Control issues with MM10 persist after the second or third playthrough. Still a fun game, still better level design than 9.
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I actually watched Vixy stream it on her Justin.TV channel, and it looked horrendous, with her complaining about the controls at times during her live stream, dying due to limited shitty controls.
O^O Wha? Huh?
Wow. Just, wow. I never knew that Vix sucked that badly.
That's because I didn't suck at all.
23. (Friday) Rockman X2: Soul Eraser (01 (http://www.justin.tv/a/vixyrpm/b/258692250), 02 (http://www.justin.tv/a/vixyrpm/b/258692247), 03 (http://www.justin.tv/vixyrpm/b/258692245), 04 (http://www.justin.tv/a/vixyrpm/b/258692243), 05 (http://www.justin.tv/a/vixyrpm/b/258692240), 06 (http://www.justin.tv/vixyrpm/b/258692230))
PB please, this isn't funny anymore. Stop embarrassing yourself. =3=
Don't use myself as bait into thinking I suck at a game that I really love so dearly.
Please say you're sorry. O^O
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Never once in Xtreme2 will you cancel out of a support unit because some moron decided to leave the weapon switch on the back side of your controller. Neither so will you ever dash directly into a pit because of some inexplicable game-enforced dash-jump lag. That's two counts on which MM10's controls are a LOT shittier than Xtreme2's, and you don't see me boycotting that game.
And never forget the Ultimate Buster. It's like RMRM Blues, except in a game that doesn't otherwise suck.
.....it's classic MegaMan. Why would you even use the weapon switch button on the back of the WiiMote instead of just pausing and selecting your weapon......or for that matter, not use the Classic Controller, GCN, or the even more awesome Classic Controller Pro if that were even an issue? Hey, what a novel idea.....controller options! XD
LoL, and why bring up a weapon which I know nothing about, you know, being that I haven't played the game, nor said weapon having anything to do with the controls?
Also, Save your breath Hyper- He is clearly bent on never playing it for the dash controls meaning a lack of Dash wall kick meaning he cant play it how he likes to, and because Lou thought it was as shitty as Xtreme 1. (although that is a comparison that really deserves a magical fish /Zee uppercut)
Hahaha. You should know full well that nerds do not know how to save their breath!
I don't doubt it, but I get bored.
Seeee! 8D
Just to reiterate what Flame said, Lou is wrong. Period. Whether you like Xtreme2 and whether it is superior to Xtreme1 are two different questions. Xtreme1 has no air-dash (which adds a LOT; with proper momentum it makes dash-wall-kicking obsolete) and uses Select as a dash button, which is completely senseless.
And yet again, who's opinion do you think I value more? Go on, guess? 8)
What value is there in the controls that redundant saber skills seek?
Fish Fang, FTW.
Beats me. I didn't play a whole lot of the game. Bumpy bus rides meant lots of GBA deaths with platformers, so I never got around to it! Hopefully the train ride is smooth coming home from my trip this week, so I can play my newly bought Zero Collection.
You must really hate Hyper Dash.
*in The Most Interesting Man In The World Voice*
I have no idea what this is!
And uh....Xtreme1 has an auto-dash-wall-kick. Not my idea of a good upgrade, but I'm just saying, it's there.
Auto meaning I can't control it. Bravo! XD
Wow. Just, wow. I never knew that Vix sucked that badly. And this is coming from somebody who found a unique way to die on MM10's Easy Mode, for God's sake.
If you're going to blame an Xtreme2 death on something, you could at least blame it on the screen size. Anybody who honestly got killed by Xtreme2's control setup, well, I can't imagine how the Zero series doesn't eat them alive.
Perhaps she was complaining about the screen size, or the fact that it was on an emulato.....wait, you died on Easy Mode in MM10? How is that even possible?
So- ironically, theres more chance of PB playing Xtreme 1, other the one of the two which is actually good?
Also, may I add, in the Xtreme titles, X at least- seems faster than on the SNES, even without the dash. His normal walking speed alone has GOT to be at least 1 percent faster than usual. which makes dashing alone something not exactly necessary.
Clearly, there's no chance! I'm actually loving the fact that you two keep trying! It's hilarious! XD
Well I think I will purchase and enjoy Other M.
I'm hoping that Nintendo World has some kind of cool Metroid: Other M launch event that I can go to when I pick up my game. I gotta say, even though I'm not the hugest Metroid fan, like the majority of people in the thread...
(http://www.starstore.com/acatalog/metroid-prime-gunship.jpg)
I still kinda want this every time I walk into Nintendo World. What's dangerous is that I can "technically" afford it right now too! 8D
O^O Wha? Huh?
That's because I didn't suck at all.
PB please, this isn't funny anymore. Stop embarrassing yourself. =3=
Don't use myself as bait into thinking I suck at a game that I really love so dearly.
Please say you're sorry. O^O
Perhaps I was mistaken in what I saw and saw you type, so my apologies! Heh, it's not like I can prove it anyway! XD
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I might have known you slandering Vix's gameplay.
*UPPERCUT!!*
Why would you even use the weapon switch button on the back of the WiiMote instead of just pausing and selecting your weapon......
You wouldn't. Did you not gather from my post that I was referring to an unintentional button press? That's what happens when large hands hold the Wii remote sideways, B button gets in the way easily.
In a way, the fact that nostalgia demands you NOT use it kind of compounds the problem. If you don't use the B button for anything, the need to avoid it gets more forgettable. Until you cancel out of a Jet/Treble Boost, anyway.
LoL, and why bring up a weapon which I know nothing about
I figured you wouldn't, but I don't really care. If you think I'm honestly trying to change your mind, think again. I say again, I just get bored. :P
I have no idea what this is!
You haven't played X5 or X6 either?
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You wouldn't. Did you not gather from my post that I was referring to an unintentional button press? That's what happens when large hands hold the Wii remote sideways, B button gets in the way easily.
.......I have large hands and that's never been an issue with me. I mean, unless you have hands like A-Rod or a basketball player, then maybe! XD
I figured you wouldn't, but I don't really care. If you think I'm honestly trying to change your mind, think again. I say again, I just get bored. :P
Which is why I always love bringing this up. It's hilarious! 8)
You haven't played X5 or X6 either?
X5 yes. X6 no.
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LoL, and why bring up a weapon which I know nothing about, you know, being that I haven't played the game, nor said weapon having anything to do with the controls?
*in The Most Interesting Man In The World Voice*
I have no idea what this is!
You seem to have missed X6.
I dont remember if X5 had Hyper Dash though...
EDIT:
God damn you people typing faster than me.
X5 yes. X6 no.
Ever plan on playing X6? Or is that also on your list of "too stubborn to play"?
And yet again, who's opinion do you think I value more? Go on, guess?
The one who has no freaking idea what hes talking about when he says Xtreme 2 is "just as shitty" as Xtreme 1?
BTW, might wanna fix your quotes up there.
Clearly, there's no chance! I'm actually loving the fact that you two keep trying! It's hilarious!
Well, you cant blame us for trying.
After all,
Hahaha. You should know full well that nerds do not know how to save their breath!
8D
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.......I have large hands and that's never been an issue with me. I mean, unless you have hands like A-Rod or a basketball player, then maybe! XD
If you're playing MM10 with the Classic/Pro controller, it damn well shouldn't be. And there's no other game I can recall where that was a problem.
X5 yes. X6 no.
Blame the game's anti-completionist Part layout, then.
Ever plan on playing X6? Or is that also on your list of "too stubborn to play"?
Oh, if he's not playing Xtreme2, I sincerely doubt he will play X6. I love X6 to death, but it is not a user-friendly game. I often refer to it as being to X what Lost Levels is to Mario.
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Ever plan on playing X6? Or is that also on your list of "too stubborn to play"?
Got nothing against X6. It fell into the Legends category of "games I never got a chance to play due to not owning system" phase. I'll get around to it one day.
The one who has no freaking idea what hes talking about when he says Xtreme 2 is "just as shitty" as Xtreme 1?
LoL, bingo!
Also, you keep misreading. I said "pretty much just as shitty." The "pretty much" part denotes that while not thinking Xtreme 2 was worse than Xtreme 1, he still hated it. Next time I bring it up, I'll say "almost just as shitty!" Will that help? 8D
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Got nothing against X6. It fell into the Legends category of "games I never got a chance to play due to not owning system" phase.
What, don't tell me you didn't even have a GC/PS2 for X Collection :P
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Eh... while Xtreme 2 is indeed a more solid game than the first, saying it controls like the home console games is taking it a bit too far. I prefer having a separate button for dashing, and I found the slide motion to get in the way from time to time.
Anywho, I'm honestly looking forward to Other M quite a bit. I get the impression it's going to be more linear than what I'd prefer, but that said it still looks fun.
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Well, if it's less linear than Fusion, it's already an improvement.
I'm anticipating it a lot more now than I was early on, although I still find one or two things questionable. But with the sheer amount of EFFORT they're putting into it, I can't NOT want it.
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Got nothing against X6. It fell into the Legends category of "games I never got a chance to play due to not owning system" phase. I'll get around to it one day.
I'll rephrase: He may eventually play X6, but I doubt he will stay with it past 20% completion.
Next time I bring it up, I'll say "almost just as shitty!" Will that help? 8D
It might. 8D
Eh... while Xtreme 2 is indeed a more solid game than the first, saying it controls like the home console games is taking it a bit too far.
I wouldn't say it controls "like" them, per se, but I would say that the benefits of proper air-dash momentum far outweigh the negatives. More so than a dash button, I'd say that Zero could use another attack button. Using the pause menu to ground-punch is a slight inconvenience.
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Now now, everyone, behave and let's have some non-locked thread fun, okies? :3
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Nl5vKBDn4g[/youtube]
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That figure is Other M's launch day reward? That figure is gorgeous.
A side note, less argue, more Other M talk.
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What, don't tell me you didn't even have a GC/PS2 for X Collection :P
Well by then I already had a PS2 and immediately went and bought the game for the collection.
X4 & X5 I first played over at Lou's house, due to my lack of a PS1! That X5 Devil story is still one of my all time faves! XD
I'll rephrase: He may eventually play X6, but I doubt he will stay with it past 20% completion.
If it has a Dash Button and plays like X4 & X5, I shouldn't have a problem with it! I mean, it's not like X games are hard! 8)
Now now, everyone, behave and let's have some non-locked thread fun, okies? :3
But I can still post in locked threads! 8D
Actually, I will happily end it here, since I won't even be able to read the responses till next Monday night, most likely. PB is ON VACATION! 0v0
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Where will we get our sexcellence? D:
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dammit, calm down on the Megaman X talk!!!
i'm even drunk for Craipstar's sake. Dammit.
Anyways
apparently there will be some big media thing going on...mainly in Europe, such as commercials before movies in theatres, and naturally on tvs and so on an so forth.
I can imagine the same for the US. Hopefully I see something before I see the Expendables.
edit:
Also
(http://i33.tinypic.com/nv8qv5.jpg)
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That would be a first, videogame advertisements before movies in theaters...
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Well, Sin and Punishment 2 has a quick commercial (same one from TVs) before even the trailers start in Canadian theatres.
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Really? Huh. Guess I'm not seeing enough movies.
Also.... is that supposed to be Samus having a flashback of K2-L?
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Damn, That pic reminds me, a Metroid Movie would be so cool.
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it's apparently a snapshot someone took when seeing the commercial/ad at gametrailers (it's not there anymore, I guess GT did a mistake).
Yeah, it's a flashback of K2-L.
I can only wonder how much of Samus' background will be shown in Other M. I know not every Metroid fan is aware of the Manga's events.
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I'm not...
Anywhere I can find this manga to make myself aware?
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I'm not...
Anywhere I can find this manga to make myself aware?
Volume 1 (http://metroid-database.com/manga/listing.php?vid=19)
and
Volume 2 (http://metroid-database.com/manga/listing.php?vid=13)
Enjoy it! it's actually not bad :3
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Thanks, man! ^.^
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Thanks, man! ^.^
Seconded! ^^
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Also
(http://i33.tinypic.com/nv8qv5.jpg)
Is that really Ridley? Head looks like an ankylosaurs...
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Oh, I'm sure it's Ridley, but he looks a lot beefier and more humanoid than usual.
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[spoiler]If you read the manga, then I think that might explain that. If she's reliving the worst part of her history, then that Ridley was still as he originally was. Before he got all [tornado fang]'d up by fire and stuff.[/spoiler]
At least that's how I see it.
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it's also a commercial.
I don't think K2-L was a metropolis either. Or my memory is failing lol.
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maybe they re-imagined a detail or two.
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Japanese commercials!!! 2 of them~
METOROIDO...OMOIRODO
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SdXtsGiw6eY&feature=player_embedded[/youtube]
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zoR9uRAqBeM&feature=player_embedded[/youtube]
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I want a black Wiimote...
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[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_CZqO5Z5uxU[/youtube]
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Wow. that was awesome.
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I want the name of that actress NAO. She's pretty... ^.^
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Damn, that's one hell of a commercial! :D
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Commercials are looking freaking awesome. Is that a Nintendo Channel download?
(*sigh* Lousy lack of internal storage...)
Volume 1 (http://metroid-database.com/manga/listing.php?vid=19)
and
Volume 2 (http://metroid-database.com/manga/listing.php?vid=13)
Enjoy it! it's actually not bad :3
SWEET! Thanks, man, I didn't know there were Metroid scanlations out there!
On Page 9 and I'm already loving it.
[spoiler=PB; NOT arguing, just commenting]If it has a Dash Button and plays like X4 & X5, I shouldn't have a problem with it! I mean, it's not like X games are hard! 8)
Oh, you poor naive fool, that's what they all said...
When the time comes, please tell Ninja Lou to video tape your reaction when you first attempt to attack a Nightmare on Xtreme Mode using the Blade Armor. I need to see this.[/spoiler]
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Yeah. The Metroid manga is awesome. I never get tired of reading it.
BTW, there is an E-Manga version of volume 1.
http://kodansha.cplaza.ne.jp/e-manga/club/manga/metroid/vol01/
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I read it all in about 2 hours.
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thinking about it, Flame could be right, some details might be reimagined.
Under the assumption they might show events from the manga.
Oh and Metroid.com got quite the update. (http://metroid.com)
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Man, Metroid: Other M looks better with every video. I can't wait for it to come out! ;O; 10 days is too long.
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You survived a good month of waiting.
10 days is a walk in the park :3
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I hope NYC gets it early, since a lot of big name games come out early in mom 'n' pop stores.
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I dont have enough money for all these AWESOME games! xD
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Neither do I, but since Metroid is my favorite franchise, I will go for Other M.
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Can't wait for the game? Do what I'm doing.
I'm playing through Super Metroid (for the first time) and may swing over to Prime 3 or the original Metroid for a while.
I've got time. Amazon's estimating my package will ship on Sept. 7.
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Well, I would play Super Metroid, but I beat that game far too many times. I guess I'll play Fusion again.
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Darn, I always miss the big arguments where I'd be able to cause more damage. =P
Anyway, being on holiday, and having a good chance to re-try it out, I find myself replaying through Metroid Prime, this time sober.
And I gotta say, I have a BIG newfond appreciation for it. I still have the same complaints about it as always, stuff like no strafing and having to stop to point still don't make much sense, and the overly big amount of scanning you have to do could have been reduced. But I can see that Retro Studios did a work of love in this game. Enough logs to seem like a Bioware game, a damn perfect translation of the Metroid gameplay into a first-person perspective, graphics that hold up with beauty even today, and damn, this shows Nintendo had the balls to do something amazingly new and excellent without being dicks and re-releasing Metroid with Metroid gameplay and Metroid design. It's pretty much the most perfect translation of a 2D franchise into 3D I've ever seen since Ocarina of Time.
The gameplay also feels like it should. Samus runs and jumps around naturally, the Morph Ball is a dream to move around, and everything fits so well I feel kinda guilty about not giving it the full appreciation it deserved earlier.
I'm hoping Team Ninja manage this big of a splash with Other M.
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Ive finally gotten around to playing Prime 2 again. I always get lost, and forget my objective there. at least 1 and 3 were much more clearer in reminding you of your objective. (and they didnt have dual world gameplay, ugh)
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The hint system always did nudged you in the right direction, but the amount of detail in the areas in prime 2 did got a bit mind numbing at times, but once ya get it, it's not so hard.
Only thing I wasn't too slightly fond of is the portal locations, but I enjoyed it very much nonetheless.
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The dark world in Prime 2 did seem like going through nothingness over and over, and was dull. But it fit its purpose, and they grew out of it.
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stuff like no strafing
But... there is strafing. Not in the conventional sense I suppose, but the strafe jump is immensely useful and works just as well.
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Bah, you people and your non-circular strafing...
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Double-analog control with strafing/aiming would have made Metroid Prime a pure orgasm. No need for silly lock-on by having the game choosing the enemies I want to aim at. That, and instantly looking at things I want to look at, instead of having to stop and point my ARM at them. 8D
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Perhaps, but then its status as First-Person Adventure would be even more dubious than it already is.
Closest thing to a true FPS Metroid would be Prime Hunters on the DS. Of course, the DS has no analogue, but the premise of touch-aiming is similar at least, and there is no lock.
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I agree on Prime Hunters being the closest to being an FPS, and the fact that it's very linear and hardly any exploration further proves this. I didn't like the controls though, despite being good considering limitations. It was very unconfortable for me. It was the only game to ever give me a blister. And I didn't even play it that much.
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It was more fun when everyone online only played as Trace and got into sniper fights... I stress "fun."
So fun, people began to use the electric guy to [tornado fang] over the Trace players. Everyone else was just too [parasitic bomb] to both playing as when electric bro stormed the scene.
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Sylux was overpowered. The Shock Coil absorbed health way too quickly, making it harder to kill Sylux, and his Alternate form was annoying, albeit Samus having the most broken one.
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Double-analog control with strafing/aiming would have made Metroid Prime a pure orgasm. No need for silly lock-on by having the game choosing the enemies I want to aim at. That, and instantly looking at things I want to look at, instead of having to stop and point my ARM at them. 8D
Go play the Wii version then. You'll be happy to know Samus can strafe just fine in that one.
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Perhaps, but then its status as First-Person Adventure would be even more dubious than it already is.
Closest thing to a true FPS Metroid would be Prime Hunters on the DS. Of course, the DS has no analogue, but the premise of touch-aiming is similar at least, and there is no lock.
Ease of control trumps "status recognition" easily. The original Metroids didn't have any lock-on capabilities to begin with. The adventuring is what makes it adventure, not the controls. Precise aiming and moving with the lightning-quick speed existant in the 2D games would not only be possible then, it would be perfected. And then, there would be no need for lock-on controls that don't always aim at the enemies you want to. Heck, the lock-on was the one thing that didn't click with the original games.
Go play the Wii version then. You'll be happy to know Samus can strafe just fine in that one.
Which is far better, I agree, but it sacrifices the turning speed and movement finesse that an analog could offer.
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Which is far better, I agree, but it sacrifices the turning speed and movement finesse that an analog could offer.
Not a problem at all.
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[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qwGYGxZTzQo[/youtube]
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That was intense.
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so whos the traitor O__O
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I'm just hoping that all of this drama translates into a decent story, with the least amount of quality, instead of degenerating into pointless cliche dramatic action the way Team Ninja have done in their games.
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Yes, because Team Ninja is 100% in control of it.
Or maybe they really are, who knows.
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It's obvious that Nintendo would pay alot of close attention to the game itself to make sure it's up to Metroid standards, but nobody really knows how much control Team Ninja has of it. And how the narrative may turn out. I don't think they'll be able to reach Retro's documental class, to be honest. Let's hope they do a good show of their own.
Posted on: August 25, 2010, 07:43:58 PM
[tornado fang] YEAH LEAK
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Well, as far as i'm concerned, it's the work of Yoshio Sakamoto and the CG team that did recent cinematics for TN (I forget their name. Anyhow, i'm certain the opening to DoA Paradise is the recent work by that team) that's more or less in charge of story and bits of working w/ TN to continue their goal of 'seamlessness'.
But w/e hopefully it comes out well.
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The one seeder who leaked the game has a crappy connection, so people are gonna have to wait awhile.
I'm gonna have to wait until tomorrow to burn the thing anyway, but I'll still be able to give early impressions. If anyone knows any cheap way to transmit footage, I'll also be able to stream some of it.
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I, personally, am waiting for rip of the music.
Mmmm... Metroid music.
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Alright, finished downloading, gonna burn it to a dual-layer DVD (haven't tried this before) and hoping it works.
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Filthy pirate. =P
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He's not the only pirate here. :J
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Everyone's a pirate. I'm just the one who admits it. =P
Aaaaand I'm gonna have to wait until tonight to get the only laptop in the house with a working DVD-R drive for me to burn that thing...
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I'm a pirate too, with all these Touhou game and whatnot that I have in my brother's computer. :b
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I once pirated one of those games.
But I couldn't find any toes or hoes.
I must've been doing something wrong.
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There's hoes in these games, you just gotta look hard enough. 8D
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Kotaku's review of Other M (http://kotaku.com/5623566/metroid-other-m-review-our-unexpected-future)
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Everyone's a pirate. I'm just the one who admits it. =P
Aaaaand I'm gonna have to wait until tonight to get the only laptop in the house with a working DVD-R drive for me to burn that thing...
There's a nasty little bit of AP on the game that causes the controls to lock out and for Samus to die at a certain point. Or so i've heard while waiting for a scrubbed USB compatible version anyway -u-'
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Most reviews seem to be good so far, but dismissive of Samus' new personality and past.
Although the art design seems to be total simplistic crap after years of Retro Studios beauty.
There's a nasty little bit of AP on the game that causes the controls to lock out and for Samus to die at a certain point. Or so i've heard while waiting for a scrubbed USB compatible version anyway -u-'
I've heard. It's still the PAL version, so I'll just keep on playing in the regular retail copy. I just want to try out the game, anyway.
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Yeah fair do's. I'd do the same if i had a decent connection speed :) But for now i'll wait for some delicious fix.
Well either way let us know how it goes.
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I couldn't find any friggin' dual layer DVD-Rs, so I had to get a DVD+R. This is gonna screw with the recording, I know. it. -_-
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Kotaku's review of Other M (http://kotaku.com/5623566/metroid-other-m-review-our-unexpected-future)
That opening cinematic was pure awesome.
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Most reviews seem to be good so far, but dismissive of Samus' new personality and past.
Although the art design seems to be total simplistic crap after years of Retro Studios beauty.
As much as I don't want to take a [parasitic bomb] on what SPD1 & Team Ninja have done here, especially without having played it myself, I thought the same thing for a looooooong time. If Retro had provided art while Team Ninja & Sakamoto did mechanics & level design, I would have exploded from the awesome. XD
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Whats wrong with simplistic?
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Whats wrong with simplistic?
Don't get me wrong, I don't mind it much, but I'm seriously in love with what Retro did with Metroid's art and in my mind they set the bar incredibly high for any and all future installments in the series (barring any delicious 2D sprite based Metroids that may or may not happen in the future). XD
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Whats wrong with simplistic?
Imagine you've had a beautiful tree by your bed for the last five years.
...now suddenly the tree is replaced with a green sphere on a brown straight vertical stick.
Sure, it might be a bit of a hyperbolic example, but everyone notices the sudden lack of amazing detail in things that Retro used to have, suddenly replaced by minimalistic sleek iPod designs where everything is single-color walls and simple-designed things.
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Kinda disappointed.
There's barely any exploration, it's just do this and do that. All the suit upgrades are "authorized" for you at the right time, so there's no "how the [tornado fang] do I beat this boss maybe it has a weakness to ___ I should explore more" but instead "hey this boss is weak against ___ here's your gun go kill it". The third to first person controls are awkward; you have to point the wiimote at the screen which is bungling and I've been getting times where it just enters fps when I didn't even point the controller. It's pretty easy, auto-targeting the enemies can [acid burst] you off because you can't chose your own targets. Also [tornado fang]ing [tornado fang] I hate the little pixel hunting you do when you're stuck in first person view and have to put your cursor over something to find it, jesus christ [parasitic bomb]'s annoying.
So yeah, it's a mediocre game and nothing true to Metroid roots. It's basically another game with Metroid slapped onto it. [tornado fang]ing Team Ninja, man. Thank god I didn't preorder this game, my friend still has his preorder and I can't talk him out of it and he'll surely hate the game as he's a diehard metroid guy with all those secret worlds and [parasitic bomb].
Is that correct?
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Well, what I've seen pretty much tells me that your enjoyment of this game is directly proportional to how much you enjoyed/hated Fusion.
Also, over half of the reviews I've seen are 75+ so personally I'm not worried.
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Well I loved Fusion.
So it seems that I will have fun.
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I saw some of the early livestream. I know i'm gonna enjoy it.
Besides, reviews are also opinions.
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Looks like the damn DVD+R DL didn't work on the burning. I'm gonna have to get an 8 gig flash drive or something.
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Um, did you try "Layer Break: 2084960"? o.o
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[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ElCOio3DZP4[/youtube]
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Wuz dat sum Ridley I herd thar?
Awesome trailer as usual. Makes me want this game more.
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Um, did you try "Layer Break: 2084960"? o.o
How do I do that?
I had an error right when it was finishing the burn. It tried 3 times, then didn't work. I just popped out the disc, tried it on the Wii, got an error.
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How do I do that?
The numbers are inside the ISO (or file that's attached to it), and a burning program uses that info to decide where to burn the second layer.
If you have a burning program like say ImgBurn, you can set it manually to '2084960'.
'Tools' menu -> 'Settings' option -> 'Write' tab -> 'Layer Break (For DL Media)'.
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The numbers are inside the ISO (or file that's attached to it), and a burning program uses that info to decide where to burn the second layer.
If you have a burning program like say ImgBurn, you can set it manually to '2084960'.
'Tools' menu -> 'Settings' option -> 'Write' tab -> 'Layer Break (For DL Media)'.
And inserting that number will most likely solve the problem? I'll try it tomorrow...
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And inserting that number will most likely solve the problem?
Um I hope so. I haven't tried it and I don't have a blank DVD-R DL for testing. >U<
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Um I hope so. I haven't tried it and I don't have a blank DVD-R DL for testing. >U<
Gonna have to get a Verbatim one, the Wii takes those very well.
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Gonna have to get a Verbatim one, the Wii takes those very well.
Yes it does. They are the best.
Also I think you have to install some new IOS and/or cIOS files too.
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Yes it does. They are the best.
Also I think you have to install some new IOS and/or cIOS files too.
I've already used Pimp My Wii to do so.
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As far as i remember Pimp my Wii doesn't put that much in terms of CIOS's in so you may need to go find some of the newer builds and install em as well.
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Updated version installed a shitton of stuff. And my Wii pretty much played any game before, so it should work.
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Everyone's a pirate. I'm just the one who admits it. =P
Correction: We all time/format-shift. That only makes us all pirates in the eyes of console manufacturers and the RIAA.
Yeah, I'm waiting until I get an actual retail disc in my hands. If I want to hack my Wii I'll stick to Riivolution; maybe add Yoshi into more stages on NSMB...
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My copy will be ready tomorrow morning so i'll give my thoughts on it then... however from what i've been hearing the faults are mostly minor things that people are blowing way out of proportion... you know, like good idiotic fanboys should owob
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I just got an 8 gig USB drive and am loading the game onto it now. Will give impressions on it as soon as it's ready to be played.
EDIT: Playing it. Love it so far. The d-pad is quite comfortable to play with and the action works well. The graphics are decent, but a little dissapointing. They're about the standards that the PS2 MGS games were. I know there's nothing wrong with it and that's still impressive, but almost ten years later, I expected a little bit more. It won't wow anyone like the Prime games did, everything looks very simplistic and minimalist, which is a bit contrary to most Metroid games, where I expect to see goo falling off the walls. But it's okay. The gameplay itself is quite good. Everything works as it should. Morph Ball doesn't move as realistically as it did in the Prime games, but it's still okay, and you can jump with it from the beginning.
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well almost beat the game in 1 go
currently near the end
i love the game thats how i wanted to play a Metroid game
action packed finisher and instantdeaths
the 1st person parts are a bit annoying though
and the story is pretty amazing imo
some pretty intense cutscenes and fights
the difficulty is not bad and finding items is quite easy
well one thing is the game is pretty similar to Fusion in its linearity
you go from area to area but can't access some parts till you get powerups like in fusion it was the security cards.
I like it though.
and i like how they made some awesome cameo bosses in the game
[spoiler]and ridley is a pkmn he evolved from a chicken xD[/spoiler]
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Since Ephi used the spoiler tag I'd like to point this out:
Please for the love of god use spoiler tags! From now on and forever!
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The game's completely linear so far. Not the kind of exploration I would expect from a Metroid game.
Anyone got any questions?
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beat the game just now
well the Final Boss was pretty amazing
[spoiler]Metroid Queen hard as hell if you have no idea what to do XD took me 3 tries
and the scenes after that ugh first person final sequence[/spoiler]
Its pretty awesome game though
i really love that game though
[spoiler]After Mission Boss Phantoon rather awesome fight now i truely beat the game awesome escape Zero Suit Scene[/spoiler]
Clear Time: 8h36m56s
Item Percantage: 75%
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Great to hear~
Actually, how fluent are the air attacks (the one where Samus lands on an enemy and blasts them point blank) and finishers in terms of execution?
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So far, there have been two.
One where you have to land on the enemy and finish it point blank, which isn't really very fluent because you have to jump on the enemy on a certain point of its animation, not when it's jumping around, and it doesn't always work...
...and one where you have to run at the enemy while charging the beam, while the enemy's down, so you can get them in a headlock and feed them beam. This one pretty much always works.
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Hmm...sounds like i'll have fun testing around the timing on that jump attack :3
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One thing I seriously dislike so far.
...so far, everything has been 100% linear. A few secret items and stuff, but everything's like a linear action game. No backtracking or exploring, just pressing forward.
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One thing I seriously dislike so far.
...so far, everything has been 100% linear. A few secret items and stuff, but everything's like a linear action game. No backtracking or exploring, just pressing forward.
Not even Fusion Linear?
But I liked Fusion, so it should be fine.
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Not even Fusion Linear?
But I liked Fusion, so it should be fine.
Fusion wasn't linear, you were just told where to go more accordingly.
...this is linear as in single path. No separate ways.
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...so far, everything has been 100% linear. A few secret items and stuff, but everything's like a linear action game. No backtracking or exploring, just pressing forward.
That's not good...
How's the story? Some complained about it being too melodramatic at times.
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Fusion wasn't linear, you were just told where to go more accordingly.
...this is linear as in single path. No separate ways.
I meant that in the way that fusion had lots of areas locked off before a certain point in the game.
so this isn't really metroid, but a shoot-em-up starring Samus with Metroid elements?
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its pretty similiar to Fusion o__o
and its an awesome Metroid imo
that kind of gameplay (minus the 1st person fail) should have been used earlier in the series
because samus is not just a beam shooting badass she can also kick ass
updated my previous post
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I meant that in the way that fusion had lots of areas locked off before a certain point in the game.
so this isn't really metroid, but a shoot-em-up starring Samus with Metroid elements?
The gameplay's full on Metroid, but you can only use your missiles in first person, which is kinda weird...
The combat's really, really neat, and the enemies I've seen have cool routines...
...but overall, you pretty much just go forward, go through Morph Ball tunnels and beat up guys. Sometimes you "backtrack", but it's more of "Oh look this tunnel took me back to this one hallway which had that door I couldn't go through before but can now."
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well its at least rather entertaining even though you are sometimes forced to go a certain way and backtracking is blocked
though its making sense on how its connected to the story were you are actually following orders
and since you get access to pretty much every area after a certain scene [spoiler]adam died (well obvious leads to fusion) after that you are pretty much free to do what you want.[/spoiler]
i like how it leads to fusion though [spoiler]remains of the metroids (new cloning facility on the space station) they took the remains of nightmare and ridley with them leading them to their X-Form[/spoiler]
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I didnt really catch most of that other M pirating technobabel, but my pal, (remember Lilwolf?) is curious if burning Other M to a disc requires a dual layer DVD due to the size.
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Yes, it does.
...and I'm not even sure if it works well.
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btw getting 100% items unlocks Hard Mode
Hard Mode removes all Items except story required items
so its basically just you 99Energy and 10 Missiles
good luck
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That's already a given on one thing.
I'm not trying it. I [tornado fang]ing hate Hard Modes that limit the game instead of expanding it.
I also hate how save points automatically save the game instead of asking you if you want to save like in other titles. Sometimes, I just want to heal up.
...and the fact that there are no health or missile pickups. You recharge missiles on your own (kinda stupid to even have missile ammo then) and if you're almost dead, you can recharge your health on your own up to one single life bar.
Not just that, enemy attacks take alot of your health away, so taking away pickups is generally stupid, because you end up having a single life bar as a standard in alot of the game's different parts.
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well still there are certain attacks and monsters especially during [spoiler]After Mission[/spoiler]
that can take away 99 energy in one attack
good you will survive that with the 0/1 Energy but its rather unlikely you can recharge your energy fast enough
well you can no damage the game though good luck trying that except early Heat areas
ok so the "Second Chance" ability is removed during Hard Mode
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I'm not trying it. I [tornado fang]ing hate Hard Modes that limit the game instead of expanding it.
...BROTHER! Why did we waste so much time fighting?!
Yeah. I might try Hard Mode once for the sake of satisfying my ego, but if it's just an item handicap then I'll never touch it again. Sounds to me like deja vu from the Zero/ZX games.
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So I found out some guy is remaking Metroid 2.
http://metroid2remake.blogspot.com/
There's a tech demo as well as a sort of mini-metroid game, Confrontation. Tried the latter, it's short but sweet. Just wish I could figure out how to morph-ball shinespark...
Also, trailers:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4wkr8samEBQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=amL8eLfn0yo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SyvCxkeBgYs
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thats pretty old news though
i wish the project would be finished soon
not sure if its abandoned
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Latest Blog entry reads August 10th, so looks like the project's still alive.
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That's already a given on one thing.
I'm not trying it. I [tornado fang]ing hate Hard Modes that limit the game instead of expanding it.
Yeah, the game will be harder, but at what cost? I'd rather have tougher enemies and more enemies than have the game hold you back to make you more cautious and thus prone to messing up more.
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...BROTHER! Why did we waste so much time fighting?!
Yeah. I might try Hard Mode once for the sake of satisfying my ego, but if it's just an item handicap then I'll never touch it again. Sounds to me like deja vu from the Zero/ZX games.
Because you think Shadow the Hedgehog has redeeming features. =P
And yeah. If it's a mode that simply limits the game... why? I can limit the game myself by not getting the health upgrades in the first place, but that's counter-productive.
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Needs more Ultimate Mode. Samus has all abilities and the Hyper Beam.
IT'S LIKE I'M SHOOTING SKITTLES EVERYWHERE!
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IT'S LIKE I'M SHOOTING SKITTLES EVERYWHERE!
SHOOT THE RAINBOW!
*AIEEEEEEE* *BOOM*
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Played a bit more so far. You know, I'm liking the game much more, but it's still much too linear. I know you can come back to previous areas, but the whole thing's such a straight line that you never really backtrack, just appear in past areas when required.
But the action parts and bosses are really, really well-done. Although I still lament the loss of pickups.
...oh, and Adam is a [tornado fang]ing [dark hold].
Very mild spoilers here, not of story, but just of stupid situation:
[spoiler]"Okay this is like, the sixth [tornado fang]ing room of fire and lava that I enter, and it saps my energy bit by bit. I've spent about 20 minutes in these places already, they're tough to go through. I wonder if there's a..."
"HEY SAMUS I'M LIKE... TOTALLY AUTHORIZING THE VARIA SUIT. CAUSE YOU NEED IT. TO PROTECT YOURSELF. IN THIS REALLY BIG HEAT YOU'VE BEEN TRAVERSING FOR AWHILE."
...wut
I can understand a military chief authorizing WEAPONS, which are things which can cause major distruction in a ship. But I've seen tons of parts which are only traverseable with the grapple beam, and no authorization. And there was a big room with a switch I needed the Wave Beam on. I didn't get it. I had to go through a whole damn labyrinth to get to it in the first place I backtracked a whole damn lot, and got to a part where monsters were killing me from another side of the wall. Guy waited a big while before telling me "LOL U SHOULD TOTALLY USE WAVE BEAM HERE I'M AUTHORIZING IT". You know, how about authorizing weapons that made all of those bosses I've faced EASIER?[/spoiler] I don't even know why Samus is obeying this guy so blindly. Since it's an SOS she received, she's probably got jurisdiction to do whatever the hell she wants and screw the Federation. Hasn't the Federation proven to be evil before anyway?
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Only in Fusion I think. Which technically hasnt happened before. Before then- Federation was just fine. Hell, they gave her free stuff like PED suits and the like.
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In Fusion it was more that the Federation brass was making stupid decisions and trying to warmonger. They couldn't get it through their heads that the Samus-X would destroy everything ever if it got off the station. So they probably weren't too happy with Samus when she crashed the thing into SR-388 and annihilated them both.
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They were evil in the manga, but I dunno if it's canon.
...but seriously, it's [tornado fang]ing bullshit. I pass through a Super Missile door and a Grapple Beam hook every five minutes. Many of these lead to easily-seeable-upgrades on the other side. Samus just doesn't have a damn mind of her own in this game. Couldn't she just have the excuse to be wearing a new prototype suit or something? Since it doesn't look much like her old suit, it would be a good excuse. She doesn't even get the big shoulders when she goes Varia. And Adam waits for me to tango with an unbeatable enemy for a bit before even authorizing me the weapon before I die. It's like the guy wants me to die. Not even small thanks or congratulations when I beat a boss, save someone or do something else.
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And Adam waits for me to tango with an unbeatable enemy for a bit before even authorizing me the weapon before I die.
Well, the guy's not psychic, it's not like he can know you'll absolutely need the weapon before the battle. Yeah, the whole autorization thing can be kinda stupid at times but at least it makes some sense. As for why she obeys him, it's a little bit of him being her superior in the mission, him being an important person for her, and bit of spoilers.
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Well, the guy's not psychic, it's not like he can know you'll absolutely need the weapon before the battle. Yeah, the whole autorization thing can be kinda stupid at times but at least it makes some sense. As for why she obeys him, it's a little bit of him being his superior in the mission, him being an important person for her, and bit of spoilers.
and because he said to her "Follow my Command!" and she agreed
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Manga is canon, Superbat. But they werent Evil there... Not that I remember. There was that one chairman who was all about war and taking the pirates to war and all that jazz, but as of the end of the manga, Keaton was appointed Chairman, and he was a more peaceful guy. if anything, they just had a serious disregard for others. they were attacking Zebes to get rid of the pirates, regardless of any hostages or not. Which is why Adam allowed Samus 42 hours to get in, get the hostage Chozos, and get out before him and the fleet got there.
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Well, the guy's not psychic, it's not like he can know you'll absolutely need the weapon before the battle. Yeah, the whole autorization thing can be kinda stupid at times but at least it makes some sense. As for why she obeys him, it's a little bit of him being her superior in the mission, him being an important person for her, and bit of spoilers.
He can see your weapons are having no effect. And he saw me try to press a switch I absolutely needed for progression 20 minutes before, before I backtracked, fought the monster, and had to go back to press the switch only because the guy granted me permission only after I was almost dying there.
...not just that... making me suffer through tons of fire life-sapping rooms before granting me the Varia suit? Why did he grant me the thing THEN? Hell, why doesn't Samus switch to a more powerful weapon to kill a tough enemy when she's almost dying? Makes no sense.
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Video Game logic? :V
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FINALLY.
[spoiler]Adam is a [tornado fang] who keeps saying "Any objections, Lady?" in order to annoy Samus. I get to a part where it's too damn long to jump normally. Samus gets sick of it, just unlocks both Space Jump and Screw Attack by herself.
"Any objections, Adam?" (with the biggest in-your-face tone I've ever seen. Now THIS is the Samus I know.[/spoiler]
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I need to stop reading spoilers, but that last one does put my mind at ease. 8)
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Man, I missed the space jump. "Flying" around feels like Super Metroid.
...just as an aside, I find it hilarious how people are bitching about Samus' personality being revealed as insecure and emotionally unstable. After so many years of having an almost-silent protagonist in all of the Metroid titles, somehow, people got the mental image that Samus was some kind of ultimate badass beneath her armor, and being constantly referenced as a fantastic example for all female characters worldwide. "This is how you make a female character who is strong and brave!"
The moment they started showing MORE of Samus, was the moment that people started disliking her. Making her hot in Smash Bros? She's always been hot according to 100%ed game endings, but actually SHOWING it? No way. Now giving her an actual personality, realistic in the fact that she saw both her families be slaughtered (in theory making her BATMAN SQUARED), and presently maintains a mentality of respect for people who respect her in return, and a narration of the events that brought her to where she was in the first place? (along with grief for the only creature who had ever protected her in her entire life, out of love?) This is purely realistic. Samus can't be some kind of female Duke Nukem to get in a planet, exterminate all of its creatures and get out. Her narration of the events is extremely Ender Wiggin style (From the Ender's Game book, for the few of those who don't understand the reference) which is actually fine by me, because although it's insecure and respectful, she realises she has a task to do, and NEVER shys away from it.
This is Samus Aran. A human being, just like you and me. Get used to it.
...Adam is still a [tornado fang]ing [dark hold], though.
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I have yet to get the game but thought this was kind of funny
Things I learned from Metroid Other M:
1)Women are weak and cannot do anything without a man ordering them around
2)Women will let their emotions get the best of them in moments of conflict, even if facing an opponent they have defeated numerous times before
3)Black people are the most expendable
4)Brevity in video games is stupid and for [Top Spin]s stuck in the 80's. Everybody loves sitting through long, unskippable cutscenes.
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I have yet to get the game but thought this was kind of funny
1- Jurisdiction, superior by law, legitimate orders, etc. (updates by herself as she needs it later on when she can't stand the bullshit)
2- Seeing as she had pretty much killed him dead last time around and judging by the beast, she was expecting something completely different, I'd be surprised too if the monster I was hunting turned out to be the dude who killed my parents. AGAIN.
3- Expendable, as in "only members important enough to have an actual death scene".
[spoiler]And seeing how he comes back, it's really not very important. Tell the person who said that to finish a game before criticizing.[/spoiler]
4- Cutscenes really are baby size compared to any kind of story-driven games. Just new to a saga like Metroid. Only big cutscene is the ending.
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yeah some people don't really use their heads at all, it honestly makes me frown at times.
But w/e, to more important things, so far just am past the authorized beam section and oh man, the game is sooooo much fun.
The controls and combat works in such a fluid way that like in effect of Bayonetta, you'll feel awesome that all the awesome [parasitic bomb] you're pulling off is all you, rather than having a ton of automatic actions for ya.
Finishers feel awesome once you figure out how to pull them off per enemy and then consistently after, and even then the game keeps putting ya in slightly different situations despite you knowing how to [twin slasher] the enemy~
Authorizations moment so far haven't been so bad, I guess for some people, dodging isn't too fluent, so they're making samus seem not....uber skilled, and as for that Varia suit moment.
The first three hallways were not...that long, so I can forgive that, at least it shows how tough Samus is (and the chip damage you get during those hot scenes is not much compared to the damage speed from Super); but I can see how it can irritate some. Before the boss was sort've of pushing it, but since Adam sees there's a possible tough enemy (and a [tornado fang]ing great boss fight), Varia suit is ok. So given by that time. I feel it's gonna REALLY variate on just the player's skill on the acceptance of 'authorization' and when it will annoy them. Nonetheless, i'll keep thinking more on so as I get farther slowly and slowly~
Again though, for Samus to take all that and still kick ass. My respect for her increases even more actually.
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Man, I missed the space jump. "Flying" around feels like Super Metroid.
...just as an aside, I find it hilarious how people are bitching about Samus' personality being revealed as insecure and emotionally unstable. After so many years of having an almost-silent protagonist in all of the Metroid titles, somehow, people got the mental image that Samus was some kind of ultimate badass beneath her armor, and being constantly referenced as a fantastic example for all female characters worldwide. "This is how you make a female character who is strong and brave!"
The moment they started showing MORE of Samus, was the moment that people started disliking her. Making her hot in Smash Bros? She's always been hot according to 100%ed game endings, but actually SHOWING it? No way. Now giving her an actual personality, realistic in the fact that she saw both her families be slaughtered (in theory making her BATMAN SQUARED), and presently maintains a mentality of respect for people who respect her in return, and a narration of the events that brought her to where she was in the first place? (along with grief for the only creature who had ever protected her in her entire life, out of love?) This is purely realistic. Samus can't be some kind of female Duke Nukem to get in a planet, exterminate all of its creatures and get out. Her narration of the events is extremely Ender Wiggin style (From the Ender's Game book, for the few of those who don't understand the reference) which is actually fine by me, because although it's insecure and respectful, she realises she has a task to do, and NEVER shys away from it.
This is Samus Aran. A human being, just like you and me. Get used to it.
...Adam is still a [tornado fang]ing [dark hold], though.
My man i [tornado fang]ing LOVE you. All i've been seeing left and right is people constantly bitching about this game for so many pointless reasons, Controls are too hard to get used to! Samus is a weak defenceless woman that relies on men! (Like G4 will have you believe), wah, wah, wah, blah, blah ,blah.
The only reasons i've had to complain about this game is that Adam is a douche (RAAARGH! VARIA SUUUUUIT DAMMIT!), it's a little too easy (and i don't have the concentration system to blame for that, i actually think the concentration thing works very well as far as the health restoration goes), there are one or two areas which are kinda "Guide dang it"-esque (which ultimately falls down to me being an idiot for not picking up on any visual clues) and the final boss being somewhat of an... anti-climax in a way i suppose.
[spoiler]I must admit the part you mentioned earlier when she unlocks stuff by herself had my laughing so damn hard. "Any Objections, Adam?" i need to go back and check what else she unlocks if anything because a friend of mine tells me that she unlocks Power Bombs at the same time and i never noticed.[/spoiler]
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[spoiler]Power Bombs are actually only unlocked for the last hit on the "final" boss. And then you unlock them for the post-story, to explore the stuff you missed. It's stupid, having put you through a tutorial with them...[/spoiler]
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[spoiler]all while laughing in your face telling you
"they are too strong too bad you aren't allowed to use them ever"
as they can instantly vaporize a human [/spoiler]
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[spoiler]BTW, what do you guys think of the TRUE final boss? I think it was kinda tacked on. Hell, I think the whole story kinda stole us of the last level buzz, we weren't even allowed in Sector Zero, and only faced Metroids in the Metroid Queen fight. I would have liked to face Metroids in the field some other times. Not just that, fighting MB in some way would have been awesome.[/spoiler]
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I just find the switching to first-person to fire missiles frustrating, since you can't move and dodging in first-person is iffy.
Oh, and I hate that enemies don't drop energy pickups. Beyond that, yeah, fun game so far.
(And I'm all for humanizing Samus, goddamn it. I always figured she had to be emotionally unstable after everything that's happened to her, anyway.)
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I just find the switching to first-person to fire missiles frustrating, since you can't move and dodging in first-person is iffy.
Oh, and I hate that enemies don't drop energy pickups. Beyond that, yeah, fun game so far.
(And I'm all for humanizing Samus, goddamn it. I always figured she had to be emotionally unstable after everything that's happened to her, anyway.)
The first-person switch is still the most fuild motion-based switching mechanic I've seen in any game.
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Today at work they were giving out free posters of Metroid Other M, I got myself one of those posters. In fact, rarely anyone was getting them, they'd get one by buying a copy of the game... looked like no one was buying today.
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Ridley Boss battle and the scenes before and after.
AWESOME, I love the feel of intensity~
and there's the first and second rounds of that gravity-changing creature. I even nearly died on the first round and still managed to recharge my life. It was so heart pounding~
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Ridley Boss battle and the scenes before and after.
AWESOME, I love the feel of intensity~
and there's the first and second rounds of that gravity-changing creature. I even nearly died on the first round and still managed to recharge my life. It was so heart pounding~
He's called Nightmare. =P He's from Fusion.
Tons of comeback bosses in the game, actually.
[spoiler]Ridley was expected, but Nightmare, Queen Metroid and Phantoon?[/spoiler]
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Wait, wasn't Nightmare an experiment made by the federation?
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I guess. But he's here too.
The extra boss doesn't make any sense either, but whatever, he's cool.
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Well, just finished the game. Along w/ the extra mission.
Overall, I VERY VERY VERY VERY AM MUCH, MUCHO PLEASED. In fact i'll play it through from the beginning, after getting 100% in the current file of course~
i'm a bit scared to try out hard mode though...
Story is also pretty damn amazing~ Samus is indeed quite the woman, very very cool.
He's called Nightmare. =P He's from Fusion.
Ah ok. I've yet to play Fusion~ and now that I finished this game, now I must hunt down a copy of Fusion~
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This game reminds me of Fusion in so many ways. Not necessarily a bad thing mind you, but it won't be topping my favourite Metroids if only for it's linearity. It's still fun though, no question about that.
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You know, the game's great and all, but...
...well, Prime SPOILED us too much on how to make a 3D Metroid work amazingly well. I think every world they throw at us will seem dull and ugly in comparison with what Retro did.
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Uh, this is really odd.
I'm stuck in 1st person after the part in sector one where Samus gets pinned. It doesn't seem like one of those parts where the game shifts you into forced 1st person either. The game's just not registering that I'm turning the remote away from the screen.
Edit: Bah, nevermind. It'd be nice if the game was -consistent- about how it locked you into first-person view! Normally it freezes the screen and turns it green if you move the remote away, but this time it didn't. What the [tornado fang], TN.
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The ending segment of the main story segment of the game was a little more lackluster than I would have liked. Something more grandiose at that point would have been preferred, something like what we got at the end of the extra segment. Now that was great.
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Weeell. I got the game first day. (left college and WALKED to the gamestop near right outside the mall- quite a distance- but i was feelin' brave.)
control wise- they are really smooth you DO need to get used to them at first. It can be a very slight bit overwhelming. But nothin you dont get used to quickly enough. After a while, (around a bit into sector 1-) youll be pullin' off Samus finishers like its nothin.
Story- it was good. I liked it. I find it funny- like was already mentioned, that people [sonic slicer] about Samus personality, even though fusion had pretty much already visited Samus personality and done similar to what this game did- only they didnt go full into it like M does.
[spoiler] Whoa, Metroid queen? didnt expect that. XD I was expecting something like Mother Brain's Super Metroid Body. So yeah. game ends... Queen defeated and all that, and I feel dissatisfied... "No mother brain battle? thats anti climactic... Oh well..." Then comes the after mission and I wind up on the bridge... Before even going in, lol, I take a look at it in FP, and think "wait a sec... a large empty room? with a giant glass dome no less? WTF are they going to make me fight here..." Then I go in and out of nowhere comes out Space brain there and Im like, "WHOA! now THATS what Im talkin bout! I knew you wouldnt let me down, game!" that battle was fun. even if a bit of a pushover given how easy a target Mother is. for an after mission boss, I was expecting something harder. but it was still very fun, and made me satisfied. then the mandatory evacuation sequence... for which Samus for some reason decides to run through exploding hallways infestd wih erratic enemies without her suit on. But hey whatever. It works. It was a nice look back into Zero suit samus gameplay. I was kind awishing she could go into FPS mode like that though. XD
One thing that I feel they really didnt tie up though, is the assasin plot.we realize that there is one, and see his work, even suspect who it might be, but after mystery assasin kills mystery GFS, thats it. Samus follow him for a while, and later discovers James dead body, (who we already have figured out is the assasin.) but after that, its never touched upon by her again. im not sure she even knows he was the assasin. hes just listed as dead, but no note of him being the assasin. they never finish with that fully. its like, once the player figures out who it is, they dropped it.
it was also a real nice touch how they had those guns shooting the energy circles at you. that really takes you back. XD (which was also another reason I was expecting it to be Mother Brain, not a Metroid Queen) I was kinda expecting to fight MB in SOME way or form.be she controlling some giant enemy, or turning into one. (unless that after mission Mother Brain thing IS her...) instead we get a forced missile shoot out where we have to target her.
also, yeah. the varia suit thing. WTF. Like seriously. Weapons is one thing? but why the [tornado fang] would she disable a [tornado fang]ing life supporting feature? Just walk out into space and take your helmet off samus, because Adam hasnt autharized it! you might as well. there was no reason for that. :| Im even willing to forgive the other mbility features, but that one takes the cake.
I love what they did with Ridley too. going from small adorable fuzzy thing to big ass space pirate commander. Makes me wonder if thats how he ACTUALLY "grew up" or if that was just simply the result of the [parasitic bomb] they were doing there and stuff. they brought him back and he evolved slowly into his final form. [/spoiler]
but still, very fun ass game.
It IS annoying though that [spoiler]EVERY [tornado fang]ing POWER BOMB DOOR IS ONE OF THOSE [tornado fang]ing MINIBOSS THINGS.[/spoiler]
and gadamn, I know you could see it in the art, but its even more noticable in game, Samus has got DEM HIPS.
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Hey umm... concerning the after mission stuff there Flame,
[spoiler]The boss is Phantoon. This is made even more clear from the concept in the gallery, check it out.[/spoiler]
As far as the main storyline,
[spoiler]The Queen Metroid was pretty kickass. I would rather have had that be the boss being controlled by MB, rather than what we got. The fight would have been more climatic that way, as well as the finalization of the story arc. I realize that they didn't want MB to be something you fight head on, but they were building up the fact that she controls the freaking metroids so much that you'd figure they would have gone that way instead of forced FPS aiming that didn't feel right as a final battle, with enemies that didn't really seem like anything more than regular grunts.[/spoiler]
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[spoiler]I got a little dissapointed that we didn't get any buildup that a Metroid Queen was the last story boss. I mean, we just go in a room after meeting a new character, and suddenly an incredibly epic boss shows up. What? After that, there's the whole story conclusion and the game "ends". Aren't we supposed to get that, THEN the boss?[/spoiler]
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Hey guys... so where can I like, download all the cutscenes (or at least some of them) from this game?
I seriously want that cutscene [spoiler]where Samus has a fear attack when she sees Ridley.[/spoiler]
I seriously want that in HQ.
Anyone can help me out?
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[spoiler][youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PPQ5GDld-5w[/youtube][/spoiler]
Then download it with http://www.zamzar.com/ i find to be the best approach.
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Had to post this:
(http://www.brawlinthefamily.com/comics/2010-09-02-268-Authorization.png)
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It was bound to happen i suppose :p Any Objections Adam?
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[spoiler]"None Samus, now go hunt that [chameleon sting]er that killed 2/4ths of my men."[/spoiler]
>.>'
<.<'
*goes back to watch some more House MD, Season 3*
Amusingly, I find fun similarities between Samus and Dr.Cameron, or i'm very sleep deprived and a natural idiot like always hoho~
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Had to post this:
(http://www.brawlinthefamily.com/comics/2010-09-02-268-Authorization.png)
Haha. she better have made her point! That was funny.
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Now unless this game gets plenty of sequels like Prime, we're not gonna see a Metroid game for a long time. ;_;
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Sadly.
Hmm. They could always go back to that ship that followed Samus after Prime 3... Make a sequel to this one, (although with the events of super and this game, it would be tough to bring back mainstays like Ridley and his pirates without some contrived explanation. (one that DOESNT involve Federation experiments going awry.)
Or they could explore after fusion. this kind of story driven metroid would work to explain what happens after Fusion- as long as like Hyper has said again and again- they bring back the power suit. Which wouldnt be too hard either. have her loose all her [parasitic bomb] like usual, maybe on a chozo planet, and when she collects it, she also gets a brand spankin' new power suit. (Hey, Zero mission did it. and Samus somehow made her suit go back to normal after Prime 3)
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Metroid 5 would be the obvious perfect choice. It would have to be either on the DS or 3DS.
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I want my Dread.
Just beat the regular story. The game surprised me, it's really good. Not my favorite Metroid, but there's really nothing wrong with it. Linear as hell, but it was expected from a game that takes a lot from Fusion, and I don't really mind. I do miss collecting upgrades, but at least authorization is a good replacement for losing your [parasitic bomb] in the beginning. Adjusting to the controls took very little time, but if a sequel is made, I hope their hardon for the Wiimote subsides. The game could benefit from an actual dodge button and a more conveniently placed Morph Ball button. The game looks fantastic, especially the non-spaceship areas. And I liked the story too. The twists at the end were nice. Though, unless I'm missing something, they [tornado fang]'d up by saying Samus was never part of a military operation after becoming a bounty hunter. Happened in Prime 3.
[spoiler]I'm still in shock and confusion that that white fuzzball with the chicken legs was Ridley. How the [tornado fang] did that happen?[/spoiler]
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[spoiler]I'm still in shock and confusion that that white fuzzball with the chicken legs was Ridley. How the [tornado fang] did that happen?[/spoiler]
Bwahaha, I think we ALL wondered that.
on that note-
[spoiler] Is it possible that it followed Samus around because it recognized her? and thus followed her and went on growing? the first encounter would make it seem so. it runs away at first- probably on instinct, but then sits there staring at Samus. [/spoiler]
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Though, unless I'm missing something, they [tornado fang]'d up by saying Samus was never part of a military operation after becoming a bounty hunter. Happened in Prime 3.
Or maybe they didn't if you know what I mean.
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Bwahaha, I think we ALL wondered that.
on that note-
[spoiler] Is it possible that it followed Samus around because it recognized her? and thus followed her and went on growing? the first encounter would make it seem so. it runs away at first- probably on instinct, but then sits there staring at Samus. [/spoiler]
It's just a clone.
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Doesnt mean much. depends on how cloning works in here. Some sci fi has clones retaining memories (or some, anyway...) he DEFINITELY had SOME sort of recollection of her, not only with the creepy way he stared at her, but by the way he behaved at sector 3. He sure seemed to recognize his nemesis.
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Now unless this game gets plenty of sequels like Prime, we're not gonna see a Metroid game for a long time. ;_;
Well there's always Zero Mission, Super Metroid, and Triology to keep you busy until the next Metroid game.
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Well there's always Zero Mission, Super Metroid, and Triology to keep you busy until the next Metroid game.
I know, replaying them. Still, it would have been nice to see another chapter of Samus' life, seeing how eager they are to flesh out a story now.
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Well here's to hoping! By the way, I hardly ever touched Echoes in my Triology game since I got it (I mainly got for MP3), so maybe I get on that soon as I can put down Sin and Punishment: Star Successor or a bit.
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Well here's to hoping! By the way, I hardly ever touched Echoes in my Triology game since I got it (I mainly got for MP3), so maybe I get on that soon as I can put down Sin and Punishment: Star Successor or a bit.
*curls into a ball and starts sobbing at the mention of MP2*
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*curls into a ball and starts sobbing at the mention of MP2*
Oh please. Just because it was the Return of the Jedi of the Metroid trilogy, it doesn't mean people should treat it like cancer.
Funny thing with games and gamers. Games are either the absolute and most blissful thing of all time, or they're the [tornado fang]ing plague and must be hated and shunned. Middle grounds are nowhere to be seen.
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*curls into a ball and starts sobbing at the mention of MP2*
METROOOIIDDD.. PPRRRRIIIEMMMM 222!!! DIDIN'T MEAN TO MAKE YOU CRY, I JUST WISH I WAS NEVER BEEN BORN AT ALL, CARRY OON, CARRY ON, IT DOESN'T REALLY MATTER.. Tttooo mmmeee..
On a side note, how did the Metroid Prime Trilogy became comparable to the Star Wars Trilogy?
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Hey, I'm middle ground with MP2. I have a lot of nitpicks with it, but that didn't stop me from playing it 100% 4 or 5 times.
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Funny thing with games and gamers. Games are either the absolute and most blissful thing of all time, or they're the [tornado fang]ing plague and must be hated and shunned. Middle grounds are nowhere to be seen.
They're actually everywhere to be seen. You're just referring to the internet.
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They're actually everywhere to be seen. You're just referring to the internet.
Whenever a group of several gamers (non-closest friends) come together, they BECOME the Internet.
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Adjusting to the controls took very little time, but if a sequel is made, I hope their hardon for the Wiimote subsides.
I don't mind the game being Wii-remote only, but my one gripe with controls is how they handled the Grapple Beam. They used a "switch" mentality rather than a "hold" mentality as pretty much every other Metroid game has done, which screwed me up a few times. Further, initiating it requires first-person view, while there are a few times (mainly in the lava area) where keeping the Wii remote in that position will botch your landing.
I have mixed feelings about item authorization. It works for anything potentially destructive. Samus is joining a military operation, so she has to play by their rules. They regulate weapons, as any organized outfit should. And you certainly don't want to accidentally Power Bomb a survivor, or even a corpse that could have given you clues. But the Varia Suit, Gravity Suit, and Space Jump? They have ZERO destructive potential. It makes no sense with them. And shouldn't the Ice Beam be considered Samus's equivalent to the GF freeze gun? Adam authorizes that for all troops when they're deployed, yet leaves Samus with the regular Power Beam.
But I can't really lay all of that at Adam's feet. Recall, the only things Samus ever deactivated on Adam's say-so were Bombs, Missiles, and Power Bombs. In other words, she of her own accord, was taking a pretty minimalist approach even before meeting with Adam, using no Ice/Wave/Plasma Beam, no Space Jump, no Screw Attack, no Varia/Gravity Suit, no Speed Booster, no Super Missile, and no Grapple Beam (although to be fair the opportunity for that one didn't really come up). The one appearance of the playable Zero Suit falls into the same vein here; there was no necessity. Apparently Samus just likes treating life-or-death situations as training, or something.
Majorly spoilerific story comments:
[spoiler]We could have stood some more specific closure as to the traitor. It seems to be James, who got his at the hands of the Metroid Queen (the "missing" soldier would be the one that the game showed being tossed into lava with no witnesses).
But then, wasn't a shot fired while Adam was in the command room? Yet when Samus retrieves his helmet, the flashback simply shows him running off in response to Samus meeting Melissa. This is after that gunshot, so what happened that both Adam and his attacker walked away? Further, Melissa herself met with a GF soldier. But if James previously tried to kill her...what was going on?
I'm also sensing some SERIOUS conflict of canon between this game and the existing Metroid continuity, especially Prime 3. Other M clearly treats Mother Brain as not simply controlling the Metroids but the leader of all Pirates. MP3, however, while it did not specifically reference Mother Brain, pretty much beat the player over the head with Aurora Unit references, including the Space Pirates capturing an Aurora which then functioned as a boss, and images of an "Aurora complex" that was very obviously Tourian. The clear implication is that Mother Brain is in the same boat. Further there are Space Pirate logs referencing a Pirate Command, and, if the Pirates cannot function without Mother Brain leading them, how could they have possibly resuscitated her after the original Metroid? And why exactly does Other M treat the Space Pirates as being synonymous with Zebesians? Zebes was a Chozo settling ground, to say nothing of Samus's freaking home, before the Pirates ever arrived there. By the same token I find it difficult to believe that the Pirates survived the loss of Zebes once, but couldn't survive it again. Why would any race capable of inter-planetary travel go extinct from the loss of one planet?
While it may not mesh perfectly with the series, the game on its own has a pretty great story. I especially loved Ridley's appearance in this game. Was epic in every sense, seeing Samus in shock, watching a rare instance where a "partner" tries to cover for her. I was actually relieved at finding Anthony alive at the end; I felt a lot of sympathy for him. I do kinda wish that something more could have been done about the GF jerks who actually supported the whole Bioweapon project, but I guess leaving them at large is kind of necessary for the lead-in to Fusion.
The ending of the game seems give the impression that this is a story first and a game second. It's awkward that the "true" story is not revealed until after Queen Metroid, the last real fight before the credits. And I use that term loosely, because she's a joke. The only thing remotely challenging about her is dealing with the swarm of her kids; once that's done, she's cake. Phantoon was much tougher, although the "extra" final boss being a rehash who authority-wise falls well below Ridley doesn't make the biggest bang in the world. Was awesome nonetheless, though, I just feel that the game lacks a properly climactic final battle.[/spoiler]
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Whenever a group of several gamers (non-closest friends) come together, they BECOME the Internet.
PAX proves that wrong, for me anyway.
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PAX proves that wrong, for me anyway.
Because they're being well entertained and monitored by complete exciting awesome. But get them together, bored, in a regular environment, talking about games freely, and you'll find out otherwise.
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Because they're being well entertained and monitored by complete exciting awesome. But get them together, bored, in a regular environment, talking about games freely, and you'll find out otherwise.
LoL, why would I want to hang around boring people? And what do you describe as a regular environment, cause I've met gamers & talked to them in bars, here at work, Nintendo World, etc., and they seem fine to me.
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LoL, why would I want to hang around boring people? And what do you describe as a regular environment, cause I've met gamers & talked to them in bars, here at work, Nintendo World, etc., and they seem fine to me.
Maybe fanboys around here are a little bit more annoying and common than the ones around there. I know very few "fair" gamers in real life, and have met very few as well.
...hell, I punched a guy in the face at Video Games Live because he wouldn't stop asking me if I liked mudkips.
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Maybe fanboys around here are a little bit more annoying and common than the ones around there. I know very few "fair" gamers in real life, and have met very few as well.
...hell, I punched a guy in the face at Video Games Live because he wouldn't stop asking me if I liked mudkips.
....Really? Daaaaamn.
Yeah, different experiences I guess. I'm not saying certain gamers aren't total unreasonable fanboys. Hell, Lou deals with some customers like that at GameStop. But for the most part, I've mostly met the "middle" crowd in real life.
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....Really? Daaaaamn.
Yeah, different experiences I guess. I'm not saying certain gamers aren't total unreasonable fanboys. Hell, Lou deals with some customers like that at GameStop. But for the most part, I've mostly met the "middle" crowd in real life.
I think it's because of the console bias over here. People don't really know anything other than Sony around here. I've played with the oldies, but the big bias makes the old gamers become gigantic Nintendo/Sega fanboys for the most part, refusing to acknoledge any game that isn't on their system, while 99% of the gamer population around here just knows two games. PES and whatever wrestling game comes next. I've been called a "Star Wars nerd" for playing Halo. YES, Halo.
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Wow. And here I thought I had a grasp of console fanboyism, but I never imagined the Sony/Microsoft rift was that deep.
....Really? Daaaaamn.
Yeah, different experiences I guess. I'm not saying certain gamers aren't total unreasonable fanboys. Hell, Lou deals with some customers like that at GameStop. But for the most part, I've mostly met the "middle" crowd in real life.
Lou works at GameStop? I'm curious, does some manager with a whip/cattle prod threaten the employees if they do not ask every customer if they want every single item on the pre-order list? Even if I've already pre-ordered something, they're still trying to sell me something else. It gets annoying real quick.
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I think it's because of the console bias over here. People don't really know anything other than Sony around here. I've played with the oldies, but the big bias makes the old gamers become gigantic Nintendo/Sega fanboys for the most part, refusing to acknoledge any game that isn't on their system, while 99% of the gamer population around here just knows two games. PES and whatever wrestling game comes next. I've been called a "Star Wars nerd" for playing Halo. YES, Halo.
............ o-O
Yeaaaaah, I don't think it's even close to being that bad here in NYC.
Lou works at GameStop? I'm curious, does some manager with a whip/cattle prod threaten the employees if they do not ask every customer if they want every single item on the pre-order list? Even if I've already pre-ordered something, they're still trying to sell me something else. It gets annoying real quick.
Oh, you don't know? Sometimes their jobs are on the line if they DON'T promote both Pre-orders or Game Informer.
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I don't mind the game being Wii-remote only, but my one gripe with controls is how they handled the Grapple Beam. They used a "switch" mentality rather than a "hold" mentality as pretty much every other Metroid game has done, which screwed me up a few times. Further, initiating it requires first-person view, while there are a few times (mainly in the lava area) where keeping the Wii remote in that position will botch your landing.
I have mixed feelings about item authorization. It works for anything potentially destructive. Samus is joining a military operation, so she has to play by their rules. They regulate weapons, as any organized outfit should. And you certainly don't want to accidentally Power Bomb a survivor, or even a corpse that could have given you clues. But the Varia Suit, Gravity Suit, and Space Jump? They have ZERO destructive potential. It makes no sense with them. And shouldn't the Ice Beam be considered Samus's equivalent to the GF freeze gun? Adam authorizes that for all troops when they're deployed, yet leaves Samus with the regular Power Beam.
But I can't really lay all of that at Adam's feet. Recall, the only things Samus ever deactivated on Adam's say-so were Bombs, Missiles, and Power Bombs. In other words, she of her own accord, was taking a pretty minimalist approach even before meeting with Adam, using no Ice/Wave/Plasma Beam, no Space Jump, no Screw Attack, no Varia/Gravity Suit, no Speed Booster, no Super Missile, and no Grapple Beam (although to be fair the opportunity for that one didn't really come up). The one appearance of the playable Zero Suit falls into the same vein here; there was no necessity. Apparently Samus just likes treating life-or-death situations as training, or something.
Majorly spoilerific story comments:
[spoiler]We could have stood some more specific closure as to the traitor. It seems to be James, who got his at the hands of the Metroid Queen (the "missing" soldier would be the one that the game showed being tossed into lava with no witnesses).
But then, wasn't a shot fired while Adam was in the command room? Yet when Samus retrieves his helmet, the flashback simply shows him running off in response to Samus meeting Melissa. What happened there? Further, Melissa herself met with a GF soldier. But if James previously tried to kill her...what was going on? And how could either he, or Adam, have gotten there already? Or could it have been Anthony? If so, what did they say to each other?
I'm also sensing some SERIOUS conflict of canon between this game and the existing Metroid continuity, especially Prime 3. Other M clearly treats Mother Brain as not simply controlling the Metroids but the leader of all Pirates. MP3, however, while it did not specifically reference Mother Brain, pretty much beat the player over the head with Aurora Unit references, including the Space Pirates capturing an Aurora which then functioned as a boss, and images of an "Aurora complex" that was very obviously Tourian. The clear implication is that Mother Brain is in the same boat. Further there are Space Pirate logs referencing a Pirate Command, and, if the Pirates cannot function without Mother Brain leading them, how could they have possibly resuscitated her after the original Metroid? And why exactly does Other M treat the Space Pirates as being synonymous with Zebesians? Zebes was a Chozo settling ground, to say nothing of Samus's freaking home, before the Pirates ever arrived there. By the same token I find it difficult to believe that the Pirates survived the loss of Zebes once, but couldn't survive it again. Why would any race capable of inter-planetary travel go extinct from the loss of one planet?
While it may not mesh perfectly with the series, the game on its own has a pretty great story. I especially loved Ridley's appearance in this game. Was epic in every sense, seeing Samus in shock, watching a rare instance where a "partner" tries to cover for her. I was actually relieved at finding Anthony alive at the end; I felt a lot of sympathy for him. I do kinda wish that something more could have been done about the GF jerks who actually supported the whole Bioweapon project, but I guess leaving them at large is kind of necessary for the lead-in to Fusion.
The ending of the game seems give the impression that this is a story first and a game second. It's awkward that the "true" story is not revealed until after Queen Metroid, the last real fight before the credits. And I use that term loosely, because she's a joke. The only thing remotely challenging about her is dealing with the swarm of her kids; once that's done, she's cake. Phantoon was much tougher, although the "extra" final boss being a rehash who authority-wise falls well below Ridley doesn't make the biggest bang in the world. Was awesome nonetheless, though, I just feel that the game lacks a properly climactic final battle.[/spoiler]
I really have to agree with everything here.
[spoiler] The Ridley appearance reminded me of the Manga so much. Also, yes. the traitor thing was never closed up. Samus most likely never even figured out James was the deleter. He isnt listed as such under her profile for him after the game. just that she found him dead. Also, i never understood just HOW he died... I dont think it was the queen, cuz well, shes just way too big. that room doesnt look like the queen could access it. Im willing to bet Melissa did something. I mean, she IS a robot. and she DOES have super strength and that thing she did at the end. She could have overpowered him or something.
I wondered about the shot fired in the command room myself. They suddenly dropped that, and then showed Adam running off.
also, on the Space pirates, all because Zebes was blown up doesnt really mean anything if their homeworld is still there. I dont recall the federation ever having launched a full on attack there- unless Im forgetting something from prime 3. Samus just destroyed their Leviathan and went on her way, leaving them there.
On Phantoon however- I was actually quite satisfied with that. Well, more than with Metroid Queen anyway. Which felt really only like they were trying to say "hey look! its Metroid ll's final battle in 3D!!" and actually came out of NOWHERE. Tell me, when you saw from its point of view and saw it attack Ridley, was I the only one actually kinda expecting a repeat of Super Metroid's Mother Brain? I mean, given that Mellisa basically IS Mother Brain, and the main antagonist here, I would have actually assumed Id fight her in some sort of battle body. Having a queen in there doesnt make much sense either, wouldnt she have been in sector Zero with the OTHER metroids? Even if Zero was made for the new unfreezable ones, there would, if I was running that [parasitic bomb]- a sort of special area or sector set apart for the unaltered specimens. Which brings me to another point- all because they cant be frozen... um, so what? If I recall correctly, the Prime 1fission metroids, (the ones that split) I dont think they were affected by ice, were they? but forgetting even that- just take them out with Samus' regular weaponry. I mean, plasma beam seems to be quite effective, and in 3, the X ray visor let you outright just snipe their nucleus, for an instant kill. Its not like she couldnt have done it. Now if you told me they made Metroids invunerable to ALL weaponry, then thats another story.
Oh yeah. and the Space pirate/Zebesian deal. when i first heard her say "Its a Zebesian..." I went- "whoa, hold up now- theres a race called Zebesians? like there are space pirates and Chozos? Well why didnt I know this? As far as I know, only Chozo and random creatures and stuff lived there. Those look like robo space pirates more like."
and I sort of figured that was an error on their part.
I liked though, how after the game, you see that the federation cleaned up everything- including Nightmare and Ridley, which accounts for their appearance in Fusion
[/spoiler]
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............ o-O
Yeaaaaah, I don't think it's even close to being that bad here in NYC.
It's because gaming just isn't well recognized around here, and there's absolutely no love for a few consoles.
For example, most stores have a tiny shelf of 360 titles, with very few of them. But they have whole displays will of PS2 titles. And they keep selling and selling and selling. The ridiculously high prices and the fact that renting games is illegal don't help much either.
See, the overall environment of people who think the Playstation was the first gaming console of all time leads old-school fanboys to go deeper and deeper into their assholism, becoming completely retarded classic gaming activists, refusing to play anything that isn't sprited or has a combo meter.
So on one side we have football-loving people who know nothing else but the sport and who basically just get what's popular, and know only PES as a game. Laugh at anyone playing any other kind of game.
On the other, we have fat kids in old Nintendo sweaters, shouting their love for whatever's "true gaming", stinking up the place with their bad breath and unwashed armpits and speaking in cliché japanese sentences, being useless retarded weeaboos. And refusing to play anything that doesn't fit their definition of "gaming".
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Am I the only one who didn't like Prime 3 as much as the other two? Echoes isn't perfect by any means, but I still enjoyed it more than Corruption.
As far as continuity... I honestly get the impression that they're ignoring the Prime games when it comes to Other M. Let me put it this way... in basically every non-Prime Metroid, metroids are essentially invincible except when being frozen comes into the equation. In that context the fact that they can't be frozen is a pretty damn big deal. I could be wrong, but that's the vibe I'm getting.
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Am I the only one who didn't like Prime 3 as much as the other two? Echoes isn't perfect by any means, but I still enjoyed it more than Corruption.
As far as continuity... I honestly get the impression that they're ignoring the Prime games when it comes to Other M. Let me put it this way... in basically every non-Prime Metroid, metroids are essentially invincible except when being frozen comes into the equation. In that context the fact that they can't be frozen is a pretty damn big deal. I could be wrong, but that's the vibe I'm getting.
I think they consider the Primes canon, but a self-contained story that doesn't need references.
...kinda saddens me when you come to think of it, because the Primes showed how Metroid could be played in 3D. While Other M disregarded all of it, and although it was good, it wasn't as good as it could have been.
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What are referred to as Zebesians in this game are called Zebesian Space Pirates in other games. Which I guess means they were produced on Zebes. They just chose to abbreviate it in this game for whatever reason. And about Metroids, it was always established that they were invulnerable to every non-ice weapon in the numbered games, though Power Bombs can also hurt them in Super. The ones in Prime are specifically called Tallon Metroids. And you can kill them with basically anything. I'm guessing Tallon Metroids weren't made properly or something. Kinda like the Mocktroids in Maridia.
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I think they consider the Primes canon, but a self-contained story that doesn't need references.
Well, Sakamoto said that, as great as they were, he didn't consider them real Metroid games. Interpret that however you want to.
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Well, Sakamoto said that, as great as they were, he didn't consider them real Metroid games. Interpret that however you want to.
Where and when did he say that?
Considering they were both better and more Metroid-ish than Other M will ever be, this guy may be moving onto George Lucas territory.
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Am I the only one who didn't like Prime 3 as much as the other two? Echoes isn't perfect by any means, but I still enjoyed it more than Corruption.
Echoes >> Prime >>>> Corruption. Seriously. (All three however are high tier.) My opinion is insanely niche, but in reality, it's just reconfirmed every time I play a game out of the Prime series and either ask myself "Why am I not playing Echoes?" or marvel at the complexity of Echoes as I play through it.
If you were to ask me, Retro really just seemed to catch a bad case of Majora's Mask syndrome in regards to 2. The first one was a [tornado fang]ing landmark in video games no doubt, but because of that the second game got scrutinized to hell and back and eventually got pegged as the red headed stepchild for some of the weirdest reasons, even though for a sequel it was totally ingenious with its progression. A lot of people cite the backtracking and dark world as the greatest sources of headaches, but coming fresh off a replay of the game, I just can't see it, especially since Retro took great lengths to make the design challenging but not daunting.
I actually wanna talk a bit more about this too, since I find it amazing that people will praise Corruption over Echoes vehemently.
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Where and when did he say that?
Considering they were both better and more Metroid-ish than Other M will ever be, this guy may be moving onto George Lucas territory.
An interview, but can't say I remember the source, sorry ~__~ Or maybe I'm misremembering the quote, I dunno, but it's not impossible that they don't consider them canon to the story.
Still, he really praises them as being great games, just different.
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I actually like Echoes better than Corruption, myself. So no, Jericho, you aren't alone.
As for Other M, the more I play it, the more I realize that storywise, it's nothing but a wholesale ripoff of Fusion. It's definitely getting lower on my list of favorite Metroid games.
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Echoes dual world problem wouldnt have been as bad if they didnt ALSO give Samus Limited Ammo for her beam weapons. I mean, thats kind of unheard of, that I know of. And in a game like Echoes, that can get tedious with having to track and backtrack through the light and shadow worlds, it's frustrating.
However Ive noticed this much. its only frustrating and tedious at the beginning. About halfway in, it gets much better. and Sanctuary Fortress has got to be one of the most beautiful things ever.
But I still think Prime is at the top of all 3. Echoes is nice when yoiu get used to it, but you shouldnt have to get used to it, and the limited beam ammo was pretty ridiculous. (at least you could still charge up to fire uncharged shots)
Corruption was nice too, but felt a bit too linear compared to the other 2. Although it has some really nice and varied scenery, and I loved that Steampunk Skytown Elysia.
I also dislike the PED suit. it looks fine normally, but once it gets corrupted and turns blue, it just doesnt look as appealing anymore. Although, that probably IS the point. You wouldnt look too pretty either if you were being consumed by a glowing blue radioactive, highly mutagenic compound.
As for Other M, the more I play it, the more I realize that storywise, it's nothing but a wholesale ripoff of Fusion. It's definitely getting lower on my list of favorite Metroid games.
Oh come on, Its not THAT bad. So all because it has a few cameos and a narrated story, its a fusion rip off? (and because its on a space station?)
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Echoes dual world problem wouldnt have been as bad if they didnt ALSO give Samus Limited Ammo for her beam weapons. I mean, thats kind of unheard of, that I know of. And in a game like Echoes, that can get tedious with having to track and backtrack through the light and shadow worlds, it's frustrating.
You think so? I remember rarely ever being in need of ammo.
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No, Flame, not because it has a few cameos and a narrated story. But because the story is essentially a rewrite of Fusion's without the Samus-X.
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No, Flame, not because it has a few cameos and a narrated story. But because the story is essentially a rewrite of Fusion's without the Samus-X.
Agreed on some aspects, especially as far as Sector 0 is concerned. Pretty sure it creates some inconsistencies in Fusion too, if you think about it.
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Oh yeah, big time.
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How does it make any inconsistencies in fusion?
the Sector 0 thing was no doubt intentionally a nod to Fusion, but the story felt different to me. :|
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It's true that Prime is unusual in having Metroids vulnerable to non-Ice Beam weaponry. Even so, it's the most effective way, sans Power Bombs, of dealing with them. Story-wise, I'd see a cold-proof Metroid as perhaps not indestructible, but EXTREMELY durable. Surely a tremendous threat. And, yeah, I'd buy SR388 Metroids being more durable than Tallon Metroids. You never know what the Space Pirates can screw up, just look at their Morph Ball research.
As far as "ranking" the Metroid Prime games goes, I too am annoyed by Prime 2's ammo system. Sure, ammo is bountiful enough, but the fact that ammo for one given beam ONLY appears when using its opposite gets very, very annoying. In addition, it storywise feels almost like one giant side-quest. You can go from Prime 1 to Prime 3, and really not miss anything; the Aether conflict isn't terribly relevant to the Phazon story arc. It just covers Dark Samus for those who didn't score a 100% completion in Prime 1, and that's about it. So, while I'll put 2 at the bottom, I have a hard time choosing between 1 and 3. 3 has the more immersive presentation and a larger scale storyline, but 1 better offers that "isolation/exploration" feel that classic Metroid is known for. Depends on what you're looking for in the game, I think.
What are referred to as Zebesians in this game are called Zebesian Space Pirates in other games. Which I guess means they were produced on Zebes.
That excuses the naming ambiguity, but it does not excuse the fact that Other M treats the destruction of Zebes as equaling the extinction of the Space Pirates.
Oh, you don't know? Sometimes their jobs are on the line if they DON'T promote both Pre-orders or Game Informer.
I suspected...
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14 hours play time and 100% collection later, STM has laid Other M to rest (...Hard mode? Yeah. No.)
Let's get this [parasitic bomb] going:
[spoiler=Delicious bite-sized bullet points for happy enjoyment reading]+Samus' characterization. After hearing so much bitching about her panic attack at seeing Ridley back and finally seeing the scene, her reaction was as it should have been: she was convinced she finally nailed the bastard on Zebes... and here he is... again, never mind she has PTSD from the Zebes extermination mission and the death of the Baby Metroid.
+Atmosphere. At least early on, the game had an air that kept me on my toes and awaiting some big bad mother hubbard from coming out and tearing a superfluous new hole in my rear end. Not so much later on.
+Ridley, Phantoon, Nightmare. Easily the best bosses in the game... which is sad because they're all returners. None of the new bosses were any good.
+Gameplay. Very tight 2D and 3D. While controls could have been better, everything in the game played very nicely. Honestly, I didn't use FPS view a lot unless I wanted to missile/super missile the [parasitic bomb] out of something because of how clunky it could get in battles.
+Adam. You damn well know why. He died a man's death.
+Lil' Birdie. It's so cute and cuddly and--OH MY GOD IT ATE MY SPLEEN.
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-Music. Generic atmospheric crap; there was no "Phendrana Drifts" or "Maridia" like music. None of the boss themes (aside from Ridley, obviously) really stood out either.
-Story. Look, I like that it was exploring Samus' psyche, I really do. The mission itself was also nice, if bordering Fusion a little. However, the Deleter plot being dropped cold and then the big plot twist of "The GF recreated Mother Brain's A.I. to make a unit containing Space Pirates and Uber Metroids within the military? AND the AI was put into an android that looks like a 15 year old girl? AND it learned to feel and have a soul? AND it grew to hate humans? THIS CAN'T GO WRONG!"
But it did. The last scenes, while sad, did nothing emotionally. She died... oh well. I didn't feel anything wrong because of how abrupt the revelations were and the true Madeline being introduced so late that the player can't give two shits that she treated MB like a daughter. Adam's death was far greater because he was man enough to enter a section with invincible metroids, shoot [parasitic bomb] up and blow up the section so he could take them all to Hell with him.
Otherwise, it really treaded closely to Fusion, for better or for worse.
-Final Boss. Really? I like the long-needed Metroid II throwback, but come on. The Metroid part was just annoying because if you weren't fast enough to dispatch them quickly, you get mobbed and murdered. After that, Queen Metroid was no more threatening than a normal enemy. The last phase was even sillier as, while you're expected to Power Bomb her from the inside (Metroid II players will know this instinctively), others will be confused as to what the hell is going on because you're never told, after a whole game of hand holding, that you can now use them. The game only tells you AFTER the credits roll.
-Length. Look, I know Metroid games are traditionally known for not being long, and maybe this is a spoil point from the Prime series, but this game felt awfully short. Right now, people are attempting sub-three hour runs on the game. While this isn't a huge deal with stuff like Zero Mission, Super or Fusion, the sad truth that this is a really low mark for a modern title, especially one gunning at $50. Maybe this is a problem with the state of gaming, I don't know, different topic, NEXT.
-First Person perspective. Aside from missile use, the set up felt clunky. I do appreciate the slow down that happens when switching into it to allow time for orientation, but in frenzied battles, like against the Metroids or even the Power Bomb door guardians, it felt more like a hindrance than an aid. This is also true for Phantoon. The more frantic battles get, the less usefulness it has unless the enemy takes a breather from attacking. By end game, the Plasma Beam and Screw Attack will be the main arsenal murdering every non-boss enemy, so it also becomes useless too.
-Scan scenes. Some were pretty annoying, like the blood one because of no true indicator of what to be on the lookout for at time or it being covered up too well (the green blood one, for example).[/spoiler]
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Umm... it's [spoiler] not [spoilers]
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Damn thing submitted on its own. Fixed.
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I liked reading it; nice summary. ^.^
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Having not yet played Metroid II to completion (I know, it's shameful), the Power Bomb use had me stumped. Wasn't as bad as the earlier mob, but really, it is a surprising break given that EVERY SINGLE OTHER ITEM USE IN THE ENTIRE GAME IS SPELLED OUT FOR YOU IN A POP-UP WINDOW, and the game's early cutscenes beat you over the head with why Power Bombs are not authorized, are not safe, and generally are just not something you should be setting off when there's an unarmed human in the next room.
As far as length, I believe that to be a state-of-gaming issue. I curse that a 10-hour game is considered "not valuable enough" for a disc, and that replayability means nothing in this day and age hence the near-death of the platforming genre. Yeah, it's short compared to Prime, but the game feels like it belongs in a faster pace. You can only drag out a three-Sector space ship exploration for so long, plus there's post-game item hunting to kill time. The game has an exceptionally cinematic presentation which very much lends credit to its "modern" gaming value.
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Thanks. I was mostly just trying to capture the raw feeling I have before it subsides and the opinion goes wishy washy.
tl;dr of that post: It's a good Metroid game, but it's honestly not worth $50, especially not with how rapidly it can be blazed through, even while dicking around to find upgrades (such as what I did.) It's honestly worth a rent. Metroid fans will probably find more joy out of it because of all the throwbacks and references, but will be very much put off by how linear and hand-holdy the game is, even more so than Metroid Fusion.
EDIT: As for replayability, it's something I considered too, given how short it is, but at the same time, I don't feel compelled that it's worth another playthrough. The game relied pretty heavily on the story to pace things along. Strip that out and, while the adventure is now MUCH faster, you're still screwed by the lack of true exploration and utilization of items. Most of the fun of replaying the earlier Metroid games, and even Zero Mission and Fusion, was finding what sorts of stupid stunts you could pull off to create sequence breaks to get things earlier than you should or to shorten your time radically.
While time shortening is an option, the others aren't. There's also hard mode, but the prospect of almost all late-game enemies and bosses being able to kill you in one hit makes the whole idea of playing it far too tedious than its worth.
That, and you get nothing for beating it outside of hollow bragging rights.
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Well, I dunno about it being shorter than the Prime games. It certainly felt shorter, but looking back on it I finished the Prime games in about the same time length.
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You might be right on that. I'll have to check my MP1 records sometime.
Oh and on boss rehashes:
[spoiler]Ridley is always awesome, and I loved the cutscene of Samus in shock, Anthony covering for her, Adam trying to snap her out of it. Truly the game's finest moments. Phantoon was cool, but the fact that he's the highest challenge of the game is kinda sad. Queen Metroid is awesome for appearance, she really deserves to show up again, but she goes down too easily. This isn't X6 Sigma, she doesn't have the excuse of being halfway brain dead. Nightmare, I was not impressed by. Though I've completed Fusion, I'm not a huge fan of it, and like the volcano run, the Nightmare battle is one of those moments when you really have to wonder why Samus delays activating suit upgrades and puts up with all the crap she does.
You know, I just noticed, the four rehashed bosses are one from each "numbered" Metroid game. Yay.[/spoiler]
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I can vouch that the game's length was on par with the Primes. My first completion of the first two Primes was around the 10 hour mark, and my first run of Prime 3 was actually really quick, maybe around 8 hours. Other M clocked in at 12 hours.
I don't plan on playing Hard mode as I'm not a fan of low% challenges, and you don't get anything from it. But I will play the game again at least once. With every Metroid I play again with the knowledge of where the items are so I can cut the time down. But I'm a speedrunner, so yeah.
It's [tornado fang]ing dumb that the cutscenes are still added to your time even if you skip them.
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It's [tornado fang]ing dumb that the cutscenes are still added to your time even if you skip them.
FF9 had that same problem; another reason it's difficult to get Excalibur II in that.
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For me, there's an incredible flaw in terms of story.
[spoiler]Adam.
It's like they want you to hate the guy as much as they can with pretty much the entire game and Samus' daddy complex, along with the authorization process.
Than out of nowhere, they make him die a heroic death just like that. What the [tornado fang]?[/spoiler]
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I wonder how the game was received in Japan?
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[spoiler]Adam.
It's like they want you to hate the guy as much as they can with pretty much the entire game and Samus' daddy complex, along with the authorization process.
Than out of nowhere, they make him die a heroic death just like that. What the [tornado fang]?[/spoiler]
[spoiler]I don't see it that way. Adam never came off as someone to hate, even though there was a chance he was the Deleter at one point. He's harsh, but that's how he's always been. Maybe it's because I played Fusion and read the manga first, but I could tell that Adam was doing what he was doing for a good reason. I could tell before the game told you. It's tough love.[/spoiler]
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Same.
also, two of the forced scans had me there for a good while, wondering WTF I had to do.
[spoiler] The green blood. It is green blood, on green grass. I didnt notice it until the pointer went on it by pure chance.
The bugs before the wasp thing battle. I was supposed to look for those beetle like things? really? I didnt know that! I acually thought my game glitched and i was stuck! I actually reset my game and loaded back up.
Also, the metroid Queen Power bomb thing. yeeeeah. I dont know why they even game you that breif bit of shooting her stomach when all it takes is a power bomb in the stomach. And I didnt know that at first either. having watched videos of 2, I knew that you had to morphball into her stomach and bomb it, but I was laying regular bombs and I would end up dead. I tried using a power bomb and then it suddenly worked to my surprise.[/spoiler]
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[spoiler]I don't see it that way. Adam never came off as someone to hate, even though there was a chance he was the Deleter at one point. He's harsh, but that's how he's always been. Maybe it's because I played Fusion and read the manga first, but I could tell that Adam was doing what he was doing for a good reason. I could tell before the game told you. It's tough love.[/spoiler]
Felt like a schmuck, and the Varia Suit deal sealed it.
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Hard mode beat! Unfortunately...
[spoiler]You can't do final chapter, so no hard mode phantoon[/spoiler]
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One more reason for me not to do it.
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Hard mode beat! Unfortunately...
[spoiler]You can't do final chapter, so no hard mode phantoon[/spoiler]
Seriously? Wow.
[spoiler]Maybe that would explain why other bosses are such pansies compared to Phantoon, since you're not realistically expected to single-Tank him (though I'm sure it could be done with practice). It's bad enough that "Hard mode" is just "this is what would happen if you sucked at finding items", but to trim the game length down as well?[/spoiler]
Moronic. No other way to describe that; even Inticreates didn't sink that low with their difficulty levels.
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So basically a bigger difficulty level means less game, huh?
That's [tornado fang]ing stupid.
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Felt like a schmuck, and the Varia Suit deal sealed it.
Samus is no better than Adam, though.
[spoiler]How do you excuse delayed activation of the Gravity Suit when she already took it upon herself to activate Space Jump and Screw Attack, the latter not being really necessary in any way?[/spoiler]
At the end of the day, it's just game mechanics; you need to experience what obstacles your suit upgrades are countering before they're utilized, or the experience turns awfully shallow. But there are better ways they could have gone about it. Since Samus was bizarrely conservative enough to leave 90% of her crap unactivated before she even knew Adam was there, they could have had her store that stuff in a remote location, like her ship, had it damaged, and have Adam or one of his troops work to recover/transmit it. Would have been a lot more plausible.
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In hard mode you also take way more damage and most of the bosses and other attacks 1-hit you
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but I assume that with the sense motive, it makes Hard mode much easier no?
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Well I still messed up a lot and some moves are hard to predict
[spoiler]Ridleys on ground tail swipe actually made him challenging, and only two of his moves don't 1-hit you, the wall scrape grab and his combo claw swipe (but if the first one hits you the second will more than likely hit you as well)[/spoiler]
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Samus is no better, though.
[spoiler]How do you excuse delayed activation of the Gravity Suit when she already took it upon herself to activate Space Jump and Screw Attack, the latter not being really necessary in any way?[/spoiler]
At the end of the day, it's just game mechanics; you need to experience what obstacles your suit upgrades are countering before they're utilized, or the experience turns awfully shallow But there are better ways they could have gone about it. Since Samus was bizarrely conservative enough to leave 90% of her crap unactivated before she even knew Adam was there, they could have had her store that stuff in a remote location, like her ship, had it damaged, and have Adam or one of his troops work to recover/transmit it. Would have been a lot more plausible.
I'm guessing that at first she doesn't really feel like she has to leave every single armament on her suit turned on. Probably wastes power or something.
I'm guessing that it's like leaving the safety on a gun. As for the gravity suit, I'm guessing she unlocked it when she felt she needed it the most or something. Or it's a hack explanation, I dunno.
-
shes just so tough that she doesnt mind going through gravitational anomalies. Only when shes [spoiler]about to get sucked into space[/spoiler] does she say "god damn I need this [parasitic bomb] now!"
Which reminds me, that part is my favorite part.
-
[spoiler]"Oh [tornado fang], oh [tornado fang], oh fuuuuuuu--
(black screen)
ACTIVATE GRAVITY SUIT!
(thud)
And suddenly space pirates clinging to floors and walls for dear life.[/spoiler]
Golden.
-
[tornado fang] you Amazon shipping. Thanks to you, I have spoiler tags I'm inching around just to not spoil my Other M surprise. XD
-
[spoiler]"Oh [tornado fang], oh [tornado fang], oh fuuuuuuu--
(black screen)
ACTIVATE GRAVITY SUIT!
(thud)
And suddenly space pirates clinging to floors and walls for dear life.[/spoiler]
Golden.
Indeed.
[tornado fang] you Amazon shipping. Thanks to you, I have spoiler tags I'm inching around just to not spoil my Other M surprise. XD
Gamestop that [parasitic bomb] next time. 8D
-
Gamestop that [parasitic bomb] next time. 8D
I should have, but delicious 20 bucks off my next game purchase sounded so good to me especially with the massive load of awesome games headed our way in Q4 2010. XD
-
[spoiler]"Oh [tornado fang], oh [tornado fang], oh fuuuuuuu--
(black screen)
ACTIVATE GRAVITY SUIT!
(thud)
And suddenly space pirates clinging to floors and walls for dear life.[/spoiler]
Golden.
Yes. so yes. XD I lold so much at that. [spoiler]honestly, when it faded I was like "huh? did I die? did I do something wrong?" Then that happened, and I was like, OH U.[/spoiler]
-
To break away from Other M for a minute, it's just been discovered that you can keep your stuff in Prime 2. Involves a bunch of tricky [parasitic bomb]. But it cuts down the lowest possible percentage to 8%. This is huge. Huger than when the puzzle of 20% in Prime 1 was solved. Hell, this is huger than the discovery of Space Jump First.
I am anxiously awaiting a video.
-
This is relevant to my interests, as I enjoy a good [tornado fang]ing up of a game.
-
To break away from Other M for a minute, it's just been discovered that you can keep your stuff in Prime 2. Involves a bunch of tricky [parasitic bomb]. But it cuts down the lowest possible percentage to 8%. This is huge. Huger than when the puzzle of 20% in Prime 1 was solved. Hell, this is huger than the discovery of Space Jump First.
I am anxiously awaiting a video.
Echoes proves yet again that it is the best Prime game. Ho-ly [parasitic bomb], what a week for Metroid games. XD
-
Who knows, maybe that bit about doing that in prime 1 may be true as well.
-
Most likely not. I don't believe it's possible to get out of bounds on the Frigate, and in order to get out you have to pass that trigger. Prime 2 doesn't have this problem because the intro sequence is on the same map as the rest of the game.
Oh, and let me clarify. Skipping the item loss is not old news. You can do it easily with Action Replay. What's been discovered is a way to do it without cheating devices.
-
Which is what makes it more interesting. Any shmuck can noclip with an Action Replay, or even just hack them back on after the cutscene. It's doing it without that will set the men from the boys.
-
so, how exactly do we do it?
Also, I find it funny how most people's bitching about Samus characterization is aimed at [spoiler] her confrontation with Ridley and the way she goes into shock[/spoiler] those folks who [sonic slicer] and moan need to get equipped with the Metroid manga, and the confrontation THERE! 8D
makes the one in other M look like a meditation exercise.
-
so, how exactly do we do it?
Also, I find it funny how most people's bitching about Samus characterization is aimed at [spoiler] her confrontation with Ridley and the way she goes into shock[/spoiler] those folks who [sonic slicer] and moan need to get equipped with the Metroid manga, and the confrontation THERE! 8D
makes the one in other M look like a meditation exercise.
I find it kinds silly that the manga is canon. The tone's very different from the game itself.
And, well... Ridley TALKS there. =P
-
To break away from Other M for a minute, it's just been discovered that you can keep your stuff in Prime 2. Involves a bunch of tricky [parasitic bomb]. But it cuts down the lowest possible percentage to 8%. This is huge. Huger than when the puzzle of 20% in Prime 1 was solved. Hell, this is huger than the discovery of Space Jump First.
I am anxiously awaiting a video.
Wow, no [parasitic bomb]? Goddamn, that opens up some major sequence breaking potential.
-
so, how exactly do we do it?
To get out of bounds, you have to use something called the Infinite Speed Bug (http://m2k2.taigaforum.com/post/unlimited_possibilities.html). It's a strange bug that screws up hit detection, letting you activate triggers early such as grabbing items without entering the same room. I don't know where you use it in this case, but I'm guessing it's around the second room where you jump down in a cutscene.
If you go to the spot where you lose your items, apparently everything is reset. You lose your items and your percentage goes down to 0. Supposedly the items you collected are gone forever.
-
It uses Infinite Speed? Damn it, I'll never pull that off...
-
It's a very hard trick.
And correction: 7% is the lowest. All you'd need to collect is Dark Beam, Light Beam, Dark Visor, Dark Suit, Light Suit, Power Bomb, and Screw Attack.
-
@Prime 2 stuff: WHOOOOOOOOOOOOOA!! that's awesome~
@Authorization controversy: I've no problem w/ it. If anything, it just makes me appreciate Samus on how tough she is, unless the player died that much on the early volcano areas. Then well, tough luck to you.
-
The heat never was a problem for me. The damage it does is so small. It was the enemies and the lava that was killing me at first.
-
The heat never was a problem for me. The damage it does is so small. It was the enemies and the lava that was killing me at first.
I thought that pretty much the whole game was based on "now how do I kill this thing?" rather than pure twitch-reaction skill.
Seriously, the only part of the game where I had problems while knowing how to beat the boss, was Ridley. He's amazing as a boss. 3 tries.
-
He turned black and I can't hurt him... god damn IT!
[spoiler](Super Missile's him in rage... and it makes him purple again.)
Make it raaaaain Super Missiles~[/spoiler]
-
(http://www.brawlinthefamily.com/comics/2010-09-02-268-Authorization.png)
-
YOU'RE TOO SLOW!
Had to post this:
(http://www.brawlinthefamily.com/comics/2010-09-02-268-Authorization.png)
-
I'm just gonna leave this (http://cid-ae3b5583d7854eab.photos.live.com/play.aspx/Metroid%20Other%20M/Metroid%20Other%20M%20001.jpg?ref=2) here.
edit: tread on said gallery, it does contain spoilers as the gallery goes on. For those that have yet to play it that is.
-
asks me to sign in to windows live
-
Really? that's a shame :(
-
What Other M would look like displayed on a higher resolution?
I really do wonder why Nintendo just didn't include 720p display support on the Wii.
-
asks me to sign in to windows live
Then get a Windows Live account.
-
What Other M would look like displayed on a higher resolution?
I really do wonder why Nintendo just didn't include 720p display support on the Wii.
There are already HD screenshots of Metroid: Other M around, when played on the Dolphin Wii Emulator.
http://www.nintendoeverything.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/metroid_other_m_hd-18.jpg
http://www.nintendoeverything.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/metroid_other_m_hd-19.jpg
http://www.nintendoeverything.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/metroid_other_m_hd-4.jpg
Mighty purdy, if i may say so.
-
Then get a Windows Live account.
I have one. but I can never remember the extension. (the "@[insert here]" since its my college email, its got this long annoying one I never remember)
And im too lazy to go check what it is. :P
-
I have one. but I can never remember the extension. (the "@[insert here]" since its my college email, its got this long annoying one I never remember)
And im too lazy to go check what it is. :P
|:
-
What is it anyway?
-
You mean that Live Gallery-thing? Dunno. It told me to install the latest version of Microsoft Silverlight and I couldn't be bothered.
-
Learn to use photobucket, kids!
Meanwhile, nobody says anything about the HD Metroid shots I posted. >_>
-
Learn to use photobucket, kids!
Meanwhile, nobody says anything about the HD Metroid shots I posted. >_>
no no, they are nice.
-
no no, they are nice.
That's what you say to all the guys who post HD Metroid pictures when it's requested in a topic and don't get attention. >_>
-
awww, Super batsy! dont be that way! The pictures were very nice.
-
I kinda wish I had a computer good enough to handle the Dolphin emulator. Aside from Motion Plus stuff, it seems to do everything the Wii can do, and it works in HD, so games like Metroid, Mario Galaxy and others look absolutely amazing.
-
It doesn't run everything perfectly though, so it still wouldn't be a replacement for an actual Wii.
-
It will eventually, though.
I just hope Nintendo's next console is able to play previous Wii and Gamecube games in HD.
-
It better, those Dolphin shots for games like Galaxy, this game, and Wind Waker are gorgeous.
-
Learn to use photobucket, kids!
Meanwhile, nobody says anything about the HD Metroid shots I posted. >_>
ImageShack might work, too.
Anyways, I just got Super Metroid downloaded into my Wii Sunday, and I'm already hating Maridia because I'm getting so lost in this place trying to figure my way around to the next boss and I keep running into those stubborn gray hatches that won't open even after I killed everything in sight (unless I'm suppose to fight Ridley first)..
-
I usually get lost a little bit whenever I get to Maridia. And I've been playing the game for over 10 years.
The gray doors unlock when you beat Draygon, actually.
-
Maridia's tricky, but not TOO tough. For me, it's not so much the gray doors as it is tracking down the Plasma Beam.
I find it kinds silly that the manga is canon. The tone's very different from the game itself.
And, well... Ridley TALKS there. =P
Agreed.
Does anyone actually have a quote on the manga's canon status, though? I've heard people say that Nintendo said so, but I've not seen such confirmation for myself. Best evidence I've found is that some of Zero Mission's staff worked on it.
-
I finally found the part of the area in Maridia that I was suppose to shoot and continue on in the game. Now I remember why I hated that place when I played Super Metroid on emulator. 2 hours wasted going in circles looking for the breakable floor. -AC
-
Maridia's tricky, but not TOO tough. For me, it's not so much the gray doors as it is tracking down the Plasma Beam.
Agreed.
Does anyone actually have a quote on the manga's canon status, though? I've heard people say that Nintendo said so, but I've not seen such confirmation for myself. Best evidence I've found is that some of Zero Mission's staff worked on it.
I think I read somewhere that it stopped being canon awhile ago, mainly because nobody really cared about it enough and it was just silly.
...then again, Nintendo and coherent storylines with well-set canon were never the best of friends.
-
So I was thinking of how Other M could be improved upon, short of just gutting the entire plot. I've got a few thoughts, so please feel free to set them ablaze.
[spoiler=Yeah, spoiler tags in case people still give a damn]
-Sector Zero as a playable area. They took a bit of time to build up the area to players and get them excited only to ultimately cockblock them. Samus should have been allowed to go into the area and encounter these so-called Invincible Metroids. Upon finding out that the computer MB that "Madeline" told her about was a hoax, Samus needs to escape the area or else she's caught in the explosion of the colony. At this point, the Invincible Metroids are swarming like mad, maybe throw in an Alpha or Beta stage version as a midboss at any time in this area before or during the escape.
-I'm not sure how Adam's death would occur, but it'd have to be in a way that keeps the GF clear, otherwise, Samus' involvement with them in Fusion would make less sense. Probably killed by "The Deleter" taking a bullet for Samus?
-Introduce the real Madeline Bergman earlier. It's clear with the whole explanation that she treated MB like a daughter that they wanted to build some emotional sympathy with the player. However, as it stands, this is a worthless thing to do three minutes before she's ultimately killed. There's no emotional attachment and it means absolutely nothing other than "that [sonic slicer] got [tornado fang]'d up." This would also work well if MB was actually fought, as now you have the added factor of Samus hesitating to finish her off (she already feels sympathetic to her after hearing Madeline's account.)
One other little thing I and probably others would have appreciated is missiles and super missiles in third person mode while keeping the side remote style. After examining the controller, I found missiles could have easily been set to B, which can be fired with the left middle finger. To use a super missile, you follow a mechanic similar to Metroid Prime where you charge up your beam. You tap B to fire a missile and, bam, super missile.
[/spoiler]
-
A good thing would be "Don't end the story so half-assedly by explaining all of the events at once instead of sparingly."
-
[spoiler] Actually, I didnt mind the way Adam died. (if you didnt get even a little teary eyed, you are either a liar, or heartless.) I thought he died a pretty damn heroic death. ALTHOUGH, it would have been MUCH better if Samus had already encountered Sector Zero and discovered for herself that the Metroids there were unfreezable. THEN Adam can shoot her in the back with a freeze gun, and sort of lock her out of the sector while he does his thing. After all, Fusion, didnt it say he sacrificed himself to save her life? in Other M its more like he simply prevented her from endangering it.[/spoiler]
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hearless
I'm sure being deaf makes it real sad.
-
oops.
Well, typos happen.
-
I got my Japanese Other M, and guess what?
(http://lol.rockmanpm.com/metroidothermjapanese.jpg)
0v0 <3
-
Huh. interesting.
I know I was sorta disappointed the game had French and Spanish but not Japanese.
-
That's just text, Flame. US version has no audio option at all. Which makes me ask why it doesn't have it?
-
Huh... lookit that... it doesn't... I didnt mess around with it anyway, so I didnt know.
-
For the record, I didn't tear up at Adam's death because I was too busy laughing at how [parasitic bomb] the dialog was in that scene.
He has to keep reminding her she's going to be at full power soon. I mean, cool, yeah, he blew up a whole sector of invincible metroids, but the set up was so cheesed and terrible.
But so's almost every plot instance with this game. I blame that simply on Japanese writing being god awful.
-
Heartless, huh?
I would have been sad... IF ADAM HAD ANY PERSONALITY UP TO THAT POINT IN THE GAME ANYWAY. He acts like Gendo [tornado fang]ing Ikari, always silent and telling you what to do all the way, and then in one single cutscene, dude pulls a 180º and acts all heroic, his tone of choice changes and everything basically is different. Jesus Christ, it's a forced "BE SAAAAAAD" scene if I ever saw one.
-
I was touched. I liked the scene.
*shrugs*
-
Nothing wrong with liking it. It's still a friggin' Hollywood cliché, though.
-
A cliche yes, but it's pretty well done.
-
[spoiler]Its more just those final moments when he walks off into sector Zero while Samus tries to stop him, witht he door locking behind him, that are really good. Then the "No objections, right Lady?" and her teary thumbs down- that are touching.[/spoiler]
-
What is well done about it? The fact that we had no idea of Adam's true personality until then? The fact that that thing came out of nowhere? The fact that they basically gave us a ton of details about a fantastic level and fantastic enemies only to tell us we're not allowed to fight them or even see them? The fact that it was a cheap off-screen death, which means he can be brought back easily anytime? Everything in that scene was textbook Hollywood cornyness better suited to the 70's and 80's, stuff that wouldn't go near any recent sci-fi flick with a ten foot pole. It's pretty much wacky japanese stuff, that they think appeals to the western mentality, but ends up being EXTREMELY stereotypical. And the narrative itself is disjoined and doesn't favor the game in any way.
-
lol 'wacky japanese stuff'
hearing that always makes me laugh.
Now i'm itching to watch "Taste of Tea" once again~ (a japanese film btw.)
-
lol 'wacky japanese stuff'
hearing that always makes me laugh.
Now i'm itching to watch "Taste of Tea" once again~ (a japanese film btw.)
Japanese films with typical japanese culture are great, mind you. When japanese are japanese, they're awesome. It's why I love games like Yakuza/Ryu Ga Gotoku, because they look japanese, they don't like pretty bishonen with colorful hair.
Nobody Knows continues to be the one movie in the whole world which I have made a promise never to watch again, because if I did, my sadness and cries would probably cause me to commit suicide or something. Japanese storytelling manages to be AMAZINGLY good when it's adapted from their own culture, not when it tries to be a stupid copy of 80's hollywood.
-
What is well done about it? The fact that we had no idea of Adam's true personality until then? The fact that that thing came out of nowhere? The fact that they basically gave us a ton of details about a fantastic level and fantastic enemies only to tell us we're not allowed to fight them or even see them? The fact that it was a cheap off-screen death, which means he can be brought back easily anytime? Everything in that scene was textbook Hollywood cornyness better suited to the 70's and 80's, stuff that wouldn't go near any recent sci-fi flick with a ten foot pole. It's pretty much wacky japanese stuff, that they think appeals to the western mentality, but ends up being EXTREMELY stereotypical. And the narrative itself is disjoined and doesn't favor the game in any way.
that WAS his personality. all business, no play. in both Fusion, this, and the manga.
off screen death maybe, but he cannot be revived post Fusion since Fusion established that he was the computer on samus ship whom reminded her of dead Adam. and if hes revived after that, then this game has nothing to do with that, since he was already dead prior to this game. Also, I dont think cloning Humans works in the Metroid Universe- at least- its never been done.
I dont know. I thought it was a sad scene. or at least- a very cool send off for him.
-
that WAS his personality. all business, no play. in both Fusion, this, and the manga.
off screen death maybe, but he cannot be revived post Fusion since Fusion established that he was the computer on samus ship whom reminded her of dead Adam. and if hes revived after that, then this game has nothing to do with that, since he was already dead prior to this game. Also, I dont think cloning Humans works in the Metroid Universe- at least- its never been done.
I dont know. I thought it was a sad scene. or at least- a very cool send off for him.
The AI could be based of his memory. They didn't just recover his body in space so they could dump the brain into a disk. Coulda just been a backup of his memory.
-
He's a general, his blood/brain being on file somewhere is no far stretch. As Other M showed us you can barely sneeze in that outfit without somebody authorizing it.
"Samus: That perfect military mind... The wisdom of Adam Malkovich continued to serve even after death. Until today, I had no idea that the minds of leaders and scientists were frequently uploaded to computers. My incredible reunion with Adam may have saved the universe..."
So I was thinking of how Other M could be improved upon, short of just gutting the entire plot. I've got a few thoughts, so please feel free to set them ablaze.
[spoiler=Yeah, spoiler tags in case people still give a damn]
-Sector Zero as a playable area. They took a bit of time to build up the area to players and get them excited only to ultimately cockblock them. Samus should have been allowed to go into the area and encounter these so-called Invincible Metroids. Upon finding out that the computer MB that "Madeline" told her about was a hoax, Samus needs to escape the area or else she's caught in the explosion of the colony. At this point, the Invincible Metroids are swarming like mad, maybe throw in an Alpha or Beta stage version as a midboss at any time in this area before or during the escape.
-I'm not sure how Adam's death would occur, but it'd have to be in a way that keeps the GF clear, otherwise, Samus' involvement with them in Fusion would make less sense. Probably killed by "The Deleter" taking a bullet for Samus?
-Introduce the real Madeline Bergman earlier. It's clear with the whole explanation that she treated MB like a daughter that they wanted to build some emotional sympathy with the player. However, as it stands, this is a worthless thing to do three minutes before she's ultimately killed. There's no emotional attachment and it means absolutely nothing other than "that [sonic slicer] got [tornado fang]'d up." This would also work well if MB was actually fought, as now you have the added factor of Samus hesitating to finish her off (she already feels sympathetic to her after hearing Madeline's account.)
One other little thing I and probably others would have appreciated is missiles and super missiles in third person mode while keeping the side remote style. After examining the controller, I found missiles could have easily been set to B, which can be fired with the left middle finger. To use a super missile, you follow a mechanic similar to Metroid Prime where you charge up your beam. You tap B to fire a missile and, bam, super missile.
[/spoiler]
[spoiler=ZEE SPOILERZ!!]Adam's death I don't mind, but yeah, some encounter with an unfreezable Metroid would have been nice. Drive home the point that MB was setting Samus up, and also make the fact that they are a setup for Adam's death less obvious. Yeah, we know he has to buy it before Fusion, and they picked a good way for him to go, my full and sole gripe is being told why, rather than shown why.
Madeline, yeah. As I said before, her being revealed after Queen Metroid makes it clear that they were just looking at the story and not at game pacing. I don't expect to grow attached to Melissa, though. Cheezy dialogue pretty much never comes unexpected to me, and besides, no matter what Madeline thinks of her, she's still based off of Mother Brain. Samus may or may not believably hesitate to kill her, but trying to build player sympathy with her, I think, is a majorly uphill battle.[/spoiler]
Missiles I didn't mind in the least. They're sniping weapons in this game, hence the lock-on. Your added 3rd-person attack power role is filled by the close-range charge attacks.
Would I appreciate Missiles on the B button? Absolutely not. If 3rd person use were necessary, use Minus button (currently unoccupied) to switch attack modes. The B button when held sideways is a last resort, poorly positioned and easily pressed by mistake when your attention is off of it (MM10 suffers SEVERELY for this). It should never be used for anything potentially detrimental, and if it must be used, is best suited to "hold" mechanics so that accidental use can be instantly canceled (ie, Brawl's shields; in Other M you could potentially hold B to charge your Speed Booster, or possibly a 3rd-person Grapple Beam). Using it for Missiles would risk wasting ammunition (granted less of a concern with concentration) and charge time, and regardless of that would feel extremely intrusive.
-
He's a general, his blood/brain being on file somewhere is no far stretch. As Other M showed us you can barely sneeze in that outfit without somebody authorizing it.
"Samus: That perfect military mind... The wisdom of Adam Malkovich continued to serve even after death. Until today, I had no idea that the minds of leaders and scientists were frequently uploaded to computers. My incredible reunion with Adam may have saved the universe..."
[spoiler=ZEE SPOILERZ!!]Adam's death I don't mind, but yeah, some encounter with an unfreezable Metroid would have been nice. Drive home the point that MB was setting Samus up, and also make the fact that they are a setup for Adam's death less obvious. Yeah, we know he has to buy it before Fusion, and they picked a good way for him to go, my full and sole gripe is being told why, rather than shown why.
Madeline, yeah. As I said before, her being revealed after Queen Metroid makes it clear that they were just looking at the story and not at game pacing. I don't expect to grow attached to Melissa, though. Cheezy dialogue pretty much never comes unexpected to me, and besides, no matter what Madeline thinks of her, she's still based off of Mother Brain. Samus may or may not believably hesitate to kill her, but trying to build player sympathy with her, I think, is a majorly uphill battle.[/spoiler]
Missiles I didn't mind in the least. They're sniping weapons in this game, hence the lock-on. Your added 3rd-person attack power role is filled by the close-range charge attacks.
Would I appreciate Missiles on the B button? Absolutely not. If 3rd person use were necessary, use Minus button (currently unoccupied) to switch attack modes. The B button when held sideways is a last resort, poorly positioned and easily pressed by mistake when your attention is off of it (MM10 suffers SEVERELY for this). It should never be used for anything potentially detrimental, and if it must be used, is best suited to "hold" mechanics so that accidental use can be instantly canceled (ie, Brawl's shields; in Other M you could potentially hold B to charge your Speed Booster, or possibly a 3rd-person Grapple Beam). Using it for Missiles would risk wasting ammunition (granted less of a concern with concentration) and charge time, and regardless of that would feel extremely intrusive.
Yep, exactly. So Adam might still be alive somewhere. It's the general rule of off-screen deaths.
Also, Missiles would be good to have on third-person, but I actually thought that having to switch to first-person to use them was a cool move, and raised the challenge level a bit in a way that I didn't find that gimped the gameplay. Plus, if you had missiles in third person, 90% of the time you use the first person would be gone.
-
Here's the video for keeping your items in MP2. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JB1_ejJc0As)
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Nice... always fascinated by stuff like this.
-
@Flash/Bat: back from work, but in all seriousness, I can't really describe much, I like Adam and his 'death' scene touched me, and when I get that, it's good/well done to me. Repeated viewings could change that, but so far, in the case of Adam anyways, not so much of a change. That's all.
As for 'manga storytelling'. The movie adaption of Old Boy sure as hell is one [tornado fang]ing awesome adaption, considering what medium it's based on. Manga too is also awesome, oh, but I guess my opinion is invalid cuz it's wacky japanese comic [parasitic bomb]/sarcasm. :P
But whatever, to each his/her own no?
-
@Flash/Bat: back from work, but in all seriousness, I can't really describe much, I like Adam and his 'death' scene touched me, and when I get that, it's good/well done to me. Repeated viewings could change that, but so far, in the case of Adam anyways, not so much of a change. That's all.
As for 'manga storytelling'. The movie adaption of Old Boy sure as hell is one [tornado fang]ing awesome adaption, considering what medium it's based on. Manga too is also awesome, oh, but I guess my opinion is invalid cuz it's wacky japanese comic [parasitic bomb]/sarcasm. :P
But whatever, to each his/her own no?
It's cool. I'm not questioning your taste or anything.
...Old Boy is VERY different from the manga, though. Heck, manga completely sucks compared to the movie.
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Hm @ video
So, you Infinite Speed into a secret world and bypass the portal before you ever meet Dark Samus. Maybe I should try it later.
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im guessing this doesnt work on trillogy
Posted on: September 09, 2010, 10:56:51 AM
hey... found these...
(http://img825.imageshack.us/img825/5685/samus3rdpersonperspecti.jpg)
(http://img695.imageshack.us/img695/4584/earlymetroidprime.jpg)
Is it possible an early version of prime also had a 3rd person perspective?
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im guessing this doesnt work on trillogy
Posted on: September 09, 2010, 10:56:51 AM
hey... found these...
(http://img825.imageshack.us/img825/5685/samus3rdpersonperspecti.jpg)
(http://img695.imageshack.us/img695/4584/earlymetroidprime.jpg)
Is it possible an early version of prime also had a 3rd person perspective?
Um, yes. This is known. I think Miyamoto was who made them change the perspective.
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I didnt know. -3-
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Um, yes. This is known. I think Miyamoto was who made them change the perspective.
Interesting. I thought the Japanese hated first person shooters.
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Doesn't mean all 'japanese' hate FPSes.
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If he loved them, he would have told them to add a friggin' dual analog stick setup.
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No, Flame, if I remember right, they fixed the Infinite Speed bug in Trilogy. Not a hundred percent sure, but either way it probably won't work in that version.
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Barely anything works in Trilogy, and it was fixed in Prime1, so I wouldn't be surprised.
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Prediction for when the next Metroid title will be?
Metroid - 1986
Metroid 2 - 1991
Super Metroid - 1995
Metroid Prime/Fusion - 2002
Metroid Prime 2/Zero Mission - 2004
Metroid Prime Hunters - 2006
Metroid Prime 3 - 2007
Metroid: Other M - 2010
So let's see... in case the next chapter in the Metroid saga is a sequel to Other M, we might get it in 2 to 4 years. In case it's a whole new game in the franchise, with new gameplay and revamped everything... probably around 3 to 7 years. =P
I wish they went back to what they did with the Primes, and release a portable game and a console game almost at the same time.
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They might go back to the secret Prime 3 ending.
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I wouldn't mind Metroid going back to Retro Studios. If we get another drone-fest like Other M again...
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I wouldn't mind Metroid going back to whoever did Fusion/Zero Mission.
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I wouldn't mind Metroid going back to Retro Studios. If we get another drone-fest like Other M again...
Or at least to someone who makes good-looking Metroid games.
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http://metroid2remake.blogspot.com/
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dz-Sfw91A6A[/youtube]
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Man, why can't we get -that- guy developing for Nintendo?
Or the guy making AM2R.
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I thought I already linked that...
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You did.
Just wanted to bring it up again.
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I found this on the ANN forums where they were discussing other M. I liked it so ill just drop it here.
I find it interesting that the biggest issue people across the internet seem to have with the story is Samus freaking out over having to fight Ridley yet again. I feel like we've been trained by TV and movies to expect people to only be able to panic at things they've never seen before. I'm not quite sure that's how it works in real life.
A lot of people have moments of panic not from a single traumatic event, but from the accumulation of many similar ones. There's a "straw that breaks the camel's back" moment where the person has just gone through the trauma one time too many, and even though there's nothing particularly new or different about this instance, it just all becomes too much.
Considering that A) Ridley killed Samus' family, B) she's fought him many times already, and C) each time, she thought it was finally over, only to have him resurface yet again, it seems reasonable to me that she would finally hit the wall, and reach the point where it was just one time too many.
This could have been presented a little better in the story, but the basic idea of her losing it over Ridley makes more sense to me than if it had happened over some new alien threat. With any other creature, Samus could think to herself "well, I'll just kill it." With Ridley, killing never seems to work. She's trapped in a cycle. That would be enough to make anyone freak out.
The writing in the game was mediocre at best, but it felt like a problem of execution more than intent to me. If it had been explained better, the Ridley scene could have been great. The idea was sound, but they messed it up.
This is also why I don't buy the "sexism" argument. Showing a moment of weakness doesn't diminish Samus as a strong female lead; being strong isn't about lacking weakness, it's about overcoming weakness. It would be more sexist to continue to portray her as perfect, without flaws or failings of any kind. I've never met a woman like that, have you?
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The sexism thing is [tornado fang]ing stupid. People saying that Samus is so strong, is a simple matter of generalization. Given that you don't even see her face in most games, she could even be crying, and shitting herself all over everytime she sees a Space Pirate. Nobody knew until now.
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The sexism thing is [tornado fang]ing stupid. People saying that Samus is so strong, is a simple matter of generalization. Given that you don't even see her face in most games, she could even be crying, and shitting herself all over everytime she sees a Space Pirate. Nobody knew until now.
Suddenly, I think of what it would have been like if this was the case in most Metroid games and it becomes a bit more somber than I once thought. Man this series' storytelling potential is through the roof.
I'll comment on Other M later. Get ready for it. XD
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The sexism thing is [tornado fang]ing stupid. People saying that Samus is so strong, is a simple matter of generalization. Given that you don't even see her face in most games, she could even be crying, and shitting herself all over everytime she sees a Space Pirate. Nobody knew until now.
The next Metroid game will feature three more gauges:
Feces-meter, Tear-Meter and Stress-Meter
You must take care of all three and keep them balanced or Samus will suffer a physical/psychic shock which is an insta-kill.
I really should become a game designer.
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The next Metroid game will feature three more gauges:
Feces-meter, Tear-Meter and Stress-Meter
You must take care of all three and keep them balanced or Samus will suffer a physical/psychic shock which is an insta-kill.
I really should become a game designer.
Feces-meter can power the Shitbeam, one of Samus' most powerful weapons! I wonder what kind of doors it could be used to open...
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Feces-meter can power the Shitbeam, one of Samus' most powerful weapons! I wonder what kind of doors it could be used to open...
Crapdoors of course.
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I was alright with most of the stuff in Other M to some degree, but one scene in particular crossed the line for me.
[spoiler]That scene, as most people would agree to some extent, would be the Ridley scene. That was just too much. I understand why she'd react that way, if this was the original Metroid. By this point in time in the timeline though, she's killed him at least twice (four times if you count the Prime games, which is up in the air for Nintendo it seems). I'm sorry, but she would have had that freak-out much earlier than this, and I felt this was a little detrimental to her. Death of the baby metroid be damned.[/spoiler]
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I was alright with most of the stuff in Other M to some degree, but one scene in particular crossed the line for me.
[spoiler]That scene, as most people would agree to some extent, would be the Ridley scene. That was just too much. I understand why she'd react that way, if this was the original Metroid. By this point in time in the timeline though, she's killed him at least twice (four times if you count the Prime games, which is up in the air for Nintendo it seems). I'm sorry, but she would have had that freak-out much earlier than this, and I felt this was a little detrimental to her. Death of the baby metroid be damned.[/spoiler]
Read the ANN article a few posts up, dawg. It counters what you just said.
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The ANN article is dead on.
Also, I can do nothing but shake my heads at the idiots clamoring about how having a personality and emotions makes Samus weak. If anything, the fact that she grits her teeth and carries on despite all the [parasitic bomb] that's happened to her makes her stronger.
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Just for the record, heres the article that discusses other M, (and goes into details about the different comics and mangas as well-)
http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/the-x-button/2010-09-08
and the forum discussion
http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/bbs/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=134506
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The ANN article is dead on.
Also, I can do nothing but shake my heads at the idiots clamoring about how having a personality and emotions makes Samus weak. If anything, the fact that she grits her teeth and carries on despite all the [parasitic bomb] that's happened to her makes her stronger.
Very much agreed.
Sure, Samus has faced Ridley before. But it's a shock here. She not only killed him previously, but the planet he was on exploded, and the Space Pirates seemingly are out of the picture (I don't get that, but that's a whole other discussion), so there should be no chance of him returning. Samus thought that Ridley was behind her. She was not prepared to face him again. Further, going by the "straw that broke the camel's back" mentality, this IS her first game since witnessing her "baby" explode, which Other M makes no small effort to emphasize. That can't be helping things either.
Oh, and it's five times killed if you count the Primes. Ridley appears twice in Prime 3.
And sexist? Honestly? Like male heroes never panic? Like male characters carrying guns on their arms haven't hesitated to shoot murderous enemies who may be about to launch a group of missiles into their own city?
(See, more people need to play MegaMan, then we wouldn't have these problems.)
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Read the ANN article a few posts up, dawg. It counters what you just said.
I agree to a certain extent. I understand that there's a limit, but it wasn't presented well. As it's presented, it just comes out of nowhere. They spend a majority of the rest of the game with a log entry running in the background, perhaps something to that effect there would have perhaps portrayed it better. As it stand though, that is simply not the case. All we see is her freaking the [tornado fang] out, and so I can understand the criticisms of that particular scene. She takes the time to voice everything else, but here all of a sudden the stuff she says only pertains to what Ridley did in the past, not the fact that he keeps coming back. The presentation still sucks.
edit: To clarify, I'm not screaming sexism like a lot of people. I'm just saying that scene wasn't portrayed well. Just making sure that's out there before people jump down my throat making assumptions.
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True, the scene could've been done a hell of a lot better.
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As it's presented, it just comes out of nowhere.
That's because Ridley came out of nowhere. And that's the only way it works. If she knew he was coming then the scene wouldn't have made any sense. And it would make even less sense if she was just reminiscing about it. The fact that she thought she could put it behind her, bury it in the back of her head, no doubt contributes to Ridley's reappearance being such a shock. If she were comfortable discussing him prior, THEN she shouldn't have been panicking.
I will grant you, some further elaboration on their history wouldn't have been a bad idea. Besides one of Fusion's ending images, the fact that it was Ridley who orphaned Samus hasn't really been touched upon in-game. That said, the only logical place to fit it in Other M's encounter would be after the point, and by then, the main concern is what happened to Adam and Anthony. Maybe a full flashback to K2L's scenery as opposed to just showing Samus as a child would have made it a bit more clear, but I still think that the scene as-is works very well.
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Oh, and it's five times killed if you count the Primes. Ridley appears twice in Prime 3.
He died the first time in Prime 3? I don't remember that.
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Samus is perfectly content narrating everything else in log form, yet doesn't at this point which confuses a lot of people. A good amount of what we hear is presented in the past tense, as if she's going over the events after they've occurred, so don't go telling me that she couldn't think properly at that point in time since that wouldn't have an effect on her recalling the events. Ridley can still come out of nowhere which is fine, but perhaps it would have been better with an explanation as to why she'd break down at this particular meeting of Ridley. As it stands her reaction is a tad uncalled for considering what we're given to work with. Also, I was already aware of the backstory, but it doesn't change the fact that the majority won't know. As it stands, there's no reason for anyone to believe that it's because of PTSD, especially considering the fact that most people know at the very least that she's demolished Ridley several times in the past.
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Ridley didnt really die in prime 1. (not that we know of-) we just saw the Temple blast him over the edge of the ring. If I were to guess, he probably took his time off in prime 2 to be repaired and recover for his prime 3 appearance. Then Omega Ridley happens...
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For the record, my problem wasn't that certain scene (as I said, it at least made sense, even if the ham factor was a little higher than it should have been.) My problem was with how stupid the entire story was. It honestly felt more like a random fanfiction taken from the Internet instead of something more polished. I also wasn't a fan of how this story essentially forced the game into a mostly linear form.
I know some will quickly argue the invisible walls theory used with RPGs and even later Metroid titles, where every game, short of glitching, that appears open is set in invisible corridors as the programmers intend a game to be played a certain way. That's cool and all, but there are times where I either don't want to continue the story and go exploring somewhere else (but herp, I can't because a door is force locked) or authorization is nonsensical in some cases.
There's also the whole introduction of a key character and key plot point aiming to tug the player's emotions around 10 minutes before the credits rolled. The only time in recent memory I've seen that work is in Metal Gear Solid 4, and even then it was a bit contrived (but that's for another topic.)
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For the record, my problem wasn't that certain scene (as I said, it at least made sense, even if the ham factor was a little higher than it should have been.) My problem was with how stupid the entire story was. It honestly felt more like a random fanfiction taken from the Internet instead of something more polished. I also wasn't a fan of how this story essentially forced the game into a mostly linear form.
I know some will quickly argue the invisible walls theory used with RPGs and even later Metroid titles, where every game, short of glitching, that appears open is set in invisible corridors as the programmers intend a game to be played a certain way. That's cool and all, but there are times where I either don't want to continue the story and go exploring somewhere else (but herp, I can't because a door is force locked) or authorization is nonsensical in some cases.
There's also the whole introduction of a key character and key plot point aiming to tug the player's emotions around 10 minutes before the credits rolled. The only time in recent memory I've seen that work is in Metal Gear Solid 4, and even then it was a bit contrived (but that's for another topic.)
tl,dr: The story of the game was a narrative mess, it was simplistic and sloppy.
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Well, much as I like the Ridley encounter I did have plenty of OTHER story-qualms with the game that I went over many pages ago. So, I guess I can't argue with that.
I don't mind the "linear" structure in terms of story so much, as on the whole Metroid has mainly been about traveling from key item to key item anyway (especially in older titles that based your "ending" on clear time rather than item completion; smart move on Retro's part I say). But a few less locked doors would have been nice, this is true. More than once I raged at being unable to backtrack to a few item dots in the Main Sector, it's completely senseless. Requiring items to retrace your steps once in a while is one thing, but there's no excuse for just locking out the beginning area because you can. And there is NO REASON WHATSOEVER the Main Sector elevator should remain locked after you have completed the post-game mission.
He died the first time in Prime 3? I don't remember that.
IIRC, she shot him in the mouth, and he laid there. That's as "dead" as being shot off a cliff in Prime 1.
Then Omega Ridley happens...
Omega Ridley is one of those things you just excuse because it's cool, I believe. I mean, if the Pirates are in league with Dark Samus from the beginning of MP3, then wouldn't one have expected their Homeworld Leviathan to have landed before that?
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What was Ridley's final status in Fusion? Because I swear that mofo is going to come back rainbow-colored or something.
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Unless the Federation/Space Pirates have some backup DNA left... Ridley is dead. His physical remains were drained and destroyed by an X so it could take Ridley's shape.
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And then Samus absorbed that X to get Screw Attack.
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Unless the Federation/Space Pirates have some backup DNA left... Ridley is dead. His physical remains were drained and destroyed by an X so it could take Ridley's shape.
If we ever get a Metroid chronologically after Fusion I'd bet the Federation clones him so that he can go after Samus.
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Federation cloning shenanigans have to stop sooner or later, or at the very least those responsible ought to form their own organization.
I'm REALLY not willing to swallow Zebes' destruction equaling Space Pirates extinct, though, so we could always see him again that way. With how many times Ridley's been revived already, I'm sure he's "archived" somewhere.
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Or Nintendo could stop being dickheads with the repeated plot and make Samus chase a new threat, unrelated to Metroids, Space Pirates or Ridley.
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I think it'd be kinda cool if she did some actual Bounty Hunting.
Get her some CASSSSSHHHH!
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I think it'd be kinda cool if she did some actual Bounty Hunting.
Get her some CASSSSSHHHH!
Funny how most of her missions seem to be out of the kindness of her heart, and we never see her actually get PAID.
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Can't bounty hunt when the federation is after her, but I guess another midquel would work.
Or a prequel. Yeah, that would be probably be ideal for "just another Metroid game", something before even Zero Mission, would inevitably be unrelated to metroids, space pirates, and everything else familiar from the series... hm.
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Funny how most of her missions seem to be out of the kindness of her heart, and we never see her actually get PAID.
Usual in the background stuff. Imagination can fill it really.
I must admit, if only the Ridley appearance scene had a CG rendition of his killing upon Samus' parents and vice versa. I think there would be a bit less hate.
Frankly I was worried about this sometime ago if they would show events from the manga or plain expect the fans to know it which sadly, to me, is the real flaw of Other M's story; leading down what now is similar to how divisive the fanbase got w/ Chrono Cross.
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Can't bounty hunt when the federation is after her, but I guess another midquel would work.
Or a prequel. Yeah, that would be probably be ideal for "just another Metroid game", something before even Zero Mission, would inevitably be unrelated to metroids, space pirates, and everything else familiar from the series... hm.
Is it confirmed that the Federation is indeed hunting her down? Or is it just "ruined their horrible plans and saved the galaxy, so I probably pissed them off"?
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They seemed to be on okay terms in the beginning of Fusion.
Or Nintendo could stop being dickheads with the repeated plot and make Samus chase a new threat, unrelated to Metroids, Space Pirates or Ridley.
The Primes, less so 3.
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They seemed to be on okay terms in the beginning of Fusion.
The Primes, less so 3.
Metroids, Space Pirates and Ridley. All Prime games touched in at least one of these things.
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They weren't the focus though. Hell, the Metroids' presence in Prime 2 and 3 was basically just a cameo. And are they even relevant to Hunters?
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Im pretty sure the BSL station was the same people from the bottle ship. The small group within the federation. AKA the Federation shmucks who showed up at the end to pretty much clean up the mess.(because you just KNOW they were going to kill Bergman off screen.) They took Ridley and Nightmare and took them to the BSL. still had Metroid samples, and cloned them again.
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Then a game needs to be done with Samus going after that Federation branch, and killing them.
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Or Nintendo could stop being dickheads with the repeated plot and make Samus chase a new threat, unrelated to Metroids, Space Pirates or Ridley.
Metroid game not related to Metroids would kinda suck. What they need to do is stop trying to render them extinct in every damn game only to come up with some breeding/cloning solution in the next. Have the next Metroid game leave them out wild so that their reappearance needn't be the center of some contrived plot device. That way, as in the Primes, they can simply appear for the hell of it.
Ridley is, next to the title critters, the most iconic villain of the series. Going without him is like Zelda going without Ganon: it's doable, but it won't last. And since Ridley is himself a Space Pirate, yeah. But, again, just because the Pirates are in the game, doesn't mean they have to be the center of attention (see Prime 2).
They weren't the focus though. Hell, the Metroids' presence in Prime 2 and 3 was basically just a cameo. And are they even relevant to Hunters?
Weavel is a Space Pirate, I believe, although frankly all of the other Hunters in that game serve no purpose other than cannon fodder. I'm trying to remember whether or not Metroids made any appearance in that game other than the First Hunt demo...
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Just because Metroids are in the title, it doesn't mean they have to appear. There have been Metal Gear games without Metal Gears. Super Mario Land 3 didn't have Mario. Let's just put Samus in a completely different setting than she's used to, and breathe new life into the franchise (not saying it doesn't have life now, but trying something new and fresh would be quite good).
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Read this.
http://woopforce.blogspot.com/2010/09/other-m-does-not-make-samus-weak.html
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Read this.
http://woopforce.blogspot.com/2010/09/other-m-does-not-make-samus-weak.html
Again, I understand. But then he says this:
Sure, the story may not have always been handled well, the dialogue was too cheesy at times, they might have let the whole Deleter thing unexplained, and it was anti-climatic sometimes;
Then proceeds to say it still had more emotional depth than other Metroid games. While I don't disagree with him on that (though I have to wonder what he thinks of Fusion), I still don't think it excuses the part I quoted and that he admitted. Had those scenes been handled better, then I don't think anyone would have an issues with the story. As it stands, it was still poorly handled.
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nobody disagrees it wasnt handled the best way it could have, but the point stands to all the whiners.
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Of course it had more emotional depth than other Metroid games. It's easy when all your other games have ZERO EMOTIONAL DEPTH. The only emotions come from the gamers going "Ooooh such beautiful scenery, I bet Samus is feeling this or that, she must be really badass, I will count this as my own canon personality and I will be extremely pissed off at Nintendo if they ever reveal her true one!"
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Of course it had more emotional depth than other Metroid games. It's easy when all your other games have ZERO EMOTIONAL DEPTH. The only emotions come from the gamers going "Ooooh such beautiful scenery, I bet Samus is feeling this or that, she must be really badass, I will count this as my own canon personality and I will be extremely pissed off at Nintendo if they ever reveal her true one!"
NOW THAT IVE SAID IT, IT MUST BE CANON[/littlekuriboh]
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Of course it had more emotional depth than other Metroid games. It's easy when all your other games have ZERO EMOTIONAL DEPTH.
[tornado fang] your [parasitic bomb]. When that baby metroid died, I nearly cried. I loved that little bastard.
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[tornado fang] your [parasitic bomb]. When that baby metroid died, I nearly cried. I loved that little bastard.
BOOHOOHOO THAT SPRITE CAME TO SAVE ME AFTER ALMOST KILLING ME
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[tornado fang] your [parasitic bomb]. When that baby metroid died, I nearly cried. I loved that little bastard.
Only moment in the whole series then. (before Fusion and M)
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BOOHOOHOO THAT SPRITE CAME TO SAVE ME AFTER ALMOST KILLING ME
I'm beginning to think you have a stick firmly lodged up your ass, bro
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I'm beginning to think you have a stick firmly lodged up your ass, bro
8D
I'm beginning people really have no exposition to any sort of quality story whatsoever if they consider an event like that something with EMOTIONAL DEPTH.
My last bowel movement had more emotional depth than that.
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8D
I'm beginning people really have no exposition to any sort of quality story whatsoever if they consider an event like that something with EMOTIONAL DEPTH.
My last bowel movement had more emotional depth than that.
..Oh wow.
You thought I was serious.
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Super Mario Land 3 didn't have Mario.
(http://lol.rockmanpm.com/sml3ending.png)
You're right, there's no Mario riding a helicopter or a big shiny Peach statue anywhere in that game.
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Of course it had more emotional depth than other Metroid games. It's easy when all your other games have ZERO EMOTIONAL DEPTH.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oETaPIpH6nc[/youtube]
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I dont think a bunch of red shirts dying really counts as emotional depth when we dont ever get to know them as characters.
Sure, makes you go, "oh wow poor space marines"
but thats about it. Samus' gesture afterwards shows that she respects fallen soldiers like that and she feels for them, but that hardly qualifies as gripping. theres still next to Zero emotional depth.
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Certainly did more in three minutes than Other M did the whole game.
Every so called sympathetic moment was so over-cheesed that I laughed at them. That's horrible writing. Never mind the one plot point that may have had some nice impact was introduced and finished in less than 10 minutes before the credits rolled.
[spoiler] The real Madeline's introduction would have been better utilized half-way through with her actually explaining about MB, not just having Samus recant that part. It made little sense to me for Samus to take over.[/spoiler]
What the team here needs to do is hire more competent writers that actually know how to set up a story and have it flow while not bogging it down to all hell in long and needless description.
Too bad most of Japan subscribes to this long exposition style of writing and always utilizes death of someone to induce character change. I'm not saying America's writing cliches are better, but at least change things up. Only time I liked what was going on was--
[spoiler]--the cutscene where she recovers Adam's helmet... and not even because of the moment, but because it was abruptly cut off by a Klaxon.[/spoiler]
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(http://lol.rockmanpm.com/sml3ending.png)
You're right, there's no Mario riding a helicopter or a big shiny Peach statue anywhere in that game.
Nitpickers. Cameo for a character whose name is on the title? Doesn't count.
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Only time I liked what was going on was--
[spoiler]--the cutscene where she recovers Adam's helmet... and not even because of the moment, but because it was abruptly cut off by a Klaxon.[/spoiler]
Out of spite, or because it was sensible?
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The fact is that ANY previous "emotional" moment you can get out of a Metroid game is purely visual, no dialogue, and thus highly open to personal interpretation, to say nothing of attention span. There's the death of the Baby, that glare in Samus's eye when she mentions the colony being under attack, and the various childhood scenes in Zero Mission. At the end of the day, they're all only passing glimpses. Other M was the first "deep" look into Samus's character in-game, and even though it was not perfect, I still think it was enjoyable.
Fusion is a slight exception, but I don't think anything in there was particularly gripping. Dachola and Etticunes looked cute, but that's about it. For all the complaining about Adam's "authorization" policies, I think Other M did a lot more for his character than Fusion could ever hope to. Fusion just gave him a name and a catchphrase.
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Out of spite, or because it was sensible?
Just because of how poorly coordinated it was. One thing would have been to make the scene rumble instead of just abruptly cut to a Klaxon.
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I disagree with that. The klaxon is a wake-up call, and an appropriate one I think. Samus returns to a bioweapon death trap scheduled to self-destruct so she can retrieve a memento? Fine and dandy, but if nobody cleared her to be there, then she can't really afford to stand around day-dreaming. It's appropriate given the item, but not practical given the location. Or to put it another way: WE DON'T HAVE TIME FOR FLASHBACKS!
If Metroid has any issues with self-destructing, it would be the rationale (or lack thereof) behind preceding the self-destruct with who knows how many smaller explosions throughout the facility. We don't know why it happens, and there's no reason it should happen, but hey, it looks cool.
As far as Other M goes specifically, I'd prefer the use of the NES escape theme as opposed to the Super Metroid method of recycling Ridley's theme (awesome as it is). Too much of that game's soundtrack goes unappreciated within the series; part of why I love Zero Mission so much.
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The Game Overthinker (http://screwattack.com/videos/TGO-Episode-40-Heavens-to-Metroid) hit the nail on the head. In short, people may think they know Samus, but they really don't know jack.
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Movie Bob is awesome. He really is. I didnt know he reviewed Video games.
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I fully agree w/ what Overthinker says~
Especially on how the control scheme just plain works. Even now I still get surprised how nice it feels here and then during my playthroughs.
Sadly, the more dedicated forum users on the Metroid Database think otherwise, but w/e.
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I also happen to agree with Bob, but the MAIN thing that I agree with is the controller deal and the over all idea of presentation.
It's the kind of thing Legends 3 developers need to pay attention to and certain crazy flying bats need to consider.
Don't need to get complicated and abuse buttons and the double analog stick bullshit and all the extra crap that is often used in FPSes and what have you.
A simple controller scheme that allows you to control your character effectively, is perfectly fine. And a DEPARTURE from FPS style game play is more than welcome. I tire of it.
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Yep, the Overthinker nailed it (though on Primes, I liked 'em, though I generally hate the FPS genre). I agree especially on controls, Grapple Beam excepted (that was a bit awkward/clunky), the game controls remarkably well given the limited controller they chose. On character, yeah, all this bull about Samus's character switch is pure fanon, and I find this illusion that strong characters must by definition be emotionless rather disturbing.
IGN actually had some freelancer post an article (http://wii.ign.com/articles/112/1122068p1.html) about how Other M "killed" Samus (by a woman, no less, but she echoes the same "strong women must be ice lords" mentality as the rest of the internet). I posted a rather lengthy refute out of boredom, and I think one person noticed (if anyone cares, scroll down here (http://boards.ign.com/metroid/b5217/195987409/r196064584/), look for the Mewtwo avatar).
By the way, remember how Samus self-authorizes the Space Jump, being necessary, and the Screw Attack, which was not? I think I know why. Just noticed today, in Other M, the Screw Attack is listed in the menu as a sub-feature under Space Jump in the same manner as Shine Spark falls under Speed Booster.
THEY RUINED SCREW ATTACKING FOREVER!!!
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I don't see the mewtwo avatar...
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wasn't the screw attack always kinda a subfeature to the spacejump anyway?
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You could disable the space jump without disabling screw attack in Super Metroid, and though you'd still get that swirly effect you wouldn't be able to multi-jump.
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so its only one game where its not a subfeature
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In Zero Mission you could always get it early. Don't forget the original Metroid either where there wasn't any Space Jump :P
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Funny how sarcastic comments evolve into serious thoughts. Oh well, that's RPM. 8D
All of the above from Align and Jericho holds. And unless you're deliberately sequence-breaking there is no reason you should be Space Jumping before you Screw Attack in Zero Mission. The Space Jump is incompatible with your starting suit; it cannot be used until you defeat the Chozodia ruins boss.
In all previous side-scrolling games Space Jump and Screw Attack were separate items (not only that but the Screw Attack symbol is pretty much the most iconic one in Metroid). It was mainly Prime 2&3 which blurred that line, but that was because the Space Jump in Prime was a simple double-jump.
I don't see the mewtwo avatar...
Apparently my posts-per-page setting there is not the default (don't know how/if one can link to a specific post on IGN). Sorry about that.
EDITS: This (http://boards.ign.com/metroid/b5217/195987409/r196064584/) should get you to the proper page regardless. I think.
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I need to play this
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xN9WYo0Hogo[/youtube]
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZsJx7ltK-RM[/youtube]
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Looks fun, yeah.
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I want~ 0v0
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Hypershell...
You just PWNED that freelancer.
Great rebuttal there.
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That was adorable.
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People are getting too up-in-arms over her characterization when there's actually nothing wrong with it outside of the execution at times (I blame this largely on poor writing.)
Everyone expecting Samus to be a stoic and heartless killing machine have not even caught that she does show emotional signs within her more muted games in facial gestures or general actions (see: that Prime 2 scene I keep yapping about as a more in your face version of this.)
The game's problem, again writing, was that it pretty much shoved it full force into the player's face and it got rather irritating at times, and I'm not even talking Ridley scene, which I thought was perfectly fine given her backstory and thoughts, which she even mentions early on in the very game itself.
You done good, Hypershell. I also agree with the Space Pirate inconsistencies because if they need Mother Brain to be brilliant and organized and Mother Brain got zapped into oblivion... how the hell did they restructure for Super Metroid?
And now people know why Prime 3's teaser that Mother Brain was stolen GF technology makes more sense, at least as to why she came back in Super Metroid.
Here's hoping that, if we get another story-driven Metroid (probably not likely... I've been hearing this game has been getting a royal flogging at retail) they at least hire a writing team that can at least make sense of the Metroid-verse instead of Sakamoto's current overly-ham fisted and plothole filled fanfiction.
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...man, I don't what to make of this.
http://kotaku.com/5649540/in-which-samus-aran-jumps-on-stage-and-takes-her-clothes-off/gallery/
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Hahahahaha.
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...man, I don't what to make of this.
http://kotaku.com/5649540/in-which-samus-aran-jumps-on-stage-and-takes-her-clothes-off/gallery/
You know, honestly, I'm actually kinda surprised in a "I thought I've seen everything" kinda of way that this hasn't been tried before. XD
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Something tells me firing the Arm Cannon would've been very funny to see.
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Hahahahaha.
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I finally got around to actually playing Other M, after having it just lying around at home. Looks good to me, although at the moment I seem to be stuck after 4 marines gather around that other guy who died and I get forced into scan mode.
For the most part it seems like people interpreted Samus' lines in the worst way possible.
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You're looking for [spoiler]green blood in the grass.[/spoiler] Definitely one of the tougher mandatory scans.
And yeah, I agree on interpretation. You'd think the extent to which they name/describe the implications of the name for a generic distress signal, would have warned all players to leave their ham/melodrama shields up. Apparently that was not the case.
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[spoiler=Regarding above spoiler]Green blood on green grass... you would think someone would have thought this one through a little better. Maybe at least put it on a dirt patch?[/spoiler]
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[spoiler]Or make it a different color.[/spoiler]
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Or have the screen behave like it does every OTHER time you're forced into scan mode, instead of misleading you into thinking that the game's just not registering the viewpoint switch. I thought it was a bug or something and kept resetting. You know how many times I wound up redoing the fight with the lizard?
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Unless your palm is uniquely transparent to infrared light that should not be possible. Failure to register on the remote would lock you into 3rd person, not 1st.
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Still, every time you're locked into 1st-person view, the screen goes black and white if you move the remote way. Every time EXCEPT outside the test center. It doesn't make any goddamned sense!
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Still, every time you're locked into 1st-person view, the screen goes black and white if you move the remote way. Every time EXCEPT outside the test center. It doesn't make any goddamned sense!
it does it every time you move the wiimote outside of 1st person when locked in. it happened before the wasp fight too. when it wants you to scan those little grub like things.
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Yes, I'm AWARE of that.
What I'm SAYING is that the game DOESN'T do that when you're looking for the blood splotch in the grass.
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The green is pretty bright though... (seeing so upon my low% run of the game (3% so far, although it could've been 2%, but ah well, a minor mistake.)
Hopefully they'll tweak the target reaction to be a click faster if they are to keep the pixel/investigative hunts in the next "Other M" game (I personally hope they do. They got the mechanics down very nicely (albeit needing some tweaking/fixing here and there) and they can definitely do a more open world next time around :) ).
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Dunno if this was posted yet, but I found this article through TV Tropes. It's in regards to that one scene, for those of you who haven't played or spoiled it for yourselves yet.
http://gamrfeed.vgchartz.com/story/81909/ptsd-or-weakness-real-experts-on-why-samus-didnt-shoot/
Looks like either the writers got lucky, or did extensive research on post-traumatic stress disorder. Either way, this was an interesting read.
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Hahaha, all those idiots just got pwned. XD
Seriously, it's PTSD, and it's good to see that they accurately portrayed it. ^.^
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Still think a short flashback of some sort (which the fricken commercial actually does well enough) ingame would have solidified it for people. As it stands it's too open, and people who have no experience with the backstory of Samus won't get the issues Samus has with Ridley. Did the game do a good job of displaying PTSD? Yes. Did it do a good job at explaining why Samus has PTSD? Afraid not. The people that were interviewed there were told of Samus' backstory before viewing the scene, the majority of the complainers were not informed of said backstory properly. I stand firmly in that.
Just to reiterate, I already knew of her past so I could understand what she was going through. A lot of people that played the game did not have this luxury however, so I can see why they would react the way they did. Not to mention PTSD is sadly brushed under the rug a little bit too often, sadly.
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Here's some Fridge Logic that maybe you guys can help explain (or maybe the game does it later I dunno):
Why the #¤"&!@$ does Samus disable things like the Varia Suit and Space Jump in the first place?
The power bombs are perfectly justified in-game, missiles I can buy as well for being inaccurate blast damage, maybe even the different beams to minimize casualties in case any marine suddenly jumps into the line of fire or whatever... But why stop her from getting around easily? Why would Adam even want that? He certainly doesn't say anything about them at the beginning.
And why aren't these things enabled when I first step onto the Bottle Ship?!
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Items are only activated when they're absolutely necessary. Varia is kinda the exception, however the heat damage was not that severe at all. Being stuck in the boss fight for x amount of time, however, Samus may not survive.
I guess. It's gameplay design, not story design.
The green is pretty bright though... (seeing so upon my low% run of the game (3% so far, although it could've been 2%, but ah well, a minor mistake.)
No you didn't make a mistake. 3% is the lowest you can get on Normal. There's 2 energy tanks and a missile you have to pick up.
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Yeah it was story I meant. She disabled missiles when Adam disliked her using them without permission, presumably because they're dangerous (rather than because he MUST have CONTROL over EVERY LITTLE THING, which would be silly), but what kind of risk could the Space Jump possibly pose to the squad?
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No you didn't make a mistake. 3% is the lowest you can get on Normal. There's 2 energy tanks and a missile you have to pick up.
I picked up another missile by accident during...just before you hit the second switch to turn the power on. (the little Morph Ball hallway w/ the lil' falling blocks you explode on the way.)
Now i'm 4% so far lol.
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Items are only activated when they're absolutely necessary. Varia is kinda the exception, however the heat damage was not that severe at all. Being stuck in the boss fight for x amount of time, however, Samus may not survive.
I guess. It's gameplay design, not story design.
Indeed. I'll quote The Game Overthinker on this one:
"Instead of roaming the lava area looking for the fire-proof armor, you're looking for the point at which Mr. Voice tells you to turn on the fire-proof armor."
Yeah, I don't get disabling purely defensive upgrades either, but the gameplay is identical in any case.
Yeah it was story I meant. She disabled missiles when Adam disliked her using them without permission, presumably because they're dangerous (rather than because he MUST have CONTROL over EVERY LITTLE THING, which would be silly), but what kind of risk could the Space Jump possibly pose to the squad?
I still say that, if criticizing the story implications, one should not sweep under the rug the fact that Samus herself activates none of that fancy stuff even before meeting Adam, not to mention a particular aspect of the escape sequence. Samus of her own will takes a very minimalist approach in the game.
Still think a short flashback of some sort (which the fricken commercial actually does well enough) ingame would have solidified it for people. As it stands it's too open, and people who have no experience with the backstory of Samus won't get the issues Samus has with Ridley.
That much I'll give you. Even a full-on flashback as opposed to the image of a little girl standing on the Bottle Ship would have done a lot better. Only Fusion (and by extension Zero Mission, if you've linked/hacked them) has thus far touched on the issue in-game. Still, given that you know the backstory, I think the scene works exceptionally well.
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Okay I have beaten the game and am not quite happy with the story. Ridley scene could've been a flashback to the first time they fought and it would've made perfect sense to me since they already demonstrated that Samus was entirely human when she was younger (which we wouldn't know from previous games), but this is like the 5th time he gets revived and she has to put him down, and only now do the symptoms manifest? ...It may be psychologically accurate, but in video games you're supposed to go with what feels realistic, not what actually is.
But I actually had a bigger problem with the Sector Zero cutscene. It was rather unclear why Adam shot Samus - his explanation made no sense, he shot her so she wouldn't shoot the infant with her superior weaponry that would work wherever his did and then some - although I could buy that it was just an excuse and actually meant to stop her from going into S0 instead of him. More than that, I had little emotional connection with Adam (and by extension his heroic sacrifice) since I had only seen him talk for all of like 20 seconds total. Faceless orders don't count, at all. And probably most irritating, Samus reacting exactly like she did when she was an emotional teenager suggests she hasn't matured at all - meaning she's a girl, not a woman.
Posted on: 2010-10-16, 22:53:21
Only real other complaint is that the music sucks.
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Really? I found the music quite good. What little there was that wasnt just ambiance stuff.
All the other stuff goes back down to bad writing.
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It doesn't hurt to listen to it but that's about as far as I'm willing to go. It's very bland, like stuff out of a film (Disney films notwithstanding).
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Well, since they were clearly going for a cinematic presentation, that's not too surprising. I will admit, though, the fact that very near the entire soundtrack is atmospheric leaves little memorable themes besides those which are remixed from/inspired by past ones (title theme, Ridley, and "the story thus far" screens).
Ridley scene could've been a flashback to the first time they fought and it would've made perfect sense to me since they already demonstrated that Samus was entirely human when she was younger (which we wouldn't know from previous games), but this is like the 5th time he gets revived and she has to put him down, and only now do the symptoms manifest? ...It may be psychologically accurate, but in video games you're supposed to go with what feels realistic, not what actually is.
What part of "Samus thought she put Ridley behind her" do people not understand? We expect him to be there by "it's a game" logic simply because he's the next most recurring enemy after the title creatures, but the in-story rationale is that the Space Pirates are toast and as such nobody is around who would WANT to revive him.
But I actually had a bigger problem with the Sector Zero cutscene. It was rather unclear why Adam shot Samus - his explanation made no sense, he shot her so she wouldn't shoot the infant with her superior weaponry that would work wherever his did and then some - although I could buy that it was just an excuse and actually meant to stop her from going into S0 instead of him.
(http://home.comcast.net/~Anguirus/holdit.gif)
Well, good, because that's EXACTLY why he did it. Adam decided ahead of time what he was going to do, and he knew Samus would never go along with it. Heck, Samus said so herself earlier with Anthony, if another allegedly no-win situation would arise, she would still take her chances because it's "who she is." Adam knows that. Samus will not make the same compromises that he would. And if for any reason the player didn't get that, her mirroring her words from Ian's sacrifice should have beat them over the head with it.
And probably most irritating, Samus reacting exactly like she did when she was an emotional teenager suggests she hasn't matured at all - meaning she's a girl, not a woman.
That was already addressed in her monologue after flashing back with Anthony. She's matured in that she better understands why Adam did what he did, even why he was right to do so, and how difficult it must have been even if he wouldn't show it. But that still doesn't mean she'd act as he would. She already stated directly, to herself at least (Anthony let it go) that she wouldn't.
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Also, I found the Adam/Sector Zero scene to be awesome. When Adam was finally going in and Samus was banging on the door and then gives her thumbs down to him, I was already slightly tearing up.
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Yeah, other people did as well, but it did nothing for me.
And why are you yelling HOLD IT at me and then agreeing with me?
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Get equipped with Ace Attorney. It's the general "interrupt for more details" phrase. If I believed you to be flat-out wrong, you'd have gotten the OBJECTION! instead.
Also, "although I could buy" implies that you believed that to be a hypothetical scenario, whereas I very much believe that to truly be what was going on.
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I would say that was definitely what was going on, except it wasn't outright said in the story, so ultimately it's a theory.
Let's talk about Ridley once more (THE GIFT THAT KEEPS ON GIVING)
Why wouldn't Samus get equally upset the first time he's revived - Metroid Prime 1, I think? - when she's bound to be just as unprepared for his return?
And, are we dismissing Prime 3's Pirate Home World canonicity? I mean, they weren't Zebesians, but Ridley was a Space Pirate leader, wasn't he?
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I would say that was definitely what was going on, except it wasn't outright said in the story, so ultimately it's a theory.
Let's talk about Ridley once more (THE GIFT THAT KEEPS ON GIVING)
Why wouldn't Samus get equally upset the first time he's revived - Metroid Prime 1, I think? - when she's bound to be just as unprepared for his return?
And, are we dismissing Prime 3's Pirate Home World canonicity? I mean, they weren't Zebesians, but Ridley was a Space Pirate leader, wasn't he?
Prime series kinda removed from the canon though o__o
and in Metroid 1 ridley fled heavily wounded
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I kinda realized he's never been assumed dead on a planet that exploded before, too. For some reason I thought that happened at the end of Prime 1...
So I guess it would be reasonable of her to be surprised at him coming back after being atomized rather than seemingly shot to death.
Then again the Pirates work [tornado fang]ing fast. In Zero Mission he lands like 4 hours in, then you kill him shortly after, then some 2-4 hours later you fight MECHA RIDLEY!!! So it wouldn't be unreasonable for them to take off from Zebes with his remains while Samus is otherwise occupied.
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The other metroid games have never been too big in the story deparment. often telling it from lore, and events in game. We rarely see Samus reaction to anything other than "body language". For all we know, Samus Jaw drops and her eyes widen in disbelief every time she sees ridley.
Also, the "Zebesians" thing. thats Other M. For some reason, they decided to make "Space Pirate" Synonymous with "Zebesian"
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I've been reading up on the wiki and the manga (http://www.metroid-database.com/manga/listing.php) (the one simply called Metroid). The wiki claims that the Pirates that conquered Zebes (and altered themselves to live on it, according to the manga) renamed themselves Zebesians and considered it their home world, though they were still basically Space Pirates..
The manga also deals with Samus reaction to Ridley - much stronger than in Other M, but then it's also much easier to swallow since it's the first time she sees Ridley after her parents death. When they next meet she attacks without hesitation ("That's right, I'm your nightmare!"). Maybe I'm just seeing what I want to see here, but the feeling I get is that she's over and done with her terror, and even taking into account she now thinks him gone for good, her totally seizing up doesn't gel.
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PTSD is one of those things that creep on ya. Samus's is more of a less than the more serious PTSD cases.
Or so that's how I see it anyways.
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The way I see it, the all-too-easily-dismissed element of surprise is key in the Ridley encounter. Even though I don't particularly buy the premise of the Space Pirates having been annihilated, that premise is there all the same. And under that premise, nobody is left to revive Ridley, so Samus would believe she'd put him behind her. The worst possible time to face your fear is when it's by surprise.
Why wouldn't Samus get equally upset the first time he's revived - Metroid Prime 1, I think? - when she's bound to be just as unprepared for his return?
In Prime 1, Samus witnessed Ridley on board the Frigate Orpheon (and again in Phendrana, IIRC) long before ever doing battle with him. So, yeah, cat was out of the bag. There's also no telling how familiar she is with Pirate habits in regards to resurrecting defeated leaders.
And, are we dismissing Prime 3's Pirate Home World canonicity? I mean, they weren't Zebesians, but Ridley was a Space Pirate leader, wasn't he?
Other M seems to refuse to acknowledge the Primes, although quite frankly with or without the Primes I have a few issues with their canon as to how they depict the Space Pirates.
Whether you're acknowledging Prime 3's Pirate Home World or not, the Pirates as a whole AREN'T Zebesian. Zebes was a Chozo Colony as well as Samus's childhood home after K-2L. Presumably Other M is using the term as short-hand for "Zebesian Space Pirate", as in those which were bred there, but that only further emphasizes the oddity in an interplanetary race being destroyed as the result of losing one planet.
Then again the Pirates work [tornado fang]ing fast. In Zero Mission he lands like 4 hours in, then you kill him shortly after, then some 2-4 hours later you fight MECHA RIDLEY!!!
I think that's less speed and more vanity. "Mecha Ridley" having no organic components, I see it as a part of the mothership, which Ridley commands, that was designed in his image.
The wiki claims that the Pirates that conquered Zebes (and altered themselves to live on it, according to the manga) renamed themselves Zebesians and considered it their home world, though they were still basically Space Pirates.
Again, Pirates being bred on/modified for/otherwise tied to Zebes is not the problem. The problem is how exactly does Zebes' loss equal the death of ALL Space Pirates? It makes absolutely no sense because Zebes was lost twice, once in the original and once in Super. Granted in the original, the entire planet didn't explode, but having bombed their base and their mothership I think it's a safe bet that they were routed from the planet. So the fact that they survived its loss once but couldn't survive the same loss again is exceptionally hard to swallow.
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I can kinda buy her reaction if she genuinely thought he was permanently dead - and also importantly, she didn't think so previously - it's just that I think it's stupid that she would think that.
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Whether you're acknowledging Prime 3's Pirate Home World or not, the Pirates as a whole AREN'T Zebesian. Zebes was a Chozo Colony as well as Samus's childhood home after K-2L. Presumably Other M is using the term as short-hand for "Zebesian Space Pirate", as in those which were bred there, but that only further emphasizes the oddity in an interplanetary race being destroyed as the result of losing one planet.
Again, Pirates being bred on/modified for/otherwise tied to Zebes is not the problem. The problem is how exactly does Zebes' loss equal the death of ALL Space Pirates? It makes absolutely no sense because Zebes was lost twice, once in the original and once in Super. Granted in the original, the entire planet didn't explode, but having bombed their base and their mothership I think it's a safe bet that they were routed from the planet. So the fact that they survived its loss once but couldn't survive the same loss again is exceptionally hard to swallow.
Wouldn't that just mean that prior to Super Metroid, the pirates were simply practically wiped out, only having a stronghold at Zebes remaining? Things like the Pirate Home World being struck by a Leviathan would surely leave a mark, not to mention continuous conflicts with Samus' and the Federation.
There's also no telling how familiar she is with Pirate habits in regards to resurrecting defeated leaders.
One has to wonder how the Federation captured Ridley in Metroid Fusion relates to pirate resurrection habits.
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Wouldn't that just mean that prior to Super Metroid, the pirates were simply practically wiped out, only having a stronghold at Zebes remaining? Things like the Pirate Home World being struck by a Leviathan would surely leave a mark, not to mention continuous conflicts with Samus' and the Federation.
I suppose it's possible that the Federation cleaned them up after the Prime 3 home world was mostly wrecked, but the other planets survived the Leviathans well enough...
Really, we don't have a clue what's going on with the Space Pirates, the wiki even mentioned that they claimed several worlds and called them all "home world".
One has to wonder how the Federation captured Ridley in Metroid Fusion relates to pirate resurrection habits.
The frozen Ridley is probably the same as was in the BOTTLE SHIP; during the post-credits gameplay, if you check the room his corpse was in, it's gone.
So is Nightmare's head.
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The frozen Ridley is probably the same as was in the BOTTLE SHIP; during the post-credits gameplay, if you check the room his corpse was in, it's gone.
So is Nightmare's head.
They are the same
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Wouldn't that just mean that prior to Super Metroid, the pirates were simply practically wiped out, only having a stronghold at Zebes remaining? Things like the Pirate Home World being struck by a Leviathan would surely leave a mark, not to mention continuous conflicts with Samus' and the Federation.
The scenario itself is possible I guess, but as a matter of presentation it's exceptionally hard to swallow when one amends the canon established 16 years ago, even more so when it's direct sequel has been established for nearly 8 with no issues.
And it still strikes me as unlikely, that a force as widespread as theirs, even if backed into a corner, would then put all of their eggs into one basket. To leave NO ships whatsoever off of Zebes?
One has to wonder how the Federation captured Ridley in Metroid Fusion relates to pirate resurrection habits.
I would presume that prior to Other M the Ridley corpse that the Federation recovered was simply one other than Super's. As of Fusion's development there's still the original Metroid and Prime 1 to choose from.
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On an unrelated note, 'sharking the game on my hax0red Wii to make it so I can fire missiles from 3rd-person view makes the second playthrough a lot more entertaining.
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Well, I got the game a few weeks ago, and actually played it through 100% normal completion in no time; a real testimony to how fun this game is. I was just hooked. The gameplay is simple, yet great and I wouldn't mind another Metroid like this.
Anyway, the plotline; the most controversial aspect of this title...
Loved it.
Sure, Samus' monologues often have a sense of redundancy. Sure, all exposition is thrown at you after the final boss. Sure, the Deleter plot was dropped last minute. But in what this title was actually moving towards, Adam's final sacrifice, the game delivered big time. Even the infamous Ridley scene worked courtesy of the atmosphere, environment, music, and the gradual build up of Little Birdie to Ridley. And I'm willing to ignore the story's other flaws because of that.
Whilst I could have done without the Power Suit suddenly vanishing like that, or otherwise some show of feat in the Zero Suit here and there, I felt the game gave us plenty of justification for Samus' sudden PTSD attack. The most obvious premise having been discussed here before: Ridley and the Space Pirates being completely obliterated in the destruction of Planet Zebes. Adding to that, we shouldn't forget loss of the baby, her fated meeting with Adam, and the doubt cast over all her comrades thanks to the Deleter.
Looking at Samus' normal interaction with Ridley, it's notable that she's always completely isolated, or with only a computer to talk to. This feeling, known as a classic metroid staple, would help bolster Samus' emotional defenses against such a shock as Ridley's inevitable return. But now, meeting the people closest to her, all her emotions being dragged out into the open ready to be broken by mistrust; Samus' cold and harsh bounty hunter exterior can only be maintained in gameplay, not in cutscenes. She even monologues this weakness of her; she does not open up to people for that very reason. A concept I find working exceptionally well in relation to her behavior in all previous Metroid titles.
Of course, none of this can hold up until we accept the first premise; the destruction of the pirates. Which revolves on a whole lot of paradoxes between Prime3 and Other M. The important one here being the Pirate Homeworld; one of the pirate homeworlds. Which would implicate the Space Pirates being a much greater organization than simply the planet Zebes.
But is this really the case? Prime1 describes them as interstellar nomads, and makes clear Zebes was their primary base of operations, if not the only one. Following Tourian's destruction the Space Pirates split into two; Zebes and those that ended up on Tallon IV. The pirates we see in subsequent titles are just an extension of those that left Zebes. Unlike Tallon IV and Aether, this "Pirate Homeworld" would simply be their biggest base of operations since Zebes, from where they are lead by Dark Samus to become Prime3s antagonists.
With the Galactic Federation's attack on the Pirate Homeworld, everything falls back to Zebes, where Mother Brain has been slowly recovering, perhaps with the assistance of Aurora Unit technology stolen from the Federation. All neatly working its way toward Metroid II, Super Metroid and also Other M; we just need to accept that the Aurora Units are nothing compared to Mother Brain herself. What with lacking her telepathy to control Metroids.
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An excellent write-up, Zan. As mentioned last time I around, I find the Pirate scenario plausible, just not well presented. Other M being effectively a bridge title between 3 and 4, big news such as "Space Pirates were obliterated" is something that ought to have been worth mentioning in one of those two. While I still find it unlikely that they would fail to survive Zebes' loss in itself, the Federation's efforts to mop up the remnants is worth considering. This would still leave Samus as credited with dealing the death blow.
On both that and the Mother Brain/Aurora connection, what is seemingly contradictory can in fact be rationalized, it's just very poorly explained.
The main focus of Other M, though, isn't really the Pirates. It's about Samus, Adam, and the Federation. On those points, I must agree, the game is exceptional. The Ridley encounter, controversial as it was to the rest of the internet, was probably my favorite part of the game. It offers a great sense of comparison when you get to see how the GF forces measure up against him, which is something the series to date has thus far lacked. For all the collective bitching about Samus panicking, Other M made it clear that she was the only one who really stood a chance against Ridley. The likes of Anthony and Adam are just playing with death.
It's a shame that the climax of the story and the climax of the gameplay don't sync up, but they each work individually, for sure.
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Eh as I said, the only thing I have an issue with is the presentation of the Ridley scene. The core concepts behind it are fine, but I can see why people might be confused by it if they never touched the manga due to lack of proper explanation. One of the fricking commercials did it better >_>
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Eh as I said, the only thing I have an issue with is the presentation of the Ridley scene. The core concepts behind it are fine, but I can see why people might be confused by it if they never touched the manga due to lack of proper explanation. One of the fricking commercials did it better >_>
That commercial was awesome too. Much in the vein of the old prime commercials. (1 and 2. 3 had a horrible wii would like to play commercial)
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It's not just the manga, Fox. The subject was also touched on in Zero Mission's Fusion gallery.
(http://metroid.retropixel.net/metroid4/m4jap_ending2.gif)
Still, that's not enough to make it common knowledge, so the point stands. Agreed on the commercial; a full-on flashback in scenery, as opposed to throwing child-Samus into the Bottle Ship, would have worked a lot better. I'm just saying, the premise works even without resorting to manga-is-canon.
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I think the best way to do it is have one game that while progresses the story, also talks about her past w/ the Chozo and before.
But I agree w/ Fxeni, the only flaw w/ Other M is just lack of context (or to me it's the only flaw anyways). So even if I do like the Ridley scene (especially that spine chilling staredown between Samus and Ridley before the fight begins), I do agree that having a quick flashback of her mom getting incirenated by Ridley would be well...AWESOME.
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It's not just the manga, Fox. The subject was also touched on in Zero Mission's Fusion gallery.
(http://metroid.retropixel.net/metroid4/m4jap_ending2.gif)
Still, that's not enough to make it common knowledge, so the point stands. Agreed on the commercial; a full-on flashback in scenery, as opposed to throwing child-Samus into the Bottle Ship, would have worked a lot better. I'm just saying, the premise works even without resorting to manga-is-canon.
Yeah, but how many people have actually seen that image before? :P
But yeah, I never disagreed with the premise. It's always been about the execution to me. That's really my only gripe with the game to be honest. The ideas are fine to me, but the execution sometimes could have been better. Well, that and the iffy detection on the pointing to the screen with the Wiimote, but I found that that functionality could have been far worse than it turned out to be.
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Other M being effectively a bridge title between 3 and 4, big news such as "Space Pirates were obliterated" is something that ought to have been worth mentioning in one of those two.
I'm wondering if this isn't actually information that was supplied in either Super or Fusion's supplemental material. If not that, at the very least I'm thinking the premise has existed since Super or was just assumed. The pirate threat in the old games was always considered entirely restricted to Zebes, with Mother Brain as the leader.It wouldn't be until the Primes that their presence was seemingly exaggerated.
As such, I think this mess is kind of for Metroid Prime to solve. With Prime3s secret cliffhanger ending, and a comfortable transition into Metroid II and Super being needed, we could only hope for a Prime4 to tie together the loose ends.
It offers a great sense of comparison when you get to see how the GF forces measure up against him, which is something the series to date has thus far lacked. For all the collective bitching about Samus panicking, Other M made it clear that she was the only one who really stood a chance against Ridley. The likes of Anthony and Adam are just playing with death.
Hadn't even thought of that, but you're right. Recalling Adam's sacrifice, the mention that he himself is no galactic savior, and thus cannot stand up to Ridley, was one that really hit home. Especially when you compare that scene to Adam and Samus' discussion in Fusion, it works marvelously well in the continuity, drawing a perfect parallel.
It's a shame that the climax of the story and the climax of the gameplay don't sync up, but they each work individually, for sure.
The only things they should have done to improve the climax of the gameplay was actually show the Power Bomb unlock screen, and then let the MB encounter be play out solely in cutscene.
I can understand the decision to leave both the cold-immune Metroids and "Mother Brain" out of the gameplay. If we look at the way MB got taken down, that right there is a picture perfect set up for her return in a potential Other M 2.
Still, that's not enough to make it common knowledge, so the point stands. Agreed on the commercial; a full-on flashback in scenery, as opposed to throwing child-Samus into the Bottle Ship, would have worked a lot better. I'm just saying, the premise works even without resorting to manga-is-canon.
I'm not sure on a flashback during the Ridley scene. With the way Ridley's terrorizing is set up, that would surely break the atmosphere. However, a recollection after the battle, complete with exposition monologue would seem fitting from the game. But instead they focuses on communication with Adam have ceased.
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The pirate threat in the old games was always considered entirely restricted to Zebes, with Mother Brain as the leader.
(http://home.comcast.net/~Anguirus/objection.gif)
Actually, one of the most frequent Pirate-related debates is whether it is Ridley or Mother Brain who leads them, with a few seemingly contradictory sources thrown in. While Super's dialogue points to Mother Brain, more recent sources favor Ridley. Melee and Brawl's trophy lists both state that Ridley as their leader, and Zero Mission shows that Ridley commands the Space Pirate Mother Ship, in addition to some of its critical systems being modeled after him. We may gather from this that Mother Brain controls specifically Zebes and the Metroids.
Incidentally, Brawl's trophy also provides a cross-reference for Ridley killing Samus's parents. It neglects to mention when, but previous sources stated her being orphaned at K-2L before being raised by the Chozo, so the pieces aren't exactly difficult to put together. I really see the Other M bitching as an indicator of how many "fans" simply don't pay attention.
As such, I think this mess is kind of for Metroid Prime to solve. With Prime3s secret cliffhanger ending, and a comfortable transition into Metroid II and Super being needed, we could only hope for a Prime4 to tie together the loose ends.
Retro is seemingly done with that. I don't know what the point of that cliffhanger ending is; the only logical speculation at this point links it to Hunters, and even that's pretty loose.
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Actually, one of the most frequent Pirate-related debates is whether it is Ridley or Mother Brain who leads them, with a few seemingly contradictory sources thrown in. While Super's dialogue points to Mother Brain, more recent sources favor Ridley. Melee and Brawl's trophy lists both state that Ridley as their leader, and Zero Mission shows that Ridley commands the Space Pirate Mother Ship, in addition to some of its critical systems being modeled after him. We may gather from this that Mother Brain controls specifically Zebes and the Metroids.
Incidentally, Brawl's trophy also provides a cross-reference for Ridley killing Samus's parents. It neglects to mention when, but previous sources stated her being orphaned at K-2L before being raised by the Chozo, so the pieces aren't exactly difficult to put together. I really see the Other M bitching as an indicator of how many "fans" simply don't pay attention.
As I see it, both Ridley and Mother Brain are the leaders of the Space Pirates. It's just as Other M states, the way Mother Brain and Ridley guide them are different. Which incidentally fits with Prime's description of the Space Pirates as "interstellar nomads" under Ridley, but having a planetary base of operations under Mother Brain. Ridley isn't Mother Brain, and his influence extents to the Space Pirates acting pretty much exactly ike pirates, instead of an organization capable of rivaling the federation.
Either way, in a non-Prime interpretation of the series, the Space Pirates are restricted to Zebes, with both of its leaders dying in the destruction of the planet. Before that, when only Tourian went down, we might make the assumption that Mother Brain is still partially operational and thus continuing to carry out its function as "High Command." Alternatively, Mother Brain's influence on the Space Pirates could remain after her defeat; it are only the newly born Zebesians of the Bottle Ship, which have not yet been exposed to her or Ridley's presence, that will only act as feral creatures.
Retro is seemingly done with that. I don't know what the point of that cliffhanger ending is; the only logical speculation at this point links it to Hunters, and even that's pretty loose.
Even if it isn't Retro that takes care of such a title, we really do need another title for a comfortable transition into Metroid II. The exaggeration of the Phazon threat has greatly reduced the meaning of the series title. As it is, we almost need a remake of Metroid II in which a Leviathan nears/impacts SR388, to justify the Metroids as an intergalactic threat in need of complete extermination.
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As I see it, both Ridley and Mother Brain are the leaders of the Space Pirates. It's just as Other M states, the way Mother Brain and Ridley guide them are different. Which incidentally fits with Prime's description of the Space Pirates as "interstellar nomads" under Ridley, but having a planetary base of operations under Mother Brain.
It may be worth noting that Melee describes Ridley as "the head of the Space Pirates on Zebes".
I see Mother Brain as being crucial to Zebes' planetary defense as well as responsible for Metroid breeding. Nothing's suggested that her influence extends beyond the Zebes base, while we know for a fact that Ridley gets around, making him more crucial in the role of a force to "rival the Federation". If he does in fact lead Zebes as well, then he is of a higher authority than Mother Brain, regardless of how vital Mother Brain is.
Either way, in a non-Prime interpretation of the series, the Space Pirates are restricted to Zebes
Zero Mission. Mother Ship.
For that matter, the fact that Samus was raised on Zebes. The "nomadic" trait to the Pirates is by no means whatsoever exclusive to the Primes; Zero Mission absolutely cannot happen without it. The non-Prime canon is clear: the Space Pirates moved in to Zebes some time after Samus spent the majority of her childhood and more than likely teenage years there.
It is for this reason we need to remember that "Zebesian" in Other M is shorthand for "Zebesian Space Pirate" and not synonymous with "Space Pirates" in general (as the general context of the game fails to indicate), regardless of whether you are taking the Primes into consideration or not. Other M states that Zebesians require Mother Brain to, for lack of a better term, "awaken" them in order to function as proper Pirates. No evidence suggests that other Pirates, who predate the occupation of Zebes (and therefore all accounts of Mother Brain's involvement with them) are subject to the same rule.
Before that, when only Tourian went down, we might make the assumption that Mother Brain is still partially operational and thus continuing to carry out its function as "High Command." Alternatively, Mother Brain's influence on the Space Pirates could remain after her defeat;
Considering the above this is only an issue with Zebesian survivors. But of your two scenarios, the latter is FAR more likely. The earlier is contradictory due to Mother Brain not being mobile prior to Super Metroid, her "survival" would be incredibly difficult to miss. Doubly so since both Zero Mission and Super Metroid allow returning to the original Tourian, where there is no evidence of Mother Brain's activity.
only the newly born Zebesians of the Bottle Ship, which have not yet been exposed to her or Ridley's presence, that will only act as feral creatures.
They ARE exposed to Ridley's presence, and moreover, they ARE responding to him. Ridley is causing their increased aggression, hence the general loss of control on the Bottle Ship. Yet the implication is that, however threatening he may be, Ridley is unable to lead them properly as an organized force. If you do not differentiate Zebesians from other Pirates then this flies in the face of Zero Mission.
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If he does in fact lead Zebes as well, then he is of a higher authority than Mother Brain, regardless of how vital Mother Brain is.
That much should be clear by how Ridley is the leader of the Space Pirates before Mother Brain even comes into the picture.
It is for this reason we need to remember that "Zebesian" in Other M is shorthand for "Zebesian Space Pirate" and not synonymous with "Space Pirates" in general (as the general context of the game fails to indicate), regardless of whether you are taking the Primes into consideration or not. Other M states that Zebesians require Mother Brain to, for lack of a better term, "awaken" them in order to function as proper Pirates. No evidence suggests that other Pirates, who predate the occupation of Zebes (and therefore all accounts of Mother Brain's involvement with them) are subject to the same rule.
But there is simply no entry in the series where we see Space Pirates that are non-Zebesian. Ridley's are the very Space Pirates that became the Zebesians. As such, the influence of Mother Brain changed the "Zebesian" Space Pirates led by Ridley into something much greater.
The Zebesians born on the Bottle Ship, in the explanation before MB comes into the picture, would be akin to how they were led by Ridley from the very beginning.
Of course, that explanation was never wholly accurate, as MB was pretty much running the uprising from the very moment Little Birdie began his antagonism.
For that matter, the fact that Samus was raised on Zebes. The "nomadic" trait to the Pirates is by no means whatsoever exclusive to the Primes; Zero Mission absolutely cannot happen without it. The non-Prime canon is clear: the Space Pirates moved in to Zebes some time after Samus spent the majority of her childhood and more than likely teenage years there.
I think you misunderstand what I'm saying here. As I see it, without Mother Brain, the Space Pirates would not settle on a single base of operations and instead wander the galaxy on their "pirate ship" and raid whatever planet they come across. As such, there are no Space Pirates that settled down outside of Zebes until the Primes starting splitting the Zebesian remnants into two groups. And thus, in a classical interpretation, the destruction of Zebes would naturally wipe out all the Space Pirates after some thorough remnant clean-up by the Federation.
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But there is simply no entry in the series where we see Space Pirates that are non-Zebesian.
Whether we see them or not, that they exist is the only logical inference.
I think you misunderstand what I'm saying here. As I see it, without Mother Brain, the Space Pirates would not settle on a single base of operations and instead wander the galaxy on their "pirate ship" and raid whatever planet they come across. As such, there are no Space Pirates that settled down outside of Zebes until the Primes starting splitting the Zebesian remnants into two groups. And thus, in a classical interpretation, the destruction of Zebes would naturally wipe out all the Space Pirates after some thorough remnant clean-up by the Federation.
Despite the fact that they did settle on such a planet without her at some unspecified time before Prime 3? If they can organize a ship, they can organize a base. Whether or not they chose to and when, is unknown. But Zebesian Space Pirates, having never experience Mother Brain's guidance, are feral creatures incapable of either.
You're working under the assumption that all Pirates post-Metroid1 originate from Zebes, and we don't know that for a fact. Prime merely states that it was Zebesian survivors that discovered Phazon on Tallon IV.
Further, Zero Mission specifies that the Pirates lost not only Tourian but their mothership as well, making their first defeat all the more damaging, and yet they survived.
If anything, Prime 3 contributes to rather than damages the notion of the Pirates being eradicated. The numbered titles, no matter how you rationalize it with regards to Pirate behavior, run into the same problem: They lost Zebes once, they lived; they lost Zebes twice, they didn't. The Primes demonstrate continued battles with the Pirates across space, and in Prime 3, they suffer particularly heavy losses, what with Dark Samus taking them over, their brief civil conflict against any who doubted her, the Federation occupying another Space Pirate planetary base, and the destruction of Phaaze, during which any possible space-dwelling Pirate survivors would have been left stranded at the site of battle anyway. The loss of Zebes alone, however critical, has been proven to be within the realm of recovery, but the loss of Zebes following the loss of two other planetary bases in Prime 3 is quite a bit more plausible as contributing to the Pirates' annihilation.
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Whether we see them or not, that they exist is the only logical inference.
You're working under the assumption that all Pirates post-Metroid1 originate from Zebes, and we don't know that for a fact. Prime merely states that it was Zebesian survivors that discovered Phazon on Tallon IV.
The Space Pirates we see in the Primes should all be the same, though. Prime2 refers back to Tallon IV, which establishes them as Zebesian. I don't know about Prime3s, but by virtue of Ridley they too should be Zebesian. These being the insect-like creatures with a hyve-like social structure, requiring a strong leader. Non-Zebesian "Space Pirates", however, could be anything. The Prime-Other M paradox is solely in regards to Zebesians, which are the series' antagonists, not non-Zebesians.
Despite the fact that they did settle on such a planet without her at some unspecified time before Prime 3? If they can organize a ship, they can organize a base. Whether or not they chose to and when, is unknown. But Zebesian Space Pirates, having never experience Mother Brain's guidance, are feral creatures incapable of either.
I'm not saying the Zebesians are unable to establish a base of operations (as "nomads" they must settle down before moving on), I'm just saying that Mother Brain causes a change in their modus operandi. It just boils down to the fact that Ridley too, is at the core a (semi-)feral creature, instead of an organic supercomputer like Mother Brain. Ridley would however still be in charge over Mother Brain.
Prior to Mother Brain's influence, I figure the Space Pirates were probably a much smaller group that never had more than one base of operations, before abandoning it, to move on to the next planet.
If anything, Prime 3 contributes to rather than damages the notion of the Pirates being eradicated. The numbered titles, no matter how you rationalize it with regards to Pirate behavior, run into the same problem: They lost Zebes once, they lived; they lost Zebes twice, they didn't.
Thing is, Metroid/Zero Mission didn't cause "the loss of Zebes", but rather "the loss of Tourian+Mothership". Their operations on Zebes were able to be recovered by the remaining Zebesians. But this is not the case after Super Metroid, with these remnants also going down with the planet.
In the classic the focus of our attention is solely Zebes, where the small group of traveling space pirates settled down and found guidance, hence a natural assumption that Zebes' loss would lead to the eradication of the Space Pirates. Prime however has a group split from the Zebesians, to grow and become seemingly more organized and antagonistic than ever before. This too, is probably a result of focus, as the actual Space Pirates appear little in the 2D games, but make many an appearance in Prime3. The responsibility of taking care of this remnant overexposure is not Other M's, but Prime's. The considerable blows the pirates took in Prime3, as you say, should thus definitely be taken into account when it comes to re-establishing classic continuity after the series' little Phazon detour.
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You know what's delicious?
I know what's delicious.
The fact that Nintendo of Japan, for many, many, maaaaaany years, never once cared about making a truly wonderful and deep story for the Metroid series, with a good plot and details, with personalities and integral functions for every single character to have motivations, expectations of everyone around them and a coherent narrative, with all that comes around it.
And recently, seeing the success that the Prime series had with its incredibly well-crafted lore and environments, they decided to give it a try and finally create the world that so many fans had wanted for awhile, and to finally flesh out the characters and way things run through the universe of Metroid. They were finally doing what fans wanted them to do all along. To care about canon. To give characters personality. To make it so Metroid FINALLY HAS A TRUE NARRATIVE, and unlike Zelda, Mario and others, for it to be made coherent, and make things that happen in the games truly matter.
...and when they do it, they go full-on Twilight on the mofo. And the creator casually reveals... that he never actually thought about Samus' personality before this game. So basically... not just throwing the canon of the beloved Prime games out of the window, arguably one of the gaming trilogies to have a better sense of environment and ambiance ever made. But replacing it with a story that reveals that everyone's most cared-for childhood icon, a woman who is in EVERY. SINGLE. TOP. TEN. GAMING. HEROINE. LIST, simply because she is said to be the true feminist symbol of gaming, a woman who can do everything by herself, who is badass and amazing... was just wishful thinking on the part of gamers. All of it. Wishful thinking.
Because at the end of the day, your life's credits roll in. And M. Night Shyamalan appears. And he says:
"The twist at the end... is that you NEVER LIKED SAMUS IN THE FIRST PLACE! WHAT A TWEEST!" 8D
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I still like Samus, but that's just me.
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As did I. She's still the best woman in game fiction to me.
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I love Link too, but that doesn't mean he has ANY personality to begin with. =P
Maybe one day we'll get a fully voiced Zelda game with Link voiced by Gilbert Gottfried.
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...I swear that one of these days I need to buy Other M even if just to see for myself how much you guys exaggerate about the story or not.
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...I swear that one of these days I need to buy Other M even if just to see for myself how much you guys exaggerate about the story or not.
http://moonbase.rydia.net/mental/blog/gaming/metroid-other-m-the-elephant/article.html
Here. This pretty much explains all problems with the Other M story in detail.
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Or ya know, just make your opinion.
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Or ya know, just make your opinion.
I did make my opinion.
Just because I agree with an article that pinpoints most problems with the game's story, does it mean I don't have my own opinion? That's one of the stupidest things I have ever heard.
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I did make my opinion.
Just because I agree with an article that pinpoints most problems with the game's story, does it mean I don't have my own opinion? That's one of the stupidest things I have ever heard.
You have just as much an opinion as Samus does when she agrees with Adam.
Really,that article of yours falls flat on its face to represent you because it actually acknowledges why Other M just works; there is a very deliberate premise of Adam being both a hero and an antagonistic dirtbag. It is Adam, and only Adam that has any sort of leverage on Samus.
To everyone else and on her own, she's the Samus Aran we've always known. Emphasized by her having to save Anthony, boldly waltzing through the "hell run", kicking Ridley's behind shortly following PTSD, self authorizing with a sarcastic line directed at Adam, and beating the living daylights out of anything in the Bottle Ship including a Metroid Queen. This is how she is in every Metroid game, without Adam.
With Adam, her shaky relationship with him serves to acknowledge why the Deleter subplot is getting to her, serves to acknowledge exactly why Ridley is giving her a mental breakdown. And let us not forget everything else the game does to justify itself, from the baby to the complete obliteration of the space pirates; it all gives a solid reason for why emotionless Samus Aran would have emotions now. Representing not only Samus Aran, but the entire Metroid series going full circle, this is the story of a little girl turned into an emotionless bounty hunter. Other M takes that and brings her old and current self into a head to head clash. The emotions she had bottled up for years are finally coming to the surface.
And that's really how it is right now; we're simply seeing two extremes. It is for future games to bring balance to her character, to unite the emotions of the scarred girl and hardened bounty hunter into a package we can all relate to. In many ways, Fusion gives us this, and beyond that, the possibilities are endless.
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You have just as much an opinion as Samus does when she agrees with Adam.
Really,that article of yours falls flat on its face to represent you because it actually acknowledges why Other M just works; there is a very deliberate premise of Adam being both a hero and an antagonistic dirtbag. It is Adam, and only Adam that has any sort of leverage on Samus.
To everyone else and on her own, she's the Samus Aran we've always known. Emphasized by her having to save Anthony, boldly waltzing through the "hell run", kicking Ridley's behind shortly following PTSD, self authorizing with a sarcastic line directed at Adam, and beating the living daylights out of anything in the Bottle Ship including a Metroid Queen. This is how she is in every Metroid game, without Adam.
With Adam, her shaky relationship with him serves to acknowledge why the Deleter subplot is getting to her, serves to acknowledge exactly why Ridley is giving her a mental breakdown. And let us not forget everything else the game does to justify itself, from the baby to the complete obliteration of the space pirates; it all gives a solid reason for why emotionless Samus Aran would have emotions now. Representing not only Samus Aran, but the entire Metroid series going full circle, this is the story of a little girl turned into an emotionless bounty hunter. Other M takes that and brings her old and current self into a head to head clash. The emotions she had bottled up for years are finally coming to the surface.
And that's really how it is right now; we're simply seeing two extremes. It is for future games to bring balance to her character, to unite the emotions of the scarred girl and hardened bounty hunter into a package we can all relate to. In many ways, Fusion gives us this, and beyond that, the possibilities are endless.
That is the stupidest god damn argument I have ever seen in my whole life. So only the first person who comes up with something has an opinion. EVERYONE else who agrees with them are just sheep following a leader blindly. Jesus Christ.
Other M was supposed to feature a hardened Samus, after ALOT of adventures she had. Instead, it portrayed a space version of Bella Swan, who's given no other reason to connect to Adam other than "he was her commanding officer and kinda disagreed with her on stuff and called her lady" but worships him in all kinds of situations, shits her pants whenever he gives her an order and only defies him ONCE, when there is COMPLETE RADIO SILENCE.
The story is damn awful. No matter how you see it.
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That is the stupidest god damn argument I have ever seen in my whole life. So only the first person who comes up with something has an opinion. EVERYONE else who agrees with them are just sheep following a leader blindly. Jesus Christ.
Thank you for disagreeing with your own article, is all I'm saying. Samus does have her own opinion, even if Adam is the first to have it. Just as much as you have an opinion despite the writer of that article being the first to have it.
Other M was supposed to feature a hardened Samus, after ALOT of adventures she had. Instead, it portrayed a space version of Bella Swan, who's given no other reason to connect to Adam other than "he was her commanding officer and kinda disagreed with her on stuff and called her lady" but worships him in all kinds of situations, shits her pants whenever he gives her an order and only defies him ONCE, when there is COMPLETE RADIO SILENCE.
The game more than enough justifies itself. It is surprising how those that exclaim the game has a lack of subtlety (the baby, the baby!) can't seem to grasp the subtle factors involved in the Ridley fight, and even altogether ignore the very introduction that was hammered into their skulls to begin with; battle-hardened Samus Aran grieving over the loss of the baby. In that state, her fated meeting with Adam Malkovich takes on a course of events that unearths all the she kept bottled up inside of her to fulfill the role she's been given since Zero Mission. The thematic use of the name Bottle Ship should become obvious even to you; this is a woman that opens up to nobody.
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You know, it's not the story in Other M that bugs me. Granted, the execution was sloppy and could've used some fine tuning. What really bothered me were two things:
1) While the design of the Power Suit kind of grew on me, they have no excuse for making the Varia Suit nothing but a recolor of it, and even less for making the Gravity Suit nothing but a glowy aura around the Varia Suit. The art direction was fine overall, but the way they stripped down the suit is just irritating.
2) You have the ability to go into first person mode any time, any place. The game isn't restrictive about this in the slightest. So why the [tornado fang] can't we move in first-person? They had the opportunity to make a perfect blend of Metroid Prime and Super Metroid, allowing the player to switch back and forth whenever they want. But god forbid they have to plug the other half of the controller in! Oh no, this game has to be remote only.
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1) While the design of the Power Suit kind of grew on me, they have no excuse for making the Varia Suit nothing but a recolor of it, and even less for making the Gravity Suit nothing but a glowy aura around the Varia Suit. The art direction was fine overall, but the way they stripped down the suit is just irritating.
I liked the redesign of the Power Suit here. It was a lot more 'feminine' than before, and looked more like it would fit around her without dislocating a few joints. But I agree on the Varia and Gravity Suit upgrades; it was very much a let down how they did not change the suit's design.
2) You have the ability to go into first person mode any time, any place. The game isn't restrictive about this in the slightest. So why the [tornado fang] can't we move in first-person? They had the opportunity to make a perfect blend of Metroid Prime and Super Metroid, allowing the player to switch back and forth whenever they want. But god forbid they have to plug the other half of the controller in! Oh no, this game has to be remote only.
Even in a remote only set-up, I think we could have some sort of limited movement using the D-pad. However, there is a risk of repeating X7's mistakes if both viewpoints got an equal focus.
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http://moonbase.rydia.net/mental/blog/gaming/metroid-other-m-the-elephant/article.html
Here. This pretty much explains all problems with the Other M story in detail.
Oh, I've already read plenty about it since it came out, I don't need you to link me to that kind of articles. I said it more because...
Or ya know, just make your opinion.
This.
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That is the stupidest god damn argument I have ever seen in my whole life. So only the first person who comes up with something has an opinion. EVERYONE else who agrees with them are just sheep following a leader blindly. Jesus Christ.
Other M was supposed to feature a hardened Samus, after ALOT of adventures she had. Instead, it portrayed a space version of Bella Swan, who's given no other reason to connect to Adam other than "he was her commanding officer and kinda disagreed with her on stuff and called her lady" but worships him in all kinds of situations, shits her pants whenever he gives her an order and only defies him ONCE, when there is COMPLETE RADIO SILENCE.
The story is damn awful. No matter how you see it.
Did you even play the game, or are you just listening to the internet's one sided reactions that fail to read beyond face value? Because you sound exactly like the latter. A blind sheep, if you will.
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Thank you for disagreeing with your own article, is all I'm saying. Samus does have her own opinion, even if Adam is the first to have it. Just as much as you have an opinion despite the writer of that article being the first to have it.
The game more than enough justifies itself. It is surprising how those that exclaim the game has a lack of subtlety (the baby, the baby!) can't seem to grasp the subtle factors involved in the Ridley fight, and even altogether ignore the very introduction that was hammered into their skulls to begin with; battle-hardened Samus Aran grieving over the loss of the baby. In that state, her fated meeting with Adam Malkovich takes on a course of events that unearths all the she kept bottled up inside of her to fulfill the role she's been given since Zero Mission. The thematic use of the name Bottle Ship should become obvious even to you; this is a woman that opens up to nobody.
I seriously can't believe I'm going to have to explain this. I don't know what kind of narrative you're used to, but Other M's narrative was about as deep as a typical Hollywood action movie, with the added idiotic sentiment of "WE'RE BEING DEEEEP BY BLOWING APART STORY ELEMENTS". Every single time Samus is in the presence of Adam, she turns into a subservient protagonist. She does what Adam tells her, and she wouldn't dare even step outside the line for a single moment. That is NOT simply "agreeing with someone", after that someone puts her in danger purposedly, making her survive stupid [parasitic bomb] all over the adventure just to tell her "oh, you get to use this now I guess" only when it comes to a point where she basically CANNOT POSSIBLY PROGRESS any further without the goddamned item. Making her items be used in terms of "what he lets her use" is either bad storytelling, or an awful gameplay mechanic to justify her gaining the items little by little. Either way, the end result turns her into a woman that Adam uses like putty. He risks her life countless times, and for [tornado fang]'S SAKE, you cannot possibly justify in aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaany way the fact that he shot her as soon as she saw the presence of her biggest enemy. Without justifying it for a single second.
A woman who sees a parasite who follows her around for a few hours and then saves her life some time later after eating her to an inch of her life, and then suddenly GRIEVES for it like a child, is not in any way a believable woman. The number of times she grieves over some creature which didn't even make that big of a mark in her life, is not just unrealistic, it portrays her as a walking womb, hormonally driven, like the useless female she is. No, her grief and the way she talks to herself isn't in any way normal for someone who braves entire planets alone and eradicates entire evil races of aliens by herself. I have no idea how you see women, but I can assure you that no self-respecting woman behaves like that. She shouldn't feel THAT big of a loss for the baby Metroid! And she shouldn't break apart in tears when she sees Ridley again, specially since she has fought him so many times before, without flinching. Not even in narratively broken series like Megaman X does the main character break in tears everytime he sees Sigma has been revived. Why should Samus? Why should Samus, efectively ending up being at fault for the "death" of one of her best friends, let such a thing happen? Wanna see a game where past death/traumatic events in loose-storied 2D games are treated well? Look at Metal Gear Solid. Gray Fox's death is treated fairly. Snake doesn't spend hours whining about him, but he grieves about his BEST FRIEND. While Samus ends up grieving more about the death of THE BAAAABY than the death of one of her comrades. The one who was the kindest to her, probably the nicest to her, enough to sacrifice his own life just to save her. She just... wonders how he felt when he was falling. Gee, Samus. Now THAT'S being kind.
While Adam? Holy [parasitic bomb], he gets to shoot her in the back and take her to safety like the worthless woman she is, and die a veeeeeery forceful UHMERIKAN HERO DEATH. Oh, and of course I understand the "subtle" themes in Other M. Why shouldn't I, when they wack you over the head with them? And they have the depth of a high school emo's tragic poetry. Seriously, "bottle ship"?
My point stands. Metroid: Other M has one of the worst narratives I've ever seen in any game. And most people honestly agree with me. If you're gonna treat it like a deep story, like the rest of the children who honestly think that FFVII can be compared to literature, be my guest.
Did you even play the game, or are you just listening to the internet's one sided reactions that fail to read beyond face value? Because you sound exactly like the latter. A blind sheep, if you will.
Oh, THANK YOU for giving so many reasons why my well-fundamented points are wrong. Thank you for carefully rebutting every single one of my arguments with carefully worded sentences and reasons why your opinion is right and mine is wrong.
Oh, and more than anything, thank you for not just being a prick who says I'm wrong without even telling me why. Thank you for not calling me a sheep while ironically forgetting the fact that you're the one blindly agreeing with other's opinions without even saying WHY.
[/[tornado fang]ing HUGE SARCASM TAG]
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All I'm saying is that your arguments line up with those of the haters. And most of the haters subscribe to the They Changed It Now It Sucks ideology and/or haven't played the game for themselves and just go off word of mouth. But haters gonna hate, lovers gonna love, I don't even want none of the above, I want to [acid burst] on you.
And I never said you were wrong. I definitely agree that there are problems with the storytelling in Other M. I just don't have as much issue with it as the general internet opinion does. And I just don't feel like going into detail as I've probably explained my feelings elsewhere if people didn't say something similar already.
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All I'm saying is that your arguments line up with those of the haters. And most of the haters subscribe to the They Changed It Now It Sucks ideology and/or haven't played the game for themselves and just go off word of mouth. But haters gonna hate, lovers gonna love, I don't even want none of the above, I want to [acid burst] on you.
And I never said you were wrong. I definitely agree that there are problems with the storytelling in Other M. I just don't have as much issue with it as the general internet opinion does. And I just don't feel like going into detail as I've probably explained my feelings elsewhere if people didn't say something similar already.
Did I say that the game was awful? I liked the gameplay. And it was the first Metroid I ever played without getting seriously bored in the middle and dropping it for a few weeks only to return to it out of more boredom.
The storyline just plain sucks. And after all of you have been discussing fine points of the Metroid saga to a microscopic degree, I can definetly say that people do care about the story. I don't give a [parasitic bomb] about it, but it doesn't stop being the Twilight of videogames. Other M, that is.
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Every single time Samus is in the presence of Adam, she turns into a subservient protagonist.
The very same Samus Aran that vehemently gave Adam a thumbs down and boldly deserted his command. Her following his orders now is only an effort to outgrow her wild teenage years; showing her professional side, "for the sake of the mission." If she had any objections, she would damn well tell him following his trademark quote.
making her survive stupid [parasitic bomb] all over the adventure just to tell her "oh, you get to use this now I guess" only when it comes to a point where she basically CANNOT POSSIBLY PROGRESS any further without the goddamned item
Except, Samus has every single one of those upgrades disabled of her own accord. You surely can't space jump when you first enter the Bottle Ship. This is not just Adam's policy, it is Samus' as well.
When Adam's authorization protocols do come into play, they were well justified within the storyline. Weaponry being blatantly obvious, with the great risks they pose to the other soldiers, as well as any surviving scientists.
Movement items too, were justified, albeit in passing. Adam specified his wish to restrict exploration of the Bottle Ship based on the currently available equipment. An entirely logical proposal to create a set route through a virtual maze, which includes not wandering too far into hostile territory like Sector Three. Only when there is an urgent need to advance to the next area requiring a yet unlocked item (Sector Three boss, Athony save, Sector Zero collapse) does Adam authorize or Samus self-authorize the use of such equipment. No point side tracking into the Power Bomb areas when there are perfectly fine alternate routes to take across the Bottle Ship; after all, it should have been entirely traversable for the average scientist as well.
Honestly, it sounds to me like you just couldn't stand the heat in Sector Three. Because heaven forbid, Adam actually has faith in Samus, the galactic savior, to effortlessly do what the player apparently struggles with.
A woman who sees a parasite who follows her around for a few hours and then saves her life some time later after eating her to an inch of her life, and then suddenly GRIEVES for it like a child, is not in any way a believable woman.
Throughout Other M, Samus has cried only once. That was when Adam sacrificed himself.
Her grief for the baby was never portrayed as anything greater than a sense of loss, a numbness to the heart. Never once did a tear form. Just as much, Samus never sobbed during the Ridley encounter; only the recollection of herself as a child did. The Samus Aran of the present froze before Ridley, yes, lost her power suit because her focus deteriorated, yes, had Anthony seemingly die because of her own weakness, yes, but quickly got up and wiped the floor with Ridley in the way she had always done.
While Samus ends up grieving more about the death of THE BAAAABY than the death of one of her comrades. The one who was the kindest to her, probably the nicest to her, enough to sacrifice his own life just to save her. She just... wonders how he felt when he was falling. Gee, Samus. Now THAT'S being kind.
Could you make up your mind, do you want a battle hardened Samus Aran or not? Guess I should alter my views on your dislike of authorization protocols; you just hate Adam's gut, that's all there is to it.
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The very same Samus Aran that vehemently gave Adam a thumbs down and boldly deserted his command. Her following his orders now is only an effort to outgrow her wild teenage years; showing her professional side, "for the sake of the mission." If she had any objections, she would damn well tell him following his trademark quote.
Scarring event led her to run with her tail between her legs. Not justified.
Except, Samus has every single one of those upgrades disabled of her own accord. You surely can't space jump when you first enter the Bottle Ship. This is not just Adam's policy, it is Samus' as well.
Bad story/gameplay fixings. You don't walk into a minimal situation zone with your bazooka in tow, do you? But you DO take out your heavy arsenal just as soon as it's easier to defeat enemies with a certain kind of weapon.
When Adam's authorization protocols do come into play, they were well justified within the storyline. Weaponry being blatantly obvious, with the great risks they pose to the other soldiers, as well as any surviving scientists.
Movement items too, were justified, albeit in passing. Adam specified his wish to restrict exploration of the Bottle Ship based on the currently available equipment. An entirely logical proposal to create a set route through a virtual maze, which includes not wandering too far into hostile territory like Sector Three. Only when there is an urgent need to advance to the next area requiring a yet unlocked item (Sector Three boss, Athony save, Sector Zero collapse) does Adam authorize or Samus self-authorize the use of such equipment. No point side tracking into the Power Bomb areas when there are perfectly fine alternate routes to take across the Bottle Ship; after all, it should have been entirely traversable for the average scientist as well.
There are plenty of areas in which shortcuts could have been used, plenty of enemies in which more powerful weapons could have been activated, and much more. The game makes all the sense from a gameplay perspective. But NO sense at all from a story perspective. The first boss could have easily been defeated if you had the ice beam instead of the soldiers, or were able to use more powerful missiles.
Honestly, it sounds to me like you just couldn't stand the heat in Sector Three. Because heaven forbid, Adam actually has faith in Samus, the galactic savior, to effortlessly do what the player apparently struggles with.
AGAIN, makes sense from a gameplay perspective. No commanding officer would ever force any soldier to lose health forcefully when that soldier is carrying an armor that PREVENTS them from losing health in the first place. It's just not authorized. The authorization of ANY suit whatsoever makes no sense. No sense at all.
Throughout Other M, Samus has cried only once. That was when Adam sacrificed himself.
And not a single tear shed for Anthony. Who actually saved her life instead of shooting her in the back and playing the hero needlessly.
Her grief for the baby was never portrayed as anything greater than a sense of loss, a numbness to the heart. Never once did a tear form. Just as much, Samus never sobbed during the Ridley encounter; only the recollection of herself as a child did. The Samus Aran of the present froze before Ridley, yes, lost her power suit because her focus deteriorated, yes, had Anthony seemingly die because of her own weakness, yes, but quickly got up and wiped the floor with Ridley in the way she had always done.
That "sense of loss, numbness to the heart" was the result of a VERY traumatic experience, which yes, certainly must've involved off-scene crying, or she wouldn't be kicking herself about it years later as if she were to blame for the loss of an entire unit or something. And the "freezing before Ridley" doesn't make any sense. If we're going through Prime canon, she has faced him a zillion times. And if we're going through Super Metroid, even then, she had faced a reencarnation before. It just doesn't make ANY sense at all, much less losing her whole power armor over it, and causing a friend to die.
Could you make up your mind, do you want a battle hardened Samus Aran or not? Guess I should alter my views on your dislike of authorization protocols; you just hate Adam's gut, that's all there is to it.
You think a badass person wouldn't feel a little bit guilty over a person who just died to save their lives? At least much more than the lives of a prick in command and some dead monster?
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Bad story/gameplay fixings. You don't walk into a minimal situation zone with your bazooka in tow, do you? But you DO take out your heavy arsenal just as soon as it's easier to defeat enemies with a certain kind of weapon.
But she also disabled movement and defense items of her own accord. God knows what her reasons are, but she does. It isn't all Adam here.
There are plenty of areas in which shortcuts could have been used
That requires a certain prescience not characteristic of the setting. Maybe if they had a map of the Bottle Ship on hand, but as is, Adam's way of exploring the station was well justified.
plenty of enemies in which more powerful weapons could have been activated
At the risk of vaporizing the very people they were trying to save. In the worst case scenario for weapon authorization, shooting through semi-transparent walls makes it all the easier to accidentally hit people. For example, if we had a huge brawl in the room before finding Madeline Bergman, one of Samus' shots could have easily went through the little glass window and killed her.
And not a single tear shed for Anthony. Who actually saved her life instead of shooting her in the back and playing the hero needlessly.
It is sadly realistic that a woman's focus in men isn't the best choice. Maybe Anthony has a better chance at winning over Samus' heart now that Adam is no more, and she saw Adam reflected inside of him.
she wouldn't be kicking herself about it years later as if she were to blame for the loss of an entire unit or something
I don't think that as much time passed as that. At least, that's the impression I got from the intro.
And the "freezing before Ridley" doesn't make any sense. If we're going through Prime canon, she has faced him a zillion times. And if we're going through Super Metroid, even then, she had faced a reencarnation before.
As was discussed on previous pages, the entire premise rides on the complete obliteration of the Space Pirates by Zebes' destruction. There just isn't anyone that would want to revive him; even the Federation scientists didn't include Ridley in the plan. So it came as quite the shock. To make matters worse, there's Mr. Authorization dragging up her tragic past relentlessly and making her all the more vulnerable to a PTSD fall out.
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But she also disabled movement and defense items of her own accord. God knows what her reasons are, but she does. It isn't all Adam here.
I did say bad gameplay/story fixings, didn't I? The whole game rides on an EXTREMELY bad connection between gameplay and story.
That requires a certain prescience not characteristic of the setting. Maybe if they had a map of the Bottle Ship on hand, but as is, Adam's way of exploring the station was well justified.
He was in the Bottle City's control room. Don't tell me he couldn't find a damn map. Again, it was a bad relationship between gameplay and story.
At the risk of vaporizing the very people they were trying to save. In the worst case scenario for weapon authorization, shooting through semi-transparent walls makes it all the easier to accidentally hit people. For example, if we had a huge brawl in the room before finding Madeline Bergman, one of Samus' shots could have easily went through the little glass window and killed her.
Samus isn't a newbie with a gun. She wasn't going to kill innocent civilians. We're talking about a woman who is given missions to obliterate planets by herself.
It is sadly realistic that a woman's focus in men isn't the best choice. Maybe Anthony has a better chance at winning over Samus' heart now that Adam is no more, and she saw Adam reflected inside of him.
This was never about romance! Geez, you think it's unnatural for a woman to show some grief over the friendliest guy she's ever met in her unit? The guy who SAVED her?
I don't think that as much time passed as that. At least, that's the impression I got from the intro.
Weeks pass, and she's reflecting on the loss of the baby when she gets the distress call. It's typical Bella Swan behaviour.
As was discussed on previous pages, the entire premise rides on the complete obliteration of the Space Pirates by Zebes' destruction. There just isn't anyone that would want to revive him; even the Federation scientists didn't include Ridley in the plan. So it came as quite the shock. To make matters worse, there's Mr. Authorization dragging up her tragic past relentlessly and making her all the more vulnerable to a PTSD fall out.
She didn't flinch when fighting Ridley in much worse conditions. If she DID get shocked by his appearance, it certainly wouldn't be to the extent she got in the game. And like I said, not sacrificing a friend's life in the process.
The whole story just sucks, seriously. Together with taking Prime out of canon, arguably the best Metroid games (IMO), I just have no idea why they did this.
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He was in the Bottle City's control room. Don't tell me he couldn't find a damn map. Again, it was a bad relationship between gameplay and story.
Even if there could have been, this is Metroid. There can't be.
Samus isn't a newbie with a gun. She wasn't going to kill innocent civilians. We're talking about a woman who is given missions to obliterate planets by herself.
Considering exactly that planet destroying track record. Sure about that?
This was never about romance!
We all know Samus pretty much lying to herself when it comes to her feelings for Adam.
Geez, you think it's unnatural for a woman to show some grief over the friendliest guy she's ever met in her unit? The guy who SAVED her?
Yet it is strangely fitting for the Samus Aran the internet collective wants her to be.
Weeks pass
But not years.
She didn't flinch when fighting Ridley in much worse conditions.
Which conditions were worse? Theres never been a moment such as this one when she was convinced she had put him behind her, at the same time as Malkovich cracked her emotional exoskeleton.
Together with taking Prime out of canon
I distinctly recall Sakamoto acknowledging Prime as canon.
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Even if there could have been, this is Metroid. There can't be.
Exactly. Considering the importance the story plays this time around, its relationship with the game is awful.
Considering exactly that planet destroying track record. Sure about that?
She's better trained than all of the soldiers put together. I'd place a bit more trust in her.
We all know Samus pretty much lying to herself when it comes to her feelings for Adam.
No no no, I mean this isn't about romance. Do you ONLY care about the death of the one person you love? This is about her not giving a damn about a character who was distinctly more important to her survival than anyone else.
Yet it is strangely fitting for the Samus Aran the internet collective wants her to be.
You don't understand... this is NOT about Samus being a badass! This is about the woman being an emotional wreck about the baby and Adam, two things which she has all the right NOT to be overemotional about, and then not showing a single emotion about Anthony. It does NOT MAKE SENSE.
But not years.
No, not years. I just remembered alot of time had passed, more than I thought was normal. I had to check the wiki again.
Which conditions were worse? Theres never been a moment such as this one when she was convinced she had put him behind her, at the same time as Malkovich cracked her emotional exoskeleton.
Maybe stepping inside a space station to find everyone dead, and her long-dead arch-nemesis, the leader of the Space Pirates, clutching the last Metroid alive, the one thing that could lead to everything happening all over again? Heck, I think that would have the emotional effect of a World War 2 soldier suddenly seeing Hitler in front of him, carrying a machine to bring back the entire Nazi army back from the grave.
I distinctly recall Sakamoto acknowledging Prime as canon.
His quotes vary from interviews. But if he DOES acknowledge Prime as canon, it's even stupider, because quite alot of things don't make sense. Samus had worked as a team before, had seen Ridley come back PLEEEEEENTY of times, and had seen Metroids in laboratory in MP2 (I don't remember if they had been created there or not).
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The Metroid labs is from Space Pirates, not the Federation. (in MP2)
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The Metroid labs is from Space Pirates, not the Federation. (in MP2)
Ah, yes. Then what was it about them saying that Metroids were created in lab for the first time in Other M, or something of that matter? I might be completely wrong, but I think I've heard that before.
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Exactly. Considering the importance the story plays this time around, its relationship with the game is awful.
It was a novel idea to steer away from Prime's "I lost my abilities" cliché, and it did work to some degree.
She's better trained than all of the soldiers put together. I'd place a bit more trust in her.
I wouldn't say better trained, about equal, with individual differences. Adam's biggest concern is her weapons being simply too powerful. And when it comes to weapons that spread out to hit a mob of targets, and shoot through glass, thats a very big risk.
No no no, I mean this isn't about romance. Do you ONLY care about the death of the one person you love? This is about her not giving a damn about a character who was distinctly more important to her survival than anyone else.
You don't understand... this is NOT about Samus being a badass! This is about the woman being an emotional wreck about the baby and Adam, two things which she has all the right NOT to be overemotional about, and then not showing a single emotion about Anthony. It does NOT MAKE SENSE.
I don't think you're giving Samus enough credit for her responses to Anthony's death.
Furthermore, you're reversing the order of events here. Samus doesn't become a wreck over Adam until after both the baby and Anthony had already died; the accumulation of all her bottled up emotions, including Ridley.
Other than that, this is a woman raised by birds, looking up to her snarky commanding officer as the "father figure" she never had; she always was a far cry from normal. Anthony in all his kindness just failed to get into Samus' heart beyond another comrade in arms. Just be glad he's got his second chance with her, what with being the sole survivor and all.
Maybe stepping inside a space station to find everyone dead, and her long-dead arch-nemesis, the leader of the Space Pirates, clutching the last Metroid alive, the one thing that could lead to everything happening all over again? Heck, I think that would have the emotional effect of a World War 2 soldier suddenly seeing Hitler in front of him, carrying a machine to bring back the entire Nazi army back from the grave.
All of which only affect the cold-hearted and battle-hardened bounty hunter Samus Aran in her ideal protective surroundings of complete isolation. Never before has any event tried digging into her memories, affecting her human heart like this.
But if he DOES acknowledge Prime as canon, it's even stupider, because quite alot of things don't make sense. Samus had worked as a team before, had seen Ridley come back PLEEEEEENTY of times, and had seen Metroids in laboratory in MP2 (I don't remember if they had been created there or not).
Samus had worked for the Federation as a bounty hunter, which cannot be compared to working under Adam as her direct commanding officer. At best she'd been taking orders from heartless machines like the Auroras.
Ridley was consistently revived by the very Space Pirates that now no longer exist, and Metroids were held in captivity long before they were completely wiped out by Samus on SR388. Besides, why is this last point even an issue with Other M? It was Fusion, before Prime, that introduced the plot point of the Federation recreating the Metroids.
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It was a novel idea to steer away from Prime's "I lost my abilities" cliché, and it did work to some degree.
Novel idea? Yes. Used in what could be the worst way possibly imaginable? Also yes.
Why not say "Samus left weapons back in her ship", to say she didn't carry around an entire arsenal, and then block her way to the ship with an explosion as soon as she figures out the situation calls for more weapons? Why not say she lost her weapons back at the end of Super Metroid when her suit got damaged, way before the game began? The thing is, it's the most bullshit story element they could have possibly come up with.
I wouldn't say better trained, about equal, with individual differences. Adam's biggest concern is her weapons being simply too powerful. And when it comes to weapons that spread out to hit a mob of targets, and shoot through glass, thats a very big risk.
Yes. Better trained, better at everything those soldiers could possibly do, and aside from Anthony, the only one who didn't die in the mission. And far too much of a professional to hit innocent civilians. Stop taking reasons out of your ass, it is simply a very bad plot point on a very bad story just to justify gameplay.
I don't think you're giving Samus enough credit for her responses to Anthony's death.
I am. I am giving the credit of being a thoughtless [sonic slicer] who whines about a baby Metroid for weeks, enough to be called for a mission while STILL whining about it, and then not giving a [tornado fang] about a good friend dying to save her life.
Furthermore, you're reversing the order of events here. Samus doesn't become a wreck over Adam until after both the baby and Anthony had already died; the accumulation of all her bottled up emotions, including Ridley.
You'll have to explain to me when is she ever NOT a wreck throughout the game.
Other than that, this is a woman raised by birds, looking up to her snarky commanding officer as the "father figure" she never had; she always was a far cry from normal. Anthony in all his kindness just failed to get into Samus' heart beyond another comrade in arms. Just be glad he's got his second chance with her, what with being the sole survivor and all.
I am failing to get into yout thick skull about this.
Irrational being dies after she bonded with it for hours at the most = SAMUS BEING A NERVOUS WRECK FOR WEEKS, MOURNING ENDLESSLY AND ALWAYS THINKING ABOUT IT
One of best friends dying in order to save her life, due to an event that was her fault = Samus goes meh
IT. DOESN'T. MAKE. SENSE. No matter how much emotional connection she had to anyone, it does not make sense and it is horrible storytelling, I do not care in what angle you look at it.
All of which only affect the cold-hearted and battle-hardened bounty hunter Samus Aran in her ideal protective surroundings of complete isolation. Never before has any event tried digging into her memories, affecting her human heart like this.
So being face to face with the beast who killer her family after avenging it, holding the necessary weapon to unleash hell in all cosmos is all cool and doesn't make her break a sweat, but seeing its ugly face again, WHILE talking to her ex on the phone is, like... TOOOTALLY TRAUMATIIIIC!
Bad narrative. Awful story. Horrible writing. Cannot be logically perceived as anything but.
Samus had worked for the Federation as a bounty hunter, which cannot be compared to working under Adam as her direct commanding officer. At best she'd been taking orders from heartless machines like the Auroras.
She says "working as a team". Which had happened before.
Ridley was consistently revived by the very Space Pirates that now no longer exist, and Metroids were held in captivity long before they were completely wiped out by Samus on SR388. Besides, why is this last point even an issue with Other M? It was Fusion, before Prime, that introduced the plot point of the Federation recreating the Metroids.
She had seen every single space pirate being cloned and facing her again. What the hell is so surprising about Ridley being there too?
And Fusion doesn't happen before Prime chronologically, it's still the last Metroid. Null point.
Again, you cannot possibly rationalize horrible storytelling such as this. Romantic feelings do not go in the way of mourning for a comrade who just saved her life, no matter how she saw him. She has no justification for breaking down like a [sonic slicer] EVERY. SINGLE. TIME. It is a horrible, horrible, horrible story.
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Why not say "Samus left weapons back in her ship", to say she didn't carry around an entire arsenal, and then block her way to the ship with an explosion as soon as she figures out the situation calls for more weapons?
The fans would still [sonic slicer]. Why would she leave her weapons behind?
Why not say she lost her weapons back at the end of Super Metroid when her suit got damaged, way before the game began? The thing is, it's the most bullshit story element they could have possibly come up with.
Aside from being in contradiction with Super Metroid, that is the Metroid Prime cliché all over again.
I am. I am giving the credit of being a thoughtless [sonic slicer] who whines about a baby Metroid for weeks, enough to be called for a mission while STILL whining about it, and then not giving a [tornado fang] about a good friend dying to save her life.
You're exaggerating the focus the game put on the baby, Samus monologues about it the intro, immediately following Super Metroid. After which its influence is not blatantly obvious until she actually sees another infant Netroid and tries to shoot it. She does not grief, whine, cry, or tear; she only speaks of it with a sense of emptiness and finality. The EXACT same way she speaks of Anthony.
You'll have to explain to me when is she ever NOT a wreck throughout the game.
Her ONLY breakdowns were the Ridley and Adam scenes. Every other time she's been the Samus we've always known.
So being face to face with the beast who killer her family after avenging it, holding the necessary weapon to unleash hell in all cosmos is all cool and doesn't make her break a sweat, but seeing its ugly face again, WHILE talking to her ex on the phone is, like... TOOOTALLY TRAUMATIIIIC!
Again, you don't seem to grasp that Ridley was gone for good; there are no Space Pirates to revive him.
She had seen every single space pirate being cloned and facing her again. What the hell is so surprising about Ridley being there too?
Because Ridley, making the Zebesians into Space Pirates, represents everything the Federation would not want. They can control the Zebesians, but not Ridley. Furthermore, neither the Federation, nor Samus, knew Little Birdie to be Ridley.
She says "working as a team". Which had happened before.
She said, and I quote "first joint mission since becoming a freelance bounty hunter" and "first time since my Federation days that I was following the orders of a commanding officer." Both of which are true; in Prime3 she still acted on her own, without a commanding officer.
And Fusion doesn't happen before Prime chronologically, it's still the last Metroid. Null point.
Except, both Other M and Fusion occur in the same timeframe; after the Metroids are extinct. Your critic of Metroids in Other M is actually directed at Fusion.
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The fans would still [sonic slicer]. Why would she leave her weapons behind?
Aside from being in contradiction with Super Metroid, that is the Metroid Prime cliché all over again.
You're exaggerating the focus the game put on the baby, Samus monologues about it the intro, immediately following Super Metroid. After which its influence is not blatantly obvious until she actually sees another infant Netroid and tries to shoot it. She does not grief, whine, cry, or tear; she only speaks of it with a sense of emptiness and finality. The EXACT same way she speaks of Anthony.
Her ONLY breakdowns were the Ridley and Adam scenes. Every other time she's been the Samus we've always known.
Again, you don't seem to grasp that Ridley was gone for good; there are no Space Pirates to revive him.
Because Ridley, making the Zebesians into Space Pirates, represents everything the Federation would not want. They can control the Zebesians, but not Ridley. Furthermore, neither the Federation, nor Samus, knew Little Birdie to be Ridley.
She said, and I quote "first joint mission since becoming a freelance bounty hunter" and "first time since my Federation days that I was following the orders of a commanding officer." Both of which are true; in Prime3 she still acted on her own, without a commanding officer.
Except, both Other M and Fusion occur in the same timeframe; after the Metroids are extinct. Your critic of Metroids in Other M is actually directed at Fusion.
Quote tags be damned.
Cliché = Better than what we got, which was [parasitic bomb]
She keeps monologuing it for weeks, all by herself. That is crazy [sonic slicer] talk.
Yeah, same Samus we've ever known. Completewith livejournal entries, moistness whenever she sees Adam and complete subservience to superior male.
Sure there were Space Pirates. They've been appearing all through the game. All of her old enemies. She's be hella dumb if she didn't predict Ridley to pop up along with them.
Suuuuuuuure they can control the Zebesians. That's why they took over the ship, right? Cloning Mother Brain was a MASTERPLAN as well. SHITTY WRITING. NO POSSIBLE JUSTIFICATION.
She had a joint mission before. Can't remember if the dudes in MP3 were in the Federation. Since being "under the command of a superior" [tornado fang]'d up the game, I'd say it's something bad.
Then it's even stupider. If the issue was raised in Fusion, why would it be raised BEFORE?
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Oh for [tornado fang]'s sake, this thread is becoming a goddamned train wreck.
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This discussion is both old as [tornado fang] and annoying. Can we agree to disagree on things and move it along? I'd prefer not to close the only Metroid thread on RPM right now.
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I'd prefer not to close the only Metroid thread on RPM right now.
Why would you lock it? Because there are people who actually DISCUSS their POINTS OF VIEW about the game?
This is a nice change, methinks, because usually (but not necessarily) these kind of threads contain only HEY I LIKE THIS ABOUT THIS GAME HEY ME TOO ME TOO I ALSO LIKE THIS WEEEE STUPID BAKA HATERS!
C'mon... if they want to argue about what's better or worse, then let them do it until they finally sort it out, or just give up.
Meh.
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Heh, "becoming".
Anywho, I'm looking forward to that fan-made Metroid 2 remake. It seems interesting enough.
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Why would you lock it? Because there are people who actually DISCUSS their POINTS OF VIEW about the game?
This is a nice change, methinks, because usually (but not necessarily) these kind of threads contain only HEY I LIKE THIS ABOUT THIS GAME HEY ME TOO ME TOO I ALSO LIKE THIS WEEEE STUPID BAKA HATERS!
C'mon... if they want to argue about what's better or worse, then let them do it until they finally sort it out, or just give up.
Meh.
Sorry, maybe I should have been a little more specific about that although anyone who is familiar with me should know the only circumstances where I make maneuvers or statements like that. :P
Now then, for the last few pages or so, we've seen both sides of the argument and have numerous well posted and thought out comments on the issue of what made Other M's story doubleplus ungood/a good premise with bad execution(s). I have nothing against that. It's the melting down of Flash as well as the general inability to continue this argument (on both sides) without heated words & sentiments that's causing me to crack down. Admittedly, this is Flash's MO brutally honest and biting to get the point across and I'm pretty used to it even if I don't agree with the approach regularly. In the effort to kinda calm things down though, this of this as more of a reset. Go back to the tone it was before the last three or so posts on both sides of this equation (even if you had a point) and everything's good.
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Cliché = Better than what we got, which was [parasitic bomb]
When it gets to the point where one of the biggest metroid "memes" dare I say; Is about how Samus will always lose her upgrades if a pebble so much as brushes her foot during a new mission, then not really.
She keeps monologuing it for weeks, all by herself. That is crazy [sonic slicer] talk.
I recall only monologues being right after she is picked up by the federation in the intro and tutorial, which is pretty much right after Super Metroid, and is the first time she has been conscious since her fight with Mother Brain.
Then she gets a "baby's cry" distress signal, the name of which reminds her of what happened very recently.
After that, she sees a baby metroid near the end of the game, and is reminded of her meeting with the other baby metroid. she isnt monologing at this point, simply contemplating.
Yeah, same Samus we've ever known. Completewith livejournal entries, moistness whenever she sees Adam and complete subservience to superior male.
Somebody missed the point about EXCLUDING ADAM AND RIDLEY from the equation. Without Adam and Ridely, around, Samus is the same Samus as usual, killing alien species in isolation.
Sure there were Space Pirates. They've been appearing all through the game. All of her old enemies. She's be hella dumb if she didn't predict Ridley to pop up along with them.
I recall the space pirates only coming up after they learned that The federation was cloning them for some reason. Thats no reason to believe Ridley is there too. Why the hell would they clone the one who can control them against the Federation? From their perspectives, thats how it is. Federation was simply cloning the pirates, to have soldiers.
Suuuuuuuure they can control the Zebesians. That's why they took over the ship, right? Cloning Mother Brain was a MASTERPLAN as well. SHITTY WRITING. NO POSSIBLE JUSTIFICATION.
They took over only when MB turned against the ship. Also, do mind she only went bad because she thought she had been betrayed. She began to develop emotuons, and was criticizing things. So naturally, what do you do when a robot is making you butthurt? Try to reprogram it! *Of course.jpg* And that made it worse. But she is still a robot, and after she went bad, it was too late. she had already decided that her answer was logically correct. the Humans had to be "punished".
If say... Scientists hadnt been asshats to the damn robot that was only trying to do what she thought was right, then the [parasitic bomb] that went down on the Bottle ship might not have happened. I say Might of course, because Ridley was still there, meaning eventually he might have attacked and then led the Pirates to revolt.
Also, dont forget the Auroras. they are even MORE blatant Mother Brain clones. or did you forget the blueprint trailer showing what totally looks like the final stage of Metroid? (AKA Mother Brain's room) They worked rather well. Only problem was when they were kidnapped due to their lack of mobility or defense. And even then, Its safe to assume that after 3, they STILL use he remaining Auroras.
She had a joint mission before. Can't remember if the dudes in MP3 were in the Federation. Since being "under the command of a superior" [tornado fang]'d up the game, I'd say it's something bad.
What, you mean the bounty hunters? They arent federation. And shes never had a joint federation mission before Other M, unless you count lending a helping hand to the federation base, even though she was simply hired to do that. The only OTHER joint mission was the beginning of Fusion where she gets infected by X. But even that was just a job to escort the scientists. (and defend them if necessary)
BTW, you mentioned earlier, Super Metroid's intro with Ridley to be worse? Like Zan said, thats in her ideal surroundings. And even then, we never got ANY characteriation from Samus. Even when the baby dies. The only emotions are the one that the player feels, and assumes Samus does too, since we ARE Samus.
meanwhile, while she is already facing a VERY unexpected emotional situation, since she was unprepared to run into Adam, She sees Ridley rising from the fire, in what is a very obvious metaphor for Ridley rising from the firely pits of Hell for Samus, when she also did not expect to ever see him again either, ESPECIALLY after destroying the space pirates that would bring him back. There was just no way he could have come back. So, she recently had a sad experience with the baby, which she was just about getting over, then she unexpectedly runs into Adam, catching her off guard and dragging back up unpleasant and conflicted memories and emotions, and THEN, to top it off, Her arch Nemesis returns from Hell itself. In this case, Ridley was the final stresser. She couldnt take the pressure, and cracked. ALL of those factors influenced her PTSD meltdown.
Flash, did you read the rest of this thread? we have already discussed ALL of this to hell and back....
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Ah, yes. Then what was it about them saying that Metroids were created in lab for the first time in Other M, or something of that matter? I might be completely wrong, but I think I've heard that before.
Not much the first time, but pretty much a first from the actions of the Federation itself to breed Metroids and have them as Bioweapons.
There is a bit more on that from what Adam said in Sector 0, but, why bother?
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Yeah, same Samus we've ever known. Completewith livejournal entries, moistness whenever she sees Adam and complete subservience to superior male.
Feel free to review Metroid Fusion's script.
Sure there were Space Pirates. They've been appearing all through the game. All of her old enemies. She's be hella dumb if she didn't predict Ridley to pop up along with them.
She was chasing Little Birdie; neither Samus nor the player had any indication he would turn out to be Ridley, even if they knew in advance Ridley was in the game.
Then it's even stupider. If the issue was raised in Fusion, why would it be raised BEFORE?
In Fusion, a copy of SR-388's environment could be find on board the research station. Later on, it is also shown the Federation had been breeding Metroids in a restricted area, and using SR-388's environment to evolve Metroids from Alpha to Omega. It is implicated by Adam that Samus already suspected this project existed the moment she saw the copy of SR-388. Other M ties into this by having Samus learn of exactly one such a plot, justifying the events of Fusion.
while she is already facing a VERY unexpected emotional situation, since she was unprepared to run into Adam,
Not just Adam either, she was also shaken up thinking Anthony might be the Deleter.
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When it gets to the point where one of the biggest metroid "memes" dare I say; Is about how Samus will always lose her upgrades if a pebble so much as brushes her foot during a new mission, then not really.
So according to that logic, it's better to do something original that works really bad, than something cliché that works well?
I recall only monologues being right after she is picked up by the federation in the intro and tutorial, which is pretty much right after Super Metroid, and is the first time she has been conscious since her fight with Mother Brain.
Then she gets a "baby's cry" distress signal, the name of which reminds her of what happened very recently.
After that, she sees a baby metroid near the end of the game, and is reminded of her meeting with the other baby metroid. she isnt monologing at this point, simply contemplating.
All her monologue makes her seem like a whiny [sonic slicer] who cannot possibly live without Adam. Not to mention dwelling on the baby's death for WEEKS.
Somebody missed the point about EXCLUDING ADAM AND RIDLEY from the equation. Without Adam and Ridely, around, Samus is the same Samus as usual, killing alien species in isolation.
Which is the problem in itself. Why should she be reduced to a pathetic garbling [sonic slicer] who feels like she has to obey to every single order Adam gives? Why should she be like that? She doesn't behave professionally. She doesn't behave like a veteran (which she is after all she's been through) and she definetly doesn't behave like someone who actually has been through what she has.
I recall the space pirates only coming up after they learned that The federation was cloning them for some reason. Thats no reason to believe Ridley is there too. Why the hell would they clone the one who can control them against the Federation? From their perspectives, thats how it is. Federation was simply cloning the pirates, to have soldiers.
They took over only when MB turned against the ship. Also, do mind she only went bad because she thought she had been betrayed. She began to develop emotuons, and was criticizing things. So naturally, what do you do when a robot is making you butthurt? Try to reprogram it! *Of course.jpg* And that made it worse. But she is still a robot, and after she went bad, it was too late. she had already decided that her answer was logically correct. the Humans had to be "punished".
If say... Scientists hadnt been asshats to the damn robot that was only trying to do what she thought was right, then the [parasitic bomb] that went down on the Bottle ship might not have happened. I say Might of course, because Ridley was still there, meaning eventually he might have attacked and then led the Pirates to revolt.
Let me put it this way. If you walk into a laboratory and you see Goombas and Koopa Troopas coming out of vats, you obviously can be damn sure Bowser's gonna be at the end of the room in the biggest vat of all.
If they were amazingly stupid enough to make MB and fall into the most clichéd, the most overused, the most obvious plot point in ALL OF SCIENCE FICTION.
- Create intelligent being/computer superior to us- Teach it to think by itself
- Honoes, it's betraying us! How did we not see this coming?
It was good back in 2001: A Space Odyssey. Not anymore.
Also, dont forget the Auroras. they are even MORE blatant Mother Brain clones. or did you forget the blueprint trailer showing what totally looks like the final stage of Metroid? (AKA Mother Brain's room) They worked rather well. Only problem was when they were kidnapped due to their lack of mobility or defense. And even then, Its safe to assume that after 3, they STILL use he remaining Auroras.
What, you mean the bounty hunters? They arent federation. And shes never had a joint federation mission before Other M, unless you count lending a helping hand to the federation base, even though she was simply hired to do that. The only OTHER joint mission was the beginning of Fusion where she gets infected by X. But even that was just a job to escort the scientists. (and defend them if necessary)
My mistake on that part, then.
BTW, you mentioned earlier, Super Metroid's intro with Ridley to be worse? Like Zan said, thats in her ideal surroundings. And even then, we never got ANY characteriation from Samus. Even when the baby dies. The only emotions are the one that the player feels, and assumes Samus does too, since we ARE Samus.
And like I said before, I'm completely okay with them giving her pretty much any characterization at all. I did not see her as a badass bounty hunter before, and I did not see her as an amazing character in any way. I saw her exactly like Link and Mario. Characters who don't say a word for most of the time and do things because they need to be done. What I'm arguing, is that the story of Other M is awful, and it is a very, very, veeeeery bad way to tie the gameplay together. You can clearly see that while they refer to many past events and include alot of old bosses for fan appeal, the story in itself has the quality of fanfiction. And whoever wrote it is a horrible writer and should stick with keeping Metroid mostly without a plot.
meanwhile, while she is already facing a VERY unexpected emotional situation, since she was unprepared to run into Adam,
This is what I got a problem with. She shouldn't transform into a shambling, drooling human being with a fetish for submission when she sees Adam. He did NOT have that much of an effect on her through all that happened.
She sees Ridley rising from the fire, in what is a very obvious metaphor for Ridley rising from the firely pits of Hell for Samus
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA, you're giving Nintendo waaaaaay too much credit. Why was Ridley in a lava room? Because boss fights in lava rooms are hella rad. Moving on.
when she also did not expect to ever see him again either, ESPECIALLY after destroying the space pirates that would bring him back. There was just no way he could have come back.
You know, just like the last hundred times she ran into pirates and destroyed them all. That logic doesn't make sense, because Nintendo just doesn't think that far in terms of story. Specially in a story with the Hal 9000 plot twist.
So, she recently had a sad experience with the baby, which she was just about getting over, then she unexpectedly runs into Adam, catching her off guard and dragging back up unpleasant and conflicted memories and emotions, and THEN, to top it off, Her arch Nemesis returns from Hell itself. In this case, Ridley was the final stresser. She couldnt take the pressure, and cracked. ALL of those factors influenced her PTSD meltdown.
All of which are completely pathetic, completely normal factors for someone like Samus, and her overreactions further destroy her character completely.
Flash, did you read the rest of this thread? we have already discussed ALL of this to hell and back....
Yes. I'm not arguing against story facts. I'm arguing against this story making any sense at all. Because it's a tale of cliché plots, amazingly badly-crafted characters and the least amount of ambiance from any Metroid game so far. No matter how much people argue, there's simply no way they thought of stuff this thoroughly. Just as they had never created a personality for Samus before. Just like the Zelda games aren't all interconnected in a gigantic timeline with small details in the story somehow bringing them all together.
This isn't a JJ Abrams show. It's a Nintendo game.
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Which is the problem in itself. Why should she be reduced to a pathetic garbling [sonic slicer] who feels like she has to obey to every single order Adam gives? Why should she be like that? She doesn't behave professionally. She doesn't behave like a veteran (which she is after all she's been through) and she definetly doesn't behave like someone who actually has been through what she has.
How is following orders from your commanding officer not the way you're supposed to behave in a military operation?
Let me put it this way. If you walk into a laboratory and you see Goombas and Koopa Troopas coming out of vats, you obviously can be damn sure Bowser's gonna be at the end of the room in the biggest vat of all.
Being that genre-savvy is only for us players, not the characters themselves.
If they were amazingly stupid enough to make MB and fall into the most clichéd, the most overused, the most obvious plot point in ALL OF SCIENCE FICTION.
MB's creation was well justified; to control the Metroids.
This is what I got a problem with. She shouldn't transform into a shambling, drooling human being with a fetish for submission when she sees Adam. He did NOT have that much of an effect on her through all that happened.
Funny, I don't recall any instance of what you describe. She simply followed mission orders and had no objections, because, you know, she agreed with Adam.
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How is following orders from your commanding officer not the way you're supposed to behave in a military operation?
Being that genre-savvy is only for us players, not the characters themselves.
MB's creation was well justified; to control the Metroids.
Funny, I don't recall any instance of what you describe. She simply followed mission orders and had no objections.
She didn't just follow orders. She had threats to her life happening all the time and went through unnecessary danger and tactical things that made no sense whatsoever simply because her commanding officer was an idiot. An idiot who kept risking her life. An idiot who shot her so he could have a shitty heroic role and be forcefully redeemed in the eyes of the player.
And honestly, I don't care. If she had seen every single old enemy of hers come back so far, what the hell was so surprising about Ridley? What the hell was so surprising, and amazing about him that she didn't expect her ONE ENEMY WHO ALWAYS COMES BACK to... you know... COME BACK.
Oh, yes. BRILLIANT. "Hey, let's clone an evil army. But how should we have total control over them? I mean, they're evil, they might betray us. Hey, let's clone an evil genius mastermind to control that army! Man, they'll never betray us then!" Stupid, stupid, stupid, stupid, stupid. And overused. And predictable. And completely nonsensical at all.
The whole game is so damn hamfisted, I have no idea how anyone swallows it without slapping their foreheads with a sigh.
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She had threats to her life happening all the time and went through unnecessary danger and tactical things that made no sense whatsoever simply because her commanding officer was an idiot. An idiot who kept risking her life.
The game never puts her through unnecessary danger. Everything immediately prior to authorization would be a walk in the park for Samus Aran.
An idiot who shot her so he could have a shitty heroic role and be forcefully redeemed in the eyes of the player.
There are plenty of reasons why Adam shot her in the back, including her confrontation with an infant Metroid reminiscent of the one from Super Metroid. If her power suit collapsed from a mere Federation hand-gun, then definitely she wasn't in the state of mind to handle it.
And honestly, I don't care. If she had seen every single old enemy of hers come back so far, what the hell was so surprising about Ridley? What the hell was so surprising, and amazing about him that she didn't expect her ONE ENEMY WHO ALWAYS COMES BACK to... you know... COME BACK.
In many ways, it's a case of denial. Because she wants to put him behind her, and Zebes' destruction gave her an inkling of hope.
Oh, yes. BRILLIANT. "Hey, let's clone an evil army. But how should we have total control over them? I mean, they're evil, they might betray us. Hey, let's clone an evil genius mastermind to control that army! Man, they'll never betray us then!" Stupid, stupid, stupid, stupid, stupid. And overused. And predictable. And completely nonsensical at all.
Neither the Zebesians, nor Mother Brain, are evil by default. Ridley, now that's another story.
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The game never puts her through unnecessary danger. Everything immediately prior to authorization would be a walk in the park for Samus Aran.
There are plenty of reasons why Adam shot her in the back, including her confrontation with an infant Metroid reminiscent of the one from Super Metroid. If her power suit collapsed from a mere Federation hand-gun, then definitely she wasn't in the state of mind to handle it.
In many ways, it's a case of denial. Because she wants to put him behind her, and Zebes' destruction gave her an inkling of hope.
Neither the Zebesians, nor Mother Brain, are evil by default. Ridley, now that's another story.
I don't think you know what "unnecessary danger" is. Of course she could get out of that situation. But she didn't have to be in it. I don't care if you're the most experient soldier in the world, you don't go fighting a faraway enemy with a knife while you have a gun in your belt. It was unnecessary. Not required. The only reason it happened, was gameplay. And the story failed to make sense of it.
She asks him why he did. He avoids the question and then goes on to be a hero. So she couldn't confront an enemy, she gets SHOT IN THE BACK before she even does anything? It's stupid. It's completely and utterly stupid, he had absolutely no reason to shoot her. Let him shoot the Metroid, or tell her to stand down, seeing as she obeys his every word.
Denial? Hope? Stop taking things out of your ass that just aren't there! She killed him time and time again. She can just kill him once more.
And the "evil by default" thing is VERY questionable, not to mention completely ass-pulled, like most of your arguments here. You're pulling all kinds of justifications for characters who don't even act human. And you're not making any sense.
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I don't think you know what "unnecessary danger" is. Of course she could get out of that situation. But she didn't have to be in it. I don't care if you're the most experient soldier in the world, you don't go fighting a faraway enemy with a knife while you have a gun in your belt. It was unnecessary. Not required. The only reason it happened, was gameplay. And the story failed to make sense of it.
Once again, you exaggerate what the game actually puts you through.
She asks him why he did. He avoids the question and then goes on to be a hero. So she couldn't confront an enemy, she gets SHOT IN THE BACK before she even does anything? It's stupid. It's completely and utterly stupid, he had absolutely no reason to shoot her. Let him shoot the Metroid, or tell her to stand down, seeing as she obeys his every word.
Samus would sure as hell stop Adam from making the Sector Zero sacrifice, if she still had her power suit on.
Denial? Hope? Stop taking things out of your ass that just aren't there! She killed him time and time again. She can just kill him once more.
Her thoughts on Ridley's death were given early on. At last she had destroyed her long standing nemesis. It's only naturally she would not want to even contemplate the possibility of his return.
And the "evil by default" thing is VERY questionable, not to mention completely ass-pulled, like most of your arguments here. You're pulling all kinds of justifications for characters who don't even act human. And you're not making any sense.
Maybe you should have payed more attention to the story instead of moaning about it as you went along; the Zebesians without a leader are just feral creatures. They are a blank slate to control.
Likewise, Melissa was very much alike a young girl, with every potential future ahead of her. Had she been treated with kindness, and not as a tool, the Metroid operation could have succeeded without incident. The only monkey-wrench inevitably thrown into the equation is Ridley.
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Not to mention the only reason Mother brain ever even became "evil" is because she is a cold, emotionless logical being who came to her decision almost entirely logically. She also wasnt evil by default simply for the fact that she was made by the Chozo, who as we know, are pretty peaceful.
Mother Brain herself is basically the Hal 9000 stereotype you were complaining about, Flash. :P
In fact, I think even the Auroras have more personality. But perhaps thats simply because Mother brain never got the chance to speak or do anything other than be a boss. Hmm. Although, no, the Manga confirms it pretty much, she is a cold emotionless thing. With very little personality.
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Once again, you exaggerate what the game actually puts you through.
(http://fc09.deviantart.net/fs70/f/2010/260/6/a/metroid_other_m___every_unlock_by_dejitarudavis-d2yvh8r.jpg)
Samus would sure as hell stop Adam from making the Sector Zero sacrifice, if she still had her power suit on.
Brilliant to shoot her right when she was next to a Metroid.
Her thoughts on Ridley's death were given early on. At last she had destroyed her long standing nemesis. It's only naturally she would not want to even contemplate the possibility of his return.
Natural she wouldn't want to in any of the times he came back. But you just know he'll return in the next Metroid game. And for Samus to make that reaction, is just stupid.
Maybe you should have payed more attention to the story instead of moaning about it as you went along; the Zebesians without a leader are just feral creatures. They are a blank slate to control.
Thing which can be said about pretty much any sort of animal. But to attempt to control a species like that, that has been a source of danger so many times, and to replicate what controlled them directly, was just stupid.
Likewise, Melissa was very much alike a young girl, with every potential future ahead of her. Had she been treated with kindness, and not as a tool, the Metroid operation could have succeeded without incident. The only monkey-wrench inevitably thrown into the equation is Ridley.
She was MOTHER BRAIN. They replicated an entity which had turned evil before. What the hell did they expect to happen? It's the biggest cliché in "evil science experiment" there is. The whole game is a bunch of clichés badly tied together, with a story which would make even Michael Bay leave the room in complete and total agony.
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She was MOTHER BRAIN. They replicated an entity which had turned evil before. What the hell did they expect to happen? It's the biggest cliché in "evil science experiment" there is. The whole game is a bunch of clichés badly tied together, with a story which would make even Michael Bay leave the room in complete and total agony.
I repeat. The Auroras are also Mother Brains. They are just fine.
Mother Brain herself is a HAL 9000 cliche. If we are to assume that the Primes happened in relation to other M, then considering that the Aurora Units were a success, why wouldn't they try to go the next step, and basically make a version with a body and emotions?
Because surely,if anything can keep her from coming to the same conclusion that drove Mother Brain to her position, it is Human emotions. And for the most part, they worked. Until they betrayed her and tried to reprogram her. As a robot with not quite the grasp on emotions that Bergman would have hoped, she wants revenge. Only in her twisted vision, this revenge is against Humanity in general.
She didnt go bad because she was Mother Brain, she went bad because she became twisted with anger. Of course, abandoning her emotions by that point. If they hadnt pulled a dick move on her, she wouldnt have snapped.
Also, come on. This is the federation. The ones who actually tried to use a potentially GALAXY ending lifeform as a biological weapon.
The ones who despite the disaster aboard th Bottle Ship, still went ahead and decided to keep on making bioweapons, AND TAKE RIDLEY ALONG WITH THEM.
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I repeat. The Auroras are also Mother Brains. They are just fine.
Mother Brain herself is a HAL 9000 cliche. If we are to assume that the Primes happened in relation to other M, then considering that the Aurora Units were a success, why wouldn't they try to go the next step, and basically make a version with a body and emotions?
Because surely,if anything can keep her from coming to the same conclusion that drove Mother Brain to her position, it is Human emotions. And for the most part, they worked. Until they betrayed her and tried to reprogram her. As a robot with not quite the grasp on emotions that Bergman would have hoped, she wants revenge. Only in her twisted vision, this revenge is against Humanity in general.
She didnt go bad because she was Mother Brain, she went bad because she became twisted with anger. Of course, abandoning her emotions by that point. If they hadnt pulled a dick move on her, she wouldnt have snapped.
Also, come on. This is the federation. The ones who actually tried to use a potentially GALAXY ending lifeform as a biological weapon.
The ones who despite the disaster aboard th Bottle Ship, still went ahead and decided to keep on making bioweapons, AND TAKE RIDLEY ALONG WITH THEM.
The Auroras don't have evidence of being connected to Mother Brain other than their look. They're organic computers, that's all. The Federation basically tried to replicate the brilliance of a Mother Brain-like computer through their own science, nothing wrong with that, and they ended up being corrupted. They didn't hit us over the head with them. It's different than straight-up cloning Hitler along with his entire army in a science base which could be easily overpowered. It's every single cliché in the "evil creation" book at once. Mother Brain herself was HAL 9000, but it wasn't slapped over our heads in any other game. It was simply... hey, "organics suck and are straight-up illogical, what's up with that?" In Other M, they basically decided to make her a kawaii uguu girl who was defied and treated wrong, even though she had a direct link with the pirates. The scientists basically did the stupidest thing they could have possibly done. By adding human emotion (we can see how well HUMAN EMOTION fits girls in this universe, it turns them into straight up bitches) and then angering Mother Brain directly and treating it like a kid, what the hell could that have led to? Why did they even HAVE that conflict in the story? It was the most obvious thing there. The only thing missing was to make her wear a schoolgirl uniform or some crap. If you want to know how to do a Hal 9000 plot right, play System Shock 2, for example. Hell, even Portal does it right. But this? This is just wrong, wrong, wrong wrong on so many degrees.
And about Ridley, sure, you're only helping my argument. The feds basically used him AGAIN after all the crap that happened. Making it obvious that realistically, they would have cloned him this time 'round too, even if they didn't know he was a birdy. Samus didn't [acid burst] her pants and barf uncontrollably then. Oh, and she actually FINISHED HIM. On every other game I might say, instead of letting him escape like a retard.
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Technically he was dead and frozen stiff, so you know, how could it go wrong?
"Magic parasites that copy DNA and turn into the creature whole?"
"Don't be [tornado fang]ing ridiculous, man."
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Ridley is always going to come back. Always. Like Ganon(dorf), or Sigma, it is impossible to kill the bastard. He's gonna keep on coming.
By the way, can anyone tell me if any of you remember EVER seeing any female character whatsoever breaking down like a total spaz in such a way? In ANY game whatsoever. There must be some examples in JRPGs, since subservient woman roles are everywhere in Japan, but I don't really remember anything.
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Ridley is always going to come back. Always. Like Ganon(dorf), or Sigma, it is impossible to kill the bastard. He's gonna keep on coming.
By the way, can anyone tell me if any of you remember EVER seeing any female character whatsoever breaking down like a total spaz in such a way? In ANY game whatsoever. There must be some examples in JRPGs, since subservient woman roles are everywhere in Japan, but I don't really remember anything.
To the above, yup. It's one of the reasons why the PTSD episode in Other M makes a bit of sense even if it was exaggerated greatly. Samus thought that after [tornado fang]ing his [parasitic bomb] up in Super that should have been game set match. I mean seriously, she blew him up then blew up the planet his remains were on. There shouldn't have been enough of him to pick up in a Swiffer in her mind. Seeing him come back once more after all of that had to have been a "[tornado fang], HOW are you still alive?!" moment that'd cause anyone to wonder if he could ever be completely put down.
As for the second, what a loaded question. I could play a really mean card right now and ask if all of a sudden it's suddenly "not okay" to portray women having nervous breakdowns especially when one neglects the context of said panic attack. Furthermore, the way you talk about it made it sound like she went and hid herself in her hidey-hole or a kitchen curled up in the fetal position after being confronted by Ridley when in reality, she snapped right the [tornado fang] out of it and beat the hell out of him once again within a few seconds of realizing "oh yeah, it's Ridley. Lock 'n load." It's unrealistic to see a character just charging through everything (within the context of a story, gameplay is a different thing) without relenting or considering the events that led to a confrontation like this you know, but at the very least Other M's reason makes sense.
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To the above, yup. It's one of the reasons why the PTSD episode in Other M makes a bit of sense even if it was exaggerated greatly. Samus thought that after [tornado fang]ing his [parasitic bomb] up in Super that should have been game set match. I mean seriously, she blew him up then blew up the planet his remains were on. There shouldn't have been enough of him to pick up in a Swiffer in her mind. Seeing him come back once more after all of that had to have been a "[tornado fang], HOW are you still alive?!" moment that'd cause anyone to wonder if he could ever be completely put down.
As for the second, what a loaded question. I could play a really mean card right now and ask if all of a sudden it's suddenly "not okay" to portray women having nervous breakdowns especially when one neglects the context of said panic attack. Furthermore, the way you talk about it made it sound like she went and hid herself in her hidey-hole or a kitchen curled up in the fetal position after being confronted by Ridley when in reality, she snapped right the [tornado fang] out of it and beat the hell out of him once again within a few seconds of realizing "oh yeah, it's Ridley. Lock 'n load." It's unrealistic to see a character just charging through everything (within the context of a story, gameplay is a different thing) without relenting or considering the events that led to a confrontation like this you know, but at the very least Other M's reason makes sense.
It still doesn't. Hell, look at all of the times Samus faced him before. I wouldn't mind in the slightest bit if she went "No! RIDLEY!" And froze for a bit before turning towards him and fighting. But she went into total spaz mode and needed Adam's shouts and Anthony's death to snap out of it. It's not normal behavior. And not in the least bit justified. It is exactly because she's faced him so many times that she should be more used to the situation. Heck, these situations have been portrayed SO MANY TIMES throughout games. Look at MGS4's ending, in which Snake looks completely BAFFLED, after having killed a dude two times, having his remains blown up and thrown apart everywhere, and pretty much decrepit as hell, few months to live, having almost commited suicide. And he CAN STILL GET HIS GUN AND POINT IT. Same with Liquid. If Samus wasn't such a worthless human being in cutscenes and characteirzation, maybe we could have had a good character.
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(http://fc09.deviantart.net/fs70/f/2010/260/6/a/metroid_other_m___every_unlock_by_dejitarudavis-d2yvh8r.jpg)
Which is not what the game put you through, stop exaggerating.
Brilliant to shoot her right when she was next to a Metroid.
A Metroid he promptly took care of, without having Samus suffer the baby's death by her own accord this time around.
Natural she wouldn't want to in any of the times he came back. But you just know he'll return in the next Metroid game. And for Samus to make that reaction, is just stupid.
Funny, I don't recall Ridley being in every Metroid game.
Thing which can be said about pretty much any sort of animal. But to attempt to control a species like that, that has been a source of danger so many times, and to replicate what controlled them directly, was just stupid.
A species that lends itself to being easily controlled due to their hive-mind mentality.
She was MOTHER BRAIN. They replicated an entity which had turned evil before. What the hell did they expect to happen?
Even ignoring your complete and utter misunderstanding of how cloning works; she's a computer. If you don't want her evil, don't program her to be.
it wasn't slapped over our heads in any other game.
The other games didn't have a narrative to slap over our heads with.
In Other M, they basically decided to make her a kawaii uguu girl
Perfectly justified by the Federation mimicking the baby's reaction to Samus. You'd rather they make MB resemble a Metroid Queen?
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It still doesn't. Hell, look at all of the times Samus faced him before. I wouldn't mind in the slightest bit if she went "No! RIDLEY!" And froze for a bit before turning towards him and fighting. But she went into total spaz mode and needed Adam's shouts and Anthony's death to snap out of it. It's not normal behavior. And not in the least bit justified. It is exactly because she's faced him so many times that she should be more used to the situation. Heck, these situations have been portrayed SO MANY TIMES throughout games. Look at MGS4's ending, in which Snake looks completely BAFFLED, after having killed a dude two times, having his remains blown up and thrown apart everywhere, and pretty much decrepit as hell, few months to live, having almost commited suicide. And he CAN STILL GET HIS GUN AND POINT IT. Same with Liquid. If Samus wasn't such a worthless human being in cutscenes and characteirzation, maybe we could have had a good character.
If only those Lethal Strikes are non-canon 8D
And Adam wasn't shouting when Samus snapped out of her reccuring nightmare/cracking bottled up ship/feelings/panic attack upon Ridley. He got busy w/ Ja-Deleter.
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Which is not what the game put you through, stop exaggerating.
A Metroid he promptly took care of, without having Samus suffer the baby's death by her own accord this time around.
Funny, I don't recall Ridley being in every Metroid game.
A species that lends itself to being easily controlled due to their hive-mind mentality.
Even ignoring your complete and utter misunderstanding of how cloning works; she's a computer. If you don't want her evil, don't program her to be.
The other games didn't have a narrative to slap over our heads with.
Perfectly justified by the Federation mimicking the baby's reaction to Samus. You'd rather they make MB resemble a Metroid Queen?
The game shouldn't have to put you through any situation where you have to lose health at all if you actually own the health-keeping item in the first place. BAD STORYTELLING. It's the equivalent of making a soldier take non-lethal bullets in his chest when he's carrying a kevlar around. It is, put simply, bad storytelling. They could have just said Adam had access to her suit or something, and he was the only one to be able to activate the upgrades. But they didn't. He let Samus go through a whole section of health-losing while she could have perfectly put a suit upgrade on. A suit upgrade that didn't make any difference if she had it on or not, because it was not a weapon, or transportation mechanism. It was a [tornado fang]ing suit upgrade. By this point, you're either trolling me, or you're really damn clueless. I'm honestly not discussing this point any further.
He wasn't. He was in most of them, though. And we should expect him to be in one rather than not.
Perfect species to control through the means of cloning evil entities, huh?
You're both implying that cloning in Nintendo works at the level or actual cloning, and that a computer is anything without its programming. You honestly think they went that far in terms of characterization? Oh, and she was previously programmed to be evil, huh? The Chozo, masters of technological superiority, programmed a superior computer and it turned evil. Oh, the humans shall SURELY SUCCEED AT THIS. And before you start calling it a metaphor on human arrogance because the game has suuuuuuch a good story, I'll just say it's not arrogance. It is prime stupidity.
The other games had minimal story, which suited the Metroid series best. However, if you want a story, you better make it good. This was not good.
What? What does it have to do with the Metroids? They made her a kawaii uguu girl because they're japanese and they eat that [parasitic bomb] in spades. If they could give her big tits and have panty shots every 5 seconds, they would have.
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Perfect species to control through the means of cloning evil entities, huh?
Mother brain was not made an evil entity, a clone of her would not be evil either.
You're both implying that cloning in Nintendo works at the level or actual cloning, and that a computer is anything without its programming. You honestly think they went that far in terms of characterization? Oh, and she was previously programmed to be evil, huh? The Chozo, masters of technological superiority, programmed a superior computer and it turned evil. Oh, the humans shall SURELY SUCCEED AT THIS. And before you start calling it a metaphor on human arrogance because the game has suuuuuuch a good story, I'll just say it's not arrogance. It is prime stupidity.
Cloning is cloning. The act of creating a genetically identical copy of the original.That is the definition of cloning. MB has the same technology behind Mother Brain, she is basically a clone of her. Mother brain was never made as evil, therefore, MB had no prior risk of being evil.
What? What does it have to do with the Metroids? They made her a kawaii uguu girl because they're japanese and they eat that [parasitic bomb] in spades. If they could give her big tits and have panty shots every 5 seconds, they would have.
I think somebody's just upset that Nintendo got sum emotions and animu in their Ripley and Alien.
The baby Metroid immediately bonded with Samus like it's mother. Which means apparently, that works. So, they made MB with the sole purpose of being able to interact and control those metroids like their mother. She would bond with them, and they would obey her. I mean come on, she is even BLONDE like Samus is. I cant see how it's so hard to see that they were basically emulating Samus for use with the Metroids.
I love also, how many people complain about Samus' relationship with the baby as "nothing special" when back in Super, at the end of the game, they would have interpreted it quite the opposite. The baby came to rescue it's "mother" and got killed. Samus, having regained her strength, takes down Mother brain in an emotionally intense curbstomp. (which the opening cinematic represents awesomely too)
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Mother brain was not made an evil entity, a clone of her would not be evil either.
Cloning is cloning. The act of creating a genetically identical copy of the original.That is the definition of cloning. MB has the same technology behind Mother Brain, she is basically a clone of her. Mother brain was never made as evil, therefore, MB had no prior risk of being evil.
See how well that worked. Again, cloning evil entities and making big, intelligent computers which turn out betraying you is one of sci-fi's most obvious plots. In this game, it was made horribly.
I think somebody's just upset that Nintendo got sum emotions and animu in their Ripley and Alien.
I'm not even a Metroid fan, and I LIKED Other M, gameplay-wise. I just thought the story was the stupidest thing I've ever seen, and it seriously didn't fit well at all with the tone of the game. I don't mind things going animu, unless it's too much of a change. But the EMOTIONS were handled in a very awful way, completely ruining anything good this story might have ever had left to offer.
The baby Metroid immediately bonded with Samus like it's mother. Which means apparently, that works. So, they made MB with the sole purpose of being able to interact and control those metroids like their mother. She would bond with them, and they would obey her. I mean come on, she is even BLONDE like Samus is. I cant see how it's so hard to see that they were basically emulating Samus for use with the Metroids.
Sure, that might've been a story point. It's a damn stupid one, though. Since the relationship wasn't entirely beneficial for Samus either, having had the baby suck her health to 1HP before recognizing her. No experiment would ever be tried with such a stupid logic. Furthermore actually having Mother Brain in control of the Metroids, a cloned and reprogrammed Mother Brain, but Mother Brain neverthless, might've been the dumbest thing they've ever done.
I love also, how many people complain about Samus' relationship with the baby as "nothing special" when back in Super, at the end of the game, they would have interpreted it quite the opposite. The baby came to rescue it's "mother" and got killed. Samus, having regained her strength, takes down Mother brain in an emotionally intense curbstomp. (which the opening cinematic represents awesomely too)
Might've been special for the baby. Not for Samus, though. She knew the thing for hours at the most, and even though it saved her life, she couldn't have bonded with it so fast.
...hahahahaha, hey, ironic thing. The baby did the EXACT same thing Anthony did. Only the baby fed on her like cattle, and Anthony was nice to her the whole way, having known her in the past. With the baby, she was traumatized. With a good colleague of her who was consistingly nice and probably the only person who helped her fit in properly in the past, she didn't give it a second thought.
Man, that's one hell of an emotion, huh?
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1000th post GANGSTAS, YEAH!!!
ARM CANNON IT UP RIDLEY'S MOUTH!!!
lmao.
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I seriously loved those moves. I loved the game in terms of gameplay and animations. It was fluid, moved like butter, the combat was awesome...
Hated the graphics, though. First game without ambiance. BRING BACK RETRO.
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Do people really forget that The baby was stolen by Ridley?
If he was talen by pirates, then one can assume that not only did Mother Brain control him, but they experimented on him, making him aggressive. After he nearly kills her, he regains his senses and stops. In fact, he sorta lingers there, almost as if confused.
And then yadda yadda, comes to save Samus.
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Do people really forget that The baby was stolen by Ridley?
If he was talen by pirates, then one can assume that not only did Mother Brain control him, but they experimented on him, making him aggressive. After he nearly kills her, he regains his senses and stops. In fact, he sorta lingers there, almost as if confused.
And then yadda yadda, comes to save Samus.
Again, Nintendo doesn't think that much.
If they has HONESTLY never thought on giving Samus a personality before Other M, you can be damn sure they weren't thinking that hard.
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I don't know, it's pretty clear that they were feeding the baby quite a lot. Not to mention his size was ridiculously huge compared to most metroids. Some thought was put into that part, at the very least.
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Only because it'd be ridiculous for Samus to be attacked by a tiny little Metroid. They couldn't make it just like the others too. So they just made it bigger in order to make it special-looking. Problem solved.
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He let Samus go through a whole section of health-losing while she could have perfectly put a suit upgrade on.
Samus let herself go through it, she didn't whine about it. And with save stations all around, neither should you. Meanwhile, Adam made perfectly clear he didn't want her exploring the area beyond her current equipment, including Varia Suit. As in, you were not supposed to stay in the heat zone for any prolonged period of time. Which is why he authorized it only when there was no way back.
The other games had minimal story, which suited the Metroid series best. However, if you want a story, you better make it good. This was not good.
You're admitting here that Other M was ultimately limited to the very clichés its predecessors set; you're complaining about all of Metroid. Which just comes to show why you're also moaning about the very premises set by Metroid II and III.
The baby did the EXACT same thing Anthony did.
I was not aware Anthony considered Samus his mother.
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Samus let herself go through it, she didn't whine about it. And with save stations all around, neither should you. Meanwhile, Adam made perfectly clear he didn't want her exploring the area beyond her current equipment, including Varia Suit. As in, you were not supposed to stay in the heat zone for any prolonged period of time. Which is why he authorized it only when there was no way back.
It is [tornado fang]ing stupid in story terms, and you know it. Varia Suits never hurt anyone, and a protective armor should be allowed at all times. It makes perfect sense from a gameplay stucture standpoint, but it makes absolutely no sense within the story.
You're admitting here that Other M was ultimately limited to the very clichés its predecessors set; you're complaining about all of Metroid. Which just comes to show why you're also moaning about the very premises set by Metroid II and III.
The first Metroids didn't hit you over the head with the story. That's my very point. Other than a basic reason to complete a mission, you have no story in the other Metroids. In this one, however, you do, and the game's central thing is its story, going as far as to have the option to watch the cutscenes after you played the game.
I was not aware Anthony considered Samus his mother.
The [tornado fang] does that have to do with it? That is the stupidest reasoning I've ever seen. It was sacrificing one's life to save Samus'. The fact that an irrational creature thought of her as close for a few hours should not matter at all.
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It is [tornado fang]ing stupid in story terms, and you know it. Varia Suits never hurt anyone, and a protective armor should be allowed at all times. It makes perfect sense from a gameplay stucture standpoint, but it makes absolutely no sense within the story.
And I'm saying the end result was nowhere near as bad as you make it out to be. It's something you're supposed to overlook for gameplay reasons alone.
he first Metroids didn't hit you over the head with the story. That's my very point. Other than a basic reason to complete a mission, you have no story in the other Metroids. In this one, however, you do, and the game's central thing is its story, going as far as to have the option to watch the cutscenes after you played the game.
And by building up what the preceding Metroids introduced, and Fusion demands it lead to, the many plot points you complained about in Other M came into existence. If it didn't, it'd be even less classic Metroid than it already is.
The [tornado fang] does that have to do with it? That is the stupidest reasoning I've ever seen. It was sacrificing one's life to save Samus'. The fact that an irrational creature thought of her as close for a few hours should not matter at all.
The very fact that Samus is touched on a deeper level by its desire to protect its mother, despite her being the one that slaughtered the baby's true family, the other Metroids. Again, you're dealing with the very premises set by the older Metroid titles, the reason why she spared it at the end of Metroid II.
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Good God, Zan. I suspected once you were delusional when it comes to plots from games, but I didn't think it was actually true.
And now that I finally [tornado fang]ing said this, I'm out of this thread.
Ciao! ^___^
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Yeah Zan is so delusional paying attention to details, taking in the facts, and making logical connections based on said facts.
Shame on you Zan. Shame on you.
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Yeah Zan is so delusional paying attention to details, taking in the facts, and making logical connections based on said facts.
Shame on you Zan. Shame on you.
Ha, ha, ha... good one, man.
Okay then.
Paying attention to details? I can give him that. But hey, I do that too!
Taking in the facts? FACTS? Okay, I can give him that too. Sure. Nothing wrong with that.
Making logical connections based on said facts... yes, I can... WAIT WAIT WHOA WHAT?
Logical Connections? You mean all those things he theorizes about, and where most of them aren't even there because the creators of the [tornado fang]ing games obviously didn't think of all those things so much? You've got to be kidding me.
I mean, I can believe Isoc might be Wily. It would make sense, given his creepy obsession with Zero.
But much of the other stuff he [tornado fang]ing theorized about related to this, and other crap I just can't seem to remember right now, is just plain fan bullshit.
And don't get me wrong, I enjoy a nice speculation or two, but only with games/comics/mango that have ACTUAL plot.
Then there's this argument with Flash about the plot of Other M... yeah.
Just so we are clear about something. I do enjoy the fact that Zan can provide many useful information about the Megaman/whatever series, and I don't really hate the guy or anything.
But I just think he's delusional when it comes to certain things plot related.
THERE.
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Sounds to me like you have no clue what exactly we're discussing 90% of the time.
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And I'm saying the end result was nowhere near as bad as you make it out to be. It's something you're supposed to overlook for gameplay reasons alone.
Because we're supposed to overlook horrible [parasitic bomb] in games, right?
And by building up what the preceding Metroids introduced, and Fusion demands it lead to, the many plot points you complained about in Other M came into existence. If it didn't, it'd be even less classic Metroid than it already is.
And it came out as one of the worst stories I've ever seen in an AAA game. Gears of War has a deeper and more touching story than this.
The very fact that Samus is touched on a deeper level by its desire to protect its mother, despite her being the one that slaughtered the baby's true family, the other Metroids. Again, you're dealing with the very premises set by the older Metroid titles, the reason why she spared it at the end of Metroid II.
We have no [tornado fang]ing idea why she spared it in Metroid 2. Nor do we have any kind of connection with her feelings in the other Metroids. I'm saying this game is awful, and the story is absolutely damn horrible, making no sense at all from any kind of standpoint.
The japanese man whose name I cannot remember who wrote this imagined Samus as a woman who lost her entire badass nature and independence when confronted with an incompetent "superior" whose worth is banged over our heads. [parasitic bomb]'s awful.
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Sounds to me like you have no clue what exactly we're discussing 90% of the time.
Oh? Is that so?
Then how about you make a separate thread, or something (since I don't want to spam this one more than I already did) where you'll explain to me, and prove to everyone else how wrong I am about your constant asspulls when it comes to plot elements regarding Megaman games... and some other games too, probably.
Indulge me.
Unless you are just talking about this topic and your discussion with Flash, which I can summarize this way:
ZAN: Everything makes sense because the creators clearly meant much more through THIS and THAT than you might think.
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To be honest, I can't really remember a good, strong, independent and non-sexualized game heroine made in Japan. Aside from the usual weeaboo RPG thingers which are usually horrible written.
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Because we're supposed to overlook horrible [parasitic bomb] in games, right?
If it's enforced by gameplay, yes.
We have no [tornado fang]ing idea why she spared it in Metroid 2. Nor do we have any kind of connection with her feelings in the other Metroids. I'm saying this game is awful, and the story is absolutely damn horrible, making no sense at all from any kind of standpoint.
The japanese man whose name I cannot remember who wrote this imagined Samus as a woman who lost her entire badass nature and independence when confronted with an incompetent "superior" whose worth is banged over our heads. [parasitic bomb]'s awful.
We know as much about Samus' motivation during those games as we did about Samus' badass nature and independence; the result of the collective fan-consciousness making Samus out to be a certain person. That is, if there aren't actually a lot of Japanese-only material that details it. Either way, Sakamoto took that and expanded on it. It would be unfair to consider Other M outside of its established series. There just are certain things it could not have done differently, from HAL9000 to government bioweapon use to any of the plot points on "Mother" and "Baby"; this is Metroid.
As for what they did expand upon; the character of Samus Aran. Some like the result, others hate it. Me, personally, I don't care too much for Samus as a model of female badassery and independancy; the addition of a greater emotional focus was a welcome one. All they need now is find a better balance, instead of going overboard as they did here. If Fusion is the basis for Samus' future character than all should be fine; they can not have her collapse in every title as much as she did here.
prove to everyone else how wrong I am about your constant asspulls when it comes to plot elements regarding Megaman games... and some other games too, probably.
Indulge me.
I post preciously few things not backed up with fact. And with facts I mean exact quotes from game, manual or other materials. As it is, without specific examples the burden of proof is still on your end. With bringing up just Isoc and Wily as your best case, you're not showing well how much you actually pay attention to plot.
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Oh? Is that so?
Then how about you make a separate thread, or something (since I don't want to spam this one more than I already did) where you'll explain to me, and prove to everyone else how wrong I am about your constant asspulls when it comes to plot elements regarding Megaman games... and some other games too, probably.
Indulge me.
Unless you are just talking about this topic and your discussion with Flash, which I can summarize this way:
ZAN: Everything makes sense because the creators clearly meant much more through THIS and THAT than you might think.
Better, yet, why don't you prove it? prove to us, that anything Zan says is pulled from nowhere. As far as I can remember, almost all of what he says makes perfect sense, an can be backed up if he is asked for sources. And when he DOES theorize, he makes sure to emphasize that it is just theory, and that subject is then discussed as theory only.
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To be honest, I can't really remember a good, strong, independent and non-sexualized game heroine made in Japan. Aside from the usual weeaboo RPG thingers which are usually horrible written.
"To be honest, I can't really remember a good, strong, independent and non-sexualized game heroine made in Japan. Except I can, but they don't count cause I dont like them."
???
Better, yet, why don't you prove it? prove to us, that anything Zan says is pulled from nowhere. As far as I can remember, almost all of what he says makes perfect sense, an can be backed up if he is asked for sources. And when he DOES theorize, he makes sure to emphasize that it is just theory, and that subject is then discussed as theory only.
Crap. Beat me to it.
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"To be honest, I can't really remember a good, strong, independent and non-sexualized game heroine made in Japan. Except I can, but they don't count cause I dont like them."
Thanks for spinning my argument into something I didn't say, [Bumpity-Boom!].
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No problem. Just rewording it to how it sounded.
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To be honest, I can't really remember a good, strong, independent and non-sexualized game heroine made in Japan. Aside from the usual weeaboo RPG thingers which are usually horrible written.
I think there's two problems with the premise of a good, strong, independent, non-sexualized heroines, and even heroes. First, all (main) characters in fiction are idealized and sexualized in order to attract to the viewer. Secondly, too much strength and independence ultimately leads to one-dimensionality. Characters aren't supposed to be perfect with only strength and no weakness, nor are they supposed to be so independent they have no social and emotional interaction whatsoever. Samus was that kind of one-dimensional character, until they flipped her around a little too far to the other side. Now is the time to find balance between both depictions.
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I think there's two problems with the premise of a good, strong, independent, non-sexualized heroines, and even heroes. First, all (main) characters are fiction are idealized and sexualized. Secondly, too much strength and independence ultimately leads to one-dimensionality. Characters aren't supposed to be perfect with only strength and no weakness, nor are they supposed to be so independent they have no social and emotional interaction whatsoever. Samus was that kind of one-dimensional character, until they flipped her around a little too far to the other side. Now is the time to find balance between both depictions.
(http://questtonowhere.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/beyond-good-and-evil.jpg)
(http://media.giantbomb.com/uploads/0/2256/437315-kate_walker_super.jpg)
(http://tljwiki.sphid.com/images/0/05/April_ryan_image.jpg)
(http://media.giantbomb.com/uploads/0/2891/798471-faith_large.jpg)
Sexualized, huh? Idealized, huh?
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I post preciously few things not backed up with fact. And with facts I mean exact quotes from game, manual or other materials. As it is, without specific examples the burden of proof is still on your end. With bringing up just Isoc and Wily as your best case, you're not showing well how much you actually pay attention to plot.
See, and this is where the problem is.
You say facts, exact quotes from games, manuals or other materials. I have no problem with those. It's your constant "GEE I GUESS IT'S OBVIOUS THAT THE CREATORS CLEARLY MEANT MUCH DEEPER STUFF AND THEY TOTALLY DIDN'T JUST RUSH THE PLOT OF MEGAMAN X[insertnumberhere] JUST SO THEY CAN HAVE A REASON TO KEEP SPAMMING MORE GAMES!" attitude that I have a wee bit problem with.
Why? I'll tell you why.
Plot from Megaman X, which I'll use in this example, is laughably bad and simple. By looking so much into this, and trying to make connections of various stupid crap left unanswered, you just make yourself look kinda stupid. Of course, I'm not forcing you to NOT DO THIS, I'm just saying that in my eyes it looks delusional. Not a very bad and dangerous kind of delusional, but still.
Megaman Zero, for one, is a bit different, and I actually enjoyed all those different plot elements from it... the audio dramas and whatnot. Since it really seems like they actually put some thought into the plot, even if still a bit simple, it was much better. It didn't seem forced, it didn't seem stupid. It felt just right. This is a game, which is actually worth exploring with various theories... and yet I wouldn't dare look too much into it, when it's obvious that even in this case, the creators obviously... didn't think that much about this or that.
So, to summarize what I'm trying to say here:
NO ZAN! I'M NOT TALKING ABOUT YOUR ACTUAL EFFIN FACT BACKED UP THEORIES WHICH DO MAKE SENSE, BUT ABOUT YOUR CONSTANT "LOOKING TOO MUCH INTO IT" WHICH MIGHT SEEM TO MAKE SENSE, BUT OVERALL ALL OF IT FALLS DOWN WHEN YOU REALIZE THAT MEGAMAN GAMES HAVE, FOR THE MOST PART, [parasitic bomb] PLOT WITHOUT ANY WELL MADE CONCLUSION (except Zero, BN and Star Force, more or less. But I don't count these since they actually have decent plots which work)! SO BEFORE YOU TELL ME NEXT TIME ABOUT HOW MUCH DEEPER AND MEANINGFUL THE PLOT OF MEGAMAN X IS AND HOW FOOLISH I AM FOR NOT PROVIDING ANY "PROOF" FROM THE HUNDREDS OF YOUR POSTS WHICH CONTAINED THESE THEORIES AND WHERE MOST OF THEM HAVE BEEN WIPED OUT BY THE FORUM CRASHES PLEASE REMEMBER THIS:
[spoiler]"OH LOOK IT'S SIGMA AS THE BAD GUY AGAIN! I DIDN'T EXPECT THAT AT ALL! WHOOO!"[/spoiler]
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(except Zero, BN and Star Force, more or less. But I don't count these since they actually have decent plots which work)
Forgetting Legends? ZX had a good amount of structure as well, even if it was about morphers. Doesn't change the fact that it had some thought behind it. The fact that you even place BN and SF up there qualifies ZX beyond a shadow of a doubt.
Oh and, yeah Sigma was behind everything always that's why- oh [parasitic bomb] X8 and XCM. Oops!
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Sexualized, huh? Idealized, huh?
One of those is an over the top deliberate inversion; the others are still attractive in their own merit on multiple levels, even if they restrain themselves compared to say, Team Ninja's regular work. And that's just the thing, any character design will still be made in a way that is pleasing to the viewer. This applies to women AND men alike. We just need to accept a certain level of idealization and sexualization characteristic of visual media. We should be able to judge a character beyond looks. That is after all also what we have to do in reality; you don't choose to look the way you do.
Plot from Megaman X, which I'll use in this example, is laughably bad and simple. By looking so much into this, and trying to make connections of various stupid crap left unanswered, you just make yourself look kinda stupid. Of course, I'm not forcing you to NOT DO THIS, I'm just saying that in my eyes it looks delusional. Not a very bad and dangerous kind of delusional, but still.
I don't ever recall making too much out of the X-series. In fact, in the titles following the classic timeline, I consider its plot the weakest. What with its episodic structure and a lack of thematic focus. It's not until recent times that it's found its direction once again.
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Flash: One of those is an over the top deliberate inversion; the others are still attractive in their own merit on multiple levels, even if they contain themselves compared to say, Team Ninja's regular work. And that's just the thing, any character design will still be made in a way that is pleasing to the viewer. This applies to women AND men alike. We just need to accept a certain level of idealization and sexualization characteristic of visual media. We should be able to judge a character beyond looks. That is after all also what we have to do in reality; you don't choose to look the way you do.
You said sexualized and idealized. None of these are either. There's a difference between someone that looks sexual and someone that looks "okay" to viewers. None of them are idealized, and they all commit several mistakes along their way. They all struggle through things and act in a completely human way. Which one is even the over the top deliberate inversion?
I'm thinking you have no idea what the hell you're even saying.
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Forgetting Legends? ZX had a good amount of structure as well, even if it was about morphers. Doesn't change the fact that it had some thought behind it. The fact that you even place BN and SF up there qualifies ZX beyond a shadow of a doubt.
Oh and, yeah Sigma was behind everything always that's why- oh [parasitic bomb] X8 and XCM. Oops!
I didn't include Legends, because it goes without saying that these games are pure Gold.
And I didn't include ZX... because, as you might notice, I said:
"WITHOUT ANY WELL MADE CONCLUSION"
ZX had a good plot (for a MEgaman game) and characters, but it lacked a real conclusion. Just like Legends, now that I think about it.
Though we might get one soon for Legends, so eh.
X8? Okay, I'll give you that... BUT HE STILL WAS A MAJOR BOSS THERE, AND ONE OF THE MAJOR PLAYERS TOO... evne if Lumine was more major.
And CM? OH YEAH THAT GAME HAS AN ACTUAL PLOT SO SIGMA ISN'T THE BAD GUY BUT [parasitic bomb] STILL SUX BECAUSE LOL SPIDER IS
[spoiler]Redips 8 D [/spoiler]
Listen. Just because he wasn't the bad guy in two [tornado fang]ing games (X8 barely counts though, for the reasons I kinda explained above), doesn't mean plot in Megaman X games is actually IMPORTANT. By which I mean, from the standpoint of Capcom, not Inafune, because who knows what he really wants, but CAPCOM in general. If they could, they would chum out extensions to X series, with additional plot elements and adding bullshit.
And Sigma would still come back as a bad guy.
Or they would jump on Lumine and make him the new main badguy.
So in other words, Capcom doesn't care about plot, and for the most part plot in Megaman X is just stupid kiddy crap, without any entertainment value.
Keep in mind, I say PLOT. Not games themselves, since I find the games fun (except X7), but the plot in Megaman X is really... bad.
I don't ever recall making too much out of the X-series. In fact, in the titles following the classic timeline, I consider its plot the weakest. What with its episodic structure and a lack of thematic focus. It's not until recent times that it's found its direction once again.
Funny. I remember different.
Sure, I'm not saying you did this ALL THE TIME, or like... in a maniacal sort of way. But with Isoc being Wily the only example I can remember now... because well, ummm... It just made a huge impression on me, because some of it made actual sense once you gave it some thought.
I said, I could go on a stalking like rampage, regarding all your "I LOOK TOO MUCH INTO IT" regarding Sigma virus, and many other things... but many of those things I read once upon a time are gone now. dem forum crashes, man.
My point is just this: Generally looking too much into plot of video games, especially japanese made video games which are platformers for most part, is just plain silly. I can understand these types of theories regarding a plot of a good book, or movie. These are things which are based on the plot... because without them would be nothing. And it's entirely possible the creator (or creators) actually gave some real thought into these things you are theorizing about.
On the other hand games like megaman series, no matter how good their plots are, are still GAMES. Their appeal comes mostly from gameplay, and plot is just there to make the player feel more close to the characters, and because in these times, most people expect plot from most games.
Well... that's it. Good God this post took me a long time to write. : P
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Sigma wasn't behind X6 either BTW. That was all Gate.
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Can we get back to how Other M's story is horrible, guys?
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Yeah. X6 was actually pretty good in terms of story. If Sigma didn't show up at the end, it would have been pretty much perfect aside form the insta-zero-revival concept. But it brought supporting characters into the spotlight, along with deepening the Zero back story, and a new big bad to deal with who was previously unknown but fit right in.
OH- [parasitic bomb]. We're moving on, I forgot. Sorry.
THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY THE BABY
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Alright, attempt to launch a halfway decent line of debate here...
How do you guys stand on Shadow Complex's gameplay?
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It was a little loose, but it worked. It was fluid enough, and I adjusted fairly quickly. The aiming was sometimes a little wonky, but I never had any trouble finishing a fight. Ducking around and crawling through vents seemed pretty natural and flowed well. Overall I liked it a lot. One of the best damn games of this console generation to be frank.
Oh and thank god they had enough sense to give you unlimited ammo.
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Relevant.
(http://img233.imageshack.us/img233/7605/metroidwiimod.jpg)
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How to best enjoy Metroid Other M in any capacity:
1) Remove game from case
2) Load into machine
3) Aim
4) Machine fires up disk
5) Duck Hunt music
6) Shoot down disk as it goes flying away
Congratulations, you beat the game! Wasn't that fun?
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It was a little loose, but it worked. It was fluid enough, and I adjusted fairly quickly. The aiming was sometimes a little wonky, but I never had any trouble finishing a fight. Ducking around and crawling through vents seemed pretty natural and flowed well. Overall I liked it a lot. One of the best damn games of this console generation to be frank.
Oh and thank god they had enough sense to give you unlimited ammo.
The only wonky part of the aiming was the depth part, which was made automatic and you sometimes had to re-aim at an enemy for it to be aimed straight at him. I honestly think the depth part was brilliant in several ways, but it caused those slight aiming problems. A future title would have the option to aim freely in depth as well as height. The grenade engine and explosions in general felt brilliant, and so did the machine design.
The melee attacks also felt kinda overpowered at times, seeing as whenever you did one, you'd automatically kill almost any enemy in a scene where all other enemies simply disappeared from a level. But it felt pretty cool, and it wasn't any issue. I still consider this game to be the best way to make a third-person Metroid.
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You said sexualized and idealized. None of these are either. There's a difference between someone that looks sexual and someone that looks "okay" to viewers. None of them are idealized, and they all commit several mistakes along their way. They all struggle through things and act in a completely human way. Which one is even the over the top deliberate inversion?
I'm thinking you have no idea what the hell you're even saying.
Specifically in terms of looks, I'm just saying that the main characters of 'Beyond Good and Evil' and 'Mirror's Edge' still have perfect complexion, facial features and physique. This is a type of idealizing that occurs with both women and men in visual media; developers still try to make characters look good.
"Sexualizing" here becomes a matter of how much this inherent idealization is highlighted by how revealing the character's clothes are. Or otherwise put: how much form the graphic artists decided to display. You're right that they do that way too much. But our opinions on a character's personality and development shouldn't be influenced by that. Just like we should ignore the matter of gender; if a character is good, it's good. If a character is bad, it's bad.
Translating back to Samus; Nintendo always showed her with an idealized appearance. Team Ninja just happened to show it in more than just the game endings. Really, let developers sexualize characters if that's their things and just ignore it if it bugs you. But judge characters for what they are, not for that they appear.
And I didn't include ZX... because, as you might notice, I said:
"WITHOUT ANY WELL MADE CONCLUSION"
ZX had a good plot (for a MEgaman game) and characters, but it lacked a real conclusion. Just like Legends, now that I think about it.
Though we might get one soon for Legends, so eh.
Beyond the necessary sequel hook of a game series, both ZX and DASH concluded themselves nicely. But I don't get it, why would you fault any story for being incomplete? You need only review it for what it did present. The same applies to every other long running series, Metroid included.
Listen. Just because he wasn't the bad guy in two [tornado fang]ing games (X8 barely counts though, for the reasons I kinda explained above), doesn't mean plot in Megaman X games is actually IMPORTANT. By which I mean, from the standpoint of Capcom, not Inafune, because who knows what he really wants, but CAPCOM in general. If they could, they would chum out extensions to X series, with additional plot elements and adding bullshit.
And Sigma would still come back as a bad guy.
Or they would jump on Lumine and make him the new main badguy.
So in other words, Capcom doesn't care about plot, and for the most part plot in Megaman X is just stupid kiddy crap, without any entertainment value.
Keep in mind, I say PLOT. Not games themselves, since I find the games fun (except X7), but the plot in Megaman X is really... bad.
The plot of the X-series is enjoyable because it's a teenage's story. Much like classic is enjoyable because it's a children's story; it's part of the charm.
From there, by who's declaration is a recurring antagonist a sign of plot being unimportant or bad? Both Wily and Sigma's recurring role are an important assets to the mythos, well accepted by the later series with their more mature approach in story-telling. Just as much, Ridley's return in Metroid is an important plot asset. It's there for the sake of gameplay and fanservice, but does it really detract from the plot?
I said, I could go on a stalking like rampage, regarding all your "I LOOK TOO MUCH INTO IT" regarding Sigma virus, and many other things... but many of those things I read once upon a time are gone now. dem forum crashes, man.
What I believe you're talking about now is a ZERO-series recollection on the X-series. It was Inti Creates that gave us information drastically altering our perception of the X-series. By what double standard would you acknowledge the ZERO-series and ignore what it says about the X-series? Fact of the matter is that the X-series has deepened by the many references to it from the other series. Entirely comparable to how both Prime and Other M have added depth to classic Metroid.
My point is just this: Generally looking too much into plot of video games, especially japanese made video games which are platformers for most part, is just plain silly. I can understand these types of theories regarding a plot of a good book, or movie. These are things which are based on the plot... because without them would be nothing. And it's entirely possible the creator (or creators) actually gave some real thought into these things you are theorizing about.
On the other hand games like megaman series, no matter how good their plots are, are still GAMES. Their appeal comes mostly from gameplay, and plot is just there to make the player feel more close to the characters, and because in these times, most people expect plot from most games.
I prefer to think creators put their heart, soul and imagination into designing characters, a world, and stringing together a fun little plot from the depths of their mind. No matter how deep the end result is, there is still a great deal of effort put into something what could just be a different variation of two squares bouncing a square ball between two square goal posts.
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[Beyond the necessary sequel hook of a game series, both ZX and DASH concluded themselves nicely. But I don't get it, why would you fault any story for being incomplete? You need only review it for what it did present. The same applies to every other long running series, Metroid included.
Oh believe, I'm not really faulting those two. I merely wanted to say, that by judging how they ended, they KINDA lacked a real conclusion, though ZX is in much bigger need of a conclusion (story wise, because it's obvious I want new Legends game more : P) than Legends. What with all this [parasitic bomb] Thomas pulled out, and stuff.
The plot of the X-series is enjoyable because it's a teenage's story. Much like classic is enjoyable because it's a children's story; it's part of the charm.
From there, by who's declaration is a recurring antagonist a sign of plot being unimportant or bad? Both Wily and Sigma's recurring role are an important assets to the mythos, well accepted by the later series with their more mature approach in story-telling. Just as much, Ridley's return in Metroid is an important plot asset. It's there for the sake of gameplay and fanservice, but does it really detract from the plot?
Just because it's a teenage story, doesn't mean it DOESN'T stink. Really... I like the world of MEGAMAN X, and it's characters so much, but I can't help but headdesk when I think about many things in the plots of these games.
And I would enjoy Megaman X6 plot more... if the game wasn't translated like [parasitic bomb]. But that's more of a translators fault, than the writers. But yeah, it just shows how much people actually cared for the story. : <
What I believe you're talking about now is a ZERO-series recollection on the X-series. It was Inti Creates that gave us information drastically altering our perception of the X-series. By what double standard would you acknowledge the ZERO-series and ignore what it says about the X-series? Fact of the matter is that the X-series has deepened by the many references to it from the other series. Entirely comparable to how both Prime and Other M have added depth to classic Metroid.
I don't exactly ignore what Zero series says about the X series, and how it deepens it, but... comparing to what I got in Zero and ZX... everything in Megaman X just stinks. No matter how much the two of them (Zero and ZX) try to fix or add stuff.
I prefer to think creators put their heart, soul and imagination into designing characters, a world, and stringing together a fun little plot from the depths of their mind. No matter how deep the end result is, there is still a great deal of effort put into something what could just be a different variation of two squares bouncing a square ball between two square goal posts.
Oh, I think that too. Except the problem in this case, we are still talking about a PLATFORMER, where plot comes second... or maybe third. It's not some kind of "deep rpg" (well, unlike command mission, BN or star force), or an adventure game or something like, I dunno, with actual dialogue... not something thrown together to justify why am I getting atackked by Metools, robo bees and giant [tornado fang]ing mantisks that repair themselves after I killed them and keep spamming dem blades. Heh.
I tell you something, because of something like this, whenever I think up an idea for one of my original stories, I not only think through many facts about various characters, but also things related to history of their worlds.
I'm a person with huge ass imagination, and whether I will write something one day with these characters and worlds is unsure yet... but my point is, it's also easy for me to say and notice when something just wasn't thought through too much, and these kind of "theories" which are often also taken up as truth by some stupid people (keep in mind I don't mean you, or anybody on these forums right now. I'm talking more about stupid n00bs who see a beautiful theory and go preach it like it's something true) just kind of annoy me.
So overall, sorry if i seem like a horrible dick by attacking you like that, but I just wanted to finally say all of those things, since it was sitting like a rock in my stomach.
And with this, I'll just wait for you reply to this one, and I'm not arguing about this anymore.
Peace.
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Specifically in terms of looks, I'm just saying that the main characters of 'Beyond Good and Evil' and 'Mirror's Edge' still have perfect complexion, facial features and physique. This is a type of idealizing that occurs with both women and men in visual media; developers still try to make characters look good.
"Sexualizing" here becomes a matter of how much this inherent idealization is highlighted by how revealing the character's clothes are. Or otherwise put: how much form the graphic artists decided to display. You're right that they do that way too much. But our opinions on a character's personality and development shouldn't be influenced by that. Just like we should ignore the matter of gender; if a character is good, it's good. If a character is bad, it's bad.
Translating back to Samus; Nintendo always showed her with an idealized appearance. Team Ninja just happened to show it in more than just the game endings. Really, let developers sexualize characters if that's their things and just ignore it if it bugs you. But judge characters for what they are, not for that they appear.
First of all, that sounds incredibly and ridiculous stupid.
Okay, let's see... "perfect" complexion, facial features, and physique? Jade from Beyond Good & Evil has a very normal, natural face. She isn't specially pretty, she's simply normally attractive. And as for Faith from Mirror's Edge... do you not remember the shitstorm that went on because all the [tornado fang]ing japanese weeaboos thought she wasn't good-looking enough? There was actually a guy who "improved her" by photoshopping her figure in order for her boobs to be bigger, cher eyes anime-ish, and her whole figure to be more sexualized.
(http://www.blogcdn.com/www.joystiq.com/media/2008/11/twofaiths.jpg)
Something the developers said "No, she's supposed to be normal-looking." What the [tornado fang] do you think is a normal-looking woman? A distinctly ugly one? Because Faith actually looks quite average. She doesn't have a very attractive body according to the usual male ideal, and she's more of an athlete. Put her among other women athletes and she looks just... normal. Her face is stereotypically asian, and she wears a tank top and track pants! Regular exercise clothes. None of the characters are showing off their bodies more than any other woman would do so in a daily basis. Heck, the only reason Kate Walker is wearing such warm clothes, it's because she's in Syberia. Take her to a warmer climate, and she'd wear clothes just as revealing as the other two. Why? Because THAT'S WHAT WOMEN ACTUALLY WEAR. We're not talking about Bloodrayne or DOA, which are completely sexist. We're talking about games that portray their women is a very average and normal way. Jade doesn't have a typical average face because she's a cartoon character, but she's pretty damn average, nothing sexualizing her in any way, no camera angles emphasizing her butt of breasts, nothing.
And I can give male examples as well! What do you make of Frank West, for example?
(http://dualshockers.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/deadrising2_casewest_frank_west-413x332.jpg)
I'll tell you what I make of him. An averagely unnatractive male. Broad face. Fat features. Potato nose. You think this unmoralist journalist out to get the scoop of his life is handsome?
Let's take on a more popular example. Niko Bellic.
(http://connect.collectorz.com/blog/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/niko-bellic.png)
This guy isn't pretty. He's normal. He's pretty ugly, even. And not even idealized in any way.
Heck, look at Marcus from Gears of War.
(http://img227.imageshack.us/img227/3870/180pxgearsofwarmarcusaz5.png)
He's got an ugly face. If not for the bulky muscles which EVERYONE in the Gears universe seems to have, he'd just be another dude.
What about John Marston from Red Dead Redemption? I look at him and I see "ugly man" all over him.
(http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110105170327/reddeadredemption/images/thumb/6/66/Rdr_john_marston.jpg/462px-Rdr_john_marston.jpg)
These guys aren't idealized in the slightest. They're dudes with lifes filled with mistakes and bullshit. So are the girls. So, no. In terms of looks or otherwise, they do NOT have perfect complexion or looks or whatever. And their clothes, are normal, typical, everyday outfits you or I would wear in their situations. Do you even know what women wear in their everyday lives, or do you just suspect the ones who are wearing a burka are the only non-sluts? Take a look at what it means to be a normal, everyday human being. Then tell me if you end up agreeing with me, or coming to the conclusion that 80% of the human race is portrayed in a sexual manner.
Also, Samus has always been portrayed as a whore who undresses more depending on how many items you get in her games. I never argued that. I will argue that this was the first time they had to present her personality, and they chose to portray her as an insipid dominated bimbo in a very bad narrative.
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I don't exactly ignore what Zero series says about the X series, and how it deepens it, but... comparing to what I got in Zero and ZX... everything in Megaman X just stinks. No matter how much the two of them (Zero and ZX) try to fix or add stuff.
Looking at Irregular Hunter X, the story the X-series is supposed to tell has a lot more merit than you're giving it credit for. It's just the X gradually evolved across the different media and became something more than it was ever intended to be. It are those people who think about that something more, that are in charge of each of the series now.
Okay, let's see... "perfect" complexion, facial features, and physique? Jade from Beyond Good & Evil has a very normal, natural face. She isn't specially pretty, she's simply normally attractive.
(http://www.tannerhiggin.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/bge_jade_screen.jpg)
Beyond polygon limitations, I see nothing on Jade that isn't perfectionalized. She's flawless if you ask me, but not over the top and throwing it in your face. A well-balanced and restrained design leading to a very natural feel. And that's exactly the kind of inherant idealization I'm talking about; making a character the most aesthetically pleasing because any less would not work for its intended purpose. It just so happens many developers can't restrain themselves and quickly go from idealization to sexualization. Because obviously, thats what the majority wants and thus it sells.
And as for Faith from Mirror's Edge... do you not remember the shitstorm that went on because all the [tornado fang]ing japanese weeaboos thought she wasn't good-looking enough? There was actually a guy who "improved her" by photoshopping her figure in order for her boobs to be bigger, cher eyes anime-ish, and her whole figure to be more sexualized.
I think it's far too simple minded to think of restraining chestsize and adding eye marks as approaching reality in all its facets. Yes, she's definitely closer than the many examples of the Team Ninja kind. But if you were to take even the best cosplayer trying to resemble her, there are certain human things that simply cannot be put into a character design. There is always idealization, just different variations of it depending on creative vision.
This guy isn't pretty. He's normal. He's pretty ugly, even. And not even idealized in any way.
I'm not saying it's impossible to achieve an appearance that's "normal." Especially when referencing a real person it should be doable. What I'm saying is, for the most part, character designs will always be made pleasing in some manner or another, even if that is to perfectionalize looking gritty in accordance with the designated role of gangster. There are certain much more normal types of people that simply will not be used in games. In particular because they don't fit the intended role.
Fat features
And how many realistically fat features would you ever see on a female character without going overboard? From the top of my head, the only games that ever achieved this would be ones with user controlled character generators; not characters specifically designed to be the lead. I wasn't referring to chest size when I wrote of "perfect physique," I was referring to the entire body's proportions. This kind of variety is just not done in actual characters for some reason inherent to the medium.
If not for the bulky muscles
And that's exactly the type of idealization for men I'm referring to. Male leads unlike females can often excuse themselves with facial disfigurations because those only add to the stereotype of the tough guy with big muscles. Of course, most of that is because of the very roles characters occupy within a story; they just have to have that physique otherwise they cannot do what they're supposed to do. But Japan has shrimpy girly men doing the same, which in turn is also an idealization of a different kind. Once again, everything in the middle is ignored in the design process.
sluts?
It's a matter of your own mind being in the gutter if you perceive any woman to be such.
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What about John Marston from Red Dead Redemption? I look at him and I see "ugly man" all over him.
(http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110105170327/reddeadredemption/images/thumb/6/66/Rdr_john_marston.jpg/462px-Rdr_john_marston.jpg)
I see manly badass childhood role model. Hes rough but he isn't ugly. Chicks dig the bad boys.
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I see manly badass childhood role model. Hes rough but he isn't ugly. Chicks dig the bad boys.
He's rough, and he's certainly a damn role model, with everything that he goes through, but he's not the "sexualized ideal" character talked about. Hell, girls in the game actually call him ugly.
Beyond polygon limitations, I see nothing on Jade that isn't perfectionalized. She's flawless if you ask me, but not over the top and throwing it in your face. A well-balanced and restrained design leading to a very natural feel. And that's exactly the kind of inherant idealization I'm talking about; making a character the most aesthetically pleasing because any less would not work for its intended purpose. It just so happens many developers can't restrain themselves and quickly go from idealization to sexualization. Because obviously, thats what the majority wants and thus it sells.
I think it's far too simple minded to think of restraining chestsize and adding eye marks as approaching reality in all its facets. Yes, she's definitely closer than the many examples of the Team Ninja kind. But if you were to take even the best cosplayer trying to resemble her, there are certain human things that simply cannot be put into a character design. There is always idealization, just different variations of it depending on creative vision.
I'm not saying it's impossible to achieve an appearance that's "normal." Especially when referencing a real person it should be doable. What I'm saying is, for the most part, character designs will always be made pleasing in some manner or another, even if that is to perfectionalize looking gritty in accordance with the designated role of gangster. There are certain much more normal types of people that simply will not be used in games. In particular because they don't fit the intended role.
And how many realistically fat features would you ever see on a female character without going overboard? From the top of my head, the only games that ever achieved this would be ones with user controlled character generators; not characters specifically designed to be the lead. I wasn't referring to chest size when I wrote of "perfect physique," I was referring to the entire body's proportions. This kind of variety is just not done in actual characters for some reason inherent to the medium.
And that's exactly the type of idealization for men I'm referring to. Male leads unlike females can often excuse themselves with facial disfigurations because those only add to the stereotype of the tough guy with big muscles. Of course, most of that is because of the very roles characters occupy within a story; they just have to have that physique otherwise they cannot do what they're supposed to do. But Japan has shrimpy girly men doing the same, which in turn is also an idealization of a different kind. Once again, everything in the middle is ignored in the design process.
It's a matter of your own mind being in the gutter if you perceive any woman to be such.
Jade isn't flawless. I could sit here and discuss details about the pointy cheekbones, droopy boobs and big ears all day, but I'll just assume you live in whale land and think all regular-looking women look sexualized. Of course she's asthetically pleasing. As a character, in the manner that a symbol is pleasing. But she's not "sexy", she wears regular working clothes with a kind of new age fashion style going on. She's original, but definetly not sexualized in any way. That is the main issue. Not that characters look ugly, but you specifically said "sexualized and ideal". I don't see either. I just see tiptoeing around my questions with vague descriptions with how the industry works. I know how the [tornado fang]ing industry works. I also know that you said "all lead characters are sexualized and idealized", and now you're saying "most characters" and filling the topic with bullshit. Just flat-out admit you're wrong, this is getting tiring.
As for Faith from Mirror's Edge? YES, she looks like a standard asian woman. No idealization, just a plain, asian woman. Cosplayers trying to portray her?
(http://images.cosplay.com/photos/17/1772382.jpg)This is a case of a cosplayer who looks JUST like her. I can also give examples of cosplayers who look BETTER than her. It's not hard. She is not idealized, she's supposed to look normal. Stop spewing bullshit and give concrete examples and reasons.
As for certain types of people fitting certain types of roles, NO [parasitic bomb] SHERLOCK. Of course they have to look the part. But that doesn't mean a fat guy or an ugly guy can't be a main character from a game. Hell, look at Detective Scott Shelby from Heavy Rain. He's fat. He's ugly. He's normal.
(http://media.giantbomb.com/uploads/1/14030/1118551-933123_20090825_screen003_super.jpg)
He's also a main character.
And when you refer to fat, no, there aren't any games that I can remember with fat women, aside from Fable and Fat Princess. Mostly because it's kinda stupid to have a fat character run and jump in the first place (Mario and Wario are just chubby). In terms of men, I showed examples. In terms of women, it hasn't been that long since women have gained their proper equality in games. Give it time, and we'll have a good standard.
You answered your own question with the next one. Skinny guys fighting bigass aliens and wielding huge guns does not make sense. It's the same way you buff up and train as a soldier. But they can still be ugly and flawed. It's not a matter of idealization, it's a matter of LOGIC. And for Japan, I'll just say they've got screwed up tastes. Hell, look at the characters in Battlefield: Bad Company. They're a bunch of crazed soldiers who can look ugly as hell. I seriously cannot tell what kind of argument are you making here other than "they can look ideally full of muscles... but they can excuse that on the fact that all soldiers have them!" What the hell is your point other than being incredibly redundant?
You [tornado fang]'d up. You said something, then backed out on it. Sure that there are plenty of stereotypes in games. All media have them. But saying "ALL" main characters is just stupid. No, they're not ideal. Not by far. They're made for the role, yes. Because that's what you do in any story. They're made to be in that situation. But that wasn't your initial argument, and I am criticizing your initial argument. And I'll quote you again.
First, all (main) characters in fiction are idealized and sexualized in order to attract to the viewer.
No. They are not. Go look for the meaning of "idealized" and "sexualized" on a dictionary if you want. Go look for the meaning of the word ALL. Instead of bullshitting around your own arguments, backtracking on [parasitic bomb] you said, and being a general wuss.
And yes, sluts exist. Both the male and the female kind. Deal with it.
I'm tired of debating with someone who spews so much generic unrelated bullshit and who subtracts past arguments for the sake of trying to look smart. Let's get back to Metroid, please.
Does anybody know if Metroid 2 is still worth playing, or should I just wait for that fan remake?
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Skinny guys fighting bigass aliens and wielding huge guns does not make sense.
Depends... What do you classify as skinny, and what the limit is.
I could consider an average build "skinny" and then point out Isaac Clarke, who doesnt seem to be all that musclebound as say... GoW folks, Gordon Freeman, and hell, even Samus herself. (though she isnt a guy)
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Depends... What do you classify as skinny, and what the limit is.
I could consider an average build "skinny" and then point out Isaac Clarke, who doesnt seem to be all that musclebound as say... GoW folks, Gordon Freeman, and hell, even Samus herself. (though she isnt a guy)
Isaac Clarke and Gordon Freeman = Suits that power them up. In the Gears universe, seeing a guy with Final Fantasy proportions wrestle a monster with a chainsaw would look stupid. It's good that they're in a good size compared to their enemies. Gives them the Spartan/Elite rivalry that Halo's got going.
I don't usually see skinny people in action games. Mostly because they don't really have the body to go through all of that crap. But we can see plenty of skinny characters through many other games. Heck, adventure games are filled with skinny guys like Guybrush Threepwood and George Stobbart.
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Isaac Clarke and Gordon Freeman = Suits that power them up
You never specified. You said "Skinny guys fighting bigass aliens and wielding huge guns"
And thats what the above mentioned are. It makes sense when you include technology. Such as... Suits, powered armored suits.
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You never specified. You said "Skinny guys fighting bigass aliens and wielding huge guns"
And thats what the above mentioned are. It makes sense when you include technology. Such as... Suits, powered armored suits.
Yes it does. I never said there could be no exceptions to the rule whatsoever. There always are, in all sorts of fiction.
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This is a case of a cosplayer who looks JUST like her. I can also give examples of cosplayers who look BETTER than her. It's not hard. She is not idealized, she's supposed to look normal. Stop spewing bullshit and give concrete examples and reasons.
As for certain types of people fitting certain types of roles, NO [parasitic bomb] SHERLOCK. Of course they have to look the part. But that doesn't mean a fat guy or an ugly guy can't be a main character from a game. Hell, look at Detective Scott Shelby from Heavy Rain. He's fat. He's ugly. He's normal.
He's also a main character.
And when you refer to fat, no, there aren't any games that I can remember with fat women, aside from Fable and Fat Princess. Mostly because it's kinda stupid to have a fat character run and jump in the first place (Mario and Wario are just chubby). In terms of men, I showed examples. In terms of women, it hasn't been that long since women have gained their proper equality in games. Give it time, and we'll have a good standard.
I was referring to all the variations that exist. Especially with women, games will generally only depict extremes, never the intermediates. Either we're stuck with the athletic figures of Jade and Faith, or we get another Fat Princess, or the absolute reverse. Show me everything that exists in between having made its way into games.
As for Faith from Mirror's Edge? YES, she looks like a standard asian woman. No idealization, just a plain, asian woman. Cosplayers trying to portray her?
Are you really unable to see all the little human imperfections that the 3D model just fails to capture? Your Heavy Rain example is about the only one that comes near to displaying realistic skin imperfections.
Skinny guys fighting bigass aliens and wielding huge guns does not make sense.
Everything can be made to make sense in the realm of the imagination that produces games.
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I was referring to all the variations that exist. Especially with women, games will generally only depict extremes, never the intermediates. Either we're stuck with the athletic figures of Jade and Faith, or we get another Fat Princess, or the absolute reverse. Show me everything that exists in between having made its way into games.
I just showed you a whole bunch of [tornado fang]ing intermediates. No, there are no main character obese women in gaming. Aside from a few tiny expressions, neither on the film media, but we're getting there. And are you seriously implying that athletic women equal the big-breasted bimbos we get in the DOA series? Or the lolis we see in anime games? Or the realistic women we see in adventure games, like Nico Collard or Kate Walker. There are quite a few body types, and plenty of different looks. Many aren't at all extremes. Like I said, stop talking bullshit. You just seem stupid that way.
Are you really unable to see all the little human imperfections that the 3D model just fails to capture? Your Heavy Rain example is about the only one that comes near to displaying realistic skin imperfections.
That is nitpick bullshit and you know it. Graphical models can only go so far, and the cosplayer I showed you was close enough. Stop taking [parasitic bomb] out of your ass.
Everything can be made to make sense in the realm of the imagination that produces games.
Take your head out of your ass. Instead of feeding me bullshit with prettied up phrases, answer to my replies. I gave you a reply, and you picked up the parts you could bullshit around, and replied to them with [parasitic bomb] that doesn't answer anything. You say something completely stupid, and then you're not man enough to admit you made a [tornado fang]ing mistake. I gave you a well-stated, well-built reply. The very least you could do, would be to answer accordingly. But no. You disrespect me, running off with your tail between your legs and carefully wipe out the parts in my replies that you can't answer. You have absolutely no logical way to answer without saying "I'm sorry, I was wrong." So instead of simply admitting your mistake, you bullshit around it, and try to escape from it.
Well I've had it up to here talking with you, shithead. Argument over.
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Jesus [tornado fang]ing Christ. If I were a moderator I would've locked this thread two pages ago.
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Let's just get back to the Metroid convo, like I said a few replies ago, okay?
Is that Metroid 2 remake still being made?
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RqNb8Rv65o8[/youtube]
It looked pretty damn cool from what I've seen. Yo, Nintendo. We want another game like this.
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I haven't heard anything about it in a while, but it seems the game is still in progress. DoctorM64 just posted an update a few days ago, but no new videos as yet.
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Link to his blog is in the comments. Guy mentioned finishing the final areas a number of weeks ago, and more recently that he couldn't get the feel of the final battle right, so that's kind of promising I guess.
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Looking at the blog, it seems like he's mostly doing visual tweaks and trying to get the sprites done at the moment.
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Taking awhile, though. I remember a demo/full tiny game prologue being released a couple of years ago or so. Loved it back then. I wonder where I can find it again...
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You might look on the blog. Apparently there's some other mini-game he made called Metroid: Confrontation up there too that may tide you over.
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I think that's the one I was talking about. Hell of a game.
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http://metroid2remake.blogspot.com/
A demo for the metroid 2 remake is out!
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http://metroid2remake.blogspot.com/
A demo for the metroid 2 remake is out!
Haha, oh man that was great.
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(http://lol.rockmanpm.com/anothermario2remake.jpg)
>0<
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hahaha, that's adorable~
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http://metroid2remake.blogspot.com/2011/10/demo.html
Real demo now available. Controls are tight as hell and you can customize if you want toggle/hold missiles or 1-button diagonal aim, it's awesome. Feels better than some real metroid games I've played.
Posted on: 2011-10-28, 16:04:20
So xnam and I were chatting in IRC about gameplay ideas. I'll leave him to his so I don't misrepresent anything; mine was basically that instead of getting specific upgrades after defeating each boss, you'd get some sort of points that you can spend on abilities of your choosing. As a result, you get to choose the order you deal with areas.
Energy/missile tanks would be kept separate of this system so players don't accidentally lock themselves out by not getting any new abilities.
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I wonder what the next Metriod game would be like, and on what system? 3DS, or on-coming Wii U?
So far my favorite of the 2D titles is Metroid Fusion, while my favorite 3D one is Metroid Prime.
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CVG: In your Tomodachi presentation, you mentioned your mission to 'create a game that moves the industry forwards'. Does that mean you will not return to the more traditional game series that you're known for?
Sakamoto: I do not intend to do so. There might [currently] be various tasks I might be involved in with past series. However, even if so I would always like to introduce new entertainment and new fun to those series.
I would like to satisfy fans of those series, but also working with other talented individuals I would like to create entertainment that's completely different and that brings new emotions. I would like to challenge myself in those unique directions.
This might be indirect, but if we can make new types of gamers enjoy video games for the first time through Tomodachi Life, then they might eventually become interested in the more conventional games. I think we need to ensure that video games remain attractive to consumers, and in order to do so new concepts and ideas are important. I would like to challenge myself to do that.
http://www.computerandvideogames.com/459245/i-want-to-challenge-myself-says-metroid-series-director/ (http://www.computerandvideogames.com/459245/i-want-to-challenge-myself-says-metroid-series-director/)
Thoughts?
IMO, as long has he's not writing Metroid anymore, I'm happy.
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I would say that's good that he wouldn't seem to mess with the stories of the earlier Metroids.
But the early Metroids didn't have much story to begin with. Aside from backstory from other media and It's All In The Manual, the first 3 and Zero Mission are pretty much blank slates.
I would love for Nintendo to do a remake of Metroid 2. But if all we have in the future is AM2R, I'd be perfectly fine with that.