Author Topic: X's characterization  (Read 4531 times)

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Offline Sigma Zero X

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Re: X's characterization
« Reply #25 on: June 02, 2012, 07:48:24 AM »
My question wasn't really "what was the point of Spider's betrayal" but rather "what was the point of Spider being Repids"? I'll admit it's pretty clever, factoring in the New Generation reploids from X8 into the plot, but it felt like there wasn't enough build up to it, it happened way too late into the game, and it just didn't feel right. I got the impression that Spider was being developed into his own character for the grand duration of the game, getting the players invested into the character, only to be wasted with that whiplash of a plot twist. It feels like a misplaced plot twist relative to the game itself.

I think one reason that Redips was using his Spider persona aside from getting the Supra Force Metal is to gain more allies for his cause. 

Two ways he did so was this:

1.  Using public TV to gain supporters by falsely accusing X and his allies of joining the Rebellion, even with the death of Epsilon and the end of the Rebellion already known among Giga City.

2.  Spider's battles against the main chapter 2-6 bosses.  As a result, Wild Jango, Silver Horn, Mad Nautilus, Mach Jentra, and Incentas were revived and seemed to be on the side of Redips/Spider, despite suffering some behavioral problems. 
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Offline Flame

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Re: X's characterization
« Reply #26 on: June 04, 2012, 10:27:39 AM »
They werent "revived", they were copied. the rematches in Eastern MH HQ are New Generation Reploids copying them. Though your idea still stands. since he defeated them, he was able to snag DNA samples. I mean, they apparently did something with em, considering latecomer Axl still gets DNA for Jango, Silverhorn, and Psyche and such. (and this is considering the fact that X doesnt obtain Special weapons this game)

another purpose is really just that in that way, he could gain X's trust and join his group to keep tabs on him. he was spying on them in first person. Would be mighty odd of the Maverick Hunter Colonel to suddenly appear in Giga City to join X and crew. This way he can play off some small backstory and pretend to be a new addition to the group.

Quote
I'll admit it's pretty clever, factoring in the New Generation reploids from X8 into the plot, but it felt like there wasn't enough build up to it, it happened way too late into the game, and it just didn't feel right.

Keep in mind Command Mission came out before X8. X8 was still in production when it came out, as evidenced by the unlockable X8 demo. So they probably didnt have all of the X8 story fully mapped out yet. so CM is the first usage of New Generation Reploids.
...When Larry the reploid accountant goes maverick of his own accord, he's certainly formidable during tax season, but he isn't going to provide X the challenge needed to make him grow as a warrior and reach his potential.

Offline Sigma Zero X

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Re: X's characterization
« Reply #27 on: June 05, 2012, 07:09:51 AM »
They werent "revived", they were copied. the rematches in Eastern MH HQ are New Generation Reploids copying them. Though your idea still stands. since he defeated them, he was able to snag DNA samples. I mean, they apparently did something with em, considering latecomer Axl still gets DNA for Jango, Silverhorn, and Psyche and such. (and this is considering the fact that X doesnt obtain Special weapons this game)

another purpose is really just that in that way, he could gain X's trust and join his group to keep tabs on him. he was spying on them in first person. Would be mighty odd of the Maverick Hunter Colonel to suddenly appear in Giga City to join X and crew. This way he can play off some small backstory and pretend to be a new addition to the group.

Keep in mind Command Mission came out before X8. X8 was still in production when it came out, as evidenced by the unlockable X8 demo. So they probably didnt have all of the X8 story fully mapped out yet. so CM is the first usage of New Generation Reploids.

I see.  But there are several parts that supported X's conjecture of Wild Jango being Wild Jango instead of another Shang Tsung-like reploid.

1.  The way that of the rest of X's Hunter comrades addressed their respective bosses at Far East HQ during chapter 10:

Massimo to Silver Horn:

"You Rat, Silver Horn!!  Even you're here?!"

"I'm not weak like before!  Now I ... am Steel Massimo!!  Prepare yourself, Silver Horn!!"

Marino and Cinnamon to Mad Nautilus:

Marino -

"Well, well!  Who'd think that we'd meet you again?"

"Dr. Psyche!  We're sending you back to where you belong!"

Cinnamon -

"And I'm not just a helpless little girl anymore!"

Axl to Mach Jentra:

"Him again?  He really doesn't give up, does he?" 

"You sure you don't need the help of your Mechanoloid hordes?  Here goes nothing!"

Zero to Incentas:

"You!  Hmph!  Very well..."

"You owe us more than you could know!  And payment is due, right here and now!  Face your fate!"

These quotes from the show that the Hunters acknowledge that the bosses from chapter 10 are indeed the real things and no one else becoming them, especially Axl's pre-battle quotes to Jentra.  X already acknowledged Wild Jango's appearance as the real thing earlier in chapter 10 after Jango was destroyed again.

2.  Mach Jentra was able to summon Preons in chapter 10, despite the fact that Epsilon and the Rebellion were destroyed in chapter 9.  The Preons were Preon Shielder, Preon Soldier, and Preon Tank, just like in chapter 5.  Who else can summon Preons easily like Jentra and Duboar?

3.  When the bosses are destroyed, they do not change form like the copied bosses at Gateway did in Mega Man X8.  The bosses die as they way they are shown. 
"Well.  This is just delightful!" - Marino, from Mega Man X Command Mission

Offline Flame

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Re: X's characterization
« Reply #28 on: June 05, 2012, 08:11:10 AM »
Do note that after you beat Jango the note that it was a reploid copying him.

X: It's Jango! It's gotta be him!

Axl:someone used a Chameleon ability like mine, and copied Jango's abilities

And they dont say anything when you meet them either, just growl.

the rest of the refights therefore, are assumed to be more newgens. And with the head of Eastern Maverick Hunter HQ an awakened newgen, it's really not surprising.

But even as new gen copies, they still represent that reploid, and it works as character development, with each character noting how they have grown in one way or another since them. Even if they arent the originals, they still throw that in their faces because the battles are personal.

also, jentra shouldnt be able to summon preons at all because of duboar's destruction. That was due to gameplay demanding it.

also, again, remember it was before X8. It also uses a transformation effect that looks more like a teleportation. Some of the X8 details were not ironed out yet. Most notably the name of the ability. Referred to as just a Copy Ability in X8, coming from a Copy Chip, in CM it's just referred to as a Chameleon Ability, and there isnt any specific name for those kinds of reploids.
...When Larry the reploid accountant goes maverick of his own accord, he's certainly formidable during tax season, but he isn't going to provide X the challenge needed to make him grow as a warrior and reach his potential.

Offline Hypershell

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Re: X's characterization
« Reply #29 on: June 06, 2012, 01:40:48 AM »
there isnt any specific name for those kinds of reploids.
Not only that but there is reference to non-New Gen Reploids seeking the ability to upgrade themselves, such as Marino and Spider.  The copy/chameleon ability in XCM is less a matter of identity than it is in X8, where solid lines were drawn between "new generation" and "old model" Reploids.

I suppose it stands to reason that as the technology advanced, its restrictions may have been eased up, broadening its potential application.  This could possibly apply to Axl's ability being stronger in Command Mission than it is in X7/X8.

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Offline Flame

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Re: X's characterization
« Reply #30 on: June 06, 2012, 06:04:28 AM »
I would wonder though, are newgen bodies special themselves or is it just the copy chip?
...When Larry the reploid accountant goes maverick of his own accord, he's certainly formidable during tax season, but he isn't going to provide X the challenge needed to make him grow as a warrior and reach his potential.

Offline Waifu

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Re: X's characterization
« Reply #31 on: June 06, 2012, 08:54:06 PM »
I believe its the next gen reploids but its the copy chips that just in effect.