Why does everyone hate Mega Man X6?

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Offline Satoryu

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Reply #200 on: February 25, 2012, 01:36:17 AM
That was what I was referring to mostly, even though it does apply to both characters. Z Buster all the way, baby.


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Offline Waifu

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Reply #201 on: February 25, 2012, 02:14:18 AM
I actually had a lot of trouble with Wolfang especially the first part. you cannot climb the walls or do jack without dying.



Offline Treleus

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Reply #202 on: February 25, 2012, 04:22:02 AM
Uh, yeah, unarmored X exists pretty much just to show off your manliness.  If you're going to [sonic slicer] about that, then don't use him.

Oh, nooo no no no no. I'm not bitching because unarmored X is challenging. I'm bitching because the level design consists of mounds of bullshit. Make no mistake! I'd be just as pissed if I went through the whole game as Falcon Armor X or even Zero.

i never use the buster, I always use the "Hyper Saber Dash trick" when playing as X.

How the hell do you do that anyways?

I actually had a lot of trouble with Wolfang especially the first part. you cannot climb the walls or do jack without dying.

You mean the stage or the boss fight? I found an easy way to clear the first--even though I did feel cheaped out by an unanticipated spike pit in the second iceberg room. Had a surprisingly easy time beating Wolfang with blue X.



Offline Karasai♪

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Reply #203 on: February 25, 2012, 04:58:31 AM
How the hell do you do that anyways?

Well basically for X, the saber can be cancelled into ANYTHING (a buster shot, crouching, jumping, moving forward) and be used again.

-> -> /_\ -> -> /_\ -> -> /_\ -> -> /_\ As fast as you can.

O /_\ O /_\ O /_\ O /_\ O /_\ Alt version

also Zero's version;

-> -> [] [] -> -> [] [] -> -> [] [] -> -> [] []



Offline Flame

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Reply #204 on: February 25, 2012, 05:40:42 AM
Zero's saber cancel is so much easier to use than X's.

...When Larry the reploid accountant goes maverick of his own accord, he's certainly formidable during tax season, but he isn't going to provide X the challenge needed to make him grow as a warrior and reach his potential.


Offline Treleus

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Reply #205 on: February 25, 2012, 07:26:12 AM
Apparently I'd never put myself through enough suffering to get over 3000 Nightmare Souls, because I've just seen a brief but interesting pair of cutscenes involving Alia, Gate, and X. It also unlocked Gate's lab before I even beat Rainy Turtloid's or Blaze Heatnix's stage.

Does anything else cool happen if I collect more souls?



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Reply #206 on: February 25, 2012, 08:26:08 AM
Had a surprisingly easy time beating Wolfang with blue X.

Wolfang's a joke when you fight him in his own stage.  On the other hand, he goes absolutely berserk in the rematch.  Spikes all over the place...

Does anything else cool happen if I collect more souls?

Nothing besides your rank going up.

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Offline Flame

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Reply #207 on: February 25, 2012, 08:28:00 AM
And the higher your rank, the more power up parts you can equip.

And if you get what was it? 3000? I dont remember- you get that special cutscene where Alia talks about Gate.

...When Larry the reploid accountant goes maverick of his own accord, he's certainly formidable during tax season, but he isn't going to provide X the challenge needed to make him grow as a warrior and reach his potential.


Offline Treleus

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Reply #208 on: February 25, 2012, 09:54:02 PM
And the higher your rank, the more power up parts you can equip.

And if you get what was it? 3000? I dont remember- you get that special cutscene where Alia talks about Gate.

That's the one. Such a good scene too. It's unfortunate you had to dig through so much crap to get to it.

The only parts I care about having are Speedster, Jumper, Quick Charge, and either Ultimate Buster or Buster Unit equipped. I don't really feel like farming 9999 souls to equip 5 parts.



Offline Karasai♪

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Reply #209 on: February 25, 2012, 10:08:25 PM
What do the Green orbs do after you beat a boss? Give you more nightmare souls?

I always wondered.



Offline Satoryu

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Reply #210 on: February 25, 2012, 10:54:22 PM
Yeah. The green orbs give you 200 souls each.


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Offline Blackhook

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Reply #211 on: February 25, 2012, 11:29:50 PM
So..do we all agree that this game is an unenjoyable chapter of Megaman history?


Offline Karasai♪

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Reply #212 on: February 25, 2012, 11:37:26 PM
yes.



Offline Satoryu

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Reply #213 on: February 26, 2012, 12:42:24 AM
I say no, and I know there's another no coming. But I admit it's not for everyone.

Though, are we in agreement that X6 is at least better than X7?


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Offline Align

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Reply #214 on: February 26, 2012, 01:02:19 AM
They have their ups and downs...



Offline Flame

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Reply #215 on: February 26, 2012, 01:27:08 AM
So..do we all agree that this game is an unenjoyable chapter of Megaman history?
I find it quite the opposite. A fun and challenging chapter of Megaman history, which has it's frustrations.

...When Larry the reploid accountant goes maverick of his own accord, he's certainly formidable during tax season, but he isn't going to provide X the challenge needed to make him grow as a warrior and reach his potential.


Offline Treleus

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Reply #216 on: February 26, 2012, 02:11:48 AM
It's a load of [parasitic bomb]. Challenging for the wrong reasons, encourages tedious resource farming, arguably mis-balances X and Zero's abilities, and the Nightmare System is literally the stuff of nightmares.

I'd go so far as to argue X7 is more fun, but that isn't saying much. The developers of Mega Man X6 just said "[tornado fang] it" and decided to make the most difficult, frustrating, cheap, and unfairly punishing Mega Man game of all time. It's like an ambitiously sadistic rom hack, through and through.



Offline Karasai♪

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Reply #217 on: February 26, 2012, 02:42:57 AM
Which Gate stage is it?

The one with the shitload of enemies and the Totem poles you HAVE to destroy to advance? I [tornado fang]ing hated that stage.

and also the stage in which you go UP, with the walls poking with SPIKES? jesus christ.



Offline Satoryu

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Reply #218 on: February 26, 2012, 03:18:19 AM
Second stage had the totem poles. I don't they're that big a deal. If you have the right equipment, you can jump on top of the third one for a cool shortcut. Blade Armor can skip them all in fact.

As for spikes going up, that could be either 1 or 2.


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Offline Flame

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Reply #219 on: February 26, 2012, 03:22:44 AM
Blade Armor is definitely useful in Gate's stages. Also, something about X6, is that you WILL find yourself using special weapons alot. You cant just blaze through with the buster. ( I mean, you can, but using weapons makes your life easier)

...When Larry the reploid accountant goes maverick of his own accord, he's certainly formidable during tax season, but he isn't going to provide X the challenge needed to make him grow as a warrior and reach his potential.


Offline Hypershell

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Reply #220 on: February 26, 2012, 06:40:33 AM
Weapons or parts.  Neither are outright required, it's a matter of what tickles your fancy.  That's why I love the game.

So..do we all agree that this game is an unenjoyable chapter of Megaman history?
ABSOLUTELY not.  For all of the ambition that X5 showed, X6 pretty much perfected everything it attempted (other than the armor-must-be-completed-before-use thing, dunno what they were thinking with that one).  X6 is one of my favorite main-series games, right up there with X1 and X4.

arguably mis-balances X and Zero's abilities


Holy hell, is that ever burying your head in the sand.  All of the game's "standard" forms (Falcon, Blade, Shadow, Zero) are balanced according to offense, defense, and mobility (mainly in mid-air).  Falcon is the all-arounder without excelling in anything in particular.  Blade is more mobile, less offensive.  Shadow is more offensive, less mobile.  Zero is both offensive and mobile at the expense of defense.

Beyond that we have the cheat code unlocked Ultimate Armor and Black Zero which both excel across the board, and plain vanilla X, who as previously mentioned exists for no reason other than challenge.

It's also worth mentioning, as far as "balance" goes, that this is the *ONLY* PS1 game where the Ultimate Armor is not "abilities you already had + infinite Giga Attack".  I still don't get why X5 didn't just give 4th Armor the Stock Charge...

Quote
The developers of Mega Man X6 just said "[tornado fang] it" and decided to make the most difficult, frustrating, cheap, and unfairly punishing Mega Man game of all time.
While X6 does pretty much throw the kitchen sink at you, I don't agree in the SLIGHTEST that it is unfair (well, besides maybe Mijinion's nightmare effect).  It is more open, and expects you to think for yourself, and the solutions run considerably deeper than the formulaic obstacles that the other games present.  While it presents tremendous challenges there's also a wealth of work-arounds to its many challenges, which engages the player by having them find *a* solution without it necessarily being the only arbitrary strategy that the developers just decided should work.  Further, the game takes what X5 attempted to do with the expansion to armor and parts, adds more to the mix, and unlocks its full potential in a way that X5 simply does not allow.  The increased difficulty is the natural evolution to continue to keep the game balanced in the face of all that power.  Otherwise, you get Xtreme 2 (which I also love, but not everybody likes easy games).

As was said above I too get that X6 isn't for everyone.  But the things it does differently are an extension of what Mega Man is built on: non-linear progress, growing more powerful, and finding the best weapons and equipment to tackle a given obstacle.  They were simply taken to a far greater extreme than ever before (or since).  To me, that is challenging for all of the RIGHT reasons.  Unfortunately, it also makes the game less approachable, both to outsiders and to the not-so-hardcore fans.

As I always say, X6 is to the X-series what Lost Levels is to Mario.

And by the way, X6 may be the toughest X-series game, but it is a long way from being the most sadistic Mega Man game.  That title, far and away, goes to Powered Up.

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Offline Blackhook

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Reply #221 on: February 26, 2012, 09:25:49 AM
Seems like a masochist is playing devil's advocate....


Offline Align

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Reply #222 on: February 26, 2012, 03:47:48 PM
You asked for opinions and you got it.

EDIT: Say, Hypershell, you've watched Sequelitis, right? Would you say there's a similarity in the difficulty of X6 and CV1?



Offline Hypershell

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Reply #223 on: February 26, 2012, 04:14:55 PM
I haven't actually played CV1 (I've only in the last few weeks made it a point to get back into 4), but based on Egoraptor's descriptions, I do see some similarity.  X6 places a greater emphasis on some of the special weapons (especially if you're using Blade Armor), and when you start out, you most definitely need to proceed cautiously.  As you collect more power-ups, rushing the enemy head-on becomes more viable.

What seems to most turn people off about X6 is the possibility of reaching an impass (although this is limited to alternate routes and the game's final stages, and is FAR less likely than most players seem to believe; generally they just give up too easily).  Many of them seemed to never discover "Start, Select, Use Previous Data", either, although in all fairness that option was removed from the X Collection version (so save often if that's the one you have), and it would have been more straightforward to just allow the direct return to Stage Select from the weapon screen at any time.



Blackhook's just making me feel old.  If X6 is your idea of torture, then late 80s/early 90s gaming would have eaten you alive.

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Reply #224 on: February 26, 2012, 04:50:26 PM
late 80s/early 90s gaming is the type of gaming I grew up with, and I am quite fond of the challenge. :3

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