RockmanPM Forums
Rockman & Community => Rockman Series => DASH => Topic started by: ViperAcidZX on January 26, 2010, 10:58:31 PM
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Its been a LONG time since the Wii's came out and still no Mega Man 64 (Mega Man Legends) on this thing. Why? ;O;
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Probably because of this:
http://forum.rockmanpm.com/index.php?topic=2207.0;topicseen (http://forum.rockmanpm.com/index.php?topic=2207.0;topicseen)
Off-topic:
Why couldn't Earthbound be put on the VC?
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because the N64 port is terrible.
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because the N64 port is terrible.
Yus. Slow, soft blur filtering, no music in the CD store...
You can't see things at a far distance. You will only see whiteness. If you walk around in open fields, like a grass or large areas, the game will lag like crazy.
PS1 and/or PSP version are the ones you should play. ^^b </wii>
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Slow, soft blur filtering, no music in the CD store...
You can't see things at a far distance. You will only see whiteness. If you walk around in open fields, like a grass or large areas, the game will lag like crazy.
Thanks, Vixy. I was going to ask a friend in posession of the N64 port if I could try it. After reading that though, I think I've been saved from what probably would have been a terrible "first experience" with Legends. *goes looking for PSX ISO*
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I played Megaman 64 on emulator and I thought it was great. :/ Then again, it was on an emulator...
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Yea, you MUST try out the terribleness on a real N64. You will see the difference right away, compare to PS versions. =w=
PSP version of DASH 1 & 2 are the best ones, because the processing power makes it run better (see Nino Ruins topic). PS1 versions are awesome because of the English voice actors. ^.^ </wii>
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Even if the N64 version is obviously inferior (and it is), that hasn't stopped a great deal of VC games that had superior arcade ports (to say nothing of SM64; why anybody with a DS will pay 10 bucks for the original is beyond me). Since it is pretty much the sole experience the Nintendo camp has had with Legends, I think getting it on the VC would be a good idea.
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After playing the PSX version (Played the N64 Ver. First), Can't go back to the awful N64. Its just bad, fuzzy voice acting. Crummy texture quality. Makes me cringe at the thought of what MM64 2 would've been like.
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Well, given that they were shoving a 435MB disc into a 32MB cartridge, that's kind of to be expected. But yeah, PS1 version is obviously superior. It's the system the game was actually made for. I just applaud the fact that they even did an N64 version at all; the transition had to have been hell.
MM64-2? Much as I like seeing MegaMan go multi-platform, I shudder at that thought. I'm only guessing, but from visuals I'd say that L2 pushed the PS1 a lot harder than L1 did, which would probably make conversions all the more difficult.
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If it had been made for the N64 to begin with it could have turned out better, just based on hardware, however, the PS1 had the big advantage of disk space, allowing for all that great voice acting, and tons of additional content.
Despite that it was not a perfect port, I really would have liked to see it on VC. Any interest generated in Legend's favor takes us one step closer to Legends 3. Additionally I think the legends ports for PSP should have also been released state side. Off hand I can't recall the file size of UMD's, but if they packed both the Legends games into one UMD I think it would have sold fairly well here.
Though, selling well on the PSP isn't saying much, sadly. Look how bad Powered Up bombed. It was one of the best Megaman games ever for a variety of reasons, such as level editor, but the platform of choice wasn't right. Would have done way better on Wii in my opinion.
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I agree. And many more people own a Wii right now than a PSP. The only other option is to go hunting down PS1 copies (which I did, in fact it's the sole reason I own a PS2). But The N64 port I played way back when still made me love Legends. If Starfox 64 on VC is any indication, the clipping and fog at least could be reduced and the game's speed improved. The Wii does seem to improve N64 games a good bit in terms of clarity and speed.
I say the more people who can play legends the better. Right now would be quite a good time with Tatsunoko vs Capcom just being released.
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(to say nothing of SM64; why anybody with a DS will pay 10 bucks for the original is beyond me)
Maybe because they don't want to play the [tornado fang]ing thing on a broken touch-pad control scheme or d-pad. You know, the exact opposite of how it was truly meant to be played?
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(http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/capcomdatabase/images/3/35/Frank%26ServbotHead.png)
Doesn't seem to stop Frank West. Wait, cameo's can bypass legal issues?
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Additionally I think the legends ports for PSP should have also been released state side. Off hand I can't recall the file size of UMD's, but if they packed both the Legends games into one UMD I think it would have sold fairly well here.
Single Layer: 900 MB
Dual Layer: 1.8 GB (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_Media_Disc)
I ripped my UMD discs (that I bought way back at their release), and these are the game sizes. ^^
Rockman DASH - Hagane no Boukenshin (J) [ULJM-05030]
316,733,440 bytes (153,722,074 bytes, 7Zip compressed)
Rockman DASH 2 - Ooinaru Isan (J) [ULJM-05037]
349,501,440 bytes (177,345,563 bytes, 7Zip compressed)
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(http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/capcomdatabase/images/3/35/Frank%26ServbotHead.png)
Doesn't seem to stop Frank West. Wait, cameo's can bypass legal issues?
... Wait, huh? Capcom's characters weren't the issue legally, it was all on Tatsunoko's side >_>
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to say nothing of SM64; why anybody with a DS will pay 10 bucks for the original is beyond me
too bad Mario 64x4 is superior to the N64 version. >>
... Wait, huh? Capcom's characters weren't the issue legally, it was all on Tatsunoko's side >_>
KP isn't smart.
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The American release of TatsuCap would be a pretty smart reason to release the N64 version on VC. Heck, I'm enough of a Legends fan that I'd probably try it anyway, despite owning the PSX versions (well, maybe not). I also agree that the more people playing Legends, the better. There's also the potential of them fixig the game up for VC; Nintendo's gone inside N64 games to mod them for VC (like going into Pokemon Snap to change Jynx's appearance), so maybe they could fix some bugs.
(to say nothing of SM64; why anybody with a DS will pay 10 bucks for the original is beyond me).
*raises hand*
Because the new version is $40 and we're in a recession.
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In all seriousness though, I bought the original because I'd never played it before, and I figured trying it out for 10 bucks was a good deal (and it was). I seriously can't imagine playing that game on the DS's D-Pad either; I like the sensitivity of the Gamecube's Control Stick a little more. I know there were a few differences between the 2 versions (like multiple playable characters), and some other stuff, but the N64 version's a perfectly fine game to play on it's own. Besides that, it's hard to appreciate a remake when you haven't played the original at all.
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Single Layer: 900 MB
Dual Layer: 1.8 GB (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_Media_Disc)
I ripped my UMD discs (that I bought way back at their release), and these are the game sizes. ^^
Rockman DASH - Hagane no Boukenshin (J) [ULJM-05030]
316,733,440 bytes (153,722,074 bytes, 7Zip compressed)
Rockman DASH 2 - Ooinaru Isan (J) [ULJM-05037]
349,501,440 bytes (177,345,563 bytes 7Zip compressed)
Aha. So it would be very possible. Thanks for the size info.
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The Dpad makes mario 64 slightly harder, the stylus is just a pain for me to hold.
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Maybe because they don't want to play the [tornado fang]ing thing on a broken touch-pad control scheme or d-pad. You know, the exact opposite of how it was truly meant to be played?
Try not sucking. Seriously, once you're through World 2, you're past the worst of it.
The American release of TatsuCap would be a pretty smart reason to release the N64 version on VC. Heck, I'm enough of a Legends fan that I'd probably try it anyway, despite owning the PSX versions (well, maybe not). I also agree that the more people playing Legends, the better. There's also the potential of them fixig the game up for VC; Nintendo's gone inside N64 games to mod them for VC (like going into Pokemon Snap to change Jynx's appearance), so maybe they could fix some bugs.
Very much agreed.
However, I'll point out, Jynx's appearance is a political correctness issue (reminds people of blackface makeup). They've done slight editing for licensing reasons as well (removing brand names from Waverace 64). But I haven't seen them do a whole lot of performance enhancements, at least not in the recoding department (MK64 so could have used a framerate increase...).
Basically, the VC emu kills slowdown and removes the filtering (usually 3D tends to look better while 2D looks worse). SF64 actually merited a few VC updates due to the fact that its cutscene timing took N64 slowdown into account. Never paid much attention to how the emu affects fog. But yeah, I'm sure it would play MM64 better than the actual N64 did.
*raises hand*
Because the new version is $40 and we're in a recession.
Right. If forgot that this generation Nintendo has a policy against game price reduction.
*remembers seeing MP3 and Trilogy both $50 at Wal-Mart*
Still, Luigi, Yoshi, and Wario all have their own fanbases, not to mention it looks one HELL of a lot better (Bowser especially). About the only thing I miss from the N64 is that Bowser's Sub won't reappear in the DS version.
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About the N64 games looking filtered... I believe N64 games rendered at 640x480. That was effectively twice the resolution PS1 games ran at.
Now, back then I believe most people would use a cable line or AV hookup to get to the TV. AV was fairly blurry, and cable was even worse. I can't recall if there was an S-video connector out for it or not. Point is, those connection types would seem blurry especially on older TVs. While the PS1 used the same connector types, the resolution was smaller, and it would result in less blur because there was bigger pixels being displayed. If you have a PS2, try using an S-video or Component after having it hooked up as Cable or AV. You will see a dramatic difference.
The bottom line; with non HD/older televisions, the larger the resolution is, the more the image will appear to blur, because it is packing in more pixels into the same screen area. The N64, I believe, had a higher resolution than the PS1, so more blurring was likely to occur.
This could be a possible explanation for the PS1 version looking clearer. It may just be our TV technology has increased now, not so much the game.
(Side note: PS1 can technically do 640x480 but it would increase render time too much, so one used it outside of say art galleries, ala Capcom VS SNK Pro.)
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One thing I loved about SM64DS was how you could sort of "cheat" at getting certain Stars with Luigi (such as using his Power Flower ability at Bomb Battlefield)
*remembers seeing MP3 and Trilogy both $50 at Wal-Mart*
I'm suddenly reminded of how I payed only $12 for Trilogy. (wasn't used either)
EDIT: Jeez, I type slow. This post was meant to a reply to Hypershell's
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"sigh" Nice pick on me... ;O;
But, my question remains. Can a cameo bypass the law?
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How is it a cameo? It's in a Capcom game.
But if it weren't, you could possibly get sued for copyright infringement, unless you asked for permission and got permission.
The American release of TatsuCap would be a pretty smart reason to release the N64 version on VC.
Or better yet, have the PSX version for sale on the Playstation Network.
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Capcom Unity are looking into the PSN bit. ^.^ <3 </wii>
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About the N64 games looking filtered... I believe N64 games rendered at 640x480. That was effectively twice the resolution PS1 games ran at.
Both N64 and PS1 were capable of 640x480, but very very few games actually ran at that resolution, even on the N64. It's too taxing on the hardware, and without some serious custom code to stream off of the cartridge (see Factor 5's [parasitic bomb]), your limitations in textures, draw distance, and such will be shot to hell. The N64's architecture didn't exactly cut developers a lot of slack in the texture department anyway.
The reason certain N64 games are seen to have poorer textures is due to shortsightedness in the hardware design; the N64 has an extremely small texture cache (4KB), which often restricted devs to small/low color textures that had to be stretched to cover larger surfaces.
BTW, your resolution logic is backwards. The greater the number of pixels in the same area, the sharper the image, not the other way around (if you don't believe me, pick up an Expansion Pack and a game that allows switching resolution modes mid-game, such as one of the two Vigilante 8 titles). 640x480 is the sharpest you get on an SD set.
When I speak of "filtering", I am referring to the fact that actual N64 hardware uses bilinear (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bilinear_filtering) and trilinear (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trilinear_filtering) filtering, while the VC emulator does not. Many visuals look sharper on VC that way since textures aren't as blurred, but certain 2D visuals look more "blocky" when zoomed in (especially noticeable in Mario Kart 64 and Yoshi's Story).
This could be a possible explanation for the PS1 version looking clearer. It may just be our TV technology has increased now, not so much the game.
I assure you that is not the case; all of my systems are hooked up to SDTVs with composite cables (I know, behind the times, blah blah blah).
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Ah. I guess that shoots that down. Stab in the dark.
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Capcom had to optimize the game so it could fit onto the cartridge, which held considerably less space than CDs. In doing so, they had to reduce a lot of things for it to work. Not to mention the N64 being a royal pain to develop for in general.