Author Topic: Story Retcons?  (Read 6312 times)

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Offline CyberXIII

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Story Retcons?
« on: April 26, 2010, 08:47:02 PM »
http://www.themmnetwork.com/2010/04/09/does-the-rockman-zero-collection-storyline-explain-everything/

I couldn't really make much sense out of some of the story bits here, but the writers just hacked apart 80% of what was originally canon.  

For starters, the Roboenza outbreak seems to be referenced at the beginning as the reason Light built X....except Light supposedly built X to create a robot with true free will and that Suffering Circuit.  Of course, I could be wrong and the Circuit is that Virus countermeasure.

Zero's creation seems to parallel Proto Man's.  He was unwilling to obey orders, so Wily sealed him rather than start from scratch.  

Apparently the Roboenza virus could mutate like a real virus, and somehow got into Zero's capsule and mutated into the Sigma virus that started the X series.

Lastly, the Guardians are now made from pieces of X's soul as opposed to his DNA.

Thoughts on this?
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Offline Zan

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Re: Story Retcons?
« Reply #1 on: April 26, 2010, 08:56:34 PM »
Just so you know, we're already discussing aspects of this in two other places:

http://forum.rockmanpm.com/index.php?topic=4021.0
http://forum.rockmanpm.com/index.php?topic=3965.0

Quote
For starters, the Roboenza outbreak seems to be referenced at the beginning as the reason Light built X....except Light supposedly built X to create a robot with true free will and that Suffering Circuit.  Of course, I could be wrong and the Circuit is that Virus countermeasure.

It does not say the virus outbreak is the reason for X's creation. It says the virus outbreak is the reason for the inclusion of a virus countermeasure in X.

I've written this entry on MMN to combine the info we have concerning X's creation by Dr. Light.
http://www.themmnetwork.com/wiki/index.php?title=Dr._Light_(X_Series)

As for the "Suffering Circuit." It is the may not be canon source for X's ability to worry.

Quote
Zero's creation seems to parallel Proto Man's.  He was unwilling to obey orders, so Wily sealed him rather than start from scratch. 

I don't see how that parallels Blues at all. Blues had a defect in his energy systems. He does not have a cognitive flaw. His free will is how was meant to be.

Quote
Apparently the Roboenza virus could mutate like a real virus, and somehow got into Zero's capsule and mutated into the Sigma virus that started the X series.

It says nothing about the virus mutating. It says Sigma Virus is a subspecies of the one from 100 years ago. Why don't you think it's the case that Wily deliberately created it?

Quote
Lastly, the Guardians are now made from pieces of X's soul as opposed to his DNA.

Those two are the same thing:
http://www.themmnetwork.com/wiki/index.php?title=DNA_Program
http://www.themmnetwork.com/wiki/index.php?title=DNA_Soul

The soul is a DNA program.


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Offline Flame

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Re: Story Retcons?
« Reply #2 on: April 26, 2010, 10:36:01 PM »
its just that bit about "X's soul being split into 5 and each one became a Guardian" that sounds... just so... WEIRD...
As opposed to just derivatives of his DNA. like, "children" as it were.

If you ask me, Inti was reading too much Zero manga.
...When Larry the reploid accountant goes maverick of his own accord, he's certainly formidable during tax season, but he isn't going to provide X the challenge needed to make him grow as a warrior and reach his potential.

Offline Zan

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Re: Story Retcons?
« Reply #3 on: April 27, 2010, 01:25:44 PM »
I don't have much of a problem with it. By stating that, they tackled a lot of issues in one go. It still makes them derivative of his DNA, and his parts; after all, the soul split does not yet make them physical bodies.

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Offline Align

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Re: Story Retcons?
« Reply #4 on: April 27, 2010, 03:14:00 PM »
How did they get the souls into bodies, then? I thought the BioMetal technology was something new, but if they've been able to extract a reploid soul/cyberelf and put it into a body since forever...
Perhaps that's how they did it with Zero when they sealed him, just ejected his soul and stored it.

Offline Zan

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Re: Story Retcons?
« Reply #5 on: April 27, 2010, 08:01:14 PM »
Quote
but if they've been able to extract a reploid soul/cyberelf and put it into a body since forever...

It's called DNA resurrection, of which Vile is an expert in.

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Offline Align

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Re: Story Retcons?
« Reply #6 on: April 27, 2010, 08:28:05 PM »
Oh, it's not a hidden forbidden technique then? I dunno, I just figured bringing reploids back from the dead (or in from cyberspace at any rate) would be illegal like necromancy.

Offline Psycho Yuffie

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Re: Story Retcons?
« Reply #7 on: April 27, 2010, 08:36:09 PM »
Oh, it's not a hidden forbidden technique then? I dunno, I just figured bringing reploids back from the dead (or in from cyberspace at any rate) would be illegal like necromancy.
How have played Mega Man games without knowing about this? Did you think Zero was Jesus? Using magical powers to bring himself back from the dead over and over? Yay! Jesus magic!

Offline Saber

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Re: Story Retcons?
« Reply #8 on: April 27, 2010, 09:00:49 PM »
Oh, it's not a hidden forbidden technique then? I dunno, I just figured bringing reploids back from the dead (or in from cyberspace at any rate) would be illegal like necromancy.

DNA Resurrection is illegal.

From X6:

Quote
Alia: You got the Metal Anchor! A bounding weapon used on the ground. You
got the Rakukojin! Press Attack + Down buttons in the air. Metal Shark
Player. An ex-investigator of Recycle team. He studied recycling in order
to create a new Reploid from Parts of disposed Mavericks. His most
important work was to analyze and control DNA data of the Mavericks. His
analysis ability was so great, that he succeeded in resurrecting dead
Mavericks. Since DNA resurrection is explicitly prohibited, the law
instantly dealt with him.
Gate was also interested in DNA resurrection, so
he encouraged him to collect the DNA data instead of stopping him. Metal
Shark would have continued if Gate had stopped him.



Offline Zan

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Re: Story Retcons?
« Reply #9 on: April 27, 2010, 09:07:20 PM »
Quote
DNA Resurrection is illegal.

Unless you're Neo Arcadia.

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Offline HokutoNoBen

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Re: Story Retcons?
« Reply #10 on: April 27, 2010, 10:15:10 PM »
Unless you're Neo Arcadia.

Well, by that point, some odd years later, I would think it would be such a thing that what constitutes as "moral" is always up for "redefinition". Especially once you're the one in the HNIC position.  8D   

Offline Gaia

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Re: Story Retcons?
« Reply #11 on: April 27, 2010, 10:17:10 PM »
Unless you're Neo Arcadia.

Or hell, even Albert. Boss Ressurection has been going as far as back as the classic series, exception is that they are re-programmable and have backup memories. Hell, even Sigma did it, 8-10 times no less (if you count the GB sidestories). Only diffrence is that Sigma only did it to himself, with the help of the virus.
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Re: Story Retcons?
« Reply #12 on: April 27, 2010, 10:26:48 PM »
Unless you're Copy-X.

Fixed.

Under Copy-X' rule, even helping an old lady across the street can be considered an act of Irregularity.



Offline Blackhook

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Re: Story Retcons?
« Reply #13 on: April 27, 2010, 10:34:06 PM »
Well they donīt bring them back more than once though (If you donīt count Anubis, Blizack and Hanumachine, but that was Weilīs doing so yeah)

Offline Gaia

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Re: Story Retcons?
« Reply #14 on: April 27, 2010, 10:36:50 PM »
Fixed.

Under Copy-X' rule, even helping an old lady across the street can be considered an act of Irregularity.

Huh, reminds me of Half-Life 2 (A game I played before the Z series). Even worse, letting a puppy in your home apartment is considered hostile.
Workshop/DA/YT/Photobucket なにかんがえてるの!?
So its about ass now huh? EVEN THE ASS HAS 'EXCEEDED'!

One mention of LEGENDS and everyone goes batshit.  :\

Yep, every time when someone mentions that game people get energized for an apparent reason whatsoever. It's like this everywhere else, trust me.

It got really messy to find my sprite and comic topic, so it's in my sig.

Offline Align

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Re: Story Retcons?
« Reply #15 on: April 27, 2010, 11:16:40 PM »
How have played Mega Man games without knowing about this? Did you think Zero was Jesus? Using magical powers to bring himself back from the dead over and over? Yay! Jesus magic!
Zero was never brought back by the good guys, though...

Offline Flame

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Re: Story Retcons?
« Reply #16 on: April 27, 2010, 11:20:01 PM »
Zero was never brought back by the good guys, though...
Cain sure did try though. And Ciel did, if you want to count Biometalification as a revival.
...When Larry the reploid accountant goes maverick of his own accord, he's certainly formidable during tax season, but he isn't going to provide X the challenge needed to make him grow as a warrior and reach his potential.

Offline Align

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Re: Story Retcons?
« Reply #17 on: April 28, 2010, 12:10:07 AM »
Cain did well enough with the body, but it was mostly the soul thing I was surprised by - the body is just a complicated chunk of metal (and whatever makes up reploids).
Not sure what to think of the Biometals. They don't seem to mind, so I guess...

Offline Flame

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Re: Story Retcons?
« Reply #18 on: April 28, 2010, 12:21:06 AM »
Cain did well enough with the body, but it was mostly the soul thing I was surprised by - the body is just a complicated chunk of metal (and whatever makes up reploids).

Actually, It was the body that Cain failed at Building.
...When Larry the reploid accountant goes maverick of his own accord, he's certainly formidable during tax season, but he isn't going to provide X the challenge needed to make him grow as a warrior and reach his potential.

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Re: Story Retcons?
« Reply #19 on: April 28, 2010, 02:01:53 AM »
Cain sure did try though.

All Cain did was to put together the parts that the Counter Hunters had with them, the parts that Sagesse himself built from scratch. How difficult can it be to put together a head, a torso with arms and a waist with legs? He did re-install the control chip, true, but that was it.



Offline Zan

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Re: Story Retcons?
« Reply #20 on: April 28, 2010, 01:48:00 PM »
Quote
Fixed.

Under Copy-X' rule, even helping an old lady across the street can be considered an act of Irregularity.

I think you're inverting the point; Neo Arcadia revives Repliroids whenever they see fit. They apparently do not consider it illegal whenever they do it.

All Cain did was to put together the parts that the Counter Hunters had with them, the parts that Sagesse himself built from scratch. How difficult can it be to put together a head, a torso with arms and a waist with legs? He did re-install the control chip, true, but that was it.

X2 instruction manual. Brain chip miraculously survived the destruction of Zero's body. Brain chip recovered by the Hunters. Cain attempted recreating Zero's body and did not succeed.

Start X2. Enter Sagesse who does succeed, but doesn't have the brain chip.

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Offline Align

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Re: Story Retcons?
« Reply #21 on: April 28, 2010, 08:12:21 PM »
Actually, It was the body that Cain failed at Building.
He put him together from the given parts at any rate.
I think I kind of meandered off on a sidetrack there... DNA resurrection is simply plucking a cyberelf and putting it in a body, then? In so far that there's no practical difference between reviving a dead reploid and making a body for an all new cyberelf.

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Re: Story Retcons?
« Reply #22 on: May 09, 2010, 02:34:28 AM »
What one needs to understand before drawing that conclusion is that there is such a thing as a body-only resurrection.  Such is the case with Metal Shark Player's abilities, in which through illegal DNA resurrection, he calls back the form of a dead Maverick but is in fact controlling said Maverick; the dead Maverick's will is not part of the equation.  X, likewise, does the same when he obtains MSP's powers.  Also, there's Maverick Hunter X, which leaves the indication that boss revival is a simple matter of "animating the body", as X finds Launch Octopus devoid of personality when they rematch.  It's a sharp contrast to the Zero series, in which Neo Arcadian bosses are fully conscious and capable of conversing upon revival.

I'm not sure what the earliest point is that we can say a "lost soul" was called back to the world of the living (barring Sigma which we know is some manner of virus kerfunkery).  In Zero's case, the Control Chip survived containing his personality, so in a sense he was not truly dead, rather his brain was simply unplugged.  And that's the problem; we're dealing with artificial beings, they can be powered down, dismantled, bodies broken, and as long as their program is physically salvageable, repaired and reactivated just as easily.  "Plucking a cyber-elf" would mean we're looking for the point at which their personality program is impossible to recover from their broken body, and the games don't usually go into that level of detail.  Case in point: Vile.

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