Author Topic: Why do some people hate/dislike the PSX-era Rockman X games more?  (Read 8099 times)

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Offline Da Dood

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Re: Why do some people hate/dislike the PSX-era Rockman X games more?
« Reply #25 on: September 03, 2013, 04:08:25 AM »
IMO:

X4 -- My favorite of the three, closest to the SNES trilogy in design and presentation. Anime cutscenes are a real treat. Last decent boss arsenal for X. I don't agree with the critics about the level design, I think they do some interesting things. Definitely better than X3 where you're constantly zigzagging through empty tunnels.

X5 -- Questionable decisions, like the random Enigma/shuttle and the weird part system. Alia pisses me off (training stage was there for a reason, dammit!). Too many wait-and-go stages, and possibly the worst underwater level in Mega Man history. Still a fun game that took some risks. I will always respect that. Back then I couldn't imagine a Mega Man game where you didn't have to defeat all 8 bosses to reach the fortress. I have mixed feelings about X having two armor sets. Would rather collect and use the parts separately, although the variety is pretty sweet.

X6 -- A mess that somehow works quite well. This game is pure chaos, and also really open. There are many interesting ways to go through it. The challenge isn't exactly fair, but for every cheap situation you can be 2x cheaper. Some of the unintended tricks are quite satisfying, especially Zero dash cancel and Guard Shell abuse. Say what you will about saving Reploids, at least you can get any part at any time if you're good enough. Shadow X is awesome with the right parts (Speedster + Ultimate Buster for total ninjaness).

I would rate them 4 > 6 > 5, and at least 1 and 2 above them all. But I really like all PS era MMXs!

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Re: Why do some people hate/dislike the PSX-era Rockman X games more?
« Reply #26 on: September 03, 2013, 05:09:40 AM »
My opinion:

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Offline Flame

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Re: Why do some people hate/dislike the PSX-era Rockman X games more?
« Reply #27 on: September 03, 2013, 08:17:41 AM »
I like X5's X intro stage theme... :\

Zero's is bland though.

Now it's funny though, for all X5's flaws and terrible ideas, it really is the one I have the most nostalgia for, despite feeling X6 is the better of the two, and X4 being my favorite. (X4 also being my first X game- i came into Megaman with the PSX games. 8 and X4)
...When Larry the reploid accountant goes maverick of his own accord, he's certainly formidable during tax season, but he isn't going to provide X the challenge needed to make him grow as a warrior and reach his potential.

Offline Protoman Blues

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Re: Why do some people hate/dislike the PSX-era Rockman X games more?
« Reply #28 on: September 03, 2013, 08:21:37 AM »
Plus, the one thing about X5 that supersedes all other arguments...

ZERO RAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAVE!!!!



 8D

Offline Flame

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Re: Why do some people hate/dislike the PSX-era Rockman X games more?
« Reply #29 on: September 03, 2013, 11:13:57 PM »
X5 definitely has one of the best, if not THE best, final stage theme ever in the X series.

I wonder who's idea it was to remix Quickman and said "hey... let's make this the final area theme"
...When Larry the reploid accountant goes maverick of his own accord, he's certainly formidable during tax season, but he isn't going to provide X the challenge needed to make him grow as a warrior and reach his potential.

Offline MacDaddyMike

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Re: Why do some people hate/dislike the PSX-era Rockman X games more?
« Reply #30 on: September 03, 2013, 11:40:11 PM »
And it's got one of the funkiest remixes to it, too:

<a href="http://youtu.be/cwrVYWMrf-Y" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://youtu.be/cwrVYWMrf-Y</a>


I really enjoyed the X5 soundtrack overall, and can't remember a single track from X4's off the top of my head.  X6's soundtrack had some hits too, but the music often didn't fit the stage at all, like Blaze Heatnix having one of the fastest and most energetic rock tracks for the slowest and most tedious stage in the series' history.
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Offline HokutoNoBen

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Re: Why do some people hate/dislike the PSX-era Rockman X games more?
« Reply #31 on: September 04, 2013, 12:11:04 AM »
Plus, the one thing about X5 that supersedes all other arguments...

ZERO RAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAVE!!!!



 8D

It was almost as if Sigma was inviting you to his Club to destroy you in a dance competition instead of being so concerned about the fate of the world and Reploid/Humankind.

Offline Protoman Blues

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Re: Why do some people hate/dislike the PSX-era Rockman X games more?
« Reply #32 on: September 04, 2013, 12:28:40 AM »
It was almost as if Sigma was inviting you to his Club to destroy you in a dance competition instead of being so concerned about the fate of the world and Reploid/Humankind.

He already had infected 8 more Reploids with the Maverick Virus for this plan.

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Offline Hypershell

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Re: Why do some people hate/dislike the PSX-era Rockman X games more?
« Reply #33 on: September 04, 2013, 02:23:01 AM »
Plus, the one thing about X5 that supersedes all other arguments...

ZERO RAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAVE!!!!
...damn you, I can't argue with that one.  XD

X5 definitely has one of the best, if not THE best, final stage theme ever in the X series.
My fav is X2.  Cheap as it may be, reusing the intro theme lets you know that things are coming full circle, and gets you pumped up.

That said, X5 is certainly the best final-stage-theme of the PS1 arc (not that the others set the that bar high).

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Offline Protoman Blues

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Re: Why do some people hate/dislike the PSX-era Rockman X games more?
« Reply #34 on: September 04, 2013, 02:52:45 AM »
...damn you, I can't argue with that one.  XD

My fav is X2.  Cheap as it may be, reusing the intro theme lets you know that things are coming full circle, and gets you pumped up.

That said, X5 is certainly the best final-stage-theme of the PS1 arc (not that the others set the that bar high).

You know you want to see Zero & Iris getting down in da club to that beat.  8D

As for favorite final stage themes.....if Jacob counts, that's probably mine.

Offline Nexus

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Re: Why do some people hate/dislike the PSX-era Rockman X games more?
« Reply #35 on: September 04, 2013, 10:47:53 PM »
Sorry if I was a bit whiny about the Zero focus thing, Hypershell, it's just been a personal perturbance for years. If there's other criticisms I can level at the PS1 games, it's probably the start of long segments of text that get particularly chatty. It's like the characters never shut up yet simultaneously aren't actually saying much due to odd translations and repeating things. It probably wouldn't be so bad if X5 and X6 didn't have that annoying 'ba-ba-ba-ba-ba' sound for every individual letter that pops up (outside of the voiced scenes in X6, anyway). This ties in with Alia's mid-level dialogue in both games, too; get caught by one, BABABABABABABABABABABABABABA

X7's introduction of voice-acting for all scenes is better than that damn text noise, but then it segues into the voice acting quality itself, as well as being off-topic.

Offline Hypershell

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Re: Why do some people hate/dislike the PSX-era Rockman X games more?
« Reply #36 on: September 05, 2013, 03:53:53 AM »
I don't think you were being whiny at all, it's just that the point itself has been driven to death over the years.  Pretty much everyone claims that Zero is the spotlight-stealer.  And, quite frankly, sometimes they're right.  In the case of X4, they definitely are (although part of that may have something to do with it being Zero's debut as a fully playable character, but X's lack of cutscene time is hard to excuse).  But most of those people tend to either dismiss the good points that X did receive, or in the case of X5, grossly overestimate any benefit that Zero is alleged to have obtained from the extra focus.

Oddly enough Zero's best character development in X5 is probably the alternate path where he is removed from player status.  At least that way it explores the idea of his "mission" and Wily's intentions.  The "canonical" path of X5 does absolutely nothing to strengthen Zero's character, in fact he is noticeably more of a hardass in X5 than in most other titles (seen in his dialogue with Dr. Light a few times).  The game as a whole doesn't really do Zero's fans any favors, either.  A player who botches up on their first time through and is therefore punished by having Zero removed from the roster and killed is in for a very rude surprise when they're motivated to shoot for the better ending only to watch him die a cheap death anyway.

X6 I feel struck a good balance between the two.  Again, Zero may be the source of conflict, but he's also optional as a player (which contrary to popular belief, X is not in X7), and both he and X get some pretty meaningful dialogue.  X's in particular is interesting because we get to see how he reacts both to a personal threat and to a seemingly impossible one, the latter being something we almost never see outside of X1.

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Offline AquaTeamV3

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Re: Why do some people hate/dislike the PSX-era Rockman X games more?
« Reply #37 on: September 05, 2013, 03:57:44 AM »
I will say this about X6:

- I feel like aside from X1, this is the only game that properly captured the feel of scope.  In the intro stage you get bopped by High Max, and it's clear that Gate's creations are much stronger than you.  Throughout the game, you rescue numerous reploids and collect armor just to give yourself a fighting chance against all the crap in this game that's trying to kill you.  What makes it so different here than in the other non-X1 games is how much variety X6 has in its upgrades.  By the time your character collects enough items/parts/armor you're on a completely different level than when you first started the game.  Once you hit Gate's lab things come full circle and you get to curbstomp High Max and later step on Sigma's toes with your overpowered self.

For this very reason I feel like X6 is better played without rescuing Zero, just because there's something satisfying about hoarding all of the items for X and watching him grow little by little.  You can do it with Zero too, but it just doesn't have the same effect.

- Also, X6 is one of the few games that completely got the concept of "Hard Mode" correct.  Not only is the game's difficulty increased in a non-cheap manner, the game feels...more enhanced.  Bosses get new moves, enemy patterns are more challenging, and you feel like you have to actually plan your movements now.
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Offline Soultrigger

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Re: Why do some people hate/dislike the PSX-era Rockman X games more?
« Reply #38 on: September 05, 2013, 06:57:32 AM »
From my experience, Mega Man fans can never agree on anything. That being said, the PSX trilogy suffered from declining polish and innovation, which is unsurprising for any longstanding series. This causes a rift in many fans, making the general opinion across these games to be very polarized.

X4 was the console jump which boasted high quality sprites and anime cutscenes, but beyond differentiating Zero from X as a melee character, X4 didn't really bring anything new to the table.
X5 tries to do some of that, but suffered from glaring problems.
X6 fixed a lot of those problems, but it still had plenty of its own issues.

The bottomline is that every title suffers some form of mediocrity. On the other hand, X1 is an all-around masterpiece. X2 is a worthy sequel. X3...well X3 is overrated, but it at least has the nostalgia factor.



By the way, why does everyone hate Mega Man Xtreme? It wasn't original like Xtreme 2, but I don't remember it being that bad... (then again, I haven't played it in a long time)


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Re: Why do some people hate/dislike the PSX-era Rockman X games more?
« Reply #39 on: September 05, 2013, 07:02:58 AM »
X3 is overrated? I don't really know anybody that finds it to be a masterpiece or anything, its just okay.

Offline Nexus

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Re: Why do some people hate/dislike the PSX-era Rockman X games more?
« Reply #40 on: September 05, 2013, 07:05:10 AM »
By the way, why does everyone hate Mega Man Xtreme? It wasn't original like Xtreme 2, but I don't remember it being that bad... (then again, I haven't played it in a long time)

Well, Xtreme 2 wasn't entirely original either. Some of its level design was copied, if I remember right, but a lot of stages were redone at the same time. But I remember the first Xtreme running pretty choppy, with some questionable physics and such at times, and the music.. I can get down with Xtreme 2's soundtrack, but Xtreme 1 was just a bit too tinny for my likes from what I remember myself.

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Re: Why do some people hate/dislike the PSX-era Rockman X games more?
« Reply #41 on: September 05, 2013, 07:13:20 AM »
People tend to lump X3 together with X1 and X2, which makes it obvious those people can't distinguish the quality between them.

I actually view X3 in the same light as X5: it tries to expand the X series with new gimmicks, but fails to keep the game functioning as a cohesive experience. There's just too much stuff, that each one gets too little attention to make it actually worth caring about. Example, how often do you really get to use Kangaroo or Hawk?

The vertical air dash start up, really bad double charge shot, obsession with elevators, obsession with ramming-AI, ridiculous damage scaling, necessity to have item A before getting item B (particularly the <i>really bad buster upgrade</i>). I'm probably forgetting something else as well, but basically everything just feels tacky.

Here's an interesting point: the head upgrade is very poorly placed. You need the Foot Upgrade (not really) AND Tornado Fang to get the Buster Upgrade, and you need that AND Triad Thunder to get the Head Upgrade (did I mention you're doing a stage revisit?). What does the Head Upgrade do again? Help you find items. What's the problem? You need to get a bunch of things before you can even get the thing that helps you find things, most of which you probably already got trying to get the thing that's supposed to help you find things.


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Offline Flame

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Re: Why do some people hate/dislike the PSX-era Rockman X games more?
« Reply #42 on: September 05, 2013, 07:36:38 AM »

I really enjoyed the X5 soundtrack overall, and can't remember a single track from X4's off the top of my head. 
Not even Jet Stingray or Final Sigma?
...When Larry the reploid accountant goes maverick of his own accord, he's certainly formidable during tax season, but he isn't going to provide X the challenge needed to make him grow as a warrior and reach his potential.

Offline Protoman Blues

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Re: Why do some people hate/dislike the PSX-era Rockman X games more?
« Reply #43 on: September 05, 2013, 07:40:36 AM »


 0v0

Driving on the highway to this song is a LOT of fun!  [eyebrow]

Offline Arikado

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Re: Why do some people hate/dislike the PSX-era Rockman X games more?
« Reply #44 on: September 05, 2013, 07:43:21 AM »
My personal favorite from X5's ost is Volt Kraken's theme.
The only song from X4 I remember off the top of my head is X's intro stage theme.

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Re: Why do some people hate/dislike the PSX-era Rockman X games more?
« Reply #45 on: September 05, 2013, 12:59:53 PM »
Not even Jet Stingray or Final Sigma?
They're familiar after I look them up, but ultimately not memorable enough to stick in there.

I can remember and sing the melodies for almost every song in X5.
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Offline HokutoNoBen

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Re: Why do some people hate/dislike the PSX-era Rockman X games more?
« Reply #46 on: September 05, 2013, 05:26:33 PM »
By the way, why does everyone hate Mega Man Xtreme? It wasn't original like Xtreme 2, but I don't remember it being that bad... (then again, I haven't played it in a long time)

My main problem with Xtreme was that it was way too short/easy, even by MM standards. The EGM tagline that said that "[the game] goes by quicker than Quickman" is an understatement.

Also, Geemel and Zain, while pretty cool designs, were both rather short-lived boss fights that didn't really stand out enough for them to be the game's sole claim to "original content".

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Re: Why do some people hate/dislike the PSX-era Rockman X games more?
« Reply #47 on: September 05, 2013, 08:41:25 PM »
Personally, I hated the controls. The game was, sadly, before it's time. It would have been much better as a GBA game.

Offline AquaTeamV3

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Re: Why do some people hate/dislike the PSX-era Rockman X games more?
« Reply #48 on: September 06, 2013, 01:11:05 AM »
Agreed.  Megaman X without a dash button struggles really hard to be Megaman X.
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Re: Why do some people hate/dislike the PSX-era Rockman X games more?
« Reply #49 on: September 06, 2013, 01:28:54 AM »
Isn't it possible to dash by double-tapping left/right on the D-pad in the GBC games? But I do agree, a dedicated dash button is a must for the X series.

My main problem with Xtreme was that it was way too short/easy, even by MM standards. The EGM tagline that said that "[the game] goes by quicker than Quickman" is an understatement.

Also, Geemel and Zain, while pretty cool designs, were both rather short-lived boss fights that didn't really stand out enough for them to be the game's sole claim to "original content".
So the Hard difficulty is moot in terms of length?